No connection=No admission

[pavlovb]

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How many of you think that admission to medical school is mostly about who you know than what you know? After following a trend of recent discussions about honesty and integrity, I wonder how you pre-meds feel about people who play fair but have connections that guarantee either an interview and/or admission. I know a recent college graduate that was guaranteed interview even before she applied to dental school? I was shocked. A lot of us worry when it comes to reporting the accurate number of volunteer hours we did, but at the same time there is cheating on "high level". Any thoughts?

 

[koennen]

Advantage based on connections may be unfair, but it's not "cheating." It's life. Get used to it.

 

[christina30]

Maybe if you were better at networking, etc you would be in a similar position and wouldn't have such a problem with it. Accept it, my friend.

 

[whatbout2morrow]

How many of you think that admission to medical school is mostly about who you know than what you know? After following a trend of recent discussions about honesty and integrity, I wonder how you pre-meds feel about people who play fair but have connections that guarantee either an interview and/or admission. I know a recent college graduate that was guaranteed interview even before she applied to dental school? I was shocked. A lot of us worry when it comes to reporting the accurate number of volunteer hours we did, but at the same time there is cheating on "high level". Any thoughts?

I agree, it's not ethical, but that's just the way it is. It's not just admissions. Residencies, jobs, promotions, etc. All may come a bit easier if you know people in high places.

 

[justinbaily]

From what I nderstand, "connections" play a much stronger role in MD/PhD admissions than they do in straight MD or DMD. I understand that there may be some people who benefit from knowing the right people, but it probably isn't a significantly large group.

Edit: For jobs, residencies and promotions, networking/connections play a much larger role, and I don't see why they shouldn't. If I trusted a person and they assured me that applicant-X was good to work with and seemed bright, then I would be more likely to choose them over similarly qualified applicants.

 

[mvenus929]

I don't think it's fair to claim that no connection = no admission... you can gain admission without having any connections in a place, and people do it all the time. However, it is easier when you have networking, for several reasons. If you have someone on the admissions committee who knows you and can truly be an advocate for you, then you'll have an easier time. It's not cheating, it's just a fact of life. You're also more likely to apply places where you have connections, because you can get a better feel for the place overall by seeing things as someone on the inside does, and that can help you present yourself to be a better fit for the school.

 

[gadad]

...

 

[IDoIt4Love]

I can tell you for a fact that connections never helped me. Of all the schools I applied to, I had substantial connections to high-up people at 3 of them (as well as a competitive GPA and MCAT for them), and received no interviews at those schools. At the two schools I have so far been admitted, I had neither connections nor affiliations (as in, I didn't graduate from their undergrad colleges, either). I think connections play a much bigger role in obtaining a job than in the med school admissions process. Med school admissions is too random and a crap shoot to allow any sense of security in having connections. I have no idea about dental school admissions.

 

[hithere3387]

Every person who wants to get into a particular medical school should be in contact with the school to show genuine interest. While I'm not certain it helps get an interview, it certainly doesn't hurt. Further, after having had your interview, you should get in contact with those adcoms who interviewed you and express your interest in their school. Those people who interview you are your advocates to the rest of the adcoms. The interview process at most schools is designed so that those individuals can express to the rest of the group why you are more valuable than your statistics. It isn't cheating to contact your interviewers (advocates) and have them advocate for you.

 

[OddNath]

From what I nderstand, "connections" play a much stronger role in MD/PhD admissions than they do in straight MD or DMD. I understand that there may be some people who benefit from knowing the right people, but it probably isn't a significantly large group.

There are people who worked in the lab of our MD/PhD program director who didn't get in, so yeah, connections really only take you so far.

While it's easy to blame a rejection on not personally knowing a member of the admissions committee, people often discount the impression YOU make at interviews, and as it has been said, how much you influence your interviewers so that they'll fight for you at the big meeting. It's the difference between answering questions in a generic way vs. tailoring your responses so that the school seems like the perfect fit for you.

