*~*~*~*Official AMCAS Work/Activities Tips Thread 2018-2019*~*~*~*

[studentdoctornetworque]

Spanish translation activities are an excellent inclusion for a med school application.

Sorry, but driving time should not be included in any hourly counts for volunteer experiences, or for paid experiences if they aren't included on your time sheet.

If you remove travel hours, can you extrapolate how many verifiable hours for each of the three categories that you'll have by the time you apply, keeping in mind that you must provide a Contact (with email or phone #) who will agree with your accounting of hours of involvement to give maximum validity to these activities. Also mention the number of nonverifiable hours, eg, translating messages. Do you intend to continue this activity during the 2019-2020 application season?

Am I correct in assuming you have no other nonmedical community service/volunteering?

Thanks for the response Catalystik.

1. If I remove the travel hours, I would have about 150 paid non-clinical, 0 non-clinical volunteer (driving and messaging were this category), and 50 paid clinical.

2. I am going to continue interpreting until early May when I'll start a job doing clinical research.

3. And actually I have about 25 hours of nonmedical community service, but other than that, correct.

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[Catalystik]

Thanks for the response Catalystik.

1. If I remove the travel hours, I would have about 150 paid non-clinical, 0 non-clinical volunteer (driving and messaging were this category), and 50 paid clinical.

2. I am going to continue interpreting until early May when I'll start a job doing clinical research.

3. And actually I have about 25 hours of nonmedical community service, but other than that, correct.

At least you are down to two categories now. How much extra time would the nonpaid (unverifiable) messaging of translations add? Could you group it with the other nonclinical volunteering you have?

 

[deleted877060]

@Catalystik
So far I have shadowed ~50 hours total, with physicians in pediatric nephrology, neurosurgeon, primary care, and rheumatology (with longitudinal experiences with the pediatrician and primary care doc). I feel like I have reached the point of diminishing returns with shadowing. Are my experiences enough/would this mix of specialty be looked at favorably?

 

[Catalystik]

@Catalystik
So far I have shadowed ~50 hours total, with physicians in pediatric nephrology, neurosurgeon, primary care, and rheumatology (with longitudinal experiences with the pediatrician and primary care doc). I feel like I have reached the point of diminishing returns with shadowing. Are my experiences enough/would this mix of specialty be looked at favorably?

The specialty experience and total hours you've mentioned will make for a good experience listing. No need to do more.

 

[studentdoctornetworque]

At least you are down to two categories now. How much extra time would the nonpaid (unverifiable) messaging of translations add? Could you group it with the other nonclinical volunteering you have?

• The unverifiable time would probably be about 25 hours, and if I made a specific activity labeled as non clinical volunteering I could, I don’t know if that would be clunky though.
• The exact amount of time won’t be verified but one of my LORs is written by a few therapists that I’ve worked with whom I’ve done this for.

 

[Catalystik]

• The unverifiable time would probably be about 25 hours, and if I made a specific activity labeled as non clinical volunteering I could, I don’t know if that would be clunky though.
• The exact amount of time won’t be verified but one of my LORs is written by a few therapists that I’ve worked with whom I’ve done this for.

It would be "clunky" as you'd need to fit two activity descriptions in one space and list the subtotal of volunteer hours and the second datespan & organization in the narrative, but you could put the more-verifiable activity organization, dates, and Contact in the header of the experience slot. And having 50 hours in the Total Hours at the top would look far better than 25.

 

[studentdoctornetworque]

It would be "clunky" as you'd need to fit two activity descriptions in one space and list the subtotal of volunteer hours and the second datespan & organization in the narrative, but you could put the more-verifiable activity organization, dates, and Contact in the header of the experience slot. And having 50 hours in the Total Hours at the top would look far better than 25.

Okay, thanks for all of your help. I'll try to scrapbook it together.

 

[deleted927529]

Hi Catalystik, many of my non-clinical volunteer hours are from multiple different events. I had planned to list each one within a single Activities entry, but I'm not sure 700 characters is enough even to list names and contact info. I had a thought to group the events by a common theme (e.g. Sustainability covers a few events, Community Outreach & Development basically covers the rest), make an entry for each group, and then write more generally about my commitment to that particular theme, while including event names, individual contacts, and very briefly describing what I did. What do you think? And if I don't have room, would it be okay to use the meaningful experience space?

