OMFS - Pass/Fail Step 1

[BYU4you]

I just found out that the Step 1 is being looked at going to a Pass/Fail instead of numerical score in the not so distant future pending results of some survey that just ended.

If it goes through, This will likely bring changes to the CBSE and in turn OMFS residency applications.

Im curious what the future would hold, I like that there is some sort of measuring stick to go by in OMFS. My friends applying to other specialties seem a little less sure about where they stand since the ADAT and GRE are on such a program by program basis and many schools are pass/fail now.

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[DustFreeEraser]

Assuming that OMFS schools (especially the 6 year programs) wanted a CBSE score to ensure the applicant was good enough to pass Step 1, I too am not sure how this will affect OMFS applicants.

Will the CBSE no longer exist?

 

[deleted884144]

I am also curious about how these purported changes to Step 1 will affect OMFS admissions.

 

[Charcot-Marie-Tooth]

I think we're all interested... lol

From what I've heard, I thought that most people were very against the idea of Step 1 going to P/F and that it wasn't likely happening any time in the near future? They just finished the 'public comment period'. So I would assume that if it ever did happen, it's still a ways off... This is from their site - "No decisions have yet been made regarding changes to USMLE scoring. If a decision is made to change USMLE scoring, any changes would be announced well in advance of the impacted application cycle"..... But who knows?
Made some sense in Dentistry as not everyone goes on to specialize, but I'm not sure how that'd work in Medicine.

 

[toothsucker]

I’m sorry, but isn’t the CBSE separate and distinct from USMLE Step 1? Obviously the question bank is similar/the same, but there has been no mention that the scoring is changing for CBSE. And it likely won’t. AAOMS works closely with USMLE to develop a particular version of the test for the sole purpose of OMFS placement.

 

[BYU4you]

I’m sorry, but isn’t the CBSE separate and distinct from USMLE Step 1? Obviously the question bank is similar/the same, but there has been no mention that the scoring is changing for CBSE. And it likely won’t. AAOMS works closely with USMLE to develop a particular version of the test for the sole purpose of OMFS placement.

I was under the impression we took the same CBSE but are compared against other OMFS applicants when it comes to percentiles and averages. I could definitely be wrong.

 

[deleted884144]

I was under the impression we took the same CBSE but are compared against other OMFS applicants when it comes to percentiles and averages. I could definitely be wrong.

Yes, that is what I thought as well. The CBSE we take is the same one many medical students are required to take before they are given a permit by their school to register for the Step 1 (so as to prevent failure).

NBME simply gives us a permit through AAOMS.

 

[ThirdMolarz]

Made some sense in Dentistry as not everyone goes on to specialize, but I'm not sure how that'd work in Medicine.

Oh, med students are freaking out: Pass/ Fail Step 1 (as they should be)

 

[DustFreeEraser]

Their "next steps" could be taken as early as this year

Home | United States Medical Licensing Examination

www.usmle.org

 

[ab117]

Yeah I would imagine they'd just continue to administer the CBSE for dental students. OMFS still wants some way to differentiate applicants and it's being used as an admissions test rather than for licensure like for med students. I'm sure they'd rather keep using the med-based test than switch to the ADAT.

 

[deleted884144]

Yeah I would imagine they'd just continue to administer the CBSE for dental students. OMFS still wants some way to differentiate applicants and it's being used as an admissions test rather than for licensure like for med students. I'm sure they'd rather keep using the med-based test than switch to the ADAT.

I agree. I think OMFS admissions will stay as is (regardless of what happens with Step 1), with the CBSE remaining and being scored the same way.

 

[DustFreeEraser]

What would be their reason for keeping scores on the CBSE when all they need to know is whether they passed or failed?

 

[_Potassium]

I mean..Passing and failing isn't an arbitrary process. A test taker must score over a threshold to "Pass." The idea here is that NBME will allow the CBSE to be reported numerically, specifically for OMFS applicants.

I personally think this is quite premature, and I"d be very surprised if Step 1 did become Pass/Fail.

 

[Startingover123]

I just found out that the Step 1 is being looked at going to a Pass/Fail instead of numerical score in the not so distant future pending results of some survey that just ended.

If it goes through, This will likely bring changes to the CBSE and in turn OMFS residency applications.

Im curious what the future would hold, I like that there is some sort of measuring stick to go by in OMFS. My friends applying to other specialties seem a little less sure about where they stand since the ADAT and GRE are on such a program by program basis and many schools are pass/fail now.

Now that this is official do you think the cbse will continue to be scored?

 

[elwaytime7]

I honestly hope it doesn't go away. Hear me out.

4-6 years of hospital work is a huge commitment that takes some serious thought. Though the score is less meaningful, the test itself is valuable in showing that: 1) you care enough about OMFS to go through a tough process 2) you have thought long and hard if you can persist in a residency this long. It also allows you to redeem yourself if you feel like your grades don't reflect your true potential.

I think preparing yourself to study takes a lot of intention and shows a lot of character. For a program, losing a resident can really impact a program for years. If you aren't a good fit for OMFS, and drop out, it affects you and everyone else in your program.

While it was very hard at the time to juggle the CBSE while maintaining good grades but I personally felt very proud when I matched (top 5 day of my life). After all, the journey is long, but the goal is in every step along the way.

 

[Startingover123]

I honestly hope it doesn't go away. Hear me out.

4-6 years of hospital work is a huge commitment that takes some serious thought. Though the score is less meaningful, the test itself is valuable in showing that: 1) you care enough about OMFS to go through a tough process 2) you have thought long and hard if you can persist in a residency this long. It also allows you to redeem yourself if you feel like your grades don't reflect your true potential.

I think preparing yourself to study takes a lot of intention and shows a lot of character. For a program, losing a resident can really impact a program for years. If you aren't a good fit for OMFS, and drop out, it affects you and everyone else in your program.

While it was very hard at the time to juggle the CBSE while maintaining good grades but I personally felt very proud when I matched (top 5 day of my life). After all, the journey is long, but the goal is in every step along the way.

I would have to believe they would just replace the cbse with a new test?

 

[BYU4you]

Its interesting since the NBME is the one that administers the test. Im sure it will be scored for at least the next few cycles but who knows what the future will hold.

 

[bruin2013]

There has to be a way for them to tell people they are borderline failing. I don’t think these will go entirely P/F

Its interesting since the NBME is the one that administers the test. Im sure it will be scored for at least the next few cycles but who knows what the future will hold.

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[Life of Pablo]

I think especially 6 year programs will fight to keep the CBSE. It's a good indicator of passing step 1. Additionally, I don't think they can make it P/F because a passing score would be like ~68 and there aren't enough people e very cycle that break 68 to fill every residency spot.

 

[desertrat12]

I hope is remains scored. It is certainly the most challenging obstacle of all the dental specialty applications, but at least its relevant to our future, a great way to leave the playing field from a prestigious school to a no name school, cuts through the differences in grades vs pass/no pass school, etc etc. I look at my buddies doing ortho and they are torn across all sorts of ec’s trying to be the president of every organization they hear about, because those things do matter a lot for them. We are lucky to have the cbse, it’s an ultimate comparison tool that also helps us gain a body of knowledge we actually need. And I don’t have to be the president of 5 clubs to get into oms.

By the way, I still think the cbse sucks to study for. But it’s more of a love/hate relationship we’ve got going on...mostly hate - let’s not be crazy.

 

[B0wMNj]

I hope is remains scored. It is certainly the most challenging obstacle of all the dental specialty applications, but at least its relevant to our future, a great way to leave the playing field from a prestigious school to a no name school, cuts through the differences in grades vs pass/no pass school, etc etc. I look at my buddies doing ortho and they are torn across all sorts of ec’s trying to be the president of every organization they hear about, because those things do matter a lot for them. We are lucky to have the cbse, it’s an ultimate comparison tool that also helps us gain a body of knowledge we actually need. And I don’t have to be the president of 5 clubs to get into oms.

