Offshore Drilling!

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Squiggy

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No one gets to know the plan
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How would this be cheaper? Boats and gas to power boats are expensive, setting up a decent mobile clinic will cost the same as, if not more than setting one up on land, your loans still cost as much so you have to charge enough to cover your own expenses, I'm assuming your 'crew' would be american and therefore subject to the same labor laws and demands as other American employees.

Where's the draw?
 
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Great idea! My future dental practice will not suffer from the poopy-pants complaints that we hear so much about because ...

I won't play the game with unfair rules!

Choose not.

Start your own clinic, be a fee-for-service provider (pay before treatment), cash or check up front (no credit cards taking their 4%).

Allows one to give away care for free for charity work, get paid, less stress and time on stuipid billing Medicare/ade, insurance, blah.

A boat in international waters doesn't need to follow laws of USA since ... it is not in the USA! Of course I assume one would practice proper dentistry, but this will allow escaping the rule of the dropouts running this great country.


Go dentistry!

P.S. Charge extra for monkey fights. Maybe give each patient a number relating to a monkey, and whichever monkey wins pays the least of their bill! Humans love gambling.
 
WOW! is this a plan to avoid taxes in the USA? this sounds bad. If you own this and live in the usa then IRS will grab you.

I would rather focus on making a nice clininc in the USA. If the poster is not from the USA, then I can understand your desire to get the income from Americans.
 
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Squiggy said:
Heck yeah! We'll totally have monkey fights and we'll give them like hand-drills and other equipment to use! We'll also have a mini-casino!

It'll be a large sailboat so we won't need to use to much gas. And the dentists will double up as crew while we're sailing. The initial investment for the clinic will be costly but I'm gonna hire experienced dentists from low income or saturated countries cheap and make up the investment over time through high volume work. My friends and I have the boat and we'll drum up the capital to start with one or two chairs and if it's profitable, eventual expand to have like a giant floating barge 3 miles out with a lot of chairs (think Waterworld). We'll shuttle patients to and from the platform and rotate our dentists on seasonal cycles so whatever we pay them on their deployments here will be a lot over there (hopefully the dollar picks up).

So basically, we'll have cheap labor and low prices which will probably lead to higher volume, even if it is on a boat. The clinic will be expensive, but we have the boat and the loans won't be as bad since we won't have the expenses of dental school. So it all comes down to... is it legal?

Oh and it's all cash and an underground business so no taxes. And the patients are gonna pay or else they're off the boat.
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How are you gonna make up the high volume on a sail boat with 1 or 2 chairs?
 
Squiggy said:
Nah, I'm a US citizen though I don't know how my business will be viewed by the IRS. Just conjuring up fallback plans if dental school doesn't work out.

Oh and we'll also be gluing veneers and other fun cosmetic stuff too.
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So you're going to pay for a high-end cosmetic laboratory and technicians to staff it, on top of everything else?
 
aphistis said:
So you're going to pay for a high-end cosmetic laboratory and technicians to staff it, on top of everything else?
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Aphistis, don't question his plan, its quite obvious he's thought it all the way through....
 
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Squiggy said:
That comes after we expand to have the floating waterworldish barge and have enough of a revenue stream from the GP stuff to support the investment. But yes, we'll start with 1-2 chairs and cater to underserved patients. We might have higher overhead cause the clinic is on a boat rather than on land but we'll have cheap labor with our foreign crew and we won't have dental school debt. If folks coming out of USC or NYU with hundreds of thousands in debt can start their own practices, we can afford to do dentistry cheaper (though I'll admit probably lower quality care but still better than no care for the patients) and still pull a profit. Plus it's a boat so we can sleep in it and reinvest more of our revenues back into the business.
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In order to prevent the IRS from catching wind of your plan, I recommend you get a cage of sharks off the port side of the barge. After collecting your fees, just toss the unsuspecting patients into the shark cage and be done with them. This also cuts down on the overhead (no need for gas to return the patients to land).