 

[Catalystik]

Hi Catalystik, many of my non-clinical volunteer hours are from multiple different events. I had planned to list each one within a single Activities entry, but I'm not sure 700 characters is enough even to list names and contact info.
1) I had a thought to group the events by a common theme (e.g. Sustainability covers a few events, Community Outreach & Development basically covers the rest), make an entry for each group, and then write more generally about my commitment to that particular theme, while including event names, individual contacts, and very briefly describing what I did. What do you think?
2) And if I don't have room, would it be okay to use the meaningful experience space?

1) I think that's a great idea. Outlining the major initiatives and summarizing smaller, briefer events without including a Contact and a lot of detail, especially if the name is sufficient explanation would be understandable. If you have an Advisor on campus familiar with your involvement, that would be another person to use as a Contact, BTW. Don't forget to add in subtotals of hours for each organization, if you can.

2) Yes. That's another common reason for using the expanded space.

 

[deleted927529]

1) I think that's a great idea. Outlining the major initiatives and summarizing smaller, briefer events without including a Contact and a lot of detail, especially if the name is sufficient explanation would be understandable. If you have an Advisor on campus familiar with your involvement, that would be another person to use as a Contact, BTW. Don't forget to add in subtotals of hours for each organization, if you can.

2) Yes. That's another common reason for using the expanded space.

In my case, I think I'll have to list individual contacts. For the contact field at the top of the actual Activity entry, should I list the contact of the first activity listed within or put something like "various" "see below" instead?

 

[Catalystik]

In my case, I think I'll have to list individual contacts. For the contact field at the top of the actual Activity entry, should I list the contact of the first activity listed within or put something like "various" "see below" instead?

Yes, the header should list the Contact and Org info about the first activity discussed in the space.

 

[deleted927529]

Yes, the header should list the Contact and Org info about the first activity discussed in the space.

Thank you!

 

[ilovestitch4]

Can I combine activities if my position or activity is the same but under two different organizations. For example, if I played in an orchestra for a few years, then I moved on to play for a different orchestra for another few years. Do I have to separate these entries?

 

[Catalystik]

Can I combine activities if my position or activity is the same but under two different organizations. For example, if I played in an orchestra for a few years, then I moved on to play for a different orchestra for another few years. Do I have to separate these entries?

If you have the space, you can use two slots, or you can combine the two activities into one space, and then name the space something that is inclusive of both experiences. You'd probably want to use the header for the most recent of the two musical endeavors, but then in the narrative include the same info for the other, including a Contact person. You'll save room by providing a role description that covers both locations.

 

[ilovestitch4]

So in the contact information section, I would put the contact info for the most recent organization? Should I put the contact info for the previous experience in the description and clarify the activity? The role description are basically the same for both activities, the only difference would be the organization and contact person. I was planning to put the Header to be something like "Orchestral Violinist".

I really need to combine as many similar activities as possible to save up slots or I would not be able to fit everything in.

 

[Catalystik]

1) So in the contact information section, I would put the contact info for the most recent organization?
2) Should I put the contact info for the previous experience in the description and clarify the activity? The role description are basically the same for both activities, the only difference would be the organization and contact person.
3) I was planning to put the Header to be something like "Orchestral Violinist".

1) Usually, as the contact will have a better memory of your involvement, unless there's some reason you would prefer it be less likely they are contacted.

2) Yes, with the dates, organization, location, etc.

3) Sounds good!

 

[mrinko]

Hello,

I have a few questions regarding categorization of my hours for some of my experiences and if I need to bolster certain domains.

1. I have ~600 hours volunteering at UCSD's Alzheimer's Research Center during my undergrad. There was quite a bit of variety in my experience here and I'm not sure how I should categorize my time here or if I should split my hours up to round out my ECs.

