One Army dentist's story...

[teeth63a]

Can I ask what a reserve dental officer gets paid?

From the Reserve Forces Almanac 2009

An O-3 / captain, straight out of school, doing 12 weekends and two weeks annual training will make

$7316.62

2010 will reflect a 3% or so increase. This does not include BAH and BAS. Reserve and Guard dental officers do not get the same special pay as active duty dentists do, they get lump sum bonuses or loan repayments (as mentioned above).

So if a recent grad takes a $25,000 bonus his total for the year would be $32,316.62 for the equivalent of one month of work before taxes. This works out really well, unless of course you get deployed, then the finances significantly differ.

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[teeth63a]

This is exactly my situation, and I've been trying to run down more information. Before I went Army, an Air Force recruiter explained how they would award credit for my HPSP years as good reserve years, but, so far, the Army seems unaware of this. Were you able to find any more information? Any chance I could get a copy of this memo somehow? Thanks for the informative post!

I've let this slide will get you a copy. Sent you an IM.

 

[teeth63a]

Sorry, but why didn't you join the army reserve? don't they have a similar program? And also, you just joined ACTIVE reserves right? Isn't there a possibility (a likely one) to be called AD and deployed? $75K sounds awesome, but it seems there may be a catch?

I didn't know anyone in the reserve unit, but knew a whole bunch of people in the guard unit. Both have similar programs. Also, the reserve unit has a history of farming out providers to other units, without the whole unit mobilizing (higher deployment risk).

As far as I know, there are no "active" reserve dentists (Active Guard and Reserves) Those who are in the reserves, but are on active duty all the time, and are in essence active duty soliders. I am in the National Guard.

There is always a possibility of deployment. I know the units previous deployment history, and have an idea of the upcoming rotation. I joined at a time in their rest time between deployments. So I feel the chance of deployment is lower than normal.

Never look at the bonuses as there being a catch somewhere. Go into the process with eyes wide open and ask a lot of questions. The way I look at it, is that I took a huge bonus with the understanding that I may deploy. The army is not out there to trick anyone or get anyone in a gotcha situation. Unfortunately there are some unscrupulous recruiters who give the army that reputation.

 

[krmower]

I didn't know anyone in the reserve unit, but knew a whole bunch of people in the guard unit. Both have similar programs. Also, the reserve unit has a history of farming out providers to other units, without the whole unit mobilizing (higher deployment risk).

As far as I know, there are no "active" reserve dentists (Active Guard and Reserves) Those who are in the reserves, but are on active duty all the time, and are in essence active duty soliders. I am in the National Guard.

There is always a possibility of deployment. I know the units previous deployment history, and have an idea of the upcoming rotation. I joined at a time in their rest time between deployments. So I feel the chance of deployment is lower than normal.

Never look at the bonuses as there being a catch somewhere. Go into the process with eyes wide open and ask a lot of questions. The way I look at it, is that I took a huge bonus with the understanding that I may deploy. The army is not out there to trick anyone or get anyone in a gotcha situation. Unfortunately there are some unscrupulous recruiters who give the army that reputation.

There are a handful of reserve/guard dentists that are on active duty, but they are typically Colonels working for the National Guard Bureau, USARC, or DENCOM at the top levels. I have met a few that are also mobilized long-term. I could not tell you how they were selected or what you would have to do to have that happen. I would not count on it being a possibility. If you want to go full time join active duty.

I do not see any way that you would receive credit for HPSP. If I remember correctly the contract is specifically written so that no credit is given towards pay or retirement. Double check the contract to verify. Also, on HPSP you didn't do anything - so why should they pay you? The majority of HPSP recipients do not go to OBLC during school, and do not do the externships - so what justification could someone use to insist they have it credited?

Although some Army recruiters may be new and not as knowledgeable about the reserve/Guard/active duty programs - I see the Air Force as being even more unreliable for information since they put in much fewer dentists - doesn't give them a chance to learn the programs at all.

I would be under the impression that no credit would be earned.

 

[teeth63a]

There are a handful of reserve/guard dentists that are on active duty, but they are typically Colonels working for the National Guard Bureau, USARC, or DENCOM at the top levels. I have met a few that are also mobilized long-term. I could not tell you how they were selected or what you would have to do to have that happen. I would not count on it being a possibility. If you want to go full time join active duty.

I forgot about the admin side, you're right that there are AGRs there.

