non-traditional pre-med what courses to take?

[medtool]

I'm a non-traditional pre-med and have been working for 9 years after graduating with a degree in biology and engineering. My current work is very much related to molecular biology research, so I have not been totally out of touch with biology and sciences for the past few years. More recently, I have taken graduate courses in molecular biology and physiology. Since medical schools advise nontraditional applicants to demonstrate success in course work taken recently, I want to ask what kind of courses would you recommend someone like myself to take to strength my application to medical school ? I feel there are three types of courses I can take:

1. more upper level and graduate level courses (pathophysiology, pharmacology, pathology, etc)
   
2. refresh course in basic courses (biology, chemistry, organic chemistry etc) that are minimum course requirement for most medical school --- however, I have taken all these required courses in the past.
3. humanities and/or social science courses at undergraduate level (psychology, sociology, etc).

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[kraskadva]

Hi 🙂
You'll have to give some more background first.
-What was your undergrad gpa & science gpa?
-Did you do well in the basic classes (i.e. A or B)? Including Physics?
-Have you taken an MCAT practice test?
-What is the timeline you have in mind? i.e. when are you thinking of taking the MCAT and applying?

 

[medtool]

my undergrad gpa was 3.60 and BCMP gpa was 3.62 . For the biology-related graduate courses I have taken within the past 5 years, my gpa was 3.84

For basic sciences: general chemistry, organic chemistry, calculus, physics, I got A for these courses.
I did well in courses in general physics with grades of A.

With biology, I got AP credit for general biology, and I then took upper-level courses including biochemistry, microbiology, neurobiology, molecular biology, genetics, and other biology courses with grades range from A to C, my gpa for all the bio-undergraduate courses was 3.12.
These bio undergra grades were not ideal, but I feel the biology graduate courses I have taken in recent semesters show that I have improved in this area over the years.

I have not taken MCAT practice test recently. when I took the test a few years ago, my score was PS:10, BS:9, VR:8. do you think taking the MCAT practice test will help to pinpoint any academic area I need to improve?

I definitely will need to retake the MCAT to apply to medial school. With the upcoming changes to MCAT format next year, I feel I should either take the exam before 1/2015 or wait until 2016. With the limited amount of time I have between now and 1/2015, I'm more leaning toward taking the exam in 2016.

Given my situation, is taken more basic science courses and/or social science/humanities courses really going to help me much to better prepare for MCAT and medical school in general?

 

[kraskadva]

In terms of preparing for the MCAT...
It sounds to me like you*** could probably self study and take it before January. I would take a practice test, and for you I would recommend one of the newer exams (8-11) that you pay for ($35) instead of the free one (#3). The AAMC tests have a diagnostic that will help you identify what you need to brush up on. The AAMC website has topic lists for what material can appear on the MCAT, which you can use as study guides.

***For future readers, this is not general advice, but specific to someone who's had all the classes and works in science.

In terms of recent course work/applying to med school...
Typically we'll say around here that a grad gpa won't rescue an ug gpa, but yours isn't bad to start with. Also you're trying to show recent work, not repair a gpa. And having taken many of the upper levels that would be generally advised, I'm not sure what's left for you other than grad courses.

Do you have a grad degree already? Or are you in a grad program now? If not, you'd be applying soon if you want to start in the spring.

 

[medtool]

thanks for your rely, kraskadva

I'm contemplating to get a graduate degree. with the graduate courses I've taken, it makes sense that I should obtain a master degree before entering medical school. would medical school view an applicant less favorable if the applicant has taken quite a few graduate courses without eventually obtaining a graduate-level degree?

just a few follow-up questions:

in terms of having nontraditional applicants to demonstrate success in course work taken recently, how "recent" the course works have to be or should be? for example, I took some courses 5 or 4 years ago, will those courses count less than courses I took in spring of this year (2014)?

If I choose to wait to take MCAT in 2015 or 2016, I probably will not be able to take any more courses in the next 1 or 2 years since I have taken most courses available. how would it be possible for me to demonstrate success in course work taken recently in the next 1 or 2 years? will medical school insist that applicant like myself to take courses right up to the entering-year I apply for admission?

I understand there is a time limit that the mcat score can be considered for medical school application. what is the time limit ? is it 3 or 4 years?

is it true that the graduate courses are not incorporated in the GPA calculation by medical school admission committee and the AMCAS application?

 

[kraskadva]

thanks for your rely, kraskadva

I'm contemplating to get a graduate degree. with the graduate courses I've taken, it makes sense that I should obtain a master degree before entering medical school. would medical school view an applicant less favorable if the applicant has taken quite a few graduate courses without eventually obtaining a graduate-level degree?

just a few follow-up questions:

in terms of having nontraditional applicants to demonstrate success in course work taken recently, how "recent" the course works have to be or should be? for example, I took some courses 5 or 4 years ago, will those courses count less than courses I took in spring of this year (2014)?

If I choose to wait to take MCAT in 2015 or 2016, I probably will not be able to take any more courses in the next 1 or 2 years since I have taken most courses available. how would it be possible for me to demonstrate success in course work taken recently in the next 1 or 2 years? will medical school insist that applicant like myself to take courses right up to the entering-year I apply for admission?

This I can't really answer for you since I'm not an adcom, but maybe @QofQuimica or @Goro will chime in.

