NYU or USC

USC has that problem-based learning curriculum while NYUCD is more traditional lecture-based.

NYUCD has a larger student body than USC.

Patient pools: NYUCD has the largest patient pool of any dental school in the country.

NYC vs. LA.

Variable weather (NYC is cold in the winter, hot in the summer) while LA is just hot year-round.

NERB (the board exam NYU trains you to take) vs. California or WREB (the ones USC trains you to take).

Those are some of the major differences which you might consider when making a choice.

Me, I'm 100% New Yorker.

 

Actually, LA isn't necessarily hot all year round. Well, I guess compared to the north eastern schools, it might be...hehe. I'm originally from the LA area, and we get some rain or fog during the winter. And we get our 60 degree weather or so in the winter as well. Both LA and NY are hot during the summer, except NY happens to be more humid (which I think makes the weather seem warmer).

And as for living expenses...i guess that'll depend on where you live. Apartments are definitely more expensive in NY than LA, but the fact that you're probably gonna need a car in LA might end up being just as expensive as living in NY. I don't know....seems like it might be the same to me.

And btw, CA boards are one of the most difficult to pass. So, if you really want to practice in CA, I say go to USC. The way that some of the procedures are done are different between the two schools.

good luck!

 

Have you seen the prices of some apartments in LA lately? If you want to live in the ghetto (ie close to USC) then you might find some reasonable prices. But if you don't want to sleep with a gun, you're going to be paying outrageous prices for apartments. I would recommend getting a place a ways from the school, and commuting. You might spend more money on gas, but you'll be saving 500-1000 a month in rent.

 

Hey,

IMHO, USC doesn't really have that much going for it. Their PBL program is still in it's infancy and I hear a lot of complaints about it. The location is in L.A., but in a pretty bad area. The price is really high because it's a private institution. NYU on the other hand has a new wing recently built, it's in New York, and their program is pretty solid. Price is also an issue here however. So, just wait for a reply from UCLA, and if things don't go well, call them and ask for a re-evaluation. They're really fair at UCLA if you have the credentials, and quality of life at UCLA is leaps and bounds over USC or NYU...again, IMHO.

 

vietho26,

Give it a good thought before you decide on these schoolsas each of them have their Pros and Cons. Between USC and UCLA you may have to weigh beiween:

USC Pros: PBL (lot of current students like it), Renowned faculty, High clinical exposure, Huge Alumni network (More than 40% of practicing CA dentists are from USC), Very good for CA boards
USC Cons: Expensive, Not so Safe neighborhood

UCLA Pros: Posh and rich neighborhood, Strong Research orientation, class room approach, Less Fee (If you want to compromise on other aspects of your learning to save $$, this is the place, as it is state funded)
UCLA Cons: More Books oriented (Very little clinical exposure), Low confidence level to go into practice, Highly class room lecture oriented

NYU Pros: High clinical exposure, Renowned faculty, NY life, Hige alumni network
NYU Cons: Weather, Expensive like USC (But all good things come with a cost)

 

Hi,

Which eastcoast schools are you still waiting to hear from? Just wondering if they are the same as mine...UPenn and UMaryland.

Aurora

 

I would go USC...
I heard people saying that even the NYU dental students don't even like their own school.. so I didn't even go to the interview there...
class size of 210... that's too much, don't you think?
USC definitely is improving and I can totally tell the dean is doing a lot!

Good luck with your decision!

 

268 or so, actually. I think a big factor viz. the students not liking the school has to do with the astronomical expense. $60K tuition, plus $15k+ for housing in what is arguably a dump, not to mention other living expenses. What NYU offers is just fine, IMHO, but for the price you'd think we would be treated a little better than beef cattle. If my total yearly expenses were around $50-60K, I'd say, fine, NYU's great.