 

[auburnO5]

Yes, connections help; obviously, to overcome this, you need to make connections. It's easier if you know for certain one or two schools that you want to apply to.

I come from a lower middle-class family that had absolutely no connections to my choice med school (or to any other school for that matter). So, I spent a summer doing research at said school and obtained connections that probably helped me get accepted here.

3 posts in 3 years?

But to the OP, I agree with pretty much what everyone else is saying. Having connections is just a part of life that you will have to get used to.

 

[justinbaily]

There are people who worked in the lab of our MD/PhD program director who didn't get in, so yeah, connections really only take you so far.

Right. I'm not saying that a connection (ie, knowing a person)=acceptance. I'm saying that if an influencial person is very impressed with you, then you'll get the spot over similarly qualified people because they consider you a pleasant person to work with and a hard worker. Obviously if they do not think those things about you, then the connection isn't very valuable.

 

[surftheiop]

I can tell you for a fact that connections never helped me. Of all the schools I applied to, I had substantial connections to high-up people at 3 of them (as well as a competitive GPA and MCAT for them), and received no interviews at those schools.

Maybe your more impressive "on paper" and in an interview than you are after a long exposure?

 

[Ischemic]

How many of you think that admission to medical school is mostly about who you know than what you know? After following a trend of recent discussions about honesty and integrity, I wonder how you pre-meds feel about people who play fair but have connections that guarantee either an interview and/or admission. I know a recent college graduate that was guaranteed interview even before she applied to dental school? I was shocked. A lot of us worry when it comes to reporting the accurate number of volunteer hours we did, but at the same time there is cheating on "high level". Any thoughts?

I don't know how it would be "unethical". This is a fact of life, people use it all the time for getting jobs and whatnot. Why should it be any different with med school? People help people they know, that's just how things are. To think otherwise is stupid.

 

[armybound]

I was practically guaranteed an interview at a school I wasn't very competitive at because of people I knew. I definitely was not accepted. I don't consider it cheating or unethical as much as it is a courtesy.

 

[IDoIt4Love]

Maybe your more impressive "on paper" and in an interview than you are after a long exposure?

or maybe connections just don't play that big a role, or vary in importance from school to school😉

 

[Ischemic]

or maybe connections just don't play that big a role, or vary in importance from school to school😉

What a very logical and level-headed stance to have on the subject....

Now GTFO. We don't need your kind bringing LOGIC into these type of SDN arguments. 🙄

 

[gadad]

3 posts in 3 years?

Didn't have much to say.

 

[TooMuchResearch]

How many of you think that admission to medical school is mostly about who you know than what you know? After following a trend of recent discussions about honesty and integrity, I wonder how you pre-meds feel about people who play fair but have connections that guarantee either an interview and/or admission. I know a recent college graduate that was guaranteed interview even before she applied to dental school? I was shocked. A lot of us worry when it comes to reporting the accurate number of volunteer hours we did, but at the same time there is cheating on "high level". Any thoughts?

I don't.

 

[docelh]

If Jenna Bush ever enrolls in medical school, then the process is 100% rigged.

 

[amine2086]

How many of you think that admission to medical school is mostly about who you know than what you know? After following a trend of recent discussions about honesty and integrity, I wonder how you pre-meds feel about people who play fair but have connections that guarantee either an interview and/or admission. I know a recent college graduate that was guaranteed interview even before she applied to dental school? I was shocked. A lot of us worry when it comes to reporting the accurate number of volunteer hours we did, but at the same time there is cheating on "high level". Any thoughts?

Mostly, NO. Some, YES. Connection can help but there are plenty of people that get accepted to medical schools that they have NO connection with.

 

[Andy71600]

I have no connections where I was accepted

 

[TheSimple]

From what I nderstand, "connections" play a much stronger role in MD/PhD admissions than they do in straight MD or DMD. I understand that there may be some people who benefit from knowing the right people, but it probably isn't a significantly large group.

Edit: For jobs, residencies and promotions, networking/connections play a much larger role, and I don't see why they shouldn't. If I trusted a person and they assured me that applicant-X was good to work with and seemed bright, then I would be more likely to choose them over similarly qualified applicants.