I do not see any way that you would receive credit for HPSP. If I remember correctly the contract is specifically written so that no credit is given towards pay or retirement. Double check the contract to verify. Also, on HPSP you didn't do anything - so why should they pay you? The majority of HPSP recipients do not go to OBLC during school, and do not do the externships - so what justification could someone use to insist they have it credited?

Contracts I think were made obsolete by new memos and directives. You're forgetting we did get paid a stipend just for having a pulse and being a student. I don't think anyone is demanding to have it credited, it seems this came from the DOD as a post 9/11 incentive.

Although some Army recruiters may be new and not as knowledgeable about the reserve/Guard/active duty programs - I see the Air Force as being even more unreliable for information since they put in much fewer dentists - doesn't give them a chance to learn the programs at all.

Total agreement about Air Force being more unreliable LOL.

I would be under the impression that no credit would be earned.

Will post link

 

[teeth63a]

For some reason my pay stopped coming in....working on it with personnel to get it fixed...three months without my guard pay!

 

[teeth63a]

Pay issue was resolved, it had something to do with transitioning from the IRR to the NG, and something on the admin side that should have happened didn't, and now the pay is back thankfully.

On another note, I cashed in on my first CE allowance... med/dental professionals are entitled to a $2500 (max) allowance for CE. I'll be going to the CEREC conference in Vegas in August... the NCO in charge of this has cut the orders, and booked the flight. Tuition, room and per diem I'll pay for but be reimbursed after I fill out a travel voucher.

Regarding the conference...it's a three day conference, and we're entitled one day to get there and one day to get back home, so that's 5 days total of travel time. I'm using these 5 days to substitute for 5 days of my active time (2 week drill) so that my practice won't take too big a hit with me being gone for two weeks straight... so instead of losing 10 work days in July, I'll be losing 5 days and the losing only 3 days of work in August (because the conference falls on a weekend).

 

[aloysious]

I did a civilian dentist contract gig for a while in Germany between private practices.
Whew, did that experience blow me away!
Especially those Bravo dentists. (They had a 2 yr. gen. practice residency provided by the Army)
No offense, OP, but in general the career Army dentists didn't seem to have a clue as to what working hard meant. Or working efficiently. The exceptions were few and far in between.
If you know where you want to settle down, there is no reason I can see to be a career Army dentist.
If you put the effort into a private practice, the rewards are tenfold.

 

[teeth63a]

Using my first CE allowance - $2500 for conference and room. Received my orders yesterday, now I can book a flight via Carlson Wagonlit Travel (official gov travel agency) for my flight to Vegas for the CEREC conference at the end of the month. Caesar's is booked, looks I'll be at the Paris.

Life is good...

 

[teeth63a]

Going back to Las Vegas in February for another CE course via the National Guard/Army CE allowance

 

[teeth63a]

Just finished my 3rd AT rotation for the Guard. Instead of the 14 days, did only 9, substituted 5 days by attending an Anesthesiology conference payed by the Army.

Spent the first week with the mandatory yearly trainings, and then one day at a clinic at Schofield Barracks. Good times.

 

[teeth63a]

I'm coming up on my last year in the National Guard contract, it looks like I would be able to do a "unit level" promotion to LTC if I stick around. Unit level promotions are unique to the NG, which bypasses the entire board promotion system, kind of like an "in house" promotion. But the promotion board looks at my packet next year anyway.

In October I'll be going to the ADA convention in Las Vegas, which will be my last and final CME/CE course paid for by the Army.

 

[teeth63a]

My career update-

Our National Guard unit was to deploy in 2013 to Afghanistan to round out the final year of the war on terror there, but the last word we got last month was that the whole deployment was cancelled, so we're happy about that.

Under the new DOD directive, deployments are now 9 months. With dentists doing only 3 month "boots on the ground" deployments, that meant that only 3 out of our 4 dentists needed to go, and in this case, I was the lucky one who drew the long straw and wasn't going to deploy. Keep in mind that actual deployment ends up being about 4 months due to mobilization and demobilization.

And I'll be due for promotion this year either via the traditional review board, or a "unit level promotion". Unit promotions are unique to the Guard, where the state can advance officers dependent on the unit's officer vacancy positions.

 

[Dr63A]

My career update-

Our National Guard unit was to deploy in 2013 to Afghanistan to round out the final year of the war on terror there, but the last word we got last month was that the whole deployment was cancelled, so we're happy about that.

Under the new DOD directive, deployments are now 9 months. With dentists doing only 3 month "boots on the ground" deployments, that meant that only 3 out of our 4 dentists needed to go, and in this case, I was the lucky one who drew the long straw and wasn't going to deploy. Keep in mind that actual deployment ends up being about 4 months due to mobilization and demobilization.

And I'll be due for promotion this year either via the traditional review board, or a "unit level promotion". Unit promotions are unique to the Guard, where the state can advance officers dependent on the unit's officer vacancy positions.

congrats on the pvb to ltc. i put one in for maj. i hope my unit doesn't screw this one up like last time. i could have been promoted double bz using pvb.

do you have 4 years tig 04 or 5 years?

i must assume you are sitting in a o5 slot in your unit. are there many o5 slots available in the guard. there doesn't seem to be many in the usar. if there are, i may go guard within the next 4 years.

thx!

 

[teeth63a]

congrats on the pvb to ltc. i put one in for maj. i hope my unit doesn't screw this one up like last time. i could have been promoted double bz using pvb.

do you have 4 years tig 04 or 5 years?

i must assume you are sitting in a o5 slot in your unit. are there many o5 slots available in the guard. there doesn't seem to be many in the usar. if there are, i may go guard within the next 4 years.

thx!

Sorry for the late response!

I've been in 04 5 years. At this point on active duty or reserves, I'd be getting a first look at the promotion board and probably pin on 05 in 2013.

In the guard there are a few field grade slots open to dentists. Our 2 main GP slots are 04. The state dental officer is an 05 slot. I can't remember the others off the top of my head.

I believe with the reserves, your promotion situation is significantly different because with the board system, you're going up against other reservists, but the active duty component as well.

And other notes on my career:

I'm coming up on the end of my first three year contract for the Guard and going to sign up for another three years, which will bring my career total to 11 years good for retirement +/- 2 years depending on how I fanagle my points.

Our deployment for 2013 to Afghanistan has been cancelled, except for a select few. Only one of our dentists is deploying in 2013.

 

[vietmddds]

thank you for the post about your experience.

 

[teeth63a]

thank you for the post about your experience.

Hope it helps. Let me know if you have any questions.

 

[ArmyGuard63a]

Can't thank you enough for being so comprehensive in your explanations and chronicle of your career thus far.
I am just starting my 3rd year of dental school and seriously considering ARNG. I had always been interested in pursuing military dentistry however my wife of 4 years has never been interested in being a military wife. Thus far however she has been quite content with the information I've presented regarding ARNG.
How do you feel about joining the ARNG at this point in time (war-wise) and as a 3rd year? I would be collecting the MDSSP (student stipend) of $2k/month for 2 years thus incurring 4 years of MSO. Following that MSO I would want to do the HPLRP of 6 years for $240k in loan repayment.

Thanks in advance!

 

[teeth63a]

Can't thank you enough for being so comprehensive in your explanations and chronicle of your career thus far.
I am just starting my 3rd year of dental school and seriously considering ARNG. I had always been interested in pursuing military dentistry however my wife of 4 years has never been interested in being a military wife. Thus far however she has been quite content with the information I've presented regarding ARNG.
How do you feel about joining the ARNG at this point in time (war-wise) and as a 3rd year? I would be collecting the MDSSP (student stipend) of $2k/month for 2 years thus incurring 4 years of MSO. Following that MSO I would want to do the HPLRP of 6 years for $240k in loan repayment.

Thanks in advance!

Hi-

Personally, from what I know about the OPTEMPO (operations tempo, the speed and turnover of deployments) things are significantly winding down. For the most part we're out of Iraq and we should be out of Afghanistan by 2014 (maybe even sooner). This means less deployments (if at all) for reservists and Guardsmen.

Personally, I would not take the MDSSP. Your obligation is twice as much because I believe you owe a year for each 6 month of stipend. I'm sure you saw that you get the same amount ($25k I believe now) for just one year of obligation for the HPLRP. So if money is not a big deal, I'd wait until after graduation to join the ARNG. Of course your other option is the straight Health Profession Bonus. Alternatively you may want to look into the IMA reserve. Send me a DM if you have any other questions.

