NP vs. MD

[riverjib]

This question is directed towards those who have had enough clinical experience to work closely with MD's, DO's, NP's, and RN's.

I had an interview today (not for medical school), and after I spoke about what made me decide to go into medicine, he asked me why MD? He really liked my answer, but as someone who is on an ADCOM, he said that I needed to polish it for med school interviews so that I don't stumble around as much to explain it, because it is evidently becoming a popular question...at least for non-trads and traditional students who have enough clinical experience to know the difference between the different roles.

So if you were asked this question, how would you respond? What do you all see as the fundamental difference between an autonomous nurse practitioner and a physician? (This question excludes the surgery and is more geared towards internal medicine, emergency medicine, etc.)

I posted this in the pre-med allopathic forum, but so far the responses have been silly. One said, "MD's get more chicks" or something like that and another said, "NP's have a 'flirting relation' with medicine." I'd like to hear what you think is the fundamental difference between NP's and MD's, without disparaging remarks about nurses

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[Nasrudin]

This question is directed towards those who have had enough clinical experience to work closely with MD's, DO's, NP's, and RN's.

I had an interview today (not for medical school), and after I spoke about what made me decide to go into medicine, he asked me why MD? He really liked my answer, but as someone who is on an ADCOM, he said that I needed to polish it for med school interviews so that I don't stumble around as much to explain it, because it is evidently becoming a popular question...at least for non-trads and traditional students who have enough clinical experience to know the difference between the different roles.

So if you were asked this question, how would you respond? What do you all see as the fundamental difference between an autonomous nurse practitioner and a physician? (This question excludes the surgery and is more geared towards internal medicine, emergency medicine, etc.)

I posted this in the pre-med allopathic forum, but so far the responses have been silly. One said, "MD's get more chicks" or something like that and another said, "NP's have a 'flirting relation' with medicine." I'd like to hear what you think is the fundamental difference between NP's and MD's, without disparaging remarks about nurses

This is a good question. I think I recall it coming up for me. I'm not sure in what form. I have a lot of clinical experience but beyond that my mom is NP and I actually started out with the intention of going to Nursing or PA school. So that's my background. My conversations with my mom have been very extensive on the subject over the years. And I know her take on the job very intimately. She's old school. The kind of nurse with decades of experience before going back to school to be a clinician. She's very active politically too. On an organizational level. So that's the basis of my insight.

So. The polished beginning to such a query would begin with, as you astutely indicated, a compliment to the career path and it's utility to patients and it's possible long-term satisfaction for certain people.

But after that, and I suppose this is the tactical pivot point, I would have no hesitation in assaying the two careers into distinct categories. One is the pursuit of mastery and a clinical acumen that cannot be attained by other means. The physician is this category. So you could simply say that your personality is more suited to this more challenging and rigorous pursuit of knowledge. And leave it at that.

I am in favor of short tactical answers to these types of questions. You want to spend more time communicating your particular assets personality-wise or whatever pertains to your unique qualities. Questions like these are simply shakedown questions to check your wherewithal of the landscape your going into.

A quick short burst of a statement and move on. That'd be my approach.

 

[riverjib]

This is a good question. I think I recall it coming up for me. I'm not sure in what form. I have a lot of clinical experience but beyond that my mom is NP and I actually started out with the intention of going to Nursing or PA school. So that's my background. My conversations with my mom have been very extensive on the subject over the years. And I know her take on the job very intimately. She's old school. The kind of nurse with decades of experience before going back to school to be a clinician. She's very active politically too. On an organizational level. So that's the basis of my insight.

So. The polished beginning to such a query would begin with, as you astutely indicated, a compliment to the career path and it's utility to patients and it's possible long-term satisfaction for certain people.

But after that, and I suppose this is the tactical pivot point, I would have no hesitation in assaying the two careers into distinct categories. One is the pursuit of mastery and a clinical acumen that cannot be attained by other means. The physician is this category. So you could simply say that your personality is more suited to this more challenging and rigorous pursuit of knowledge. And leave it at that.

I am in favor of short tactical answers to these types of questions. You want to spend more time communicating your particular assets personality-wise or whatever pertains to your unique qualities. Questions like these are simply shakedown questions to check your wherewithal of the landscape your going into.

A quick short burst of a statement and move on. That'd be my approach.