Can't speak for USC, but my own dentist advised me not to go there. He was apprehensive about PBL, doesn't care much for the new dean, and his own experience at USC wasn't unlike mine thus far at NYU. The difference? His tuition (albeit in the late 1970s) was a relative pittance. And he could go home as often as his schedule allowed. And he does just fine as a dentist, very well, in fact, and has been since he started his practice.

 

The class in NYU will be splitted into two groups.
Then when 2nd yr comes along, they will combine with int'l dental students and split them into 3 groups.

Does anyone know why PBL causes so much money to operate?

 

ACTUALLY,

NYU weeds students out over the first two years. I actually met a few people who were weeded out and had to reapply to dental schools, take the DAT over, and go through the whole thing again. Each of them told me NYU doesnt care about the student and theyre just in it for the money. They accept 300 or so students to begin with and then its all competition from there. Survival of the fittest. I doubt anyone would look forward to a professional school like that.

In terms of USC's PBL program. I agree its not for everyone. At the same time I dont see too much negative about it. We emphasize research so much in society, and at USC its, to some effect, the way PBL is structured. Also, one reason why PBL might cost more than having lectures (and I might be wrong) but don't you get more personal attention with PBL? the entire class is broken up into groups of 8 students. Each group has a faculty mentor/ facilitator that guides their case study. So, PBL (again if i'm not mistaken) requires more instructors. Each of them is also a dentist. So you get to work really close with your teachers.

just a thought
go to USC. Be a TROJAN.

 

Wow, people who are kicked out from NYU are certainly not gonna have any hostility towards the school

You make it seem that its NYU's intention to kick people out. A tip for the OP...do a search on this issue regarding NYU because its been talked to death, and you'll see that Scrooge's comments are ignorant and wrong.

 

although i absolutely hate LA, i'd still pick USC over NYU. just read more about NYU, the cost, the reutation, and the fact that you may get kicked out easily is something to really consider.


USC all the way for you my friend. i wouldn't wait to hear from other schools by now. its getting late.

 

NYU may not intend to kick anyone out...
but then why do they accept more students than the school can handle? It makes you think it could be for the money. They accept 300+ and over the first two years knock the class size down to the average dental school class size at other schools (about 100-150). Not only that, I've heard their program is not regarded too highly of at other schools and so applying to transfer to another dental school after being kicked out of NYU is not a viable option either (also considering that every dental school has a different program). In addition, I have several family members living in NY who are practicing dentists who each individually have told me not to attend NYU even if I were accepted because of its reputation for being a not-so-great school.

So, for someone who's been already accepted to OTHER schools- it seems impractical and straight up dumb to even consider NYU.

just a thought.

 

Sorry, but frankly your information is a bunch of baloney.

News flash: Those few people you met were weeded out because they are weed.

What, did you think dental school is a 4-year-long 24/7 party that will hand you a DDS/DMD degree without doing any work just because you paid the tuition money? I don't care who you are, you will flunk out of ANY dental school if that's your attitude.

NYU graduates ~300 students EVERY YEAR. They DO NOT "knock down" their class size to "100". My sister's class (Class of 2000) graduated 320 dentists. She is in her 3rd year of private practice after doing a 1-year GPR and now she owns her own office.

"weeding out" students to "make money" makes NO sense. It makes sense for a school to keep a student for all 4 years, collect the entire $250,000 bill from the student, and on top of that have each student bring in about $15,000 worth of fees collectible from rendering patient treatment. A school LOSES money if it intentionally "weeds out" students before they can start producing patient fees for the school.

Very few schools receive re-accreditation with zero recommendations (i.e. things that the committee on reaccreditation thinks the school can improve on), and NYU achieved that last year.

Aside from the outrageous cost (which USC is also just as notorious for), NYU is as good as a dental school as any, definitely as good a choice as USC especially for people who prefer a traditional curriculum over a PBL one.

 

Good stuff Dr. Hong......I was waiting for ya to chime in here......Scrooge, stop spreading rumours......

