Parents are a creating a dilemma for me.

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delawarepremed

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Since I am almost done with my B.A. in Art History, I plan on being a part-time student for the next few semesters and taking the remaining pre-requisites. However, my parents want me to finish the remaining science courses as early as possible, take the MCAT and apply. But I want to finish the remaining pre-requisites at my own pace rather than rushing to take them because getting a good understanding of them will help me on the MCAT. You should also know that my parents are paying for my tuition. So, last night, I went to my parents' house, and they berated me by telling me that my plan for finishing the remaining perquisites at my own pace is worthless and will not work. When I disagreed with their plan, they questioned my ability to get into a DO school and briefly suggested that I look into alternative careers. They also briefly berated me that I should have majored in Biochemistry and not Art History. Adding to this already volatile situation, it doesn't help that my older brother just matched into an extremely prestigious orthopaedic surgery residency program in Texas. So, I am at a dilemma as to whether I should take my parents' advice, finish the remaining pre-requisites as soon as possible, take the MCAT etc. or comfortably finish the remaining prerequisites at my own pace as a part-time student. Your advice will be greatly appreciated.
 
Why do you want to go part-time for the remaining semesters? What is your GPA?
If it's stellar, you may be able to handle a greater courseload. If it's not, you should really try to take the prerequisites at a pace that you can guarantee you'll get the best grades possible. Delaying your progress unnecessarily will obviously be a waste of time, though.
I doubt that having a major in Art History will hurt your application unless you have a low sGPA or MCAT. I had a non-science undergraduate degree and it never came up as a negative thing during interviews at DO schools.

Also, be sure to thank your parents for their support, even if you feel like they're being hard on you. They have always had the option to let you find ways to completely fund your own education.
 
delawarepremed said:
You should also know that my parents are paying for my tuition.
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GUH said:
They have always had the option to let you find ways to completely fund your own education.
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He who holds the gold makes the rules.

You take their money you take their orders. You want to do it on your own pace you fund your own education.

Do what you believe is best for yourself but understand you might have to strike out on your own if you do so. Consequences after all.

And try not to live under your brother's shadow (though congrats to him), forge your own path.
 
If I was on their dime, I'd do what they say as long as it's reasonable. I don't think they're asking for too much out of you, except that you don't waste money or time.
 
AlbinoHawk, I have a decent idea as to what goes on in medical school. My brother just matched into residency last month. In medical school, you just have to pass your classes and do well on the boards. However, for premeds, just passing the classes in college even if they do well on the MCAT is not going to get them into medical school. So, in college, premeds have the stress of doing as well as possible in their classes and not just be content with passing their classes like medical students. Also, medical students have a psychological advantage over premeds because the vast majority of American medical students will eventually become physicians while the vast majority of premeds will never even get into medical school.
 
delawarepremed said:
AlbinoHawk, I have a decent idea as to what goes on in medical school. My brother just matched into residency last month. In medical school, you just have to pass your classes and do well on the boards. However, for premeds, just passing the classes in college even if they do well on the MCAT is not going to get them into medical school. So, in college, premeds have the stress of doing as well as possible in their classes and not just be content with passing their classes like medical students. Also, medical students have a psychological advantage over premeds because the vast majority of American medical students will eventually become physicians while the vast majority of premeds will never even get into medical school.
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There's also a significant difference between the volume of information taught in pre-clinical medical school courses and your pre-med courses. Pre-med course are not really that hard, and you shouldn't slow them down because of the MCAT. You don't do well on the MCAT by acing your pre-med courses. You do well on the MCAT by preparing smartly. Doesn't matter if you're an expert in subjects like photosynthesis because they won't ever be covered on the test.
 
Hey OP, weren't you the guy posting the Abraham lincoln quotes?

