optometry isnt worth it

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yyz said:
30K tuition/yr
20K living expenses/yr

= 200K
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youzer! that is about the same debt as an MD... but with only 1/3-1/5 the earning potential. what opt school charges $30k/year? that is ridiculous based on the income potential.
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If you look at the US Department of Labor Statistics for earnings based on tax information. OD's range between 115 K to 130 K depending on the location in the US. A close friend of mine is a primary care physician and with dwindling reimbursements and the necessity to see 40 patients in a day, he is making for himself probably 110-120k after all of his expenses. I asked him "is it worth it to you?-----going thru 7 years of post baccelaureate work for this?" He replied, " I am not rich by any means and I am still working on a 190K debt from medical school but I love what I do." Even if someone makes 100K per year and does a 10 year loan repayment plan to avoid paying 80K more in interest over a 30 yr payback is still able to have a good lifestyle and own a nice car. It will take anyone who is in Optometry, Primary Care Medicine, Chiropractic Care, etc.......5 years to get themselves fully situated. If people on here have a yearning to be "New York Penthouse" rich they should bypass healthcare altogether and work in the business sector. Even a General Surgeon making 250-300K after 10 years of med school and residency makes less when compared to someone at the executive level of a company, a prominent lawyer, or even someone at the national level of management (I know several of these people who earn 500K to 1mill a year--10 yrs out of high school and I am still in professional school with 125k a year to look forward to! lol:laugh: If someone is looking to be really wealthy by becoming an optometric physician--------> good luck you will need it. I am just looking to become a primary eye doctor, help my patients, and make at least 100K per year. I am tired of hearing these sob stories on here about making only 95,000 dollars a year. booo hoo!
 
Secret to succeeding is medical plans

I was referred a patient with common migraines with intractable pain, without auras. Did a comprehensive eye exam, and performed a full threshold visual field. This patient was around about 160 dollars.

See a patient with Eyemed, Davis vision for spectacles as an independent contractor and get $42 bucks on average.

You can work two to three times as hard in a corporate setting doing vision exams or make some real money doing medical exams.
 
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Oculomotor said:
If you look at the US Department of Labor Statistics for earnings based on tax information. OD's range between 115 K to 130 K depending on the location in the US. A close friend of mine is a primary care physician and with dwindling reimbursements and the necessity to see 40 patients in a day, he is making for himself probably 110-120k after all of his expenses.
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your numbers are a bit off, but i will agree with most everything else.

http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos073.htm
http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos074.htm
 
it would be funny if someday we have a super socialized health care system that cuts reimbursements to the point where selling glasses makes us insane amounts of money, i wonder what we would complain of next.
 
yyz said:
How many other doctors work weekends as much as O.D.'s do? Good luck trying to have a normal life when you start having kids and you are working every weekend. Like I said I don't have a trust fund and I didn't marry rich so I have to do what I can to pay for my school debt, mortgage, etc. With student loans of students approaching 200K these days the cost to benefit of optometry is no longer worth it.
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Saying goodbye to your weekends is another to reason to seriously consider whether you want to be an OD. Working Saturdays (and maybe Sundays) gets old really fast, especially if you have a significant other with a normal job whom you might want to actually interact with. Since dentists and MD's never went through an economic model that had them making most of their money selling glasses and CL's, they never had to keep retail hours. Doctors who cling to this mode of practice are doomed to a crummy quality of life until they can afford to hire some recent grad to do the scut work on weekends and evenings. At least if you can practice like a real doctor you can keep professional hours instead of being a glorified optical retailer.
 
yyz said:
Went to NEWENCO, and graduated with 150K in debt (Boston is quite expensive). I live paycheck to paycheck and have to rely on my wife's teacher salary to help pay the bills. Work commercial because it pays the best but still not enough. Wish I knew what I know now. I should have gone into pharmacy or dentistry. Have several friends that are pharmacists and they make 6 figures and they at least get every other weekend off. Not like me working every Saturday for the rest of my life. Do you see dentists or MDs working Saturdays or Sundays? I think not.
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You totally seem to really not know what the hell MDs do and how they live!

I have lots of doctors in the family, lots of friends that went on to med school, in residency, and a couple that are now practicing. Seeing them is the exact reason why I decided against med school.

My cousin whose 30ish has 6 month old twin boys and they don't even live with her! Her and her husband who are both oncology fellows can't physically take care of them and can't afford acceptable hired help with their fellowship salaries and all their debts so they live with her parents in a different country. What kind of life is that????????

I have another cousin who just married a recent med school grad whose in a ridiculous amount of debt and is barely making 35k a year as a resident, and life is going to be like that for him for the next couple of years. At least an opto starts making money right away!

Another MD friend of mine who just finished residency and now works in a hospital (married to a surgery resident whose on call like twice a week) has a 2 year old daughter that spends about 12 hours a day in daycare and she even works saturdays!

My family physician whose 50ish and has been in her own private practice for quiet some time is open from 8-2 on saturdays.