 

I would not blame on Scrooge. What he said was what I heard from my pre-health advisor who graduated from NYU, Biology Ph.D. He asked me to ask them if there are fewer spots of 3rd year than 2nd year before I decide to go.
I agree with Dr. Hong's opinion. If you don't study, you GET TO BE KICKED OUT! However, the question is how about there are fewer seats of 3rd than 2nd year? Does it mean some people will be blushed even they are all qualified (just hypothesis)?
I have a friend graduated from NYU 3 years ago and now, he has his own office. He highly recommends NYU, especially his clinic program. I think the education in NYU really worths. There are always many patients waiting in his office every time I went.

 

It seems like a lot of ppl on the west coast are misinformed about NYU. I heard exactly the same thing that scrooge was saying, but I don't want to back him up just yet because I never really closely looked at NYU. So let's take a step back and re-evaluate some pros and cons

USC Pros: PBL different method of teaching, might be for you. National Football champs, decent school (as a whole) reputation, USC networking (a lot of dental groups that are mainly USC grad's), USC makes great general dentist, high stats from accepted students (DAT and GPA) so at least you know you're going to have smart peers, and they're UCLA's little sister (annoying sibling, but part of the L.A. family all the same),

USC Cons: PBL different method of teaching, might NOT be for you. Some personal friends complain about paying so much money just to teach yourself? (I personally don't know, so don't care) Ghetto neighborhood, and true, a lot of practicing general dentist in CA are from USC, but that's because a lot of them couldn't get into specialties (PBL is in its infancy at USC, and some schools don't give USC half as much respect as they would other schools when it comes time to apply for specialties), USC makes great dentist but will be harder to specialize from

NYU Pros: Located in New York, very diverse and exciting environment. Abundant and diverse patients and cases. New clinic floor (forgot which one, but it's the one with plasma screens everywhere and marble flooring), four actual seasons, olsen twins

NYU Cons: Located in New York, most ppl are getting kicked because they can't balance partying and studying, so I'm guess temptation is not a good thing while attending dental school (Not that L.A. doesn't have tempting things though...). Rats to the exponential power, lower class academic averages (although they state a minimum 3.5 gpa is required to even apply, their average is significantly lower than that and their DAT scores are around 18's), HUGE class size (I really don't see how they can effectively give each student an equal amount of attention compared to a different school with half their size), home of the Yankees

So there you have it, I personally would choose USC, because I live on the west coast, looking at the averages it seems like USC would be more competitve to get in to, weather is great and so are the women (I admit USC cheerleaders are hotter then UCLA's...), and because I love L.A.. Have fun choosing, hope this helps

 

Go to USC, my friend. That's a good clinical school. They teach some of the best crown techniques that are secret to usc alumni. I lived in the area within 1 mile of USC campus before and nothing ever happened to me nor my neighborhood.

The PBL might not be as bad as it sounds. After all, you mostly end up learning by yourself in dental school, because of the enormous amount of materials you have to know, there is no way that your instructors can cover them all. Why not learning it with your friends? I have a few classes that have discussion groups, and I like it a lot. First, it sounds like a waste of time, but then I end up learning a tons in those classes. Much better than those classes with traditional lecture and books base classes.

 

I would choose USC.

 

than UCLA's?
no, they are hotter than anyone in the world.



bottom line, i think USC wins the fight. go there my friend and never look back.

one more thing about the PBL. isn't the PBL only for a year anyways? how difficult can it be? even if it would be, i think you could still handle 2 semesters of it.

 

Yes, only if you like PBL. USC has a very very good alumni association. This could come a long way. Even though PBL is still very young, you should have faith in it and have the mind set that you getta prepare for this different style of learning. NYC's class size is too big. USC has 144, but it is sub-divided into 24 people a group and 8 smaller group, so you are actually interacting with those 24 students. And they are scoring very well on the board.