You gotta ask urself, "What would Honest Abe do?"

but seriously tho... You got an Art history degree? not to be a doucher but come on man.. you can definitely throw in a couple science classes without overwhelming yourself.. What upper division courses do you even need to take in Art history that are so time-intensive? I mean don't get me wrong... they may be interesting courses but if you want this bad enough you gotta plan ahead. Take your classes prepare for your MCAT and take it once and then apply.
 
delawarepremed said:
AlbinoHawk, I have a decent idea as to what goes on in medical school. My brother just matched into residency last month. In medical school, you just have to pass your classes and do well on the boards. However, for premeds, just passing the classes in college even if they do well on the MCAT is not going to get them into medical school. So, in college, premeds have the stress of doing as well as possible in their classes and not just be content with passing their classes like medical students. Also, medical students have a psychological advantage over premeds because the vast majority of American medical students will eventually become physicians while the vast majority of premeds will never even get into medical school.
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Ok I don't mean to laugh, but lol what?

You make it sound like taking premed classes is infinitally harder than being in med school. I hate to break it to you, but it's not and the stress level keeps increasing as you go through med school, residency and becoming an attending.

Sure all you have to do is pass in med school but it takes A LOT more time and effort to "just pass" based on the amount of information, plus most of the information presented is pretty relevant to being a competent student 3rd and 4th year and then to become a competent doctor. So you can't/shouldn't just pass and forget everything.

If your parents are willing to pay for your education and you're 100% commited to going to med school, then I would take the classes as they have suggested. Years from now you'll be happy that you didn't have to take out loans for those classes.

I did a full time post-bacc premed program that took 1 year and a summers worth of classes and it wasn't bad at all. Why not just get the classes and taking the mcat over with?
 
Give us an idea of how you are planning on doing it and how your parents want you to do it. I'm guessing their way is not unreasonable. You should be able to easily take at least two science pre-requisites plus a math course each semester. I did it in college (chemistry, physics for engineers and calc) while taking two other classes.

You can't just dilly dally on your parents' dime.

Also comparing intro science and math courses to med school courses is naive and laughable.
 
If you're only going part-time, AND still living at home, you'd better be also working and paying your parents room and board money.

If it's on their dime, you just say "yes sir" and "yes ma'am". And if they say "jump". You ask "how high?"

You can tell them that major is irrelevant to Adcoms (but not for employment purposes outside of Medicine).

delawarepremed said:
Since I am almost done with my B.A. in Art History, I plan on being a part-time student for the next few semesters and taking the remaining pre-requisites. However, my parents want me to finish the remaining science courses as early as possible, take the MCAT and apply. But I want to finish the remaining pre-requisites at my own pace rather than rushing to take them because getting a good understanding of them will help me on the MCAT. You should also know that my parents are paying for my tuition. So, last night, I went to my parents' house, and they berated me by telling me that my plan for finishing the remaining perquisites at my own pace is worthless and will not work. When I disagreed with their plan, they questioned my ability to get into a DO school and briefly suggested that I look into alternative careers. They also briefly berated me that I should have majored in Biochemistry and not Art History. Adding to this already volatile situation, it doesn't help that my older brother just matched into an extremely prestigious orthopaedic surgery residency program in Texas. So, I am at a dilemma as to whether I should take my parents' advice, finish the remaining pre-requisites as soon as possible, take the MCAT etc. or comfortably finish the remaining prerequisites at my own pace as a part-time student. Your advice will be greatly appreciated.
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dellprecision said:
There's also a significant difference between the volume of information taught in pre-clinical medical school courses and your pre-med courses. Pre-med course are not really that hard, and you shouldn't slow them down because of the MCAT. You don't do well on the MCAT by acing your pre-med courses. You do well on the MCAT by preparing smartly. Doesn't matter if you're an expert in subjects like photosynthesis because they won't ever be covered on the test.
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This. So much. I got As and Bs in undergrad without trying very hard for most classes. I study my @$$ off to "just pass" medical school.
 
Here is my plan :

Fall 2015 - Organic Chemistry I

Spring 2016 - Organic Chemistry II

Fall 2016 - Biochemistry I

Spring 2017 - Biochemistry II

May 2017- MCAT

Here is my parents' plan:

Summer 2015 - Organic Chemistry I & II

Fall 2015 - Biochemistry I

January 2016 - MCAT

Spring 2016 - Biochemistry II
 
Your parents' plan sounds quite possible. Organic I + II in one summer will be pretty rigorous but if that is the only thing you are doing it should be fine. I mean, most of us who were science majors took 2-4 science and math courses per semester. When I was doing Organic, I was also taking Physics and Molecular Genetics. I don't think your parents are being unreasonable here.
 
