NOT starting a side gig

[Backpack234]

Anyone else feel inundated with this idea of docs needing side gigs all over social media? I've bought into this for the past few years and have looked into plenty of things. Real estate investing, day trading, chart review, expert witness, telemedicine, youtubing, blogging, etc. etc.

But the more I look into the people pushing this idea of physician side gigs, the more it seems like the best side gig is teaching people about some sort of side gig. Which comes across as pretty disingenuous. Starting to get burned out with these folks and feeling like medicine may not be perfect, but it's a pretty decent gig. Anyone else feel the same?

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[Birdstrike]

Anyone else feel inundated with this idea of docs needing side gigs all over social media? I've bought into this for the past few years and have looked into plenty of things. Real estate investing, day trading, chart review, expert witness, telemedicine, youtubing, blogging, etc. etc.

But the more I look into the people pushing this idea of physician side gigs, the more it seems like the best side gig is teaching people about some sort of side gig. Which comes across as pretty disingenuous. Starting to get burned out with these folks and feeling like medicine may not be perfect, but it's a pretty decent gig. Anyone else feel the same?

Lol, right? There's no better side gig than selling side gigs.

But I agree with you. There's no need for a doctor to have a side gig, if you like what you're doing and you think you'll continue liking it. I've done a little bit of chart review, not as a 'side gig,' but more as a favor for attorney's that asked. It's not something I feel any need to build up as a consistent "side gig" with significant income. And none of the other ones interest me, either.

On the other hand, if you enjoy real estate, day trading, expert witness work or the other side gigs, by all means go for it. But I agree there's no need to do it, if you're happy with what you're doing. It's also worth remembering, none of those side interests are free. None of them bring passive income. They all require work. If you enjoy them more than your current job, pursue them. If you don't, why bother?

I tend to think of my retirement account as my side gig. I invest in low maintenance index funds and in the long term they grow my wealth with no additional work on my part. There's no better side gig than that and none other needed.

 

[gamerEMdoc]

I'm cool with making 350-400k in a given year. I don't really want another career. My retirement is funded adequately. I see no need for a side gig.

 

[Backpack234]

Some of it to me is seeing these youtubers making 100-200k per MONTH. Knowing that I have plenty of time outside of work as an ER doc makes me feel like I could be as successful with a side gig. But it's taken a while to see through the survivorship bias and actuality of it.

 

[Groove]

Yeah, the side gig thing is a little overemphasized in this forum IMO. I’d much rather work an extra shift or two a month and just auto invest a lump sum fee into my index funds rather than managing a business or maintaining rental property, etc.. Call me “lazy”. If you can discipline yourself to auto invest 10K mo for 15-20yrs, you can retire immediately. No part time, no slowing down, no beginning to think about it...just submit that 90d notice, move to your dream location and never have to worry about working for THE MAN ever again.

 

[thegenius]

Anyone else feel inundated with this idea of docs needing side gigs all over social media? I've bought into this for the past few years and have looked into plenty of things. Real estate investing, day trading, chart review, expert witness, telemedicine, youtubing, blogging, etc. etc.

But the more I look into the people pushing this idea of physician side gigs, the more it seems like the best side gig is teaching people about some sort of side gig. Which comes across as pretty disingenuous. Starting to get burned out with these folks and feeling like medicine may not be perfect, but it's a pretty decent gig. Anyone else feel the same?

I was a software engineer for many, many years. During that time I had good days, bad days. Days I argued with my boss, days I accomplished a difficult task, days where I had customers say "thank you", days I got bonuses. Good days and bad days. It was a job.

Then I went into medicine and became an ER doc. During that time I had good days, bad days. Days I argued with my boss, days I accomplished a difficult task, days where I had customers say "thank you", days I got bonuses. Good days and bad days. It was a job.




I'm happy with my career switch.

 

[thegenius]

Some of it to me is seeing these youtubers making 100-200k per MONTH. Knowing that I have plenty of time outside of work as an ER doc makes me feel like I could be as successful with a side gig. But it's taken a while to see through the survivorship bias and actuality of it.

There are so few that do it, so many who want to do it.

There are some who play poker for a living and do quite well. But it's an exceedingly small, very small, almost negligible number of people.

 

[Birdstrike]

Some of it to me is seeing these youtubers making 100-200k per MONTH.