But, UCLA is still my choice =)

 

Hi
I am currently a third year student AT NYUCD and i can say that Mr HONG is so misinformed

First of all their accredation was a bunch of horsecrap. The members of accredation checked out selected clinics, the new bluestone research center, rosenthal and spoke with only a few hand picked students by the administration.
NYU is a dung pile, you will be a number there and that is all there is to it

NYU is only school i know which kicks out students at the end of their second year. Nobody should be weeded out while they are in dental school, that happens in undergrad.

NYU IS THE HARDEST MOST RIDICULOUS PROGRAM> AND NOW THEY ARE MAKING STUDENTS TAKE BIOTERRORISM COURSES WHILE COMPROMISING EDUCATION IN THE CLINIC SCIENCES.

The only thing i am grateful for is that they accepted me. but they will accept any student with a heartbeat

NYU has no morals or ethics, for clarification, plz email me later.

CHOSE USC. Atleast you will be happy

Class of 2005
NYpoo college of dentistry

 

Ahhh....school spirit at its finest.

 

You sound a lot like the student I've met after my interview in NYU. Do you volunteer to anwer quetions of potential students by any chance?

 

i have no problems with that. let me know what q's you have and i will answer with the utmost honesty

 

I'm sorry I didn't make myself clear. Are you one of the students who talks to potential students during their interview day? I'm asking because you sound very similar to the student who talked to us on my interview day. The guy was also a 3rd year, he lives with his cousin in a studio. Told us a lot of funny stories about the stuff that went on in NYU. But he hated it there too, just like you

Since you offered to answer my questions so kindly I can't refuse. Where do you live, how do you like it there and when do you recommend students to start looking for apartments?

 

Well i dont think i am that person since i am married and i live with my wife. But i live in manhattan, where with my rent i can probably put down a mortgage payment for a $300000 house in north carolina.
Now it is my firm belief that since you will be stuck in place for 4yrs, you have to learn to like it. When you enter third year, you will start to appreciate dentistry more at NYU because the faculty start treating you like human beings. THAT IS ONLY IN THE THIRD YEAR SINCE THE SCHOOL IS NO LONGER TRYING TO FLUNK YOU OUT> But there is a lot of red tape, and you still feel like you want to kick the **** out of somebody

Now i will recommend yu stay in the dorms, atleast for the first two years. Choose 26th st residence, its the closest to the dental school. It is a piece of ****, but its convenient. Looking for apartments in NY is like getting a bad divorce. in plain simple english, it sucks.

The best advice is this. If this is the only school you got into, then by all means come here. This was my situation, and I THANK GOD for it every day since i am living my dream. However if you have a choice, then go somewhere else. NYU's second year is like THE SIGN OF HELLS WINTER> YOU HAVE TO STAY FOCUSED, atleast during the first two years. AND YOU HAVE TO KNOW YOUR ENEMY> always understand that NYU will not hesitate to kick you out. if you fear the inevitable. you will do fine.
If you work hard, there is no reason why you will not make it. I AM the prime example, and so are the other 330 students in my class.

never listen to the bull**** of administrators. AND especially do not listen to people like MR HONG. HE HAS NOT EVEN STEPPED FOOT IN NYUCD AND DECIDES TO FORMULATE AN OPINION> "I mean people are weed" I Guarentee that if he started at NYU, he would flunk out.

I hope that helps. Let me know if you need anything else, i will be glad to help

 

FRANKLY I FEEL OFFENDED CALLING YOU DDS
things have changed since your sister went there. Have you ever set foot in NYU? if you have not, then you have no idea what goes there.
if you ever entered NYU as a freshman, you my friend would become weed, NYU has the most intense program, and frankly i have met plenty of cocky people during my time here, who could not even pass biochem.

so plz do not make rash remarks about a place you will never understand

 

Shariq.. man what did NYU do to you? I guess I'm going to a different NYU than you because this place ain't all that bad. The problem with this school is that it's probably not a first choice for most people. In the spirit of NYU, everybody has got to bitch about it until they graduate and then they can bitch some more. At the end of four years, we (NYUers) will know how to get the job done in any amount of adversity.

