Nonclinical volunteering?

[phonyreal98]

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Judging by the discussion on the MD only forum, it almost seems that nonclinical volunteering almost seems like an unwritten requirement for MD only, is this the case for MD/PhD? I assume not since it seems like you only need a minimal amount of clinical volunteering (compared to MD only) but just trying to make sure.

 

[Neuronix]

nonclinical volunteering almost seems like an unwritten requirement for MD only, is this the case for MD/PhD?

Research = nonclinical volunteering

 

[phonyreal98]

Sorry, should have clarified, I meant something that should be classified as non-clinical community service/non-clinical volunteering on AMCAS.

 

[SBR249]

It would be wrong, I think, to say that adcoms don't care about community service. However, it is not as important for MD/PhD. If you need to choose between research and almost anything else, then research usually wins.

 

[PfNO22]

You should do cummunity service and hopefully you'll like it and then you'll do it the rest of your life and you'll make the world a better place. If you hate it, try to find out why. If it's because you don't like helping people then......😱


👍

 

[phonyreal98]

You should do cummunity service and hopefully you'll like it and then you'll do it the rest of your life and you'll make the world a better place. If you hate it, try to find out why. If it's because you don't like helping people then......😱


👍

Hahaha no, it's that I don't have a lot of it...and the reason I don't have a lot of it isn't so much that I don't like helping people, but that I haven't had time due to research and other things

 

[StoicJosher]

Hahaha no, it's that I don't have a lot of it...and the reason I don't have a lot of it isn't so much that I don't like helping people, but that I haven't had time due to research and other things

👍

It sucks that community service (when applying for medical school) is seen as a sign of extended altruism. I know lots of people who force themselves through it just to list it on AMCAS. Not everyone volunteers because they like helping people and not everyone who doesn't volunteer hates helping people. I didn't have any non clinical volunteering when I applied - I was too busy with research and school. I don't think it will hold you back much when it comes to MD/PhD.

 

[K31]

It would be wrong, I think, to say that adcoms don't care about community service. However, it is not as important for MD/PhD. If you need to choose between research and almost anything else, then research usually wins.

I don't think it would be wrong to say that. In my experience with MD/PhD admissions, research and academics are really all that matters as long as you can convince us you're not a psychopath.

On the other hand, I don't think a lot of non-clinical volunteering is going to hurt you. Large amounts of clinical volunteering may though, as some interviewers may think that you are too clinically oriented and not truly dedicated to a majority-research career.

 

[SBR249]

I don't think it would be wrong to say that. In my experience with MD/PhD admissions, research and academics are really all that matters as long as you can convince us you're not a psychopath.

On the other hand, I don't think a lot of non-clinical volunteering is going to hurt you. Large amounts of clinical volunteering may though, as some interviewers may think that you are too clinically oriented and not truly dedicated to a majority-research career.

I think we just have different ways of phrasing the same thing. My original meaning was that the adcoms would take note if it was on the app but probably wouldn't bat an eye if it wasn't.

 

[StoicJosher]

I don't think it would be wrong to say that. In my experience with MD/PhD admissions, research and academics are really all that matters as long as you can convince us you're not a psychopath.

On the other hand, I don't think a lot of non-clinical volunteering is going to hurt you. Large amounts of clinical volunteering may though, as some interviewers may think that you are too clinically oriented and not truly dedicated to a majority-research career.

I don't know if I completely agree. Especially since there are schools that have the school of medicine make an independent decision about the MD acceptance before extending an MD/PhD acceptance. Of course, being an MD/PhD candidate gives you a little leeway when it comes to the MD admissions but being devoid of clinical/volunteering experience will probably be an app-kill.

 

[phonyreal98]

Would I be OK with tutoring kids at my local high school 1-2 hours a week for 3 months?

 

[K31]

I don't know if I completely agree. Especially since there are schools that have the school of medicine make an independent decision about the MD acceptance before extending an MD/PhD acceptance. Of course, being an MD/PhD candidate gives you a little leeway when it comes to the MD admissions but being devoid of clinical/volunteering experience will probably be an app-kill.

You are correct about that, and that's a point I failed to make in my post. I'm at a school where the MD program also has to OK the applicants. This means that 1) we are (mostly) only evaluating an applicant's likelihood of success as an MD/PhD student, not their motivation for becoming a physician, and 2) the applicant needs to have at least minimal clinical experience to be acceptable to the med school (although the MD side knows they are a MD/PhD applicant and they are held to a different standard than MD applicants).

 

[K31]

Would I be OK with tutoring kids at my local high school 1-2 hours a week for 3 months?

If you want to do it, go ahead and do it--just don't expect it to make a difference either way in admissions.

 

[mytirf]

I don't know if I completely agree. Especially since there are schools that have the school of medicine make an independent decision about the MD acceptance before extending an MD/PhD acceptance. Of course, being an MD/PhD candidate gives you a little leeway when it comes to the MD admissions but being devoid of clinical/volunteering experience will probably be an app-kill.

Several schools I applied to, were separate MD and PhD programs. I did not have one minute of volunteering or candy stripping or shadowing of physicians. I had no clue that it was important and it wasn't something that I did naturally. And frankly that is the case...what you actually like doing and have a passion for is most important. If you begrudgingly go to a nursing home once a week and hate it, that will show on your application, even if you've been doing it forever. Admission committees are not stupid and can instantly see through applicants that have done something, just to stick it on their application. Do it because you want to, not because you feel like you have to.

And certainly don't post how much you hate volunteering at the after school program for blind children on your Facebook page.

- my 2c

 

[StoicJosher]

Several schools I applied to, were separate MD and PhD programs. I did not have one minute of volunteering or candy stripping or shadowing of physicians. I had no clue that it was important and it wasn't something that I did naturally. And frankly that is the case...what you actually like doing and have a passion for is most important. If you begrudgingly go to a nursing home once a week and hate it, that will show on your application, even if you've been doing it forever. Admission committees are not stupid and can instantly see through applicants that have done something, just to stick it on their application. Do it because you want to, not because you feel like you have to.

And certainly don't post how much you hate volunteering at the after school program for blind children on your Facebook page.

- my 2c

I had a discussion about this in another thread and I will just copy, paste and modify my reply from that thread.

I agree that it is not about the hours but about what you got out of the experience. I also agree that adcoms might be able to see through fluff at times. And I am glad you got into medical school with no volunteering/shadowing/candy stripping. But, you were an exception to the rule and I am sure there are other exceptions to the rule - but the rule is there for a reason. Medical school admissions is still largely a numbers game and my post was based on an objective ideal case scenario. Of course - there is leeway with MD/PhD candidates.

I didn't make the rules - I just play the game. 🙂