If you have the talent to pull off $100-200K per month doing YouTube videos that shouldn't be your side it, it should be your only gig. I personally do not have the talent for that. But if I did, I'd drop Medicine like a flaming ball of toxic lava and get on that tonight. Finding what your best talents and monetizing them, is an essential part of success. You've likely already done that. If not, don't hold back, as life is never out of surprises if you're willing unlock them.

 

[GeneralVeers]

If you have the talent to pull off $100-200K per month doing YouTube videos that shouldn't be your side it, it should be your only gig. I personally do not have the talent for that. But if I did, I'd drop Medicine like a flaming ball of toxic lava and get on that tonight. Finding what your best talents and monetizing them, is an essential part of success. You've likely already done that. If not, don't hold back, as life is never out of surprises if you're willing unlock them.

There aren't that many people making that kind of money off of YouTube. They recently changed their algorithm so this is very very hard to do.

For me, if I can get 10K/month from passive investments, I'm good to retire.

 

[Apollyon]

A gig is a gig primarily to make money, but hopefully has a few other rewards along the way. I don't need a gig and a side gig. Many side gigs don't pay as well as my current gig. Side gigs aren't as interesting to me as my hobbies. If I no longer like my gig enough, then I'll quit and find a different gig. That's what thegenious did. Savings and low fee mutual funds are preparation for when I no longer have an income producing gig. It's actively planned and thought out passive income, but not a gig in and of itself. If I no longer want a gig once I reach financial independence, then I won't have one. I can find plenty of ways to fill my time between hobbies and family/friends.

I'm impressed with how many times you used "gig".

 

[GeneralVeers]

I'm impressed with how many times you used "gig".

Gigity!

 

[DeadCactus]

We went from "burn-out is a myth based on studying non-residency trained physicians" to "wellness is important, do more yoga" to every medical student who hasn't even matched yet asking about escape plans and side-gigs. Never mind the rise of physicians trying to become social media influencers, that's a different rant. Everyone wants you to work clinically and then pay them enough so rather than seeing patients they can tell you how you're miserable because you spend too much time seeing patients. The side-gig people, the wellness people, the humanism people, there's no end to it... it's all the same scam. You see patients to earn money to pay them to not see patients.

The simple truth is the majority of physicians would be better off being financially responsible, optimizing their work situation, looking for value in their work, and establishing a clear plan for what a happy career path looks like to them. Physicians don't need a side-gig, they need a well developed career and the financial prudence to be able to pursue it. The two can look similar from the outside but one is purposefully pursuing things you value while the other is falling victim to peer pressure and greener looking pastures.

 

[Hercules]

I can agree with the overuse of the term and see some of the frustration with the industry that has built up around the idea. I think a lot of these people in this industry truly are interested in teaching other physicians how to generate passive income because it’s hard not to share once you see the benefits of it. Having passive income is a game changer that significantly accelerates your path to FI and gives you more flexibility in your current job.

I don’t like the term side gig as it implies that you’re actively working to make additional money. As stated by several above, working additional clinical shifts is my best source of active income. Having said that, any active income is limited by the time I want to spend working. My passive income does not have this limitation, and it will continue to come in even when I stop working. My passive income also allows me to save a lot of money while still living a very nice lifestyle. Passive income streams greatly reduce my magic number that I need to hit to be FI.

So I’ll be one voice speaking out in favor of passive income (though not necessarily side gigs).

 

[Apollyon]

Well, at least no one has said "side hustles". I always thought that a "hustle" was cheating someone, or ripping them off.

 

[GeneralVeers]

I've sitting at home making $300/hr doing telemedicine. Easy $3000/month without the stress of real patients, a commute or hospital admin. Would do it full time if it was stable and guaranteed.

 

[bikERdoc]

I've sitting at home making $300/hr doing telemedicine. Easy $3000/month without the stress of real patients, a commute or hospital admin. Would do it full time if it was stable and guaranteed.

That's impressive. Clearly not working with companies that rhyme with Teladox and MDJive. My experience with those two has been abysmal. I gave it up after a considerable amount of time waiting around fishing for patients. Not worth it... Nowhere near 300/hr.

 

[BoardingDoc]

That's impressive. Clearly not working with companies that rhyme with Teladox and MDJive. My experience with those two has been abysmal. I gave it up after a considerable amount of time waiting around fishing for patients. Not worth it... Nowhere near 300/hr.