Good plan!
 
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I'm persuaded. How do I become a partner?
 
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I do not know if this is a troll post, but I will entertain it.

If you are a US citizen, you will have to pay tax on worldwide income. (There are exemptions, up to 80kish or so). However, if you practice in a country that is non-cooperative, you could hide the income. Why go offshore, when you can just practice in another country? The standards are more relaxed, the system is relatively more corrupt, and from the sound of your post, you can get away with "substandard care, US standards".

You may end up making less money (or more, if you're good in business) in the absolute sense, but relatively speaking, your income could probably afford you a better lifestyle in another country.

Looking at the market you want to target, you may have a problem luring high priced procedures in the demographics that may want it. You could offer it at a lower cost and lure in more people, but you would need to ensure that you get paid. If you could not get these high priced procedures, you will have to work by volume. I suggest looking for a country with little/no regulations and setup there.
 
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Squiggy said:
Setting up a practice in another country basically undermines our business model. Competing with established practices abroad will kill our profit margins. The plan is to provide dental services for lower prices like in other countries but only three miles offshore. It's expensive to fly down to Mexico, Europe, or the Caribbean but all our patients have to do is drive to port. So for the American consumer we are actually cheaper and more convenient than heading abroad.

Also keep in mind that we'll be living on the boat so aside from gas (might actually be more expensive in other countries) and food and other supplies, our expenses won't be too bad. Personally I think our care will only be substandard due to the hazard of being at sea (but then again the navy and coast guard does dentistry this way). We'll hire dentists from EU countries most likely and they are still very competent dentists who will work for probably hygienist salaries since there seems to be an oversupply over there and they go to school for free. Also, we'll have about three cruises a day, one in the morning and two in the afternoon so the volume we see I estimate will be a degree less than corporate dental clinics factoring in the time it takes to travel to and from port.

But seriously though people... is this a feasible plan? How possible will it be to net at minimum $75k a year? Will the state dental boards destroy us?
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No.
 
Huzzah! Mobile dental fleet is a go!
 
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The US government sets it international border at 200 miles out so can't park your barge 3 miles out and expect to avoid American jurisdiction. It's not feasable nor profitable to ship patients that far out even at nondiscounted market price. The patient is not gonna take that 10-20 hours bumpy roundtrip boat ride for dental care since there are already such cheap, unlicensed underground clinics in every major American city.

However, an idea that may work at sea is s*x tourism. Remember how much trouble the Minnesota Vikings and the New York governor got over such? Our society is pretty oppressive in comparison any other countries so men don't mind the inconvenience of time and distance for such spiritual absolution. Contract with the mob for some Ukrainians, Czechs, Thais, etc. and you're all set.

I support you either way. It's such creative entrepreneurial spirits that have made America great and created jobs and lifted us out of every recession.
 
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Squiggy said:
I probably should be asking a lawyer about this but I was wondering if you guys could give me input on this idea (basically if it's legal or not).

I get a decent sized boat that is licensed in a foreign country and a hire a few foreign (probably EU) dentists. We set up on-board clinic, take in a whole bunch of patients each morning, and sail out into international waters. We moor the boat, stablize it with an outrigger and we do dentistry on the cheap. The patients can relax and spend their time fishing or something before and after their procedures.

Basically it's like dental tourism combined with gambling cruise ships. We'll basically be offering dental coverage to people who can afford neither an American dentist or to travel abroad to get dental work done.

Now I know this is possible because dental work gets done on cruise ships and underway in the navy and coast guard, but is it legal?
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What exactly is your goal here? Performing procedures on a boat doesn't cost less. You're just billing less. And my guess is that taking a ship out to international waters costs much more than driving to Mexico.

Are you trying to circumvent some laws? Because this isn't cutting it. American courts often extend their jurisdiction beyond American soil. Further, the act of advertising in the US and picking up customers from the US prolly are enough to give the courts jurisdiction. You're still under US laws and regs. On top of that, you may be subjected to maritime (I think that's the word for it) laws for doing things at sea.
 
