Needing some guidance regarding a low GPA

[vetassured]

Hey guys,

I know it's no easy feat getting into veterinary school and it requires passion and persistence to do so. That being said, I have a somewhat unique situation on my hands.

I have a B.S. in web programming, which is completely unrelated to the veterinary field, with an undergraduate GPA of 2.82. I have been out of school for 2 years and recently went back to take prerequisite science courses for veterinary school. So, knowing that, my main question is this:

Since 90-95% of my prerequisite courses for vet school are being taken after obtaining a bachelor's degree, is there any way they might dismiss my undergraduate GPA and only take the prerequisite GPA into consideration?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

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[that redhead]

It really depends on the school. Since it's only been two years, I don't think any of the schools will completely disregard your undergraduate GPA (the schools that do "grade forgiveness" usually kick in anywhere from 6-10 years after the coursework was completed) but some (Minnesota and KSU come to mind first) factor in last 45 credits more heavily, which would be to your benefit if you do well.

Fortunately, if you can do extremely well in your pre-reqs, you can make a strong argument for yourself in your explanation statement. You should also have a strong GRE, solid experience hours and some stellar LORs to balance out the weaker GPA.

All is not lost

 

[MysteryCat]

You likely have a good number of pre-requisites left to take, and that's good! You'll have the opportunity to
1: raise your cumulative GPA
2: acquire an awesome last 45/science/pre-requisite GPA (some vet schools weigh that more heavily than others)
3: you'll also have your PS and your explanation statement to describe your struggles, and also to explain your change of heart (computers to vet school is a BIG change!)
5: make sure your GRE scores are really good. You'll always want to balance your weak app points with sting ones.
6: GPA aside, don't forget about veterinary experience. Start rackin' up the hours now if you can.
7: Make sure you are a well rounded applicant. Schools like to see breadth of experience as much as anything else.

I think that if you are determined, and passionate, and you work your arse off, you'll be able to raise up your stats plenty by the time you apply. Some schools (most schools?) like to see an upward trending GPA over a steadily stellar one anyways.

Good luck! Welcome!

Also, look at the successful applicants stats thread, as well as maybe utilize the "what are my chances" thread!

 

[kakurubird]

I think that if you are determined, and passionate, and you work your arse off, you'll be able to raise up your stats plenty by the time you apply. Some schools (most schools?) like to see an upward trending GPA over a steadily stellar one anyways.

okay, not picking on you here, but I hear this tossed around from time to time and I don't get it. if someone can consistently do well in classes, why ever would that be considered less than grades that start low and then get better? doesn't make any sense to me.

 

[vetassured]

You likely have a good number of pre-requisites left to take, and that's good! You'll have the opportunity to
1: raise your cumulative GPA
2: acquire an awesome last 45/science/pre-requisite GPA (some vet schools weigh that more heavily than others)
3: you'll also have your PS and your explanation statement to describe your struggles, and also to explain your change of heart (computers to vet school is a BIG change!)
5: make sure your GRE scores are really good. You'll always want to balance your weak app points with sting ones.
6: GPA aside, don't forget about veterinary experience. Start rackin' up the hours now if you can.
7: Make sure you are a well rounded applicant. Schools like to see breadth of experience as much as anything else.

I think that if you are determined, and passionate, and you work your arse off, you'll be able to raise up your stats plenty by the time you apply. Some schools (most schools?) like to see an upward trending GPA over a steadily stellar one anyways.

Good luck! Welcome!

Also, look at the successful applicants stats thread, as well as maybe utilize the "what are my chances" thread!

Thanks for the advice! I have glanced at the successful applicants thread, and it's pretty intimidating to say the least. I've been doing really well in my science courses so far, so this makes me really hopeful. ^_^

 

[MysteryCat]

okay, not picking on you here, but I hear this tossed around from time to time and I don't get it. if someone can consistently do well in classes, why ever would that be considered less than grades that start low and then get better? doesn't make any sense to me.

I think that the idea here is basically that the schools like to see someone solving problems and getting on track. If you can thoroughly explain yourself, anyways, they like to see people having to deal with life. Rather than shooting straight through and never really struggling/persevering to get to where the want to be. I think it's sort of a "how bad do you want it" approach. But I could be wrong. I hope not, because my freshman GPA is abysmal.

 

[vetassured]

It really depends on the school. Since it's only been two years, I don't think any of the schools will completely disregard your undergraduate GPA (the schools that do "grade forgiveness" usually kick in anywhere from 6-10 years after the coursework was completed) but some (Minnesota and KSU come to mind first) factor in last 45 credits more heavily, which would be to your benefit if you do well.