Whatever Shariq is saying is definitely true but its not that bad, he's probably just pissed off because NYU figured out a way to screw him again. At the end of the day, we get out education even if we have to fight for it. If we can work at a place where handpieces dont work, chairs get stuck, instruments in cassettes missing then damn it.. we can make it anywhere.

All you predent people out there, just be careful of the advice you get on this forum.

Btw, I'd go with USC if you live in cali or west coast. The east coast sucks.. its too cold or too hot.

 

There is red tape everywhere, it is not unique to NYU. Dr. Hong & I went to the same school and our classsmates still feel like the administrators screwed us and we can't believe the amount of red tape we had to go through sometimes. In fact, I haven't gotten over that "I got screwed" feeling yet as I am still having to deal with the school while all my classmates who graduated with me left for the beach two weeks ago.

Again, you have to stay focused to make it through any dental school. Of course you have to stay focused, this is a professional school we are talking about. Our new dean at Buffalo takes no mercy on those who can't meet the minimum 2.0. What did you expect - to coast through dental school? Or the fact that you paid the tuition so you should be guaranteed to stay & get a diploma? If fearing the administration is your way of keeping yourself on track, then fine. We all have our ways to stay on top of the mounds of requirements demanded of us in dental school. But even your own NYU colleagues don't necessarily think NYU is as bad as you make it out to be, as apoptosis told us.

As far as the "NYU has the most intense program" comment, I can't even begin to tell you some of the opinions of your school's curriculum to educate 320 dentists in one class that float around here at the other end of New York state, from students, faculty, and administrators. (PM me if you care, I don't want to start a war here.)

This sounds like a case of "the grass is greener on the other side" to me. NYU, as with any other dental school, will be what you make of it. If missing instruments in your cassette is enough to set you on fire and think that the administration is out to make your life hell and set you in a bad mood the rest of the day, then yes, NYU will suck for you. But the student next to you can take the missing instruments in stride, accept it as a nuance in the system and choose to overlook it for the good at NYU (I'm sure there are good things at NYU) - the diversity in treating so many patients, caring instructors, making a difference in your patient's quality of life, etc.

 

i was supposed to attend nyu last year and they screwed me over. they claimed they didnt receive my transcipt in time so i was sent back home to ca...oh well

i hate the administration there..they promise one thing and then turn their backs on you...especially assistant dean novella jones and amy knowles..yes even her..its not professional to name names but i dont have much respect for them anyways...i hope things have changed since..

i think the reason why students are "weeded out" is because nyu accepts students with lower GPA and lower DAT scores..this only means that either the student wasnt motivated in undergrad to start with or theyre just not ready for the rigors of dental school.. people who say nyu boots people out just for the hell out it are ignorant..

anyways, if you attend nyucd, find me on aim (sn: froggyboob) or send me a pm...i wouldnt mind meeting some nyu students

vincent

 

Shariq, quit whining about NYU. I have a good friend whom I went to undergrad with, and he is in his 3rd year there right now. Its definitely a tough program, but it is not impossible. After all 320+ students will be graduating from there this year. It is a good school, has a good reputation and has the number one patient pool in the country out of any of the dental schools.


______________________________
NYU College of Dentistry 2008

 

yeah guys stop picking on me.
Ask anybody in my class and they will say the same thing. I am being honest here, and well its up to you guys to take my advice.

In any case, best of luck to all of you

 

I don't think shariq is whinning, nor is his opinion different from the norm. Actually what he said more closely resembles from what I've heard from real NYUCD students. The misinformation that's been circulating around here for some time now has in most part been by those not attending NYUCD. Of course shariq has focused on the negatives and not the positives of which there's an ample amount as well.