 

[krmower]

Can't thank you enough for being so comprehensive in your explanations and chronicle of your career thus far.
I am just starting my 3rd year of dental school and seriously considering ARNG. I had always been interested in pursuing military dentistry however my wife of 4 years has never been interested in being a military wife. Thus far however she has been quite content with the information I've presented regarding ARNG.
How do you feel about joining the ARNG at this point in time (war-wise) and as a 3rd year? I would be collecting the MDSSP (student stipend) of $2k/month for 2 years thus incurring 4 years of MSO. Following that MSO I would want to do the HPLRP of 6 years for $240k in loan repayment.

Thanks in advance!

My understanding is that only the Reserve offerred the $250k loan repayment option...not the Guard.

 

[ArmyGuard63a]

Looking forward to your continued chronicle here teeth63a! I just passed my MEPS physical yesterday so things are definitely rolling along!
I decided to forgo the MDSSP as we are not in dire need of the money at the current time. One factor that influenced that decision was being able to take the 75k/3yr contract sooner (after my 6 years of HPLR) however one fear that I've had is that they might end the contract bonuses. What do you think the chances are that 7.5 years from now they will have ended the contract bonus?

 

[teeth63a]

Looking forward to your continued chronicle here teeth63a! I just passed my MEPS physical yesterday so things are definitely rolling along!
I decided to forgo the MDSSP as we are not in dire need of the money at the current time. One factor that influenced that decision was being able to take the 75k/3yr contract sooner (after my 6 years of HPLR) however one fear that I've had is that they might end the contract bonuses. What do you think the chances are that 7.5 years from now they will have ended the contract bonus?

Good choice to forego the MDSSP, the obligation is not worth it. The HPLRP and the HPSP will always be around. The only thing will change is the available spots for it. As the budget tightens, there will be less money available, and it will be more competitive. Without these incentives, the military will have a hard time recruiting military providers. And since you've signed a contract, you're locked in. Unless the government bankrupts

 

[teeth63a]

Career update: I was promoted to Lieutenant Colonel in February and had my promotion below gun turret #1 on the USS MIssouri, at Pearl Harbor!

The Guard reinstated our $2500 CE allowance this year, after a 3 year absence.

 

[coolslugs]

Career update: I was promoted to Lieutenant Colonel in February and had my promotion below gun turret #1 on the USS MIssouri, at Pearl Harbor!

The Guard reinstated our $2500 CE allowance this year, after a 3 year absence.

View attachment 179598

Congrats! Is the CE allowance reinstated only for Guard?

 

[teeth63a]

Congrats! Is the CE allowance reinstated only for Guard?

Thanks!

I'm not entirely sure. Guard funding is different from Reserve funding, so I can't tell you.

 

[teeth63a]

Well, here I am, seven years after finding this forum. I've hardly stopped by, but I just found some messages that I've neglected, hopefully they're still helpful!

My career path in the Guard pretty much parallels what it would have been in the active duty side. I'm currently the OIC of the dental section of the state's Medical Detachment. I'm chairside less (we do exams only), and the rest of the time is doing administrative work. There was a mixup with my bonus pay, so I'm behind by one year, and hopefully it gets straightened out soon.

 

[umdnj101]

Well, here I am, seven years after finding this forum. I've hardly stopped by, but I just found some messages that I've neglected, hopefully they're still helpful!

My career path in the Guard pretty much parallels what it would have been in the active duty side. I'm currently the OIC of the dental section of the state's Medical Detachment. I'm chairside less (we do exams only), and the rest of the time is doing administrative work. There was a mixup with my bonus pay, so I'm behind by one year, and hopefully it gets straightened out soon.

Hi Sir, every HPSP doc receives a commitment of 8 years of service usually 4 years of active duty + 4 years of reserve time. Now I understand an individual finishing up his 4 year commitment, isn't entitled to any bonuses in the regular/active reserves until his/her total 8 year military commitment is satisfied, is that true? If so, would the best choice of coming off of active duty is to transition to the IRR then applying for reserves or guard after another 4 years? Does the national guard offer any incentive or bonuses for dentists coming out of active duty (after 4 years)?

 

[teeth63a]

What you described is what I learned that hard way, that I was not eligible for a bonus right outside of active duty, so riding it out in IRR can be a viable option. While in the IRR, make your bare minimum amount of points to count for retirement. Alternatively, you can maintain your career in the military and go reserves or guard (though without the bonus). The guard pretty much offers the same bonuses as the reserves, but you're still limited to your original obligation.