Fortunately, if you can do extremely well in your pre-reqs, you can make a strong argument for yourself in your explanation statement. You should also have a strong GRE, solid experience hours and some stellar LORs to balance out the weaker GPA.

All is not lost

Helpful info. Thank you. BTW, how do you determine if a school will weigh last 45 more heavily? I know that this may be a long shot, but my goal is to get into NC state.

My fiance is from NC, we currently live in TN, and we're planning on moving there in about a year after he gets his PhD. By that time I will have completed about half of my pre-reqs, and then I can obtain NC residency before I apply to NC State. I really hope that will increase my chances enough, and I don't know if building a rapport with NC State staff will help too much or not.

Obviously I'm a long way off, but I want to try to do this right. Thank you for your help.

 

[that redhead]

how do you determine if a school will weigh last 45 more heavily? I know that this may be a long shot, but my goal is to get into NC state.

My fiance is from NC, we currently live in TN, and we're planning on moving there in about a year after he gets his PhD. By that time I will have completed about half of my pre-reqs, and then I can obtain NC residency before I apply to NC State. I really hope that will increase my chances enough, and I don't know if building a rapport with NC State staff will help too much or not.

You can check the website or call the admissions office of the school(s) you'd like to apply to and figure out how it is weighed (check the website first, in case it's listed clearly).

In general, vet school admissions aren't "who you know in admissions" like it was in the good ol' days. I still remember my dad pushing me to take the admissions person out to lunch to talk about my application I think the best things you can do for yourself are ace those pre-reqs, gain a bunch of experience, rock the GRE and get some people who will write you awesome letters of recommendation. Sounds easy, right?

I got in with sub-3.0 GPA. Looking through the successful applicants thread really helped boost my confidence when I was feeling hopeless - definitely check it out.

 

[vetassured]

I think that the idea here is basically that the schools like to see someone solving problems and getting on track. If you can thoroughly explain yourself, anyways, they like to see people having to deal with life. Rather than shooting straight through and never really struggling/persevering to get to where the want to be. I think it's sort of a "how bad do you want it" approach. But I could be wrong. I hope not, because my freshman GPA is abysmal.

Haha, I hope that's the case. My mind was elsewhere during undergrad, and all I wanted was a degree. It's really sad to say, I could blame my GPA on struggles that most everyone encounters at some point in their life, but the motivation to do well wasn't there. If I can prove that I have the motivation now, maybe that will be convincing enough.

 

[vetassured]

You can check the website or call the admissions office of the school(s) you'd like to apply to and figure out how it is weighed (check the website first, in case it's listed clearly).

In general, vet school admissions aren't "who you know in admissions" like it was in the good ol' days. I still remember my dad pushing me to take the admissions person out to lunch to talk about my application I think the best things you can do for yourself are ace those pre-reqs, gain a bunch of experience, rock the GRE and get some people who will write you awesome letters of recommendation. Sounds easy, right?

I got in with sub-3.0 GPA. Looking through the successful applicants thread really helped boost my confidence when I was feeling hopeless - definitely check it out.

Ah, thank you, you're awesome! Congrats on getting in... the curriculum seems super interesting. I really would love to work with aquatic mammals, oh and sea turtles of course, but that's just a daydream right now.

 

[MysteryCat]

Haha, I hope that's the case. My mind was elsewhere during undergrad, and all I wanted was a degree. It's really sad to say, I could blame my GPA on struggles that most everyone encounters at some point in their live, but the motivation to do well wasn't there. If I can prove that I have the motivation now, maybe that will be convincing enough.

I've been there. I think personally that something as honest and real as that is enough. As long as you never show signs of weakness in your pre-recs, it sounds like you have pieces of a good PS.

I started undergrad in high school, with really no idea what I was going to do. I had ALWAYS (like since I was 5-6, my aunt is an LVT) wanted to be a vet. But due to my raising being, in some cases, less than supportive, I thought that I wouldn't be good enough. I was depressed and dealt with anxiety. After living a little I stumbled upon a job at a clinic. I soaked it up and remembered how much I loved it. That was two years ago and I am fiercely set upon my goals. Being a "pure" type A personality, I do not give up once I really, truly set myself on something. I plan to use my childhood and adolescent struggles as an explanation of poor grades.

This is just my example. Everyone has had something to overcome. They get that, and if you really, really prove yourself, they can't totally fault you for your past.