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LOL, this is the first time I am hearing that Asian parents are not being unreasonable. I mean I am proud that I am from South Korea and still hold a South Korean passport to this day even though I have been living in the United States for so many years but sometimes I wish that I was born into an American family because Americans parents tend to be very supportive, reasonable, and not too nosy. I wish Korean and other Asian parents were like that.
 
Well, I am genuinely happy for you that you made it into medical school. But I also have to work hard because I cannot just be satisfied with B's in pre-requisites. B's might seem to be good grades but they can be seriously detrimental to the science GPA of an individual with a non-science major like me. If I got mostly B's in my science classes, my science GPA would hover around a 3.0, which is not going to get me even interviews at DO schools. And believe me, at my school, getting A's in classes like Organic Chemistry and Biochemistry is far from easy when at least half of the students fail, drop etc. and the test averages in those classes hover around 50 after the curve.
 
My brother just called me, and he harangued me as to why I am giving our parents such a hard time. He told me that I need to be a "good boy", and listen to our parents. I should not have picked up the phone because he is the reason as to why I have such an inferiority complex about my own potential. My parents show him off to family and friends because he is their favorite son. I mean why wouldn't he be their favorite son. He has always been way more intelligent than me. After all, he easily got a 4.0 from the University of Michigan and got a 42 on the MCAT with only a few weeks of studying while I actually have to work hard to maintain a 3.5 at my school. And he scored a 260 on the USMLE Step 1 and just matched into orthopaedic surgery at a very prestigious program in Texas while I will be lucky if a DO school considers me for an interview. Actually, I don't even care that my parents are proud of my brother and that he will become an orthopaedic surgeon one day as long as they leave me alone and respect my passion for primary care.
 
U need to learn how to stick up for yourself grow some confidence man
 
delawarepremed said:
Well, I am genuinely happy for you that you made it into medical school. But I also have to work hard because I cannot just be satisfied with B's in pre-requisites. B's might seem to be good grades but they can be seriously detrimental to the science GPA of an individual with a non-science major like me. If I got mostly B's in my science classes, my science GPA would hover around a 3.0, which is not going to get me even interviews at DO schools. And believe me, at my school, getting A's in classes like Organic Chemistry and Biochemistry is far from easy when at least half of the students fail, drop etc. and the test averages in those classes hover around 50 after the curve.
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This is what I'm hearing:

"You guys had it easy for taking more rigorous science courses because you had the chance to overcome early B's in easier pre-req courses by demonstrating your technical proficiency by excelling in more rigorous/demanding courses! Do you know how hard it is to only take a few non-rigorous science courses? If I screw up something easy, it looks terrible!"

No offense, dude, but +pity+. I'm sorry to hear about how your brother makes you feel (congratulations to him, btw, he actually is pretty impressive.), but it might not be a bad idea for you to open up this dialogue with your parents. Therapy might not be a bad idea either. There really is no reason why you should feel inferior.
 
delawarepremed said:
AlbinoHawk, I have a decent idea as to what goes on in medical school. My brother just matched into residency last month. In medical school, you just have to pass your classes and do well on the boards. However, for premeds, just passing the classes in college even if they do well on the MCAT is not going to get them into medical school. So, in college, premeds have the stress of doing as well as possible in their classes and not just be content with passing their classes like medical students. Also, medical students have a psychological advantage over premeds because the vast majority of American medical students will eventually become physicians while the vast majority of premeds will never even get into medical school.
Click to expand...

Get 1 million miles out of here. "Just" passing my easiest medical school class so far has been 5 times harder than acing the hardest pre-med class I ever got a high grade in.
 
Your parents' plan is quite possible if you switch ochem 2 to fall and take it with biochem 1. That is doable and you can start studying for the MCAT starting from Thanksgiving and take it in Spring. Like everyone here said, if you can't handle these schedules, you will have a hard time in medical school. Good luck though.
 
Your parents plan is do able, i feel like you just afraid to commit to the hard work. Im guessing you're not working right now since your parents are supporting you, no job = free time to study.
 