Nasrudin, thank you for your insight! You always approach questions with really thoughtful answers, and I appreciate that tremendously. My interviewer told me that I should follow up with the whole team if I wanted to differentiate myself among other applicants, and that coming up with a heartfelt (read: equally honest but more polished answer) to this question would be a great way to follow up. I've been carefully shaping my response to this question, but I'm worried about stepping on the toes of other practitioners, especially since this particular interviewer is an NP.

So how do you suggest I shape my answer? NP's can diagnose, treat, and research any clinical condition. MD's do the same thing, but are currently the "final word," so to speak. The roles are different, but the line is becoming blurred. How do I emphasize that I want to learn everything possible, and be required to do so (academic rigor applies here) without suggesting that NP's don't attain the same level of knowledge?

To me, the difference lies in the disciplines themselves. Medicine is about solving a physiological problem (almost in an engineering sense), whereas nursing is at a fundamental level about treating the person, and nurses are trained to so at different levels, depending on their levels of education. The goal of both professions is to treat the patient's condition, but doctors are more expert in the science of medicine, whereas nurses are more expert in dealing with the various needs (emotional, physiological, familial) of patients.

Maybe that's not quite right? I'd love to hear more about your opinion, Nasrudin, or what others think. Any nurses on the board? I have years of experience in health care, but I find that my understanding of the different roles is constantly challenged, and that's a very good thing

 

[Charles_Carmichael]

Nasrudin, thank you for your insight! You always approach questions with really thoughtful answers, and I appreciate that tremendously. My interviewer told me that I should follow up with the whole team if I wanted to differentiate myself among other applicants, and that coming up with a heartfelt (read: equally honest but more polished answer) to this question would be a great way to follow up. I've been carefully shaping my response to this question, but I'm worried about stepping on the toes of other practitioners, especially since this particular interviewer is an NP.

So how do you suggest I shape my answer? NP's can diagnose, treat, and research any clinical condition. MD's do the same thing, but are currently the "final word," so to speak. The roles are different, but the line is becoming blurred. How do I emphasize that I want to learn everything possible, and be required to do so (academic rigor applies here) without suggesting that NP's don't attain the same level of knowledge?

To me, the difference lies in the disciplines themselves. Medicine is about solving a physiological problem (almost in an engineering sense), whereas nursing is at a fundamental level about treating the person, and nurses are trained to so at different levels, depending on their levels of education. The goal of both professions is to treat the patient's condition, but doctors are more expert in the science of medicine, whereas nurses are more expert in dealing with the various needs (emotional, physiological, familial) of patients.

Maybe that's not quite right? I'd love to hear more about your opinion, Nasrudin, or what others think. Any nurses on the board? I have years of experience in health care, but I find that my understanding of the different roles is constantly challenged, and that's a very good thing

Try not to worry so much about hurting the other person's feeling or whatever, especially when something is true. It's absolutely true that physicians graduate with a much greater fund of knowledge than midlevels and given the same amount of years practicing independently, the physician is much more likely to be more clinically competent in his/her specialty. You can't crunch down 7+ years of rigorous medical training into 3-4 years of non-rigorous (relative to medical training) nursing training. If you're the type of person who wants the curriculum to require you learn as much as possible (as you stated), you already know what path you want to go down.

Also, that thing about physicians treating the disease and nurses treating the patient is not really true. You shouldn't pay attention to TV shows (I think that nurse on Mercy or whatever said that?). Nursing doesn't own compassion. There are physicians who are good and bad at interacting with people and there are nurses who are good and bad at interacting with people.

Hope this helps.

 

[Nasrudin]

Nasrudin, thank you for your insight! You always approach questions with really thoughtful answers, and I appreciate that tremendously. My interviewer told me that I should follow up with the whole team if I wanted to differentiate myself among other applicants, and that coming up with a heartfelt (read: equally honest but more polished answer) to this question would be a great way to follow up. I've been carefully shaping my response to this question, but I'm worried about stepping on the toes of other practitioners, especially since this particular interviewer is an NP.

So how do you suggest I shape my answer? NP's can diagnose, treat, and research any clinical condition. MD's do the same thing, but are currently the "final word," so to speak. The roles are different, but the line is becoming blurred. How do I emphasize that I want to learn everything possible, and be required to do so (academic rigor applies here) without suggesting that NP's don't attain the same level of knowledge?