-Research: Mainly longitudinal research here. Generally more data entry/cleanup oriented. A lot of my time here was working with with one neurologist on a substudy measuring blood flow in brain via ultrasound where I acted as a coordinator, recruiting and consenting subjects. Not sure if I'd even call this research, but more regulatory and data grunt work.​

-Non-clinical: Community outreach. Aforementioned tasks if they'd be better classified as non-clinical. Not much direct interaction with subjects, but more busywork recruiting/regulatory. Assisted in menial tasks around the center.​

Of course, these are just stark descriptions for the purpose of the post. I could certainly go into more detail and talk up the stronger, meaningful points of volunteering here on my application (working and talking with people afflicted with Alzheimer's/pre-Alzheimer's; grandmother succumbed to the disease a few years back).

2. Working full time as a research associate at the same center. ~1250 hrs at time of application, probably ~3200 at time of matriculation.
-Lead CRC for clinical trial involving subjects with Down Syndrome - took over role partway through study from a mentor that left for another job

-Work closely with PI and another study clinician in assessing safety from lab results, ECGs, investigational drug orders, regulatory
-I conduct the visits and clinical tasks would mainly be assessing vitals and taking ECGs
-Expected to continue until next April
-Also act as coordinator for UCSD's Adult Down Syndrome Program for organizing outreach events and partnership​

-Backup coordinator for another clinical trial, this time for a pre-Alzheimer's population

-Generally more data entry oriented with occasional subject interactions
-Lab processing and shipping of samples
-Little interaction with PI
-This will end up only being for a few months as another coordinator is taking over soon​

-Coordinator for stem cell study gathering fibroblasts from participants

-Recruitment, scheduling, and consenting mainly​

-Lab manager

-Will soon be transferring to this role
-Making sure everything in the small, onsite lab is up to regulation, EH&S etc.
-Assisting neurologists on lumbar punctures
-Processing and shipping of cerebrospinal fluid and blood for main study at center
​

3. These experiences comprise most of my undergrad ECs. I will have ~50 hours of shadowing a few different specialties. I don't have community service, concrete clinical volunteering (hospital volunteering), or concrete lab research which is why I'm in a bind. I know many of my hours could fit the bill of a few of those EC categories, but not sure what realm I should pursue to round out my app. Especially determining if my work should be classified as Paid Clinical, Paid Research, or split based on duty and hours spent on a specific role.

Apologies for the wall of text, but please let me know if you have any opinions on the best way to break down my hours on my application. Trying to determine if I should pursue additional volunteering on the weekends, and, if so, what category it should be.

Best and thank you in advance to whoever helps.

 

[Catalystik]

I have a few questions regarding categorization of my hours for some of my experiences and if I need to bolster certain domains.

1. I have ~600 hours volunteering at UCSD's Alzheimer's Research Center during my undergrad. There was quite a bit of variety in my experience here and I'm not sure how I should categorize my time here or if I should split my hours up to round out my ECs.

-Research: Mainly longitudinal research here. Generally more data entry/cleanup oriented. A lot of my time here was working with with one neurologist on a substudy measuring blood flow in brain via ultrasound where I acted as a coordinator, recruiting and consenting subjects. Not sure if I'd even call this research, but more regulatory and data grunt work.​

-Non-clinical: Community outreach. Aforementioned tasks if they'd be better classified as non-clinical. Not much direct interaction with subjects, but more busywork recruiting/regulatory. Assisted in menial tasks around the center.​

Of course, these are just stark descriptions for the purpose of the post. I could certainly go into more detail and talk up the stronger, meaningful points of volunteering here on my application (working and talking with people afflicted with Alzheimer's/pre-Alzheimer's; grandmother succumbed to the disease a few years back).