Trust me, optometrists have it WAY EASY when you're comparing with MDs-your argument holds no water
 
My father was a Family practice MD and I know full well what an MD's life is like. My father chose to work on Saturday and was not forced to. My point being is when you are in the amount of debt of an average optometry school grad these days (200K), working as a salaried employee of an OD (done that) or worse yet working for an MD (done that) is not as lucrative compared to getting a corporate lease(what I've been doing for 6 yrs). Having a corporate lease pretty much locks you into every Saturday and even Sundays in some cases. Now you are working every Saturday by force because you don't want to lose your lease and as you know the public is used to OD's working on Saturdays, so they expect you there. On the rare occasion you can find someone to fill in for you on a Saturday, you are usually taking CE credits to upkeep your license. So that leaves you with pretty much no vacations. (Which I haven't taken in 7 years). At least a family practitioner can close up shop one Saturday for some R and R. So tell me what kind of quality of life does that leave you?

As for your other relatives, it sounds like they are either in fellowships or residencies which require alot of time comittment now, which will payoff exponentially when they are finished.

Hope this holds a little water for you.
 
your dad own his own practice? if that is the case, then he can close whenever the heck he wants, same thing if you own your own practice. working for the man? of course you work the hours they dictate you.

you want other unfair comparisons? uncle won it big in vegas a few years back and then got damn lucky with some stocks. he now works zero days a week has more money then you and i will make ever as optometrist. his quality of life is awesome.

maybe if you want some vacations and control over your hours, stop selling out and buy/start a business.
 
yyz said:
My father was a Family practice MD and I know full well what an MD's life is like. My father chose to work on Saturday and was not forced to. My point being is when you are in the amount of debt of an average optometry school grad these days (200K), working as a salaried employee of an OD (done that) or worse yet working for an MD (done that) is not as lucrative compared to getting a corporate lease(what I've been doing for 6 yrs). Having a corporate lease pretty much locks you into every Saturday and even Sundays in some cases. Now you are working every Saturday by force because you don't want to lose your lease and as you know the public is used to OD's working on Saturdays, so they expect you there. On the rare occasion you can find someone to fill in for you on a Saturday, you are usually taking CE credits to upkeep your license. So that leaves you with pretty much no vacations. (Which I haven't taken in 7 years). At least a family practitioner can close up shop one Saturday for some R and R. So tell me what kind of quality of life does that leave you?

As for your other relatives, it sounds like they are either in fellowships or residencies which require alot of time comittment now, which will payoff exponentially when they are finished.

Hope this holds a little water for you.
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OK YYZ......

The complaint that you're making about your situation as an OD you can say about an MD as well. Since you're so miserable about not having a say in what days you have to be open and not being able to take days off I'm going to assume that if you were financially stable enough to open up your own practice which will make you autonomous over your schedule you would.

My friend who I mentioned in the initial post with the daughter that spends 12hrs/day in daycare, she obviously couldn't afford to start her own practice right out of residency (like most MDs) so she accepted a position with the hospital she was a resident in which REQUIRED her to work saturdays and she's even on-call I believe it's either once or twice a month. She's not 'choosing' to work saturdays, it's something she pretty much has to do. She could have worked for another MD in a private practice and have an 'easier' life, but with her husband a fellow not making much and both of their combined student loans (something around half a mil) and a child and mortgage and car payments she felt it was necessary to opt for the better paying hospital job and thus sacrifice.

You stated their sacrifices will 'pay off exponentially'. Well, as soon as her husband is through being a fellow she plans on quitting and becoming a full-time mom for some time and if she goes back to work it won't be to practice, it'll be to do research because she can do that part-time and it doesn't involve nearly the stress she's enduring now which to her no amount of money is worth if she doesn't need it. I'm talking about her because I know her personally but she's just an example of the struggles of a young/middle-aged MD.

The point that I'm trying to make here is that the circumstances you described for yourself that are making it necessary for you to live the 'miserable' schedule you're living are not unique to optometry as you're trying to claim, but rather they're actually compounded in the MD profession. Don't compare yourself to your dad who graduated from med school at a completely different time than the one we're in, compare yourself to an MD that's your similar age or one that's been out of med school the same amount of years when trying to claim that your quality of life is worse.

I don't doubt that you have your share of troubles and stress but I find it so strange you're trying to suggest your quality of life is worse than what an MD's is just because of your schedule. I'm currently working for an optometrist and I've shadowed two previously (corporate, and private). I used to be a pre-med and have done my share of MD shadowing and lots of volunteering in different healthcare settings and the main reason why I decided against med school was because of the lifestyle that I witnessed, which is why I'm getting all riled up about your post. It's true that OD has its disadvantages but there's a HUUUGGGEEE difference between the two practices, MDs at all stages put up with lots of SHT that an OD would never have to think about.
 
Doctor M said:
Can someone enlighten me as to why optometry school is sooo dammmnnn expensive:eek: 150k in school loans???? Is this for 4 years of optometry school? I assume these are private schools??? I have much respect for optometrists but school tuition seems a bit steep.
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He chose to attend a private optometry school in Boston. NECO is one of the most expensive optometry schools in the nation. He should have known what he was getting into.

YYZ, consider suing your alma mater for deceiving about the potential optometrist salaries and charging you so much tuition. Maybe the new optometry schools will get the hint and close down.

SCO just broke the average 100k debt mark for its graduates last year. I can't imagine 200k!
 
Eyegirl2k7 said:
$247000 in debt. ICO grad.
3 days in corporate optometry making $100 K
Exhausted from seeing about a million patinets a day.
Don't know what I think about it yet.
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3 days a week to make 100K aint all that bad at all!

dont know what you're complaining about?!:laugh:
 
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