To me, the difference lies in the disciplines themselves. Medicine is about solving a physiological problem (almost in an engineering sense), whereas nursing is at a fundamental level about treating the person, and nurses are trained to so at different levels, depending on their levels of education. The goal of both professions is to treat the patient's condition, but doctors are more expert in the science of medicine, whereas nurses are more expert in dealing with the various needs (emotional, physiological, familial) of patients.

Maybe that's not quite right? I'd love to hear more about your opinion, Nasrudin, or what others think. Any nurses on the board? I have years of experience in health care, but I find that my understanding of the different roles is constantly challenged, and that's a very good thing

Yeah. It's an interesting discussion with some passionate avenues. I could talk about the dynamics of inter-professional relations in health care till the cows come home. and rarely get bored doing it.

I think to f/u your response. The chances of you being questioned by an NP are not likely. It's much more likely that you'd be asked about research interests by a phd. I had no time or inclination for it at this stage and yet was face to face with academic scientists in interviews.

Medical school admissions and interview personnel are phd's, md's, maybe a few education specialists, and their support staff. Maybe there is an occasional nurse practitioner. If so they wouldn't be the type who would be too worried about NP politics. B/c they'd be working for the man. And even as just folks charged with selecting the next generation of physicians there main ploy with such a query would be to weed out any potentially arrogant pricks who would demean another professional unthinkingly.

You could even keep it as simple as...yes I have considered those fine professions--but I want the responsibility and opportunities that go with being a physician.

I bet you a coffee and a doughnut that the question will stop there.

Mostly this debate is carried out in the minds of premeds--many of them for good reasons nontraditionals--who are trying to make up their mind which path to pursue. At the medical school interview...it's a non-issue. Maybe at most, a ploy for probing issues in the applicant.

 

[southerngrl]

This question is directed towards those who have had enough clinical experience to work closely with MD's, DO's, NP's, and RN's.

I had an interview today (not for medical school), and after I spoke about what made me decide to go into medicine, he asked me why MD? He really liked my answer, but as someone who is on an ADCOM, he said that I needed to polish it for med school interviews so that I don't stumble around as much to explain it, because it is evidently becoming a popular question...at least for non-trads and traditional students who have enough clinical experience to know the difference between the different roles.

So if you were asked this question, how would you respond? What do you all see as the fundamental difference between an autonomous nurse practitioner and a physician? (This question excludes the surgery and is more geared towards internal medicine, emergency medicine, etc.)

I posted this in the pre-med allopathic forum, but so far the responses have been silly. One said, "MD's get more chicks" or something like that and another said, "NP's have a 'flirting relation' with medicine." I'd like to hear what you think is the fundamental difference between NP's and MD's, without disparaging remarks about nurses

NP's are are trained with the basics in pathophysiology and treating different disease processes-the education just skims the surface of what you need to know. Speaking as an NP, this is not enough for me. I want to know more to help my patients better so this is why I am now going premed...

 

[Paramedic2DocMD]

This question is directed towards those who have had enough clinical experience to work closely with MD's, DO's, NP's, and RN's.

I had an interview today (not for medical school), and after I spoke about what made me decide to go into medicine, he asked me why MD? He really liked my answer, but as someone who is on an ADCOM, he said that I needed to polish it for med school interviews so that I don't stumble around as much to explain it, because it is evidently becoming a popular question...at least for non-trads and traditional students who have enough clinical experience to know the difference between the different roles.

So if you were asked this question, how would you respond? What do you all see as the fundamental difference between an autonomous nurse practitioner and a physician? (This question excludes the surgery and is more geared towards internal medicine, emergency medicine, etc.)

I posted this in the pre-med allopathic forum, but so far the responses have been silly. One said, "MD's get more chicks" or something like that and another said, "NP's have a 'flirting relation' with medicine." I'd like to hear what you think is the fundamental difference between NP's and MD's, without disparaging remarks about nurses

River I found this thread "N.P vs MD/DO" down in the Clinicians [RN/NP/PA] section.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=673669
Seems to get alittle side tracked on some pages but I belive it covers the topic you are aiming at. Its nine pages long so far, don't know if you have seen it. Though the thread is rather arguemental.
This a excellent question that I don't think some folks have a good answer for, makes you think. Im going to have to think about a answer my self.