I understand there is a time limit that the mcat score can be considered for medical school application. what is the time limit ? is it 3 or 4 years?

is it true that the graduate courses are not incorporated in the GPA calculation by medical school admission committee and the AMCAS application?

There is a time limit on MCAT scores, typically 3 years, though this can vary some school to school and maybe will shift with the new MCAT coming into play. Currently 3 years is typical though.

Grad work will be shown on your AMCAS, but separately from UG. The gpas are also calculated separately. But post-bacc work at the UG level is calculated with your ug gpa.

 

[QofQuimica]

thanks for your rely, kraskadva

I'm contemplating to get a graduate degree. with the graduate courses I've taken, it makes sense that I should obtain a master degree before entering medical school. would medical school view an applicant less favorable if the applicant has taken quite a few graduate courses without eventually obtaining a graduate-level degree?

Are you in a graduate program, or just taking some random classes out of interest? If it's the former, the ideal would be to get your degree. If it's the latter, I'd suggest getting the degree if it's not a large imposition on you time-wise and financially, but it's not absolutely necessary.

just a few follow-up questions:

in terms of having nontraditional applicants to demonstrate success in course work taken recently, how "recent" the course works have to be or should be? for example, I took some courses 5 or 4 years ago, will those courses count less than courses I took in spring of this year (2014)?

Every school sets its own policy, but courses taken within the past 3-5 years are probably fine at most schools.

If I choose to wait to take MCAT in 2015 or 2016, I probably will not be able to take any more courses in the next 1 or 2 years since I have taken most courses available. how would it be possible for me to demonstrate success in course work taken recently in the next 1 or 2 years? will medical school insist that applicant like myself to take courses right up to the entering-year I apply for admission?

No.

I understand there is a time limit that the mcat score can be considered for medical school application. what is the time limit ? is it 3 or 4 years?

Usually three years at most schools.

is it true that the graduate courses are not incorporated in the GPA calculation by medical school admission committee and the AMCAS application?

They are not incorporated into your UG GPA, which is what many schools use when screening applicants. However, AMCAS does report grad grades as a separate GPA.

If I may be so bold as to make a suggestion, you may want to consider taking some humanities or social science classes that require intensive reading and writing in English. Your posts come across as being written by a non-native speaker, and improved fluency in written English would likely help you perform better on the MCAT as well.

 

[Goro]

OP, your GPA numbers are nicely competitive.


Yes.
Do you think taking the MCAT practice test will help to pinpoint any academic area I need to improve?


Only you can answer this. Take as many diagnostics as needed, to see if you have any deficits.

I definitely will need to retake the MCAT to apply to medial school. With the upcoming changes to MCAT format next year, I feel I should either take the exam before 1/2015 or wait until 2016. With the limited amount of time I have between now and 1/2015, I'm more leaning toward taking the exam in 2016.

Given my situation, is taken more basic science courses and/or social science/humanities courses really going to help me much to better prepare for MCAT and medical school in general?[/QUOTE]

 

[mavric1298]

Also, if you are taking the new MCAT, it opens up some classes that you'll need to take if you haven't; Biochem (assuming you have) but you'll be adding some psych and soc classes. Yes the basic intro classes should provide enough for MCAT, but if you are running out of classes, you could do a psych/soc based course load and get something more out of it as well.

 

[medtool]

Are you in a graduate program, or just taking some random classes out of interest? If it's the former, the ideal would be to get your degree. If it's the latter, I'd suggest getting the degree if it's not a large imposition on you time-wise and financially, but it's not absolutely necessary.


Every school sets its own policy, but courses taken within the past 3-5 years are probably fine at most schools.


No.


Usually three years at most schools.


They are not incorporated into your UG GPA, which is what many schools use when screening applicants. However, AMCAS does report grad grades as a separate GPA.

If I may be so bold as to make a suggestion, you may want to consider taking some humanities or social science classes that require intensive reading and writing in English. Your posts come across as being written by a non-native speaker, and improved fluency in written English would likely help you perform better on the MCAT as well.

very well said. I never mean to discount the importance of humanities/social science classes. For example, I like to read about European history, but due to lake of time and financial resources, I haven't been given too much thought on taking a history class in the past few years.

That being said, is it possible for a non-traditional applicant to gain exposure to humanities/social science and to improve english reading/writing skills without formally taking an academic course?

 

[medtool]

thank you for all of your response so far, I'm glad to be able to ask questions and to hear what you think about my situation.

I have a followed-up question that is related to my original post:

since I graduated from my BS degree in biology and engineering, I have not taken any more class in general physic and chemistry. I got A's for general physics and chemistry when I took them as a 1st/2nd year undergraduate student. Nine years have passed, and the graduate-level courses I have taken in the past 4-5 years are all related to biological sciences and math ( although biochemistry may be an exception since it is grouped under chemistry course category according to AMCAS).

To meet the pre-medical course requirement of most medical schools, is it likely that the medical school admission committee will ask me to retake classes in first-year general physics and general chemistry? Or will it depend on a case by case basis?

I searched for similar topic in the forum, but I seem to get a mixed response from past discussion.

 

[hawkbit]

Not necessarily case by case, but school by school. Some schools want all pre-requisites within a certain amount of time, some just want some recent (within the last two years) coursework to show current grade trends. I would probably not retake those courses if I were in your position, unless you have certain schools you want to get into that require recent classes. You will have to brush up on that content for the MCAT though. A great resource to check out for more information about what medical schools accept would be the MSAR (just do a google search for MSAR AAMC).