I think that it depends a lot on the other components of the OPs app. If he/she is at Harvard or Hopkins and/or had 15 publications, 260 etc. they would probably still match. But ortho is very unforgiving.
I planned on taking a gap year for research and dual applying anyway, but with so many qualified people I have difficulty seeing how a PD would pick my application over all the other apps that are just like mine - but without that blemish.
The most costly thing would be not matching, so I'll figure it out.
Ortho is one of the fields least likely to see significant cuts.
I'd absolutely advise meeting with them if possible. They'll be an excellent resource.
No one fails a rotation at t5’s. The worst is you have to remediate some part of it and there will be no record of it either. That’s one of the advantages of going to a top place. They try their best to not hinder you in any way. Remediation is never mentioned in MSPE or transcript and the way they let you pass through remediation is unspeakably lenient.
The school has agreed strike my failure off the record provided I pass the shelf exam. However the highest grade I would be guaranteed is a Pass (vs. High Pass or Honors).
a lot better than a remediation on record.
Not a red flag. You just dodged a massive bullet. Knuckle down and pass that shelf exam and move on. Honor/High Pass as much other stuff as you can, but this one Pass won't sink you.
How does dual applying actually work? I've heard you can't apply to two residencies at the same institution (technically you can, but the risk of them hearing you've applied for two is too high and then neither will take you)...not sure how true any of that is
PDs in unrelated fields at the same institution are less likely to talk to one another. There may be some cross-talk between those in similar fields, but the overall risk tends to be lower than the perception it'll tank your chance at either program at the institution, IMO.
FM (or other adult primary care) pay isn't that low anymore. CMS has been slowly increasing reimbursements for outpatient primary care over the years to get more people to do it. Once you factor in the additional training time most surgery require (5-7 years vs 3 years for FM or IM), the long hours typically worked during training and as an attending by a surgeon, taxes (most physicians are in the 35% federal tax bracket and add state taxes and Medicare taxes on top of that), and the high malpractice premiums paid by surgical specialties as a whole (often upwards of $100k-200k in high risk surgical specialties), surgical specialties who are employed only make a bit more per hour in most cases than employed primary care counterparts. And they will be financially behind primary care specialties the first few years out of training due to their longer training times.
I think that this is somewhat understood but more and more people may be looking towards “moat” specialties that will retain high pay despite the barrage of full practice legislation
Sorry bone bro. You sound like a good dude, and I'm sure you'll find the aspects you liked about ortho in another specialty.
The percentile data was from clerkship grades only as that's how our school ranks students (and it will be included in the MSPE). It wasn't a holistic overview, but nobody in the bottom half of the class has ever matched this past decade.
One life... worth an attempt in my eyes. Why settle?
very kind of the captain of the 1st division to drop by
I would take anything a dean tells you with a grain of salt. They often give advice from the perspective of trying to protect their stats. One P does not a failure applicant make…
What are your boards like? Or are you in the P/F cohort? I'm in less prestigious field but the two programs I've been at we were boards>>>class rank for interviews and personality=>board scores>>>class rank. Class ranks are so variable from school as to be somewhat nebulous in meaning and questionable in value, as a student with an excellent rank at one school may have a terrible one in another. There's gotta be some ortho programs that look at it the same way.
Because fields like Rads and Anesthesia are no longer shoo ins, even if they aren't competitive on the level of ortho. If OPs application smells too much like dual app, it may tank his chances for his back up specialty. Also going full send ortho and then likely ending up having to reapply next cycle as a former graduate instead of current senior is not a good time and is an automatic red flag at a lot of places.
So I agree with everyone that you need to be very careful before you decide to dual-apply. However, presumably you are currently below the 50th percentile RIGHT NOW. If you get all Honors on your remaining rotations, how high could you rise? What about various mixes of H/HP?
Endorse. Have a friend going through this right now - she didn't take an LOA for financial reasons and now might be out of medicine entirely. Heartbreaking.
Having read your posts, you seem extremely down to earth bud. I would go down radiology, be amazing at it, and if you don’t like it because it’s too boring for you then go deep into IR. I cannot fathom that if you have this risk averse attitude and that you have the maturity to accept that this is a little dangerous to persist, that you would not be happy going down the radiology path.
That sucks. Then I agree, unless you have very high risk tolerance a change in specialty is likely a good idea
Respectfully, you have no idea how the residency matching process works in the United States or how competitive orthopedic surgery residency programs are. This advice would not be in the OP’s best interest
You know what? You're right, I don't have the same insight as you. What I do know is that those specialties are competitive anywhere in the world (Respectfully, to get into general surgery where I live u need, yes need, a PhD and at least 2 years of clinical experience. So that's like 5-6 years u gotta invest to just get in the residency)
Urology is a surgical subspecialty and is also very competitive. IR is highly competitive,
I would say that class rank is indeed much more important than the other factors. It is really hard to overcome because the successful applicants will have all of those characteristics, plus the higher class rank. Whether class rank can be overcome, I think depends on your institution. In this case, the OP said the last time someone matched from the bottom 50% was 2011, so it seems like it is very difficult to overcome from his institution.