2. Working full time as a research associate at the same center. ~1250 hrs at time of application, probably ~3200 at time of matriculation.
-Lead CRC for clinical trial involving subjects with Down Syndrome - took over role partway through study from a mentor that left for another job

-Work closely with PI and another study clinician in assessing safety from lab results, ECGs, investigational drug orders, regulatory
-I conduct the visits and clinical tasks would mainly be assessing vitals and taking ECGs
-Expected to continue until next April
-Also act as coordinator for UCSD's Adult Down Syndrome Program for organizing outreach events and partnership​

-Backup coordinator for another clinical trial, this time for a pre-Alzheimer's population

-Generally more data entry oriented with occasional subject interactions
-Lab processing and shipping of samples
-Little interaction with PI
-This will end up only being for a few months as another coordinator is taking over soon​

-Coordinator for stem cell study gathering fibroblasts from participants

-Recruitment, scheduling, and consenting mainly​

-Lab manager

-Will soon be transferring to this role
-Making sure everything in the small, onsite lab is up to regulation, EH&S etc.
-Assisting neurologists on lumbar punctures
-Processing and shipping of cerebrospinal fluid and blood for main study at center
​

3. These experiences comprise most of my undergrad ECs. I will have ~50 hours of shadowing a few different specialties. I don't have community service, concrete clinical volunteering (hospital volunteering), or concrete lab research which is why I'm in a bind. I know many of my hours could fit the bill of a few of those EC categories, but not sure what realm I should pursue to round out my app. Especially determining if my work should be classified as Paid Clinical, Paid Research, or split based on duty and hours spent on a specific role.

Apologies for the wall of text, but please let me know if you have any opinions on the best way to break down my hours on my application. Trying to determine if I should pursue additional volunteering on the weekends, and, if so, what category it should be.

Best and thank you in advance to whoever helps.

-Are you aiming for primary care-oriented schools or do you have the stats to be considered by selective research-oriented school?

-When did you decide to pursue medicine as a career?

-Do any of the studies in which you've participated benefit the subject with any immediacy? Will lab results be entered in their regular medical chart? If you directly interacted with patients who already have a known diagnosis, such as by drawing blood, assisting with lumbar puncture, doppler blood flow studies, social stimulation, or taking a history, that would be considered "clinical." I don't think you have a choice but to split out sub-elements of an activity and using another space to list them under a separate category, so the clinical components won't be missed. Roughly, how many hours would that add up to in total?

-Keep in mind that future hours should be separated out from completed hours and that your figures should match the records of the Contact who can verify them. Future hours have little impact on decision-making by adcomms. You want to be completely transparent on your application.

-Lab Manager might be considered Leadership if you are coordinating the efforts of others and taking responsibility for outcomes.

-Under #2, please give more detail of your role where I highlighted in RED and subtotal of hours.

 

[mrinko]

-Are you aiming for primary care-oriented schools or do you have the stats to be considered by selective research-oriented school?

-When did you decide to pursue medicine as a career?

-Do any of the studies in which you've participated benefit the subject with any immediacy? Will lab results be entered in their regular medical chart? If you directly interacted with patients who already have a known diagnosis, such as by drawing blood, assisting with lumbar puncture, doppler blood flow studies, social stimulation, or taking a history, that would be considered "clinical." I don't think you have a choice but to split out sub-elements of an activity and using another space to list them under a separate category, so the clinical components won't be missed. Roughly, how many hours would that add up to in total?

-Keep in mind that future hours should be separated out from completed hours and that your figures should match the records of the Contact who can verify them. Future hours have little impact on decision-making by adcomms. You want to be completely transparent on your application.

-Lab Manager might be considered Leadership if you are coordinating the efforts of others and taking responsibility for outcomes.

-Under #2, please give more detail of your role where I highlighted in RED and subtotal of hours.

-Likely more primary care-oriented MD & DO schools with my stats. Unfortunately my freshman and sophomore GPA were very low which somewhat touches on the second point. sGPA (Fresh: 3.03, Soph: 3.17, Junior: 3.75, Senior: 4.00) [avg 3.35] cGPA (3.32,3.17,3.74,3.96) [avg 3.5] MCAT: 514

-Made the hard decision later in my undergrad. Around mid junior year which is also when I started my volunteering. Always wanted to pursue medicine in some form, but didn't believe in med school being a possibility until I transferred from a CC to UCSD and my GPA shot up with much more stimulating biochem classes, hiked out of depression, fixed poor study habits, etc.