I completely disagree with the MD/PhD statement. I have absolutely 0 connections at the MSTP that I will be matriculating to. While it never hurts to have connections, I don't think it will make or break your application for any program.

 

[Brown8472]

I don't think it's fair to claim that no connection = no admission... you can gain admission without having any connections in a place, and people do it all the time. However, it is easier when you have networking, for several reasons. If you have someone on the admissions committee who knows you and can truly be an advocate for you, then you'll have an easier time. It's not cheating, it's just a fact of life. You're also more likely to apply places where you have connections, because you can get a better feel for the place overall by seeing things as someone on the inside does, and that can help you present yourself to be a better fit for the school.

The key word is networking. People will know you, your personality and whether you will fit into a certain environment or not. That's only part of the application process so that is why they have an interview and check out your gpa, ec and lor to weed out the cookooes who may look great on paper but can only be trusted to do a frontal lobotomy.

Hey, I got interviewed and admitted at several schools and I had no connections and did not suck up to anyone. So the idea that no connection=no admission is just a devious way of thinking (call it jealousy or else....).

So stop smelling your armpits, you will get a headache. Oh Nooooo!😱😀

:troll:
​

 

[trep14]

I have no connections to the school I will be attending in the fall.

 

[Brown8472]

:troll:
​

 

[wagmanager]

*knowing people* is a way of life Being that med school admission has a degree of subjectivity to it, it can't really be called unethical.Hypothetically speaking,if there's a fix cut off eg mcat 15 and gpa 3.0, anybody above that can get admission for whatever reason- superb EC"S, research, knowing someone who knows someone. Every institution has 'friends of the university' . These people make huge donations and in gratitude one or two of their 'peeps' get in.

 

[carboxylWill]

In my personal experience, my connection sent me up **** creek without a paddle, and it was even for my state school. Keep in mind, any 1 person you talk to has to convince a room full of people who don't give a crap about you. Personally, I think connections only help if you're teetering on the edge of acceptance.

If Jenna Bush ever enrolls in medical school, then the process is 100% rigged.

LOL

...or Bristol Palin for that matter

 

[christina30]

Well MOST people that get accepted don't have connections - networking just won't hurt your application for sure.

No connections = no admission is a pretty ridiculous and untrue statement, though.

 

[Ischemic]

For those that are claiming unfairness for med school admissions because of connections you guys ain't seen nothing yet. Residency placements is ALL about fit and making those connections. That's why many 4th years do away rotations at places they might want to do residency in. These people want to know what YOU can do for the next 4-x years. They can either choose someone they KNOW works hard or some other kid that MAY seem competent because of some test score. Also, most residency directors tend to pick kids from schools that they have had good experience with previously over others that they may not know much about.

 

[ErmaBoBurma]

What a very logical and level-headed stance to have on the subject....

Now GTFO. We don't need your kind bringing LOGIC into these type of SDN arguments. 🙄

hahahahahah.... word 🙂

I think connections might make things a bit easier, but are no guarantee of success. For example, my friend is applying to school this year and he needed someone to shadow. His parents are both in medicine/research/generally know lots of people in this field. It was easy for him to find someone who would say he did a lot of shadowing without actually doing a lot of shadowing. I have no such connections coming from a rural-ish background in the midwest with parents who have nothing to do with this field and had to find people on my own, mostly by asking people who were more or less strangers.

It does suck not having connections and makes it seem like the system is unjust sometimes. However, I still got into some great schools on my own accord, and believe that anyone willing to put in the hard work and maybe throw themselves out there can do it too.

 

[rmaj79]

Would you consider a combined degree (BS/MD) a "connection"? Although with my stats and EC's Im confident I'd realistically be admitted through the normal route, 9'oclock news feature on my degree program called it "Free Ticket to Med School"...

 

[MossPoh]

The schools I had the strongest connections at were the ones I was rejected pre or post interview from.