 

[that redhead]

Ah, thank you, you're awesome! Congrats on getting in... the curriculum seems super interesting. I really would love to work with aquatic mammals, oh and sea turtles of course, but that's just a daydream right now.

It's funny, too: I'm doing awesome grade-wise in school. Trying and failing not to sound cliche, but it's all about what you put your mind to Do some work at a local aquarium or one of those sea turtle nesting research programs!

 

[vetassured]

I've been there. I think personally that something as honest and real as that is enough. As long as you never show signs of weakness in your pre-recs, it sounds like you have pieces of a good PS.

I started undergrad in high school, with really no idea what I was going to do. I had ALWAYS (like since I was 5-6, my aunt is an LVT) wanted to be a vet. But due to my raising being, in some cases, less than supportive, I thought that I wouldn't be good enough. I was depressed and dealt with anxiety. After living a little I stumbled upon a job at a clinic. I soaked it up and remembered how much I loved it. That was two years ago and I am fiercely set upon my goals. Being a "pure" type A personality, I do not give up once I really, truly set myself on something. I plan to use my childhood and adolescent struggles as an explanation of poor grades.

This is just my example. Everyone has had something to overcome. They get that, and if you really, really prove yourself, they can't totally fault you for your past.

It's so great that you overcame your struggles. It can be hard, like digging yourself out of a hole, but once you're out you don't really want to be reminded of it. Ha ha.

The only thing is that I didn't grow up dreaming of being a vet, like most veterinarians. Had I come to that conclusion at an early age, I would have majored in something related to veterinary science. The story I'm about to tell you may sound silly, but it is my reason for wanting to become a veterinarian.

Growing up I had a few pets, and have always loved animals, but was unable to interact with them as much as I would have liked. My dad always insisted on keeping the dogs outside, almost all the time, and we only had one cat growing up when I was very young. So, it wasn't until recently that I experienced the joys of being a true pet owner.

My cat's name is Sophie, and she's the sweetest cat in the world. When I found her she was being neglected by my parent's neighbor, a M.D., and she was meowing and rubbing up against my leg when I noticed an abscess on her tail from where a dog maimed her. I went to the neighbor's practice to see if I could get permission to take Sophie to the vet, because her tail looked infected. After negotiating with the M.D. for a bit, he finally said that I could take her and keep her. Sophie was about 6 months old at the time, and I had no idea but she had never even been to the vet. Her tail was infected to the point that if I had waited a week longer to take her to the vet she may have died. She had worms, giardia, a abscess on her tail, and ear mites. All I could think was, how could an M.D. have such disregard for a living thing. After about 2 months of treatment she finally got better with medicine, love and care. That's when I decided that this is what I wanted to do.

Silly or not, it changed me.

 

[MysteryCat]

My cat's name is Sophie, and she's the sweetest cat in the world. When I found her she was being neglected by my parent's neighbor, a M.D., and she was meowing and rubbing up against my leg when I noticed an abscess on her tail from where a dog maimed her. I went to the neighbor's practice to see if I could get permission to take Sophie to the vet, because her tail looked infected. After negotiating with the M.D. for a bit, he finally said that I could take her and keep her. Sophie was about 6 months old at the time, and I had no idea but she had never even been to the vet. Her tail was infected to the point that if I had waited a week longer to take her to the vet she may have died. She had worms, giardia, a abscess on her tail, and ear mites. All I could think was, how could an M.D. have such disregard for a living thing. After about 2 months of treatment she finally got better with medicine, love and care. That's when I decided that this is what I wanted to do.

Silly or not, it changed me.

I don't think it's the least bit silly! For one thing, I admire you for taking steps to better her life, and for another, I think that that would be (with out bashing MDs in general, or maybe without even mentioning that aspect) a great anecdote for your PS, if you so choose.

 

[vetassured]

I don't think it's the least bit silly! For one thing, I admire you for taking steps to better her life, and for another, I think that that would be (with out bashing MDs in general, or maybe without even mentioning that aspect) a great anecdote for your PS, if you so choose.

Awww... thanks. Well, she's like my baby. I couldn't live without her. I never considered myself a cat person until about a year ago, haha.

 

[FarmerMom]

I'm not sure how many pre-reqs you have to complete, but if I don't get into one of the schools I apply my first cycle, I'm going to apply to a non-thesis masters in biology that's specifically for pre-professional students. That's just something to consider.