 

No problems or complaints from me yet. Been a smooth sail so far and I commute 4 hours a day. Sure I do not have a 4.0 but much better than a 3.0

 

i wonder what kind of board scores nyu students get? any nyu students here willing to share?

 

A commute of 4 hours a day? Thats crazy!! Are you going to do the same thing for 2nd year?

 

I remember Broc mentioned that he lived with family in NJ in an earlier post, so I guess that he saves a $hit load of money by not paying rent, but I give the guy credit on the 2 hour commute...

 

Oh hell No I am not. I'm moving to Hoboken, NJ where the commute from door to door will be 35 min. I expecting some very good grades next year

 

Yeah, first year cost me around $49k...no rent, free bagged lunch, free dinner.

 

Around national avg but they are trying to change this. They now have a few weeks of board review and we get all the Kaplan material for free. I think the DS2's this year are the first class and I will be the 2nd class to do this. So we will see how this goes.

 

Hey, if you can please share some info about living in hoboken. What's the rent like? Also how will you commute to NYUCD? thanks

 

Hoboken is all over the board. You can find great deals or you could live in the new high rise places and pay just as much as Manhattan. Here is the price range that I came across in my search of Hoboken: 1-bedrooms $850(little old lady was offering it and I guess she doesn't know current rates. She was even offering to pay heat, water, and electric) to $1750 with Manhattan skyline view; 2-bed $1,000 ( a little up town and in so would be 20 min walk to PATH. PATH is downtown) to $2600 for a luxury high rise; 3-bed $1900 to over $3500+ in luxury high rise

I found a 2 family home: Two bedrooms, wash and dryer in the unit, back yard, 5 min walk to the PATH, has parking, roughly 1200 sq ft for $1600 a month. Its a very good deal. I MOVE IN AUGUST!!!

From Hoboken to school is very easy. I would suggest finding a place walking distance to the PATH station (5min walking for me), then you take it to 23rd and 6th (11min train ride), and you could either walk to NYUCD (13min) or take the M23 bus (never took it so do not know the time). The PATH runs every 5 min during rush hour and 11 min during non-rush hour.

If you want really really cheap rent and a similar commute via the PATH (maybe 10 min longer) look into Jersey city. Lots of one bedrooms for $800 and up. I wasn't too thrilled with Jersey city. Hoboken is very very nice and clean and everyone is really young. If you like to go out, there are bars galore in every which direction you walk. Hoboken is like a mini-Manhattan...

If you want to live in NYC across the river from school (30 min commute or so) look into Greenpoint. Thats a really nice area with cheap rent. I saw this beautiful one bedroom there for $900 a month. It was close to the L-train and the L-train drops you off at 1st and 14th which is about 8 min walk to school. And if you like to work out, the NYU gym is right next to the L-train sub-station on 3rd and 14th so it would be really easy to workout whenever you wanted.

Screw the bus man, just walk everywhere like I do. Eventually you will become almost like a power walker...I haul a$$ now.

Lots of options if you are willing to commute under 40 min and save $$$ on rent

 

Great post, thanks for the advice. I'm just curious as to what you are winning here. You can get a studio right next to the school for $1400. Yes, you lose a room, but you have no commute. I'm guessing you are planning on finding a roommate to split the 1600$ rent?

 

A studio is around 500 sq ft, near the size of a shoe box. I will not have a roommate because I am getting married soon. I wanted an extra room as an office area to study. Plus, living in NJ I get to have two cars and not pay $300 a month each to park them (like in the city). So if I want to go mountain biking or hiking up-state NY or even go for a weekend ski trip to Vermont, I will hop in my truck or car and go. What I am winning here is freedom to do what ever I want, not live in a tiny place and drive myself crazy, and live in a much nicer and calmer area.

The key to doing good in school is happiness. Living in 500 sq ft is not happiness to me...living in 1200 sq ft with a BBQ in the back yard and biking through near by trails is happiness to me!

If all you do is school you will be unhappy and burnout. You have to get out and enjoy life and school comes much easier.