Hell, one of the schools had money donated by my dad every year for nearly 40 years.

 

[GoSpursGo]

Having connections certainly do not hurt you, and they CAN certainly help you; I was accepted off of a waitlist from a school because I had worked there over the summer for two years and my PI basically beat down the admissions office doors to get me in.

However, I was accepted nearly 6 months earlier to another equally if not more prestigious school that I had no connections at. So those connections certainly do not guarantee you anything, and clearly a lack of connections also does not condemn you. It's just another part of your application that may or may not help put you over the top if you happen to have it.

 

[Cyradis]

A connection can either help or hurt you IMO... The way I see a connection is just another piece of information that is a part of your application (personally knowing you). Now, in most cases, that's a good thing since I'm going to go ahead and say most people applying to medicine are genuinely good, intelligent, caring people - so having a connection means the person KNOWS you are, rather than having to guess at it from marks/an 800 or whatever word essay.

If on the other hand - your "connection"'s experience with you was lukewarm - that will probably hurt your application.

I definitely know some people who thought their supervisor loved them who I know for a fact did not (i.e. the supervisor told me).

 

[BBender716]

I feel like this is much more true for prestigious undergrad institutions vs. prestigious medical schools. Again, to echo the sentiments of others here, not that it can't help you, just not as dramatically as with undergrad admissions. It makes sense because undergrads have more spots to play with than medical schools.

 

[psipsina]

Networking will forever be a part of your career. Its something you can take control of and I don't think its unfair because its a skill you need to develop in any career (not just medicine). Yes people may be born into some connections but its not impossible to make them without this little advantage. Legacy on the other hand somewhat bothers me and I personally did not utilize my own because of this. It drove my family crazy because it was a big name school and I refused to even apply. My acceptance meant much more to me knowing that I had gotten it entirely on my own merit (including my ability to network).

 

[IDoIt4Love]

What a very logical and level-headed stance to have on the subject....

Now GTFO. We don't need your kind bringing LOGIC into these type of SDN arguments. 🙄

lol, yes, heaven FORBID that having connections doesn't GUARANTEE your acceptance or interview offer at any given school...and heaven forbid you can actually get into med schools WITHOUT prior connections...

seriously people, sometimes money and connections help, but at the end of the day, it's up to admissions to listen to whoever your connection is who's pushing for you. if they don't want to, they don't have to. we all know they have no shortage of applicants to choose from...

 

[amygdaloideum]

How many of you think that admission to medical school is mostly about who you know than what you know? After following a trend of recent discussions about honesty and integrity, I wonder how you pre-meds feel about people who play fair but have connections that guarantee either an interview and/or admission. I know a recent college graduate that was guaranteed interview even before she applied to dental school? I was shocked. A lot of us worry when it comes to reporting the accurate number of volunteer hours we did, but at the same time there is cheating on "high level". Any thoughts?

If you're worried about connections, schedule a few meetings with some admissions people of medical schools you would like to attend. They will guide you to knowing what are the weak points of your application.

Another option is doing research, even if it's unpaid for some faculty. I've poured in hundreds of hours to "free research labor" hoping it will pay off when I apply... when you do a favor for an MD they're more generous with throwing your name on pubs, writing you recs and being that connection you feel you lack... Good luck. 👍

 

[riverjib]

How many of you think that admission to medical school is mostly about who you know than what you know? After following a trend of recent discussions about honesty and integrity, I wonder how you pre-meds feel about people who play fair but have connections that guarantee either an interview and/or admission. I know a recent college graduate that was guaranteed interview even before she applied to dental school? I was shocked. A lot of us worry when it comes to reporting the accurate number of volunteer hours we did, but at the same time there is cheating on "high level". Any thoughts?

Yup, it's life. Get used to it. I'm naive and stupid and never realized that people around me were cheating until tonight, when the director of my major (a mild-mannered guy) announced very strict rules about how our final exam was to be administered. Evidently, someone (or many people) have taken advantage of the relaxed attitude in our program. I never would have guessed that anyone would have cheated, but someone must have. People are screwed up.