Organic Chemistry II is the pre-requisite for Biochemistry I at my school. So, I cannot take Biochemistry I without taking Organic Chemistry II first.
 
delawarepremed said:
Since I am almost done with my B.A. in Art History, I plan on being a part-time student for the next few semesters and taking the remaining pre-requisites. However, my parents want me to finish the remaining science courses as early as possible, take the MCAT and apply. But I want to finish the remaining pre-requisites at my own pace rather than rushing to take them because getting a good understanding of them will help me on the MCAT. You should also know that my parents are paying for my tuition. So, last night, I went to my parents' house, and they berated me by telling me that my plan for finishing the remaining perquisites at my own pace is worthless and will not work. When I disagreed with their plan, they questioned my ability to get into a DO school and briefly suggested that I look into alternative careers. They also briefly berated me that I should have majored in Biochemistry and not Art History. Adding to this already volatile situation, it doesn't help that my older brother just matched into an extremely prestigious orthopaedic surgery residency program in Texas. So, I am at a dilemma as to whether I should take my parents' advice, finish the remaining pre-requisites as soon as possible, take the MCAT etc. or comfortably finish the remaining prerequisites at my own pace as a part-time student. Your advice will be greatly appreciated.
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Your parents are right about the course load, but for the wrong reasons. Unless you have a full time job, being a part-time student is looked at suspiciously. Medical school is something like 27 credit hours a semester, and almost all of them are hard sciences. Seriously consider whether your able to do that. Also with a 'easier' undergrad like Art History, you should be able to handle a full load with a science class.

Put the pedal to the metal brother, prove your worth with a full load, take a semester off after prerequisites and then rock the MCAT. Thats my advise.
 
delawarepremed said:
I am from South Korea.
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Oh really, so is my wife. Man you really need to step it up. I am surprised your parents even think DO school is okay in the first place. Most of the parents I goto church with (at a Korean Church) scoff at DO (i.e. MY kid will only go MD, at Harvard, after completing their undergrad there on National Merit Scholarship like Yaywon (or whoevers kid) did!).
 
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delawarepremed said:
What about the psychological disadvantage of being a pre-med?
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giphy.gif


Seriously dude, you just made me laugh out loud, literally. Is this thread a late april fools joke?
 
delawarepremed said:
Here is my plan :

Fall 2015 - Organic Chemistry I

Spring 2016 - Organic Chemistry II

Fall 2016 - Biochemistry I

Spring 2017 - Biochemistry II

May 2017- MCAT

Here is my parents' plan:

Summer 2015 - Organic Chemistry I & II

Fall 2015 - Biochemistry I

January 2016 - MCAT

Spring 2016 - Biochemistry II
Click to expand...
Okay your parents plan is alittle out of line, but yours is way too lax:
Sum 15 - Orgo 1
Fall 15- Orgo 2 (if required prior to Biochem I) Otherwise Biochem I should be here.
Spring 16- Biochem 1
summer 16 - study for MCAT with take in Late July/early Aug
Fall 16 - Biochem II if you feel like it.

They are right that you should be taking the MCAT for the 2016 cycle. A January MCAT is not necessary tho. And you should dedicate a semester to studying for it, if you can. Your plan is way too slow tho. If you were my kid I would tell you to speed it up too, and I am American (with a half-korean kid no less!).
 
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Initially, my parents used to think DO schools are not bona fide medical schools. Of course, the fact that brother went to a very prestigious allopathic school did not help my case. But it took a lot of time and energy on my part to convince them that DO's are also fully licensed physicians in the United States.
 
delawarepremed said:
Initially, my parents used to think DO schools are not bona fide medical schools. Of course, the fact that brother went to a very prestigious allopathic school did not help my case. But it took a lot of time and energy on my part to convince them that DO's are also fully licensed physicians in the United States.
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Maybe you should stand up for yourself by telling your parents to stop comparing you to him. Other than that, suck it up and do it. There's no such thing as psychological disadvantage of pre-med.
 
Goro said:
If you're only going part-time, AND still living at home, you'd better be also working and paying your parents room and board money.

If it's on their dime, you just say "yes sir" and "yes ma'am". And if they say "jump". You ask "how high?"

