NORML co-founder on application?

[fridayed]

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Hey, me and some other people got together and started a NORML chapter at my school (this is our sophomore year). No, I've never been a marijuana smoker, and I never plan to be. I've felt this way since long before we decided to start the chapter.

On my end, there were two main reasons I decided to get involved:

1. I feel like medical marijuana is a very valid thing that needs to legalized, or at least more thoroughly investigated by the federal government.
2. I have family members dependent on alcohol, cigarettes, and/or marijuana. While the former two are legal, these are the two addictions that have caused by far the most harm on the family and individual. None of my relatives who are dependent on marijuana have had especially negative consequences come from it (though the negative consequences are definitely there, it's not destructive in the way the alcohol/cigarettes have been).

Of course, our focus is mainly on educating people about various facts and research on marijuana (current policies, statistics on imprisonment, effects of marijuana), allowing them to decide for themselves whether or not they're for legalization--though we generally feel like if people have this information, they'll identify with the cause of legalization.

This is something I'd really like to continue being involved in, but I have two questions:

1. How will medical schools look like this, and should I include it in my application? I understand in the past where it may have been viewed negatively, but what about now, when many (maybe even most) well-known doctors are advocates for marijuana and we even have two states that have flat-out legalized it? Will it be viewed as a positive example of commitment and community involvement, or as a red flag? I'd hate to be viewed as a pot head, especially when I actually feel very strongly about not using marijuana for my own personal reasons.

2. If I shouldn't risk putting it on my application, how much time can I justify spending on it? I wouldn't want to spend, say, 10 hours a week dedicated to NORML--around 300 hours a schoolyear--and erase that time and thus make it seem like I just didn't do as much in ECs as I could have and goofed off.

 

[clothcut]

as absurdly unjustifiable and pathetic the demonization of marijuana (and subsequently the war on drugs) is, marijuana is still classified as a controlled substance. tread lightly, and realize that much of the existing medical community is of a past generation which may still have lingering reservations about the sticky-icky (even amidst scientific studies debunking many misconceptions about it). w/ the med school app process being such a high-stakes game, do you really want to potentially jeopardize your chances off of a mentioned EC? i'd play it safe and avoid mentioning it.

 

[Goro]

Suggest not mentioning this. You can't risk having interviewers who take a dim view of drugs of abuse.

Hey, me and some other people got together and started a NORML chapter at my school (this is our sophomore year). No, I've never been a marijuana smoker, and I never plan to be. I've felt this way since long before we decided to start the chapter.

On my end, there were two main reasons I decided to get involved:

1. I feel like medical marijuana is a very valid thing that needs to legalized, or at least more thoroughly investigated by the federal government.
2. I have family members dependent on alcohol, cigarettes, and/or marijuana. While the former two are legal, these are the two addictions that have caused by far the most harm on the family and individual. None of my relatives who are dependent on marijuana have had especially negative consequences come from it (though the negative consequences are definitely there, it's not destructive in the way the alcohol/cigarettes have been).

Of course, our focus is mainly on educating people about various facts and research on marijuana (current policies, statistics on imprisonment, effects of marijuana), allowing them to decide for themselves whether or not they're for legalization--though we generally feel like if people have this information, they'll identify with the cause of legalization.

This is something I'd really like to continue being involved in, but I have two questions:

1. How will medical schools look like this, and should I include it in my application? I understand in the past where it may have been viewed negatively, but what about now, when many (maybe even most) well-known doctors are advocates for marijuana and we even have two states that have flat-out legalized it? Will it be viewed as a positive example of commitment and community involvement, or as a red flag? I'd hate to be viewed as a pot head, especially when I actually feel very strongly about not using marijuana for my own personal reasons.

2. If I shouldn't risk putting it on my application, how much time can I justify spending on it? I wouldn't want to spend, say, 10 hours a week dedicated to NORML--around 300 hours a schoolyear--and erase that time and thus make it seem like I just didn't do as much in ECs as I could have and goofed off.

 

[Ismet]

Medicine is largely a conservative profession. Don't jeopardize anything by putting that on your app.

 

[AndyB]

I would include it. It's something you are passionate about and have spent much of your free time on. Will some screener decide that it's a red flag? Possibly. Will it come up in an interview? You should hope it does, so you have an opportunity to speak knowledgablely and eloquently about something that you're passionate about.

Don't pander to what you think people want to see/don't want to see. at the end of the day, we dont know who is reading our apps. It could be the very thing that makes you stand out. Be yourself.

It would piqué my interest if I were reading your app. Good luck.

 

[AndyB]

I'd add that in this process (and in life) there are many temptations to take the conservative approach because it's easier to fly under the radar/to fit in. You know this already -- you started a NORML chapter. If you're interested in medical marijuana and want to be an advocate for it's legalization and use in your career, there's going to be even more pressure to stifle that passion. Of course, the right reaction is to be proud of and true to your beliefs/passions.

 

[Kinch]

I would probably not list it, the only reason I might would be to highlight any significant accomplishments made.

 

[ES2]

I think the majority of young professionals (including doctors) favor marijuana legalization or reformation; however, you never know who may be reviewing your application. You might want to sit on this one and think about it.