-No immediate benefit, unfortunately, unless the study drug was, in fact, having a positive effect, but that would not be known on an individual basis. For trials, some lab results are going into their EMR. If wildly abnormal results come back from a central lab then those would be reported to their PCP for treatment. In terms of hours of volunteering I could call clinical in that sense, perhaps 60-80 of the 600; maybe tack on 20 more if getting history for recruitment purposes via telephone interview would count. Pure clinical paid would be more along the lines of 150 or so of my 1250 by the time of applying.

-In terms of leadership, some of my hours dedicated to working on my primary clinical trial may be applicable as I'm coordinating the efforts of psychometrists and cognitive testers so visits run smoothly. Additionally, I'm handling the financial and regulatory sides of the trial as well.

-Coordinating for the Adult DS Program is pretty minimal and intersects with its corresponding clinical trial to an extent. Mainly involves referring parents of adults with DS to the clinic of the trial's PI (he is the director of the Down Syndrome Center). While it hasn't occurred since I took over the responsibility, I'll likely be coordinating with local special care facilities and events. For example, prior to being given the responsibility, the previous coordinator and I set up an information booth for our program at a walk for the Nation DS Society.

I really appreciate your help!

 

[Catalystik]

-Likely more primary care-oriented MD & DO schools with my stats. Unfortunately my freshman and sophomore GPA were very low which somewhat touches on the second point. sGPA (Fresh: 3.03, Soph: 3.17, Junior: 3.75, Senior: 4.00) [avg 3.35] cGPA (3.32,3.17,3.74,3.96) [avg 3.5] MCAT: 514

-Made the hard decision later in my undergrad. Around mid junior year which is also when I started my volunteering. Always wanted to pursue medicine in some form, but didn't believe in med school being a possibility until I transferred from a CC to UCSD and my GPA shot up with much more stimulating biochem classes, hiked out of depression, fixed poor study habits, etc.

-No immediate benefit, unfortunately, unless the study drug was, in fact, having a positive effect, but that would not be known on an individual basis. For trials, some lab results are going into their EMR. If wildly abnormal results come back from a central lab then those would be reported to their PCP for treatment. In terms of hours of volunteering I could call clinical in that sense, perhaps 60-80 of the 600; maybe tack on 20 more if getting history for recruitment purposes via telephone interview would count. Pure clinical paid would be more along the lines of 150 or so of my 1250 by the time of applying.

-In terms of leadership, some of my hours dedicated to working on my primary clinical trial may be applicable as I'm coordinating the efforts of psychometrists and cognitive testers so visits run smoothly. Additionally, I'm handling the financial and regulatory sides of the trial as well.

-Coordinating for the Adult DS Program is pretty minimal and intersects with its corresponding clinical trial to an extent. Mainly involves referring parents of adults with DS to the clinic of the trial's PI (he is the director of the Down Syndrome Center). While it hasn't occurred since I took over the responsibility, I'll likely be coordinating with local special care facilities and events. For example, prior to being given the responsibility, the previous coordinator and I set up an information booth for our program at a walk for the Nation DS Society.

I really appreciate your help!

Referring to the Original Post:
1) Since you want to appeal to primary-care oriented schools, for activity #1, I suggest you break it into clinical (~60 hours) and nonclinical volunteering (~540 hours), taking care to give yourself a low-level title that doesn't suggest active involvement in research (Volunteer Aide to Staff Neurologist?). I'd guess that you might not have been talking to patients on the phone, but rather their caregivers. If it was the patients, you can count that as clinical. Be sure your PI agrees with your hours.

2) Break it into Clinical Employment (~150 hours) and Research or NonClinical Employment (~1250 hours).

For each of the above you can use the AMCAS Repeated feature to add in your Future hours on a second line of the header, but only if you are absolutely sure you will complete the predicted hours (ie, don't break a leg). Alternatively, add at the end of the entries that you intend to continue working through [date] at about YY hours per week.

3) -You won't need "concrete" lab exposure for primary care-oriented schools, but it's helpful if you have a full understanding of the hypothesis, methods, etc of the project, if asked at interviews. You do need more exposure to a variety of acutely ill and injured patients, so I suggest getting in some volunteering where you would have exposure to a broad range of patients: skilled-level nursing home, ED, peds unit, hospice, etc. Plan to continue with that activity until you have an acceptance in hand, for the sake of Secondary essays, update letters (where allowed), and in case you need to reapply.