Yeah. I used teladoc for a while. During peak covid, they were paying up to $50 per patient visit and I could easily bang out 6 an hour. Now volume is waaaaaaay down and they've credentialed a million docs so there's no one to see and the rate is through the floor. No thanks. At least there's still high paying locums nearby to augment cash flow.

 

[Saddleshoes]

I have a little bit of a different angle on the side gig idea.

I have been able to make a hobby that I dearly love a side gig. I don't make a ton of money at it BUT I am able to write off many of my professional and hobby expenses as business expenses for the side gig/hobby.

 

[mheat3]

I have a little bit of a different angle on the side gig idea.

I have been able to make a hobby that I dearly love a side gig. I don't make a ton of money at it BUT I am able to write off many of my professional and hobby expenses as business expenses for the side gig/hobby.

Based on the saddle shoes is this golf? On the mini-tour? Please make me jealous!

 

[Birdstrike]

Based on the saddle shoes is this golf? On the mini-tour? Please make me jealous!

Those are bowling shoes bro. We're in the presence of a bowler G.O.A.T.

 

[Saddleshoes]

Based on the saddle shoes is this golf? On the mini-tour? Please make me jealous!

Your close.
While not golf it is sports related.
I am an official. Most of my time has been spent doing football (youth, high school, college and some indoor pro). I have also done other sports as well. It's been great fun and a total escape from healthcare. I have made great officiating friends all over the country.

 

[Apollyon]

Your close.
While not golf it is sports related.
I am an official. Most of my time has been spent doing football (youth, high school, college and some indoor pro). I have also done other sports as well. It's been great fun and a total escape from healthcare. I have made great officiating friends all over the country.

Oh, probably football. Where I used to work, there was a CRNA that was a football official in the fall, and a basketball ref in the winter. He told me that there were a bunch of combos, like reffing wrestling in the winter, baseball ump, and soccer, that other officials did.

 

[Backpack234]

Based on the saddle shoes is this golf? On the mini-tour? Please make me jealous!

Off topic here, but are you ready for Miami Heat b-ball to come back tonight?

 

[Ironspy]

The best physician side gig is learning to live within or below your means

 

[GeneralVeers]

That's impressive. Clearly not working with companies that rhyme with Teladox and MDJive. My experience with those two has been abysmal. I gave it up after a considerable amount of time waiting around fishing for patients. Not worth it... Nowhere near 300/hr.

It's not EM or COVID related. Great and easy work. Too bad I question the stability of it. I'd love to quit clinical medicine, but I'd need at least 10K a month in income to keep the standard of living.

 

[mheat3]

Off topic here, but are you ready for Miami Heat b-ball to come back tonight?

I'm so excited. I truly think sports returning will help ease some of the general angst and craziness going on right now.

 

[Fox800]

It's very telling when so many new docs are looking for ways out of the ****storm that is modern American medicine.

I'm a newer attending. I had been banging out 150-160 hours per month while the getting was good. Now that's getting cut down to 108-120. I just want to have my loans at least halfway paid off before I switch down to a job that I enjoy more. That probably means a lower-volume position at some place like Kaiser, a hospital-employed position, the VA, etc.

I just don't know that I want to crank out 2-2.5 PPH with no scribe and a crappy EMR, supervising a midlevel forever. The stress of having notes undone, or having a full waiting room aren't worth it to me.

The money is good at the moment but that won't last with balanced billing legislation on the horizon and the never-ending onslaught of new residency programs and 187,000 midlevels gunning for our pay.

 

[cyanide12345678]

I have two side gigs. But mostly because of interest in entrepreneurial ventures. My income from my doctor job is exponentially more and funds my side gigs.

First side gig is a travel search engine website at Cheapestflightshotels.com . Hardly make any money. But it's a pretty good comparison website search engine. Have a 100k Facebook following. But very little revenue so far. I invest 1-2 hours per week into this and am spending $200/mo right now for other people to do the work of SEO link building and weekly blogging. But honestly, hardly making any $$$ right now. This is a 5 year plan to see what happens when search engines really start valuing the website and traffic picks up organically over time. Domain name is 7 months old right now, so organic traffic is minimal. Mostly all traffic is through Facebook.