 

[NontradCA]

Medicine is largely a conservative profession. Don't jeopardize anything by putting that on your app.

All the interviewers I have met have been overwhelmingly liberal.

 

[Mr Avante]

Fridayed,

Wut u doin,​

Fridayed,

Stahp​

 

[NontradCA]

Also, OP. If you do a search this exact same question has been answered before.

 

[Ismet]

All the interviewers I have met have been overwhelmingly liberal.

And what's your sample size on that?

It varies, of course, especially with age, potentially with where the school is located and maybe even what specialty your interviewer was in. It's still not something you should risk by putting it on your app.

 

[Mr Avante]

All the interviewers I have met have been overwhelmingly liberal.

and the rest of the committee?

 

[kami333]

All the interviewers I have met have been overwhelmingly liberal.

There's a difference between being liberal and being stupid/naive.

As a professional, your name is your brand. Protect it. While it might be ok to come out for legalization etc once you are established and have the credentials to back it up, to do so at the start of your career (or even before) is not the smartest thing to do.

 

[NontradCA]

There's a difference between being liberal and being stupid/naive.

As a professional, your name is your brand. Protect it. While it might be ok to come out for legalization etc once you are established and have the credentials to back it up, to do so at the start of your career (or even before) is not the smartest thing to do.

K.

 

[acceptedMD18]

OP, you need to understand that being involved with NORML in any way SCREAMS pothead. You may not be, but if you tell people you started a NORML chapter they're going to assume you smoke trees on the daily. As others have said, medicine is still a conservative profession and medical schools put professionalism above all else. Putting anything related to drugs on an application, even if it demonstrates leadership or whatever, isn't a high risk/low reward deal- it's suicide.

You gotta take a Sanjay Gupta approach man. Wait until you're an established doc with CNN-level cred (haha) before you start touting the wonders of marijuana.

 

[NontradCA]

And what's your sample size on that?

It varies, of course, especially with age, potentially with where the school is located and maybe even what specialty your interviewer was in. It's still not something you should risk by putting it on your app.

21 interviewers from the east coast, south, west coast and Midwest. I got the impression that med school faculty were liberal. But yes you're right, I'm sure it varies.

Not advocating the OP disclose any drug involvement. It's a no-brainer.

 

[NontradCA]

and the rest of the committee?

Who knows?

 

[Ismet]

Who knows?

Exactly.

 

[AndyB]

It's the exact attitude presented by a lot of the people on this thread which prevents the US from having a cogent, reasonable drug policy. Incidentally, it's also the reason why organizations like NORML exist.

This business about "being involved with NORML in any way SCREAMS pothead" and 'it might be ok to come out for legalization etc once you are established and have the credentials to back it up' is such utter, cynical, narrow-minded garbage. It's an impediment to science and to progressive thinking in general.

As I said before, I can only imagine that the pressure to not be involved in public policy relating to currently illegal drugs and in research into therapeutic uses for these drugs will only increase as you move through medical school. Take a look at Dr. Rich Strassman, for example.

Once again, the pressure to not be yourself in this process is pretty huge. My guess is that if you're someone who follows his/her passions, that will resonate with some medical schools.

 

[NontradCA]

Exactly.

Lolwut. What are you insinuating here ?

 

[acceptedMD18]

It's the exact attitude presented by a lot of the people on this thread which prevents the US from having a cogent, reasonable drug policy. Incidentally, it's also the reason why organizations like NORML exist.

This business about "being involved with NORML in any way SCREAMS pothead" and 'it might be ok to come out for legalization etc once you are established and have the credentials to back it up' is such utter, cynical, narrow-minded garbage. It's an impediment to science and to progressive thinking in general.

It may be cynical, but it's the truth. Err on the side of caution until you get in. I love weed, but in professional settings I don't tell people about it because they may not.

 

[NontradCA]

It may be cynical, but it's the truth. Err on the side of caution until you get in. I love weed, but in professional settings I don't tell people about it because they may not.

 

[terp720]

Lolwut. What are you insinuating here ?

She's saying that there are other people on the committee, not just the interviewers who you felt seemed liberal. Since you don't know about the other people on the committee (as you said, "who knows?"), you can't assume they are all liberal.

 

[NontradCA]

She's saying that there are other people on the committee, not just the interviewers who you felt seemed liberal. Since you don't know about the other people on the committee (as you said, "who knows?"), you can't assume they are all liberal.

Yes, because I just happened to interview with the minority of interviewers at 10 different schools. Makes a lot of sense.

Also, and Mr. Avante and Ismet know? I know they don't teach common sense in Med School, but... We can't assume they're liberal, but we can assume they're conservative.

 

[Lollygag]

Agreed that you should definitely not mention it. I think the harm it can cause far outweighs any benefits.

And unless it is very evident that you did absolutely nothing else that year, I doubt an adcom would think you were "slacking". If you had a couple extracurriculars going on you could always say you wanted to focus on your school work or were studying for the MCAT (if you were).

 

[Ismet]

Also, and Mr. Avante and Ismet know? I know they don't teach common sense in Med School, but... We can't assume they're liberal, but we can assume they're conservative.