 

[kakurubird]

I think that the idea here is basically that the schools like to see someone solving problems and getting on track. If you can thoroughly explain yourself, anyways, they like to see people having to deal with life. Rather than shooting straight through and never really struggling/persevering to get to where the want to be. I think it's sort of a "how bad do you want it" approach. But I could be wrong. I hope not, because my freshman GPA is abysmal.

how accurately do grades indicate struggling/persevering though? it's just as easy to get a C because you have 100 real, valid things going on outside of class as it is to get a C because it's more fun to drink/get high/whatever than study. and doing well in a class isn't indication that you aren't working really hard and have to struggle for those grades or don't have lots of other things going on that you have to deal with as well. why should someone be "penalized" for having their academic life together from the start?
mostly, I just don't think grades are a very good indicator of anything beyond how many questions you got right over the course of 15 weeks and don't reliably say anything about outside of the exam room. I've seen people really struggle and work hard for a C and I've seen people do barely any work for an A.

 

[vetassured]

why should someone be "penalized" for having their academic life together from the start?
mostly, I just don't think grades are a very good indicator of anything beyond how many questions you got right over the course of 15 weeks and don't reliably say anything about outside of the exam room. I've seen people really struggle and work hard for a C and I've seen people do barely any work for an A.

You have a good point. I can admit to myself that my low GPA was 90% lack of motivation. I think the conditional statement here is this; for students who have a low GPA overall, an upward trend is preferred to a downward trend. People with a high cumulative GPA still have the advantage, I'm sure.

 

[vetassured]

I'm not sure how many pre-reqs you have to complete, but if I don't get into one of the schools I apply my first cycle, I'm going to apply to a non-thesis masters in biology that's specifically for pre-professional students. That's just something to consider.

Thanks for the info. I'm going to stick with this path though for as long as possible before I decide on something else. We'll see what happens.

 

[kakurubird]

You have a good point. I can admit to myself that my low GPA was 90% lack of motivation. I think the conditional statement here is this; for students who have a low GPA overall, an upward trend is preferred to a downward trend. People with a high cumulative GPA still have the advantage, I'm sure.

agreed on the trend upward vs. downward being a possible factor. though this is also taken into account already some when schools consider a last 45 credits gpa as another factor.

 

[abbercadaver]

how accurately do grades indicate struggling/persevering though? it's just as easy to get a C because you have 100 real, valid things going on outside of class as it is to get a C because it's more fun to drink/get high/whatever than study. and doing well in a class isn't indication that you aren't working really hard and have to struggle for those grades or don't have lots of other things going on that you have to deal with as well. why should someone be "penalized" for having their academic life together from the start?
mostly, I just don't think grades are a very good indicator of anything beyond how many questions you got right over the course of 15 weeks and don't reliably say anything about outside of the exam room. I've seen people really struggle and work hard for a C and I've seen people do barely any work for an A.

You are not seen as "better" for having a low GPA and then bringing it up than a person who had it together (as you said) from the get-go.

You are seen as "not a completely lazy baffoon or an idiot" because they can see you were able to improve.

It's an upwards trend that helps to balance out your bad GPA, not that you look better than someone with a 4.0. That's ridiculous. OBVIOUSLY a 4.0 is weighted heavier than a 3.0, even IF the person had an upwards trend--it's the rest of the application that will make or break you either way.

Because as you stated, while GPA is one of the few numeric values we have to pull from that is standardized (kindof a stretch in some cases), it is NOT an indicator of perseverance, willpower, and overcoming obstacles.

 

[kakurubird]

It's an upwards trend that helps to balance out your bad GPA, not that you look better than someone with a 4.0. That's ridiculous. OBVIOUSLY a 4.0 is weighted heavier than a 3.0, even IF the person had an upwards trend--it's the rest of the application that will make or break you either way.

completely agree here. I just see every so often on here someone trying to say that an upward trend is "better" and "something schools prefer" than a consistently good trend, and I don't have a PG way to say what I feel about that.
it's part of why I think it's good that a last 45 GPA is considered as well as a cumulative GPA. some people screwed around or had other things that impacted their performance early on and they managed to turn things around, and I think it's good that schools do take that and other additional things into consideration for admissions.

