Parents forcing me into medicine

[lazyindy]

Hey all,

So recently I have decided to not pursue medicine and go to dental school instead. I cannot see myself being happy as a physician and very turned off by the emotional and physical wear and tear of pursuing medicine. I took the MCAT and received a 34 so I know I absolutely have a shot but deep down I know I won't be happy in this field.

I told my parents about my situation and they are now enraged. They are typical controlling Indian parents who think the only way to achieve high status is to be a physician. They even had the audacity to tell me that "dentists have no respect" and "they don't make anything" -- verbatim from their mouths. I completely understand the sacrifices they made as immigrants and how hard they worked to put me through school and college. However I feel they're expectations at the moment aren't reasonable. I can't sacrifice my happiness just so they can tell their friends and family that "my son is a doctor". I have nothing but respect for them for putting a roof over my head and all but today their derogatory remarks have really hurt me -- calling me a "failure, loser, and an idiot" for even considering dentistry.

How do I handle a situation like this? I couldn't even find a job after graduating this May and my parents make me feel very guilty for free-loading off of them. What kind of jobs can I get with a B.S in biochemistry? and how on earth do I convince my parents that dentistry is not as bad as they make it out to be? I am so stressed right now, I can't even think straight.

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[Warderino92]

Try looking up some of the pharmaceutical manufacturing companies and apply for a QC chemistry position. Here in the south they usually start off around $25 per hour. Not amazing but not bad either if you need to separate yourself from your parents for awhile to become your own person and follow your own dreams.

 

[johnnytest]

Definitely do not do medicine if you are not going to be happy. I can tell you know better than your parents and how things are in today's day and age. Jobs depend on what kind of experience you have. Off the top of my head I think entry level research positions are best for you.

 

[rodmichael82]

DON'T DO MEDICINE IF YOU'RE NOT PASSIONATE ABOUT IT OTHERