Oms-iv q&a

[DrUKDO]

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I saw a similar thread in the pre-medical allopathic forum, but not one in the pre-osteopathic, and since MD and DO schools are different hopefully I can help answer some questions.

I am currently a 4th year osteopathic medical student c/o 2012, excited to graduate soon in May. If you have any questions or would like my input on anything, ask away! 😀

 

[ManBroDude]

With the Match in a few short months, what's your plan? AOA/ACGME? How have you prepared these past few years?

 

[Iliketoytles]

Hi DrUKDO! Thanks for this thread. This will really help a lot of people.

I posted a similar question in the DMU specific thread, but I'll ask here too. Can you explain how you went about setting up your rotations?

 

[donkeykong1]

Ahh I've been looking forward to the OMS version of one of these types of threads. So have you taken the USMLE & COMLEX? If you have, how did you prepare for both exams?

 

[Rollo]

What field are you going into?

Did you take USMLE Step 2? If so, when did you take COMLEX II & USMLE II, and what did you use to prepare?

 

[pianoman511]

I am a fourth year osteo student as well so I will throw my opinion on here so everyone will have a few perspectives (not trying to hijack - I swear).

With the Match in a few short months, what's your plan? AOA/ACGME? How have you prepared these past few years?

I will most likely be participating only in the ACGME (MD) match. This was not a choice I made until this year when I rotated at an allopathic institution with a residency program (EM, btw) and loved it. I did do anything specific to be able to apply MD with the exception of having SLORs completed (standardized letters of recommendation - very EM specific but required for applying to MD programs in EM).

Hi DrUKDO! Thanks for this thread. This will really help a lot of people.

I posted a similar question in the DMU specific thread, but I'll ask here too. Can you explain how you went about setting up your rotations?

My rotations at LECOM were set up by small groups - we had to select from a list of affiliates and work it out amongst ourselves for the core rotations (i.e. medicine, surgery, family medicine, pediatrics, ob, etc) and for the elective rotations it came down to what I was interested in for third year and where do I want to do a residency for fourth year.

Ahh I've been looking forward to the OMS version of one of these types of threads. So have you taken the USMLE & COMLEX? If you have, how did you prepare for both exams?

COMLEX only (because I decided late to do the MD match) - prepared with First Aid, Kaplan Q-bank, Savarese for step 1 and Step Up to Medicine, Step Up to Step 2, and COMBANK with Savarese for step 2.

What field are you going into?

Did you take USMLE Step 2? If so, when did you take COMLEX II & USMLE II, and what did you use to prepare?

EM, see above. I took COMLEX II at the end of June (beginning of third year) so that my score would be available in time for interview/application season. Many programs are now looking more closely at COMLEX/USMLE II scores but most PDs still emphasize the importance of rotating at an institution with a residency program and obtaining good letters of recommendation over step I&II scores. However, they often use these scores to screen applicants for interviews.

 

[lftbndlbrnchblk]

I am an OMS-I, looking to go into ACGME EM. Do not want to research this summer. Or ever, really. Is that going to hurt me?

 

[cliquesh]

how many interviews do you have with just comlex scores? And did you get above or below a 600

 

[DrUKDO]

Hi all! Thanks for your questions. I will do my best to answer. If you ever need clarification or have any additional things you want to ask, feel free!

With the Match in a few short months, what's your plan? AOA/ACGME? How have you prepared these past few years?

The first big decision I had to make after the 1st year of med school was whether I wanted to take the USMLE or not. I went back and forth for awhile about it, but I decided to take COMLEX only. I am not the greatest standardized test taker and I decided to focus 100% on the COMLEX. I also knew I wanted to do an osteopathic residency so only COMLEX is needed. I actually started studying for the USMLE Step 1 originally, but made the personal decision to just focus on COMLEX for the reasons above.

As far as the match, I applied to both AOA and ACGME programs thru ERAS. I applied to IM programs only. I really only settled on IM just before I filled out ERAS. I applied to ACGME programs as kind of a backup, just to see if I would get any interviews. I really want to match osteopathic, so I am definitely going thru the AOA match.

As far as preparing for the match, there's really nothing specific you can do. The best way to prepare is to do well in your classes, on Step 1, and on your clinical rotations. Have an open mind and choose your field based on where you feel you can thrive and do well.

Hi DrUKDO! Thanks for this thread. This will really help a lot of people.

I posted a similar question in the DMU specific thread, but I'll ask here too. Can you explain how you went about setting up your rotations?

I set up rotations all over the country. My school allows us to do elective rotations wherever we are able. My main resource was opportunities.osteopathic.org. You can search for programs you are interested in and on their info page it shows if they accept 3rd and 4th year osteopathic medical students for rotations. If they do, just email the program contact or go to their website. On their website, try to find the Medical Education page and how to apply for a rotation. Sometimes they have forms to fill out online, but if you can't find anything just email the program contact, not the program director.

Ahh I've been looking forward to the OMS version of one of these types of threads. So have you taken the USMLE & COMLEX? If you have, how did you prepare for both exams?

As above, I settled on only taking the COMLEX. If you can do both, more power to you. It will keep more doors open for you, but I think the decision is a personal one and situation specific.

To prepare for COMLEX Level 1, I used First Aid, some UWorld, COMBANK, Savarese, Lippincotts Biochem, Brenner's pharm flash cards, and BRS physiology.

I read a lot of Biochem when I thought I was going to take USMLE, which I didn't really need on COMLEX. First Aid, some kind of pharm and micro review, Savarese, and some kind of COMLEX question bank are a must. I prefer COMBANK but I have heard good things about COMQUEST also.

For COMLEX Level 2, I used Step Up to Step 2, COMBANK, and Savarese.

What field are you going into?

Did you take USMLE Step 2? If so, when did you take COMLEX II & USMLE II, and what did you use to prepare?

I want to go into IM. It took me awhile to decide. I considered anesthesia, radiology, EM, and IM/EM dual residency. I ruled these out as I went along through my 3rd year, and now can say with confidence I want to do IM.

I did not take USMLE Step 2. I took COMLEX Level 2 PE in April and CE in May of my 3rd year. This was sorta early, but I had a vacation month during May and the timing was right. If you can take it at the end of your 3rd year, I definitely recommend it. It feels nice to have it done going into 4th year and residency interviews.

For Step 2, I used Step Up to Step 2, Savarese, and COMBANK.

I am an OMS-I, looking to go into ACGME EM. Do not want to research this summer. Or ever, really. Is that going to hurt me?

Pianoman might be able to provide some more insight into the ACGME EM. I know that ACGME EM programs are hard to get into. I don't know how much emphasis they place on research, but doing research definitely cannot hurt you. Not doing research probably won't hurt you necessarily, but it will make you more competitive for a very competitive specialty. If you have the opportunity I would take it, but take some time off during the summer too.

 

[DrUKDO]

how many interviews do you have with just comlex scores? And did you get above or below a 600

At allopathic IM programs, I only have 1 so far.

At osteopathic IM programs, I have had over 10 requests for interviews. Being on sub-internships and having low funds, I am not going to be able to go to all of them. I interviewed at my top places already and am going to as many others as possible.

I scored below a 600 on both Level 1 and Level 2.

 

[cliquesh]

At allopathic IM programs, I only have 1 so far.

At osteopathic IM programs, I have had over 10 requests for interviews. Being on sub-internships and having low funds, I am not going to be able to go to all of them. I interviewed at my top places already and am going to as many others as possible.

I scored below a 600 on both Level 1 and Level 2.

Thanks, goodluck

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

What school did you go to:
Step 1 scores:
Did you take USMLE step 1:
-> If so what's the score:
-> Also did you feel like your school prepared you for the USMLE Step 1:
Did you feel like your school prepared you for the COMLEX:
Intent to fellowship:
Most bothersome aspect of being an OMS:
If you could change anything about your medical education what would it be:
Favorite thing about being an OMS:

hmm....

 

[pianoman511]

I am an OMS-I, looking to go into ACGME EM. Do not want to research this summer. Or ever, really. Is that going to hurt me?

Research, while I am sure it will help you, does not seem to be that necessary. I did not do any research at all. What seems to be important in EM is any clinical experience you may have, a true interest in EM (i.e. joining EM clubs at school, going to conferences or additional lectures, shadowing in the ER...stuff like that).

how many interviews do you have with just comlex scores? And did you get above or below a 600

With just COMLEX (and I got below 600 on both steps) - I applied to 10 allopathic and 10 osteopathic programs (some would say not enough) and I so far have received 4 allopathic interview invites, 3 allopathic no-invites, 6 osteopathic invites, and 1 osteopathic no-invite.

While my COMLEX scores aren't stellar I have very strong letters of rec (from what I've been told), honors or high pass in all my clinical rotations, a very strong SLOR from a university EM program (with a residency), and tons of clinical and EMS experience.

What school did you go to:
Step 1 scores:
Did you take USMLE step 1:
-> If so what's the score:
-> Also did you feel like your school prepared you for the USMLE Step 1:
Did you feel like your school prepared you for the COMLEX:
Intent to fellowship:
Most bothersome aspect of being an OMS:
If you could change anything about your medical education what would it be:
Favorite thing about being an OMS:

hmm....

LECOM-Erie.
Didn't take USMLE, but probably should have. Felt more prepared for USMLE than COMLEX (but only in retrospect) and felt that school prepared me adequately for COMLEX.
Fellowship - EMS, Critical care, or possibly palliative care
Bothersome aspect - not being able to audition rotate at all the programs I would have liked.
Change....rotated at more places (see above)
Favorite thing - OMM - have helped many patients with musculoskeletal complaints on rotations using OMM vs. meds

 

[donkeykong1]

Question for pianoman:

Was the fact that a big chunk of ACGME EM residency programs are 3 years as opposed to all the AOA ones being 4 years a factor when applying?

Also, if you get into an osteopathic program that basically draws you out of the allo match right?

 

[DrUKDO]

What school did you go to:
Step 1 scores:
Did you take USMLE step 1:
-> If so what's the score:
-> Also did you feel like your school prepared you for the USMLE Step 1:
Did you feel like your school prepared you for the COMLEX:
Intent to fellowship:
Most bothersome aspect of being an OMS:
If you could change anything about your medical education what would it be:
Favorite thing about being an OMS:

hmm....

What school did you go to: LMU-DCOM
Step 1 scores: Less than 600
Did you take USMLE step 1: No
-> If so what's the score: Took COMLEX only
-> Also did you feel like your school prepared you for the USMLE Step 1: I felt prepared for COMLEX, which should be number 1. After all, it's an osteopathic school. Didn't take USMLE, but I think my classmates who did felt well prepared.
Did you feel like your school prepared you for the COMLEX: yes, very well. I felt prepared for all levels of the COMLEX, 1, 2, and especially PE
Intent to fellowship: not sure, considering Pulm/CC
Most bothersome aspect of being an OMS: Osteopathic medicine is not known very well by the general public and I've had to explain it many times. Some think we are not true doctors. It can be frustrating, but worth the time to explain.
If you could change anything about your medical education what would it be: I can't think of anything I would change
Favorite thing about being an OMS: Being able to fix structural complains with OMM, and help my family with them too.

Question for pianoman:

Was the fact that a big chunk of ACGME EM residency programs are 3 years as opposed to all the AOA ones being 4 years a factor when applying?

Also, if you get into an osteopathic program that basically draws you out of the allo match right?

If you match into an osteopathic program you get automatically withdrawn from the allopathic match.

 

[pianoman511]

Question for pianoman:

Was the fact that a big chunk of ACGME EM residency programs are 3 years as opposed to all the AOA ones being 4 years a factor when applying?

Also, if you get into an osteopathic program that basically draws you out of the allo match right?

The 3 vs 4 years is a big deal, but a bigger reason to go ACGME is the simple fact that the programs are often at larger university centers. There is a larger pool for pathology and you will just end up "seeing more". It somewhat evens out having 3 years of broad pathology and high acuity vs. 4 years of more limited pathology and medium acuity.

Bottom line - you have to either pick one or the other and you don't really get a good idea of how your chances are until you interview.

 

[donkeykong1]

The 3 vs 4 years is a big deal, but a bigger reason to go ACGME is the simple fact that the programs are often at larger university centers. There is a larger pool for pathology and you will just end up "seeing more". It somewhat evens out having 3 years of broad pathology and high acuity vs. 4 years of more limited pathology and medium acuity.

Bottom line - you have to either pick one or the other and you don't really get a good idea of how your chances are until you interview.

that makes sense. i guess for EM though unlike surgery and gas, when considering job prospects post residency it shouldn't really matter if you went through an acgme or aoa program.

good luck on your interviews. I hope you applied to SUNY buffalo's program, i met an attending that went there for residency just recently, he praised the strength of that program a lot, and they're DO friendly.

 

[pianoman511]

that makes sense. i guess for EM though unlike surgery and gas, when considering job prospects post residency it shouldn't really matter if you went through an acgme or aoa program.

good luck on your interviews. I hope you applied to SUNY buffalo's program, i met an attending that went there for residency just recently, he praised the strength of that program a lot, and they're DO friendly.

Funny you should say that

 

[coffeeeandtea]

Research, while I am sure it will help you, does not seem to be that necessary. I did not do any research at all. What seems to be important in EM is any clinical experience you may have, a true interest in EM (i.e. joining EM clubs at school, going to conferences or additional lectures, shadowing in the ER...stuff like that).

Which EM organizations would you recommend joining? EMRA or AAEM, etc?

 

[sylvanthus]

I would definately join EMRA. AAEM is decent as well, but EMRA has more opportunities all around for medical students.

 

[JeetKuneDo]

I would definately join EMRA. AAEM is decent as well, but EMRA has more opportunities all around for medical students.

When do you join these clubs? Beginning of year 1? Or do you wait until your clinical years?

 

[sylvanthus]

The sooner the better. There are opportunities to join committees, the medical student council, attend conferences etc.

 

[DrUKDO]

Anyone have any more questions? Surely there are more out there! 🙂

 

[Iliketoytles]

It's awesome to have you around here DrUKDO (and pianoman).

I'm sure you're going through residency applications. What would you rank as the most important aspects of the application? I've read a lot of pre-med opinions on this... but not really much from an actual 4th year.

I'd imagine COMLEX and rotation LORs would be most important, correct? How important is it to keep a high GPA 1st/2nd year? Do you know of anyone who has made all A's their first 2 years? (not trying to be a gunner... just curious if it's possible).

Also... during rotations, how do you go about asking for LORs? Do you need an LOR from every rotation you do? Or can you choose? And how many do you need?

Sorry for all the questions! Thanks in advance.

 

[OzelloPiRat]

Looking from your perspective to where most of us are at now, what would you tell us to do/not do?

It is great to hear students say they are actually using OMM on patients. Do you foresee being able to work OMM into practice when you are on the ins companies dollar tho?

How much does an IM or EM residency at an Osteo program change your employment chances vs an allo one? I have heard varying opinions on this.

Thank you for this! These threads are the best!

 

[SLC]

Would anyone here be interested in an OMS-1 Q and A thread?

 

[Iliketoytles]

Would anyone here be interested in an OMS-1 Q and A thread?

If you're willing to, that'd be great! The more med students willing to help us out, the better.

You can probably just join in on the action in this thread though, so all the advice is compiled. I'll be your first question.

Is anatomy as difficult as people say it is? I'm sure it's super time consuming... but what would you say is the most difficult part about it?

 

[COTA2Phys]

Would anyone here be interested in an OMS-1 Q and A thread?

For sure

 

[scotchtapetest]

It's awesome to have you around here DrUKDO (and pianoman).

I'm sure you're going through residency applications. What would you rank as the most important aspects of the application? I've read a lot of pre-med opinions on this... but not really much from an actual 4th year.

I'd imagine COMLEX and rotation LORs would be most important, correct? How important is it to keep a high GPA 1st/2nd year? Do you know of anyone who has made all A's their first 2 years? (not trying to be a gunner... just curious if it's possible).

Also... during rotations, how do you go about asking for LORs? Do you need an LOR from every rotation you do? Or can you choose? And how many do you need?

Sorry for all the questions! Thanks in advance.

1) COMLEX/USMLE > Rotation grades > LORs > Showcase rotation*> Dean's Letter Ranking** > Pre-clinical grades => Leadership positions/research/publications/other ECs.

* Showcase rotation mainly help your chances for the programs at the institution where you rotated especially in the AOA programs. Otherwise it is another rotation grade.

** Most schools tell you that they don't rank you but that is BS. At the end of the dean's letter ALMOST all schools use a "code word" (such as outstanding/excellent/very good/good) as the "dean's recommendation." The factors involved depend on the school (grades, boards, leadership, etc). I just went to a residency interview where the interviewer only looked at that last paragraph of my dean's letter and totally ignored the rest of my application.

1a) This highly depends on the desired specialty. BUT generally speaking, COMLEX/USMLE will get you the interview, others will move you up/down the rank list (although board scores still make a difference for where you are ranked).

2) Your pre-clinical GPA affects your "class rank" in Dean's letter so it is important. But boards are more important.

3) I know of people who have MOSTLY (>90%) made A's/H's first 2 years. But it is possible!

4) When you are done with a rotation, you ask your attending if he/she would be willing to write you a LOR. You do NOT need a letter from each rotation. You definitely would want to get a letter from the rotation in the desired/related specialty (IM for IM and Surgery for Surgery/gas) You need at least 3-4 as almost all program require 3 and some require 4 which is the maximum you can send through ERAS to each program. But most people get 5-6 and then decide which 3-4 to send to any given program.

 

[scotchtapetest]

Looking from your perspective to where most of us are at now, what would you tell us to do/not do?

It is great to hear students say they are actually using OMM on patients. Do you foresee being able to work OMM into practice when you are on the ins companies dollar tho?

How much does an IM or EM residency at an Osteo program change your employment chances vs an allo one? I have heard varying opinions on this.

Thank you for this! These threads are the best!

If you want to do academic medicine or fellowship at big name places then a lot.

If you just want to get employed by the highest paying employer, or open up your own shop (IM) then not very much (non-academic positions = more pay).

Regarding OMM = Some insurance plans pay for OMM, some don't. Medicare (most of your IM patients) reimburses for OMM. So you actually make more money if you use OMM than if you don't. Obviously you should only use it when indicated.

 

[DrUKDO]

It's awesome to have you around here DrUKDO (and pianoman).

I'm sure you're going through residency applications. What would you rank as the most important aspects of the application? I've read a lot of pre-med opinions on this... but not really much from an actual 4th year.

I'd imagine COMLEX and rotation LORs would be most important, correct? How important is it to keep a high GPA 1st/2nd year? Do you know of anyone who has made all A's their first 2 years? (not trying to be a gunner... just curious if it's possible).

Also... during rotations, how do you go about asking for LORs? Do you need an LOR from every rotation you do? Or can you choose? And how many do you need?

Sorry for all the questions! Thanks in advance.

What would you rank as the most important aspects of the application?

Really depends on what you want to do. Some place a very high emphasis on GPA and board scores. Others value LORs, personal statement, and dean's letter. It's important to do your very best on all aspects of filling out the ERAS.

How important is it to keep a high GPA 1st/2nd year?

GPA is very important. GPA + step 1 is really all programs care about from 1-2nd year.

Do you know of anyone who has made all A's their first 2 years?

Yes, this is possible. I know a few who have done it. I, however, am not one of them. 🙂

How do you go about asking for LORs?

On a rotation that you have done well in, or want to go into, just ask the doctor if he/she would be willing to write you a LOR in support of your residency application. The worst they can say is no.

Do you need an LOR from every rotation you do?

No, you shouldn't ask at every rotation. But, it is good to get some LORs from outside your specialty of choice as well.

Or can you choose? And how many do you need?

Definitely choose. Ask doctors that like you and want to help you succeed. They will not be hard to find. As far as the number required, all programs are different. Most programs require 2, but some require 3 or even 4. It is best to have 4-5 strong letters of recommendation, and have 1 or 2 from outside your specialty.

Looking from your perspective to where most of us are at now, what would you tell us to do/not do?

It is great to hear students say they are actually using OMM on patients. Do you foresee being able to work OMM into practice when you are on the ins companies dollar tho?

How much does an IM or EM residency at an Osteo program change your employment chances vs an allo one? I have heard varying opinions on this.

Thank you for this! These threads are the best!

Looking from your perspective to where most of us are at now, what would you tell us to do/not do?

Good question. If I could do it over again, I probably would have gotten more involved with extracurricular activities during my 1st year. The friendships that you will form in medical school will last a lifetime. Study your hardest, but take some time to get to know your fellow classmates and have fun with them too. Work hard and play hard.

Do you foresee being able to work OMM into practice when you are on the ins companies dollar tho?

I hope I will be able to. Most doctors don't because the reimbursement is not enough to justify the time it takes to do the treatment. It is another way to earn income though and would be worth doing if you can be fast and efficient. Most docs don't use it after medical school and forget it. If you want to do OMM when you are out practicing, then make an effort to remain good at it throughout your clinical rotations. Patients might think it's a little strange at first, but they love it when they feel better.

How much does an IM or EM residency at an Osteo program change your employment chances vs an allo one?

Should not be an issue. There is a shortage of doctors almost everywhere. You should have no problems getting a job.

 

[donkeykong1]

I had a question related to what ozilloprat asked. So basically if one does an AOA accredited residency in any field like gas, surg, rads, ortho or whatever they are therefore board certified by the osteopathic specialty colleges and not the ABMS right?

Does this have any effect on employment opportunities other than setting up your own private practice?I know for FM, IM, peds there really is no impact but what about with other specialties?

 

[DrUKDO]

I had a question related to what ozilloprat asked. So basically if one does an AOA accredited residency in any field like gas, surg, rads, ortho or whatever they are therefore board certified by the osteopathic specialty colleges and not the ABMS right?

Does this have any effect on employment opportunities other than setting up your own private practice?I know for FM, IM, peds there really is no impact but what about with other specialties?

If you do an osteopathic specialty, you will be accredited by the osteopathic version of the board. The short answer is, it should not affect your ability to be hired at all. However, if you want to go to a large academic institution or work at a very prestigious school as a faculty member then it can. However, it is difficult to get a job at these places anyway, even if you did an allopathic residency. A lot of these physicians are double board certified and have PhDs, etc. Being the best doctor you can, taking care of your patients, and having a good reputation will be the greatest factor in determining where you can work, no matter what specialty you are in. In my experience, doctors are not judged on if they are a MD or DO. They are all seen the same after medical school. Patients don't care either, they just want a doctor who cares.

 

[scotchtapetest]

I had a question related to what ozilloprat asked. So basically if one does an AOA accredited residency in any field like gas, surg, rads, ortho or whatever they are therefore board certified by the osteopathic specialty colleges and not the ABMS right?

Does this have any effect on employment opportunities other than setting up your own private practice?I know for FM, IM, peds there really is no impact but what about with other specialties?

Yes, you would be board certified by the respective osteopathic board and NOT by ABMS.

Again, if you want to do academic medicine or fellowship at big academic centers it does effect you (even in IM, Peds and any other specialty except MAYBE FM). On the other hand, if you want to go back and teach at osteopathic schools/rotation sites, then it will definitely help you.

But for any other employment opportunity outside of what I mentioned makes no difference for any specialty.

 

[Iliketoytles]

Thank you bala and drUKDO for the responses!!

You both mentioned something else I was thinking about... I'm extremely involved in making/participating in clubs at my undergrad and in the community. I've created many clubs and have held many officer positions. It's something I take really seriously and feel passionate about, so I want to make sure I get involved!! I tend to spend a little TOO much time with leadership positions, making templates and planning events and whatnot, so I'll have to force myself to cut back so I can study!

For the Dean's letter... how does the Dean know what you're involved in? Say you're a leader in a few clubs... how would the Dean know? Does the Dean actually write it, or just sign off on it??

 

[donkeykong1]

Yes, you would be board certified by the respective osteopathic board and NOT by ABMS.

Again, if you want to do academic medicine or fellowship at big academic centers it does effect you (even in IM, Peds and any other specialty except MAYBE FM). On the other hand, if you want to go back and teach at osteopathic schools/rotation sites, then it will definitely help you.

But for any other employment opportunity outside of what I mentioned makes no difference for any specialty.

thats great news since i heard (on the anesthesiology forum on sdn) that for anesthesiology the consensus is to go the ACGME route since there are many private/public employment opportunities which discriminate between one being BC by the oseto rather than as they say the gold standard of the ABMS

 

[DrUKDO]

Thank you bala and drUKDO for the responses!!

You both mentioned something else I was thinking about... I'm extremely involved in making/participating in clubs at my undergrad and in the community. I've created many clubs and have held many officer positions. It's something I take really seriously and feel passionate about, so I want to make sure I get involved!! I tend to spend a little TOO much time with leadership positions, making templates and planning events and whatnot, so I'll have to force myself to cut back so I can study!

For the Dean's letter... how does the Dean know what you're involved in? Say you're a leader in a few clubs... how would the Dean know? Does the Dean actually write it, or just sign off on it??

You enter yourself in ERAS the clubs you are involved in, what positions you have held, and what experience you have had.

The "Dean's Letter" is like a snapshot of your first 3 years. It has stats like class rank, comments from preceptors on your rotations, and any disciplinary action taken against you. It is not written by the dean, its compiled by your school and is supposed to reflect your academic performance and your character. Most of the information about yourself that the programs will see is from what you enter personally into ERAS.

 

[scotchtapetest]

Thank you bala and drUKDO for the responses!!

You both mentioned something else I was thinking about... I'm extremely involved in making/participating in clubs at my undergrad and in the community. I've created many clubs and have held many officer positions. It's something I take really seriously and feel passionate about, so I want to make sure I get involved!! I tend to spend a little TOO much time with leadership positions, making templates and planning events and whatnot, so I'll have to force myself to cut back so I can study!

For the Dean's letter... how does the Dean know what you're involved in? Say you're a leader in a few clubs... how would the Dean know? Does the Dean actually write it, or just sign off on it??

At my school, for every EC activity you do, you have to fill out a form and submit it to the school with appropriate verifications. At the end they have a list of all the things you have done and include it in your Dean's Letter.

As far as getting involved, it is only truly valuable if you hold national/regional leadership positions or majorly involved in some amazing activity (e.g. starting a weekly free clinic in town). Otherwise, everyone and their mother has hold some kind of "club position" in medical school (so it is not very valuable and no one cares). But, if that's all you can get is better than nothing.

The Dean signs off on your "Dean Letter" (aka Medical Student Performance Evaluation [MSPE]).

 

[scotchtapetest]

thats great news since i heard (on the anesthesiology forum on sdn) that for anesthesiology the consensus is to go the ACGME route since there are many private/public employment opportunities which discriminate between one being BC by the oseto rather than as they say the gold standard of the ABMS

Gold standard my a**.

Most employers want to make money without getting sued. If you can help them do that, they will hire you. Now major academic centers and teaching/research/fellowships positions are a different story!

 

[donkeykong1]

Gold standard my a**.

Most employers want to make money without getting sued. If you can help them do that, they will hire you. Now major academic centers and teaching/research/fellowships positions are a different story!

True That!

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Bala, are you this passive aggressive/ overtly defensive in real life or what?

 

[scotchtapetest]

Bala, are you this passive aggressive/ overtly defensive in real life or what?

With my posts, you can HARDLY call me passive aggressive! However, I am overtly very proud of osteopathic medicine and being a DO (soon)!

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

With my posts, you can HARDLY call me passive aggressive! However, I am overtly very proud of osteopathic medicine and being a DO (soon)!

I understand, and I'm happy that you're proud to be a DO. It is a great accomplishment, but please, tone down the defensiveness. This is the internet... you don't need to prepare for a tactical nuke every other time a guy comments a bit badly on something DO.

 

[donkeykong1]

With my posts, you can HARDLY call me passive aggressive! However, I am overtly very proud of osteopathic medicine and being a DO (soon)!

No need to simmer down bro! I myself couldn't be more ecstatic about being an OMS1 next year🙂

 

[OzelloPiRat]

Thanks for the replies! Any and all info is a huge help. Know what to expect and having those little tidbits is awesome!

 

[SLC]

If you're willing to, that'd be great! The more med students willing to help us out, the better.

You can probably just join in on the action in this thread though, so all the advice is compiled. I'll be your first question.

Is anatomy as difficult as people say it is? I'm sure it's super time consuming... but what would you say is the most difficult part about it?

Anatomy is a tough subject, like all of your courses though, the difficulty lies in the sheer amount of time most have to put in. It's pure memorization, very little conceptuality with this subject. I feel very lucky because I took an extremely good anatomy course in undergrad and as a result I haven't had to study much for anatomy. A little in Neuroanatomy but noting else. However, I've seen it really give fits to others in my class. This is the one area where I feel a little pre-study would be beneficial. If you have a chance to take an anatomy course in the spring, before you start medical school, you'll thank yourself later.

Sorry for the delay in answering, was studying for a first semester OMM final.

 

[DrMediterranean]

Funny you should say that

I know you may not be able to answer the question completely because you haven't finished residency (or even started it for that matter), but can you elaborate?

What are the differences in job opportunities for DOs who complete an ACGME EM residency vs. an AOA EM residency? I know that some may have already answered the question, but your response in the above quote makes me think you have something to say.

There are some EM/Internal Medicine 4-year residency programs, any information on the quality of training you receive?

Thanks.

 

[ShyRem]

I know you may not be able to answer the question completely because you haven't finished residency (or even started it for that matter), but can you elaborate?

What are the differences in job opportunities for DOs who complete an ACGME EM residency vs. an AOA EM residency? I know that some may have already answered the question, but your response in the above quote makes me think you have something to say.

There are some EM/Internal Medicine 4-year residency programs, any information on the quality of training you receive?

Thanks.

These are questions for people who have already completed residency. However, being somewhat closer to that than perhaps an OMS-IV, let me take a stab.

Job opportunities will depend on where you trained. For EM, if you train at a level 1 facility, your training will be more important than if you trained at a level 4 facility. Where you do your residency is SO key. Now, can you get a job coming from a base hospital that is a level 4? Sure. But probably not at a level 1 or 2 hospital.

EM/IM. This one I can talk about from the AOA side. I applied to more than a few AOA EM/IM residencies in Ohio, West Virginia, Michigan area, thinking I might want to do that. I also applied to straight IM residencies. While there were plenty of folks who thought the EM/IM programs were just awesome, I didn't end up ranking any of them. None were at level 1 facilities, and I felt the training I would have received there for both EM and IM was not what I was looking for. I matched to a program that does IM at two level 1 trauma centers - my #1 choice.

Now all that being said, it seems folks who do EM/IM fall in love with either EM or with IM. Rather like IM/Peds residents. Most end up doing either Peds or IM, but rarely both. EM/IM is the same. I find most of the EM/IM folks I have talked with end up in smaller community hospitals when they are done with their training.

 

[akatigerj]

What exactly is a traditional rotating internship? Who 'must' do them? Do you get paid the same salary as you would during residency?

 

[IDFsoldierboy]

What exactly is a traditional rotating internship? Who 'must' do them? Do you get paid the same salary as you would during residency?

also continuing in this question, I have heard it can make you more competitive if you do a TRI and then go into your specialty of choice...just wanted to know if thats true