By the way, I still think the cbse sucks to study for. But it’s more of a love/hate relationship we’ve got going on...mostly hate - let’s not be crazy.

Agree, I'd rather focus on doing well and learning something that will benefit our future than participate in activities I'm not interested in solely to pad the resume.

 

[caffeine jitters]

I think this was touched on a bit earlier, but I have a hard time believing the CBSE (a test to indicate a student's preparedness for STEP I) would go P/F. This is just a practice test for the vast majority of people that take it (medical students), so making it P/F would do little to help those students truly appreciate whether they're ready for the real deal or not. The numerical score associated with the CBSE is so valuable because the SEE allows students to better predict if they'll actually pass STEP, even if they have an "off day" (lower end of CBSE SEE score range).

 

[Xtract]

four year OMFS programs still require a CBSE score even though their applicants dont need to take the step 1. Now that the Step 1 will be pass/fail, I just think it'll hold less weight for 6 year programs.

 

[volleyball28]

Does anyone know if there are any current unfilled residency programs for 2020 post match?

 

[deleted913442]

I hope not.. I learned so much about medicine that I wouldn't have known because of the CBSE. While it is useful for to quantitatively analyze an applicant, it also helps them prepare for the medical side of things that they might have had issues grasping during dental school (or not even learning in dental school for that matter.)

 

[Dr.Varicocele]

I still think CBSE will be relevant. Atleast for 6 year programs. A couple things to keep in mind...
1. You still have to pass Step 1. One of the main goals of the CBSE is let programs know you are ready and able to do that. The higher your CBSE score, the more assurance they might have that you will pass. Passing Step 1 has aways been a concern for 6 year programs.
2. Step 2 and 3 are still numerical scores. While maybe the CBSE isn't directly correlated score predictability wise, these more clinical based exams do require a foundation of knowledge that you must build upon from CBSE/Step 1.

All in all, CBSE is still an assurance to programs that you are ready to pass medical-based licensing exams, especially for 6 year programs.

 

[OMaxFace]

I still think CBSE will be relevant. Atleast for 6 year programs. A couple things to keep in mind...
1. You still have to pass Step 1. One of the main goals of the CBSE is let programs know you are ready and able to do that. The higher your CBSE score, the more assurance they might have that you will pass. Passing Step 1 has aways been a concern for 6 year programs.
2. Step 2 and 3 are still numerical scores. While maybe the CBSE isn't directly correlated score predictability wise, these more clinical based exams do require a foundation of knowledge that you must build upon from CBSE/Step 1.

All in all, CBSE is still an assurance to programs that you are ready to pass medical-based licensing exams, especially for 6 year programs.

Exactly. Still have to demonstrate you can pass (especially for 6y programs) which is not necessarily a walk in the park. Most of the CBSE scores people apply with are borderline pass or a straight fail. Failing the Step 1 creates such a rift between OMFS programs and medical school admins. A good, passing CBSE score creates an extra layer of assurance for PDs.

 

[Dr. USMLE]

I still think CBSE will be relevant. Atleast for 6 year programs. A couple things to keep in mind...
1. You still have to pass Step 1. One of the main goals of the CBSE is let programs know you are ready and able to do that. The higher your CBSE score, the more assurance they might have that you will pass. Passing Step 1 has aways been a concern for 6 year programs.
2. Step 2 and 3 are still numerical scores. While maybe the CBSE isn't directly correlated score predictability wise, these more clinical based exams do require a foundation of knowledge that you must build upon from CBSE/Step 1.

All in all, CBSE is still an assurance to programs that you are ready to pass medical-based licensing exams, especially for 6 year programs.

Sounds about right.