You can tell them that major is irrelevant to Adcoms (but not for employment purposes outside of Medicine).
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This OP has it lucky, at least he's getting a loan free education. Most children here with parents from the biggest continent of the world will respond like this regardless and still pay for their own education with jobs and loans.
 
Stop making excuses...your sole responsibility are your grades (no job + tuition paid for). If you believe there is a psychological disadvantage of being premed, wait til you get to med school...or ask your brother. He will speak some sense into you.
 
delawarepremed said:
Initially, my parents used to think DO schools are not bona fide medical schools. Of course, the fact that brother went to a very prestigious allopathic school did not help my case. But it took a lot of time and energy on my part to convince them that DO's are also fully licensed physicians in the United States.
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Dude you need to become a dentist, I can already tell, the comparison to your brother will never end if you go physician.

Seriously tho, that situation sucks, and I have a very good idea how much it sucks knowing Koreans very well. You aren't helping by trying to put DO school off for another year. Do you really want to be a doctor, cause your plan almost sounds passive aggressive? I know Law and Dentistry are definitely acceptable. Maybe even MBA if you get in a good school. Tell me why you are doing this. I just saw the post about your brother, it doesn't sound like pretty much 99.9999% of the population can compare to him.
 
HandsomeRob, thanks for suggesting alternative careers like dentistry. I have shadowed dentists, and I have realized that dentistry is not a good fit for me. My passion lies in primary care. I currently shadow an internal medicine osteopathic physician who will be writing my recommendation letter when I apply. I can only see myself going to to a DO school and becoming a primary care physician. I don't care how long it will take or how painful the process might be but I am not just going to give up my dreams of becoming a primary care physician. Perseverance and hard work are the keys to success.
 
OP seems to be making excellent points.... (not regarding the brother issue). Valid concern OP, but crack down and get her done.
 
delawarepremed said:
HandsomeRob, thanks for suggesting alternative careers like dentistry. I have shadowed dentists, and I have realized that dentistry is not a good fit for me. My passion lies in primary care. I currently shadow an internal medicine osteopathic physician who will be writing my recommendation letter when I apply. I can only see myself going to to a DO school and becoming a primary care physician. I don't care how long it will take or how painful the process might be but I am not just going to give up my dreams of becoming a primary care physician. Perseverance and hard work are the keys to success.
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If you want to be a doctor, then get to it. Why in the world would you take so long. Your plan isn't perseverance, its procrastination. See my suggested schedule. Follow it. Add sociology in there sometime before the MCAT if you haven't taken it. Especially at DO schools, a July/August MCAT is fine, and you should be able to do that relatively low stress by next summer. BTW, Most DO schools are not pass fail, but have grades. Check around carefully when you make your list.
 
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I need to Psychology as well. But I also want to take a full year of Biochemistry before taking the MCAT since the new MCAT is so heavy on Biochemistry.
 
delawarepremed said:
I need to Psychology as well. But I also want to take a full year of Biochemistry before taking the MCAT since the new MCAT is so heavy on Biochemistry.
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Then take biochemistry in the Summer and take the MCAT by Oct/Nov 2016. MCAT prep books will get you ready much better than Biochemistry courses (and they will be better because the test will be over a year old by then). There is no excuse for not having a 2016 app IMO. I have been accepted to schools that I sent the primary in during Dec 2014. So have many others. Even with the silly requirement of taking 2 semesters of Biochemistry first, you should get this done relatively easily.
 
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HandsomeRob said:
If you want to be a doctor, then get to it. Why in the world would you take so long. Your plan isn't perseverance, its procrastination. See my suggested schedule. Follow it. Add sociology in there sometime before the MCAT if you haven't taken it. Especially at DO schools, a July/August MCAT is fine, and you should be able to do that relatively low stress by next summer. BTW, Most DO schools are not pass fail, but have grades. Check around carefully when you make your list.
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Well said! consider this as a self test delaware,...I am all for perseverance but at one point or another you gotta do it with the attitude that you're under the clock. People that run marathons, if they don't get through the 1st half in a certain time they're asked to get off the course. The tortoise wins the race or whatever the saying is, do it wisely.
 
delawarepremed said:
Perseverance and hard work are the keys to success.
Click to expand...