 

[puppyloomp]

I think a lot of the time when people say that an upward trend is seen as good/just as good as a 4.0, they mean something along the lines of getting a 3.4-5 freshman year and getting 4.0 semesters by senior year might be viewed as generally being as academically strong/showing that they can be as strong as someone with a 4.0 their whole career. I have no idea if that's truly what admissions likes but it would make sense. I dont think they mean that someone who got 1.0 freshman year and ended getting 3.0s senior year is viewed as being as favorable in terms of gpa as a straight 4.0 applicant. For non-trads and people who already finished their degree but are getting another one or going back to school several years later and didn't end up with a high gpa the first time around, I think they definitely do see the upward trend as being very positive and it won't be just as good as always having had a 4.0, but if you go back to school and make all a's after several years off and getting experience I do think that's seen favorably and they understand that you've matured and have the potential to be a good student in vet school even after you didn't do well in undergrad the first time around.

 

[sarah1029]

Hey guys,

I know it's no easy feat getting into veterinary school and it requires passion and persistence to do so. That being said, I have a somewhat unique situation on my hands.

I have a B.S. in web programming, which is completely unrelated to the veterinary field, with an undergraduate GPA of 2.82. I have been out of school for 2 years and recently went back to take prerequisite science courses for veterinary school. So, knowing that, my main question is this:

Since 90-95% of my prerequisite courses for vet school are being taken after obtaining a bachelor's degree, is there any way they might dismiss my undergraduate GPA and only take the prerequisite GPA into consideration?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

I have a BS in computer science (3.1) that I got several years ago, and I can say from experience that trying to get in with a low GPA is tough. It's definitely doable (you can check out the successful applicant stats thread), but you are going to have to bust your butt off. I'm on my third application cycle right now, and I've been told from some of my file reviews that I have a great application, but my lower GPA (which has improved from undergrad since I took all the prereqs + additional upper level electives) is preventing my file from getting passed onto the second phase of the application review process. It's difficult to really boost your cumulative GPA when you have so many credits so try to ace your prerequisites and have a high last 45-hr GPA. Also, choose schools wisely! Some schools put more emphasis on that last 45 hour GPA

 

[vetassured]

I have a BS in computer science (3.1) that I got several years ago, and I can say from experience that trying to get in with a low GPA is tough. It's definitely doable (you can check out the successful applicant stats thread), but you are going to have to bust your butt off. I'm on my third application cycle right now, and I've been told from some of my file reviews that I have a great application, but my lower GPA (which has improved from undergrad since I took all the prereqs + additional upper level electives) is preventing my file from getting passed onto the second phase of the application review process. It's difficult to really boost your cumulative GPA when you have so many credits so try to ace your prerequisites and have a high last 45-hr GPA. Also, choose schools wisely! Some schools put more emphasis on that last 45 hour GPA

Thanks for the advice! Good luck getting in, BTW. I'm just going to give it my all. I've been doing really well in the prereqs thus far, it's just a matter of keeping up the momentum. Hopefully things don't fall apart when I get to organic chem though. I just wish they would disregard my undergrad degree since most vet schools don't require one anyway, and virtually none of my prereqs were included in my degree.

 

[LetItSnow]

Haha, I hope that's the case. My mind was elsewhere during undergrad, and all I wanted was a degree. It's really sad to say, I could blame my GPA on struggles that most everyone encounters at some point in their life, but the motivation to do well wasn't there. If I can prove that I have the motivation now, maybe that will be convincing enough.

I know I'm quoting a couple-week old post, but since the thread is still active ....

I just wanted to say that there are a LOT of people who come here wondering whether/how to explain past poor performance. The "should I explain this" or "how do I explain this" question is common.

I really think that's the wrong attitude. I really like that you said "If I can prove ...." because that's the very *best* way to explain any checkered past. You've got the right attitude.

Sure, if you have some major badness in your background you need to address it, probably in the explanation section. But the correct focus is not on explaining away why you were a poor performer back then and why you'll be a great vet student now. The correct focus is on giving them EVIDENCE that you'll be a great vet student.

I used to read personal statements for people and a super consistent theme was applicants saying "I have quality X" .... with nothing to back it up.

It was amazing. People would talk about how they wanted to be aquatic vets ... but they had never so much as shadowed a vet doing aquatic work. They'd talk about how they were great leaders ... but they had never taken a leadership position in a structured organization. They'd talk about how they were "quick learners" (lame) and "responsible" people ... with nothing to suggest it was true. The same thing is true with historically bad grades. It's one thing to say "I had bad grades because <insert life crisis here>." It's another to say "Yeah, I had bad grades because <life crisis>, but with that resolved look at my performance NOW." The second one wins hands down every time.

So whatever you do in your application, make sure the evidence is there for the applications people to say "yup ... she says she's matured past her earlier performance and sure 'nuff, she's actually gotten straight A's."

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