Take a couple business courses, and a common sense one while you're at it.
 
How do casino boats get away with it then? (the maritime laws)
 
No offense, but if you need people to tell you why this isn't going to work, I'm not sure you have the business sense to make it work in the first place.
 
Squiggy said:
How do casino boats get away with it then? (the maritime laws)
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Get away with what? You'll have to be much more specific before others can answer your question.

You can't escape liability entirely. You CAN have different sets of laws apply to you. Are you trying to evade taxes? Or are you trying to escape US jurisdiction?
 
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Squiggy said:
Sorry about the lack of info. I'm talking about the casino boats in states that ban gambling. They go on like 3-5 cruises a day and they sail out so they are not subject to state gamblng laws.

I'm not trying to evade taxes, just US jurisdiction for dentistry. I figure if those boats can bypass state gambling laws, I can bypass state dental laws at sea.
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There are ways to circumvent jurisdiction, but I'm not going into details because I don't want you trying to do it. If you get patients from the US, sail from the US, and advertise in the US, then the US courts have what is called specific jurisdiction. They can hear cases that "arise" out of that transaction. In short, you CAN get sued.

As far as state law goes, there's what's called the 100-mile rule. Courts have jurisdiction for up to a 100 miles radius, applied particularly if the end of that 100 miles is outside the state boundary. If the defendant is outside of that 100 mile radius, then the court won't have any jurisdiction. The federal government can do much more. They can reach you even if you're in Korea, for example. It's a highly complicated case, and you're unlikely to escape the pull of the US law. So I'd forget trying to circumvent it.
 
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Squiggy said:
Sorry about the lack of info. I'm talking about the casino boats in states that ban gambling. They go on like 3-5 cruises a day and they sail out so they are not subject to state gamblng laws.

I'm not trying to evade taxes, just US jurisdiction for dentistry. I figure if those boats can bypass state gambling laws, I can bypass state dental laws at sea.
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what laws are you trying to bypass that you do not want to abide by? it sounds like you are trying to make a quick buck by doing sub-standard dentistry.

i must say that this is one of the worst thought out plans i have ever seen.

some of the many problems: where are you going to send your lab work? Answer: probably the US, so there is another way they can get you. are you going to hire assistants? what are you going to do with your waste? just dump it in the water?
 
whoops
 
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thedudeabides6 said:
what laws are you trying to bypass that you do not want to abide by? it sounds like you are trying to make a quick buck by doing sub-standard dentistry.

i must say that this is one of the worst thought out plans i have ever seen.

some of the many problems: where are you going to send your lab work? Answer: probably the US, so there is another way they can get you. are you going to hire assistants? what are you going to do with your waste? just dump it in the water?
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You seriously think someone who is trying to figure out a plan like this is going to pay a US lab to do quality labwork? I'm sure China can make crowns with sufficient enough margins and enough nickel for his underserved population. ;)

Mods please close this thread, the op is obviously a troll or someone who is looking for a quick way to do unethical dentistry, either way, not a topic for young impressionable dental minds. :D
 
ScubaDr2B said:
You seriously think someone who is trying to figure out a plan like this is going to pay a US lab to do quality labwork? I'm sure China can make crowns with sufficient enough margins and enough nickel for his underserved population. ;)

Mods please close this thread, the op is obviously a troll or someone who is looking for a quick way to do unethical dentistry, either way, not a topic for young impressionable dental minds. :D
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We'll let it ride for now. I think the OP is being "peer-moderated" pretty effectively at the moment. :)
 
Sigh... one of these days I'll find a way... maybe an airship or something...
 
free room and board on a ship in the med or Caribbean, and I might do this with you....;)
 
He'd be better off trying to find ways to reduce cost in a US clinic. Perhaps an off-shore site to have labwork done. Or better yet, have a clinic near the US boarder and have labwork done in Mexico and shipped over to the US. Or buy dental equipment Made in Mexico.
 
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