Then what is wrong with your parents' plan? Sounds like you have the drive and desire so just go for it. Don't slack off just to stick it to your parents. Get a full time schedule set up, take the advice given on here, and go for it. Not because it's what your parents want, but because it's what you want. It seems like you're trying to go at your own pace so that it's up to you and not your parents so you're ignoring what actually makes sense.
 
delawarepremed said:
My brother just called me, and he harangued me as to why I am giving our parents such a hard time. He told me that I need to be a "good boy", and listen to our parents. I should not have picked up the phone because he is the reason as to why I have such an inferiority complex about my own potential. My parents show him off to family and friends because he is their favorite son. I mean why wouldn't he be their favorite son. He has always been way more intelligent than me. After all, he easily got a 4.0 from the University of Michigan and got a 42 on the MCAT with only a few weeks of studying while I actually have to work hard to maintain a 3.5 at my school. And he scored a 260 on the USMLE Step 1 and just matched into orthopaedic surgery at a very prestigious program in Texas while I will be lucky if a DO school considers me for an interview. Actually, I don't even care that my parents are proud of my brother and that he will become an orthopaedic surgeon one day as long as they leave me alone and respect my passion for primary care.
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Delaware, I don't believe any of this last statement at all about not caring what your parents think. In fact, this whole post was rather defeatist. Stop being mentally weak man. Your competition is not your brother, its yourself! You don't need to be your brother to get into medical school. I am certain you can click my MDApps and see that. I am beginning to think maybe you should take Orgo I and II this summer, just to prove to yourself that you can.
 
delawarepremed said:
I need to Psychology as well. But I also want to take a full year of Biochemistry before taking the MCAT since the new MCAT is so heavy on Biochemistry.
Click to expand...
BTW, I highly recommend you take some time with an actual MCAT course. Your brother may have gotten a 42 with 3 weeks studying, but that is not normal. Take a couple months just for the MCAT. It seems like the only thing you don't give time too is probably the hardest (talking about MCAT here).
 
Im south asian so I know what its like to have parents who expect you to always score in the 99th percentile on every exam. I also use to live in the shadow of my brother, as well as other family members, because of how much higher they scored on standardized exams. Thing is, you cant compare yourself to them because they have a natural gift. However, that does not mean that you cant be great either. The first time I walked into my PIs office, I saw 10 different certificates, degrees, and all kinds of honorary awards framed on his wall. He is the head of the neuromuscular division at the medical school and has done many different national presentations. I made a quick joke about all the degrees on his wall and he responded with "yea, im a slow learner, but I worked hard to get where I am." The sooner you realize to never compare yourself to anyone else and to work hard for what you want, the lower your anxiety levels are gonna be, and the better you're gonna do on tests.

All of that being said, I dont think spreading out your classes that far apart is a good thing. As many others have stated, medical school isnt gonna give you a chance to take your time and absorb the material. You're gonna have to work at the pace that they want you to work. Therefore, I agree with your parents and think you should follow a much more time restrictive plan, similar to what they gave you.This will "flex" that part of your brain and allow you to acclimate to the fast pace of medical school

Also, dont listen to anyone who tells you that classes are hard. so many people told me that Orgo was gonna murder me. I quickly realized that those people just dont study. As soon as you learn to forget what people say and keep a completely objective mind, the sooner you'll be able to perform at your peak.
 
delawarepremed said:
AlbinoHawk, I have a decent idea as to what goes on in medical school. My brother just matched into residency last month. In medical school, you just have to pass your classes and do well on the boards. However, for premeds, just passing the classes in college even if they do well on the MCAT is not going to get them into medical school. So, in college, premeds have the stress of doing as well as possible in their classes and not just be content with passing their classes like medical students. Also, medical students have a psychological advantage over premeds because the vast majority of American medical students will eventually become physicians while the vast majority of premeds will never even get into medical school.
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You have no idea what you're talking about. The amount of work I've put in to pass a class trumps 5x fold the amount of work I put into getting an A in undergrad. Believe me, I'm not the only one putting this much time in.
 
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