 

[pavlovb]

Thank you all for the expressed opinions!

 

[Kanye West]

Whatever you do with your life, always remember:

"Your network is your net worth, and where there is a contact there is a contract"

You will go far.

 

[justdoit31]

I do believe networking has a part but the school I got into I had no connections with (except being from the area)... and the one that I had the best connections with (prominent physician talked to adcom members and wrote letter for me) didn't even give me an interview. Both schools were same "tier"and the one I didn't get the interview with was my state school while the one I did was OOS- who knows what happens in that process.

 

[bannie22]

if another applicant knows someone in the school. kudo to them. i would feel hard done, but i think they deserve it more than me... (unless of course that applicant is total garbage) but at this point in the game, we are all really similar in terms of ability

 

[heyyouyouyou]

i'd say that a good ~10-20% of your class will have gotten in based on their grades + MCAT + connections...

connections could be:
* a parent that attended the school
* a parent who is a doctor in the hospital
* the student followed some kind of hospital-connected pre-medical track, in which they were able to meet/work with people on the admission staff
* relative who is somehow connected to the admission staff


I had a 'distant relative' who was an emeritas prof, who was previously on the medical admission staff of a semi-prestigous school. i applied very late & got into that school quickly. i'm sure it was due to my 'connection.' i ended up not going there.

however, the other 80% of the students will have gotten in on their own, i believe...

 

[surftheiop]

i'd say that a good ~10-20% of your class will have gotten in based on their grades + MCAT + connections...

connections could be:
* a parent that attended the school
* a parent who is a doctor in the hospital
* the student followed some kind of hospital-connected pre-medical track, in which they were able to meet/work with people on the admission staff
* relative who is somehow connected to the admission staff


I had a 'distant relative' who was an emeritas prof, who was previously on the medical admission staff of a semi-prestigous school. i applied very late & got into that school quickly. i'm sure it was due to my 'connection.' i ended up not going there.

however, the other 80% of the students will have gotten in on their own, i believe...

I think the bolded is an important point

"Connections" probably serve a similar purpose of EC's, something that can separate you from a ton of people with the same numbers.

 

[tncekm]

How many of you think that admission to medical school is mostly about who you know than what you know? After following a trend of recent discussions about honesty and integrity, I wonder how you pre-meds feel about people who play fair but have connections that guarantee either an interview and/or admission. I know a recent college graduate that was guaranteed interview even before she applied to dental school? I was shocked. A lot of us worry when it comes to reporting the accurate number of volunteer hours we did, but at the same time there is cheating on "high level". Any thoughts?

Not even close. Sure, it may help some people, but I knew absolutely nobody in medicine (didn't even know any physicians, etc., let alone have "connections"). Most people, the vasssstttt majority, don't have connections to get them in.

 

[Maneuver]

How many of you think that admission to medical school is mostly about who you know than what you know? After following a trend of recent discussions about honesty and integrity, I wonder how you pre-meds feel about people who play fair but have connections that guarantee either an interview and/or admission. I know a recent college graduate that was guaranteed interview even before she applied to dental school? I was shocked. A lot of us worry when it comes to reporting the accurate number of volunteer hours we did, but at the same time there is cheating on "high level". Any thoughts?

A friend of mine got into University of Washington, but no other schools, because [according to him] his parents attended medical school there.

He ended up not going to medical school and pursuing something else

Connections don't matter too much if you are really good. Your achievements will make up for any lack of familial connection. They really do wonders if you're a bum though...

 

[NotAsking4Much]

Connections make a difference for sure. Are they going to vault you to the top when you're completely unqualified. No.

But when you have similar stats and life experiences and accomplishments as 100 other applicants or more (which given how many applications they are, this is easily possible) - that connection is what will distinguish you from the other 100.

Is it unfair? From a pure ethical standpoint, probably yes.

But that's how the world is and has been for its entire history, and if you were the adcom looking at 100 applicants remarkably similar and you knew one of them personally, you would take him/her yourself.