Uhh not sure why you felt the need to throw the common sense comment in there, but yes, to be safe, assume that the adcom is conservative. I have more experience than interacting with 10 interviewers, and while the face of medicine is slowly changing, it's still quite conservative. Other adcom members and docs on SDN have said this before as well.

 

[Ismet]

Yes, because I just happened to interview with the minority of interviewers at 10 different schools. Makes a lot of sense.

Also like I said before, it makes a difference where you're interviewing. Most of my interviews were at east coast suburban schools. I'd say more than half of my interviewers came off as more conservative or moderate than came off as liberal. I never interviewed on the west coast, but I'd imagine things would be more liberal over there. Also can vary based on the age of the interviewer.

 

[NontradCA]

Uhh not sure why you felt the need to throw the common sense comment in there, but yes, to be safe, assume that the adcom is conservative. I have more experience than interacting with 10 interviewers, and while the face of medicine is slowly changing, it's still quite conservative. Other adcom members and docs on SDN have said this before as well.

Oh, only med students can be snarky. Check. Also, I said 20 interviewers at 10 schools; my original comment was an error. Not ALL of them were liberal (they might have been but I could not explicitly say so), I think location probably has something to do with it it sure. I agree that you will find medicine as a whole to be conservative, but at the med school level I'd imagine it's quite liberal.

 

[deleted303591]

I am a supporter of the use of medical marijuana, in certain circumstances.

I was even prescribed synthetic THC pills (called Marinol, available by Rx in all 50 states), at certain points of time, for chronic nausea and vomiting due to a digestive issue I have.

I have to say that putting down anything related to NORML or anything remotely related to marijuana, legal or illegal, is a bad idea, and is way too risky.

 

[Mr Avante]

Yes, because I just happened to interview with the minority of interviewers at 10 different schools. Makes a lot of sense.

Also, and Mr. Avante and Ismet know? I know they don't teach common sense in Med School, but... We can't assume they're liberal, but we can assume they're conservative.

The majority of the members vote with a purist mentality.
To challenge a tradition is to covet the loss of your seat.

 

[NontradCA]

The majority of the members vote with a purist mentality.
To challenge a tradition is to covet the loss of your seat.

Purist mentality? Do you even know what that means?

 

[Barcu]

The issue that people have failed to mention is that weed is still illegal. If you get caught with it, you may face drug charges that would make it hard to get a medical license. You also cannot get federal student loans if you have a drug charge on record. No school would want to take the risk of a student not being able to get a license or not being able to pay for school.

OP. I know you said you don't smoke. But it's not unreasonable for a person to assume someone involved in NORML would smoke weed. Even if the adcom is in favor of legalization, a student getting caught with pot could end poorly for the school. They would try to avoid that. So, I would not list it.

 

[jm192]

OP, you need to understand that being involved with NORML in any way SCREAMS pothead. You may not be, but if you tell people you started a NORML chapter they're going to assume you smoke trees on the daily. As others have said, medicine is still a conservative profession and medical schools put professionalism above all else. Putting anything related to drugs on an application, even if it demonstrates leadership or whatever, isn't a high risk/low reward deal- it's suicide.

You gotta take a Sanjay Gupta approach man. Wait until you're an established doc with CNN-level cred (haha) before you start touting the wonders of marijuana.

This times 100.

Reading the first post, it's hard not to take you as the pot head who is going to educate me about it. The facts about it may be what they are. But, abusers of every substance say most of the same things. Non pot-heads will rarely take that information seriously. And, you'd risk having it come up at your interviews? ...assuming you get them?

 

[Pacna]

I'd absolutely include it. You need to convince them that you're not a stoner, but I think being involved in a political movement is a big positive. Guaranteed there will be someone on the committee who disagrees with your position, but that won't make them not be impressed by your accomplishment. I disagreed vehemently with one of my interviewers, but we had a discussion about the issue and I think I came across intelligent and respectful (I got accepted, anyway).

TL;DR: Doit

 

[jm192]

I'd absolutely include it. You need to convince them that you're not a stoner, but I think being involved in a political movement is a big positive. Guaranteed there will be someone on the committee who disagrees with your position, but that won't make them not be impressed by your accomplishment. I disagreed vehemently with one of my interviewers, but we had a discussion about the issue and I think I came across intelligent and respectful (I got accepted, anyway).

TL;DR: Doit

No. They're going to make up their minds on you before you get there in many cases. You may not get the chance to convince them you aren't a stoner.

 

[Gither]

I would include it. It's something you are passionate about and have spent much of your free time on. Will some screener decide that it's a red flag? Possibly. Will it come up in an interview? You should hope it does, so you have an opportunity to speak knowledgablely and eloquently about something that you're passionate about.

Don't pander to what you think people want to see/don't want to see. at the end of the day, we dont know who is reading our apps. It could be the very thing that makes you stand out. Be yourself.

It would piqué my interest if I were reading your app. Good luck.

No. Im passionate about many things I would never include on my application or residency interview. Med education is a game. Just play by the rules and be yourself/take opportunities to speak about your passions on your own time after you get in.