-Hopefully your shadowing includes an office-based primary care doc that is providing longitudinal care.

 

[ThetisAntithesis]

I have some questions and apologize if these have been asked before.
1) For the character count, I understand its 700 for each activity but for the meaningful activities, is it 700 +1325 or just 1325 characters in total?
2) I read somewhere just (1 or 2 websites mentioned this) that it may not be advisable to add in religious activities. 2 of my activities are in church settings and are both significant (1 is a meaningful activity) - Mentorship and Leadership. Just clarifying that I can actually use these activities.
3) I did research in college (I've been out 10 yrs) - I collected data basically - 1 semester only and it was for credit hours. I did end up having my name on the paper when it got published in a journal - Should I list this? And it would be under "Research"?
4) Wondering how much shadowing I should try to get in? I'm an NP in primary care. I have shadowed one of the MDs I work with but it was informal (even before I considered going though this process) and in her pediatric setting mostly - not many hours, prob less than 20. I've been advised (not on here) to not bother with shadowing bc the point of shadowing is to see if healthcare/MD is for you and since I'm already in that setting, I don't need it. At the same time, even though being an NP is not the same as being an MD, would it be advisable to get in some hours? It feels like box-checking to me but if I have to do it, I would rather do it.
5) I work with the homeless- It is part of my job (paid employment). I am planning to list this as separate from my paid employment as "Clinical volunteering"- I think I tried to highlight in my PS that it is part of my actual job. Anyway, I have some hours that are volunteer (after hours) even within this setting - Foot clinics, fairs, etc as well. Is this okay?

I think that's all the questions I have for now.
Thanks so much.

 

[Catalystik]

I have some questions and apologize if these have been asked before.
1) For the character count, I understand its 700 for each activity but for the meaningful activities, is it 700 +1325 or just 1325 characters in total?
2) I read somewhere just (1 or 2 websites mentioned this) that it may not be advisable to add in religious activities. 2 of my activities are in church settings and are both significant (1 is a meaningful activity) - Mentorship and Leadership. Just clarifying that I can actually use these activities.
3) I did research in college (I've been out 10 yrs) - I collected data basically - 1 semester only and it was for credit hours. I did end up having my name on the paper when it got published in a journal - Should I list this? And it would be under "Research"?
4) Wondering how much shadowing I should try to get in? I'm an NP in primary care. I have shadowed one of the MDs I work with but it was informal (even before I considered going though this process) and in her pediatric setting mostly - not many hours, prob less than 20. I've been advised (not on here) to not bother with shadowing bc the point of shadowing is to see if healthcare/MD is for you and since I'm already in that setting, I don't need it. At the same time, even though being an NP is not the same as being an MD, would it be advisable to get in some hours? It feels like box-checking to me but if I have to do it, I would rather do it.
5) I work with the homeless- It is part of my job (paid employment). I am planning to list this as separate from my paid employment as "Clinical volunteering"- I think I tried to highlight in my PS that it is part of my actual job. Anyway, I have some hours that are volunteer (after hours) even within this setting - Foot clinics, fairs, etc as well. Is this okay?

1) 700+1325, so 2025 characters in two boxes that can be presented as one essay if the paragraph break is in the right place.

2) Whether you should use them depends on your role. Feel free to clarify.

3) Yes, you should list the Publication. You may also use a Research space to discuss your role if it won't fit in the Publication space.

4) 50 shadowing hours is the average listed. 40 are required by some schools and I consider it a minimum. Feel free to list the 20 informal hours and try to get 20 more dedicated hours with another office-based primary care doctor, +/- including other specialties if you like. You need to check the box.

5) Yes. Be sure to have a Contact who will validate the volunteer time.

 

[Catalystik]

It's time to wrap up this thread and start one for the 2020 application season. Post questions here: *~*~*~* Official AMCAS "Work/Activities" Tips Thread 2019-2020 *~*~*~*