Next, i have started dabbling in options trading. Always used to think options were dangerous. They really aren't, depending on what you do. I'm only doing cash covered puts and covered calls, which actually have similar returns to stocks but less volatility and higher sharp ratio. I have just started this, am no way an expert, but roughly made $350 in 2 days of trading after maybe 30 minutes of time investment to put in trade orders. But obviously much bigger time investment to learn options. Playing with smaller amounts of money to learn before going bigger. Options is definitely not my primary investing style. I'm investing 15k monthly on automation into a bogleheads lazy 3 fund portfolio since this March. But options can enhance returns and what I'm doing is actually safer than my 3 fund portfolio at least theoretically.

Lastly, I'm looking a lot into syndicate real estate investing through crowdstreet, arbor crowd, realcrowd etc. Haven't had the guts to throw in 25k into a project yet to become a part owner of a commercial real estate asset yet.

But like you said, being a physician has a million times better return on time for me. I'm much better off doing an extra shift per month. I'm only doing the other things because i truly enjoy those things.

 

[bravotwozero]

It's very telling when so many new docs are looking for ways out of the ****storm that is modern American medicine.

I'm a newer attending. I had been banging out 150-160 hours per month while the getting was good. Now that's getting cut down to 108-120. I just want to have my loans at least halfway paid off before I switch down to a job that I enjoy more. That probably means a lower-volume position at some place like Kaiser, a hospital-employed position, the VA, etc.

I just don't know that I want to crank out 2-2.5 PPH with no scribe and a crappy EMR, supervising a midlevel forever. The stress of having notes undone, or having a full waiting room aren't worth it to me.

The money is good at the moment but that won't last with balanced billing legislation on the horizon and the never-ending onslaught of new residency programs and 187,000 midlevels gunning for our pay.

Working for yourself via 'side-gigs' is always a risky venture, and will require one to sacrifice work life balance in the initial stages. The trade-off, if successful, is your independence. Something that all ED docs lack, unless they are one of the lucky few still running their own FSED or Urgent Care.

Kevin O'Leary (of Shark Tank fame) likes to frequently mention the story of his first job, where he worked at a ice cream shop as a scooper. One day at closing time, he wanted to head out with the girl next store over in the mall he worked. His boss told him to scrape the gum off the tiles after closing. He says to his boss 'you hired me to scoop ice cream, not to scrape gum'. The response was 'You are my employee so you do exactly what I tell you to'. He refused and was fired on the spot, and decided he never wanted to work for someone else again.

I don't know how much truth is to that story, but it really does strike a chord with me. Replace the ice cream scooper with you as the ED doc, and the manager/boss with the C Suite, and it's the same situation.

 

[namethatsmell]

The best physician side gig is learning to live within or below your means

Agreed, and this can sometimes actually be fun. Back when we could roam freely I loved planning big trips with the wife to travel well but without spending $$$ recklessly. Putting in the extra time to really look at tons of options was a) cool and b) probably had a ROI in the vicinity of 10-20k/year.

 

[Tenk]

All of the people I know with side gigs have a lot of money but no life. F that.

 

[sloh]

Agree with mostly everyone here that the ROI from working an extra shift, hours, or seeing more patients trumps almost any side gig. Funnel that money into low cost mutual funds.

What is also overlooked is that turning a hobby/passion into a career (what many imagine fits into “side gig”) often times backfires making you lose the intrinsic joy of the pursuit

 

[mheat3]

I think it’ll be really interesting to see how this goes down. The loss of sports has shown me that I actually don’t care as much as I thought I did, and I’ll probably watch little if any at all any more as I’ve found other interests. If this is true for a lot of other people I could see sports taking a big hit. On the other hand as you suggest, it’s possible that a lot of people will find it to be a wonderful escape and ratings will go through the roof.

It certainly could go that way as well and ratings could fall. As I've gotten older obviously the importance of sports has dropped for me but it is still something I enjoy to watch. I think what I mainly was getting at is that if there is more of other stuff out there in the ether (i.e. news coverage of local sports teams, ESPN showing highlights and all their other silly shows) then hopefully that is less time for more divisive things to be aired and emphasized. Maybe I'm just engaging in some wishful thinking...

 

[Birdstrike]

It certainly could go that way as well and ratings could fall. As I've gotten older obviously the importance of sports has dropped for me but it is still something I enjoy to watch.

Spectator sports only purpose for me is escapism. Make them light, fun and entertaining and I may watch. Make it heavy or political, like everywhere else I turn now, and I won't.

 

[Birdstrike]

The best physician side gig is learning to live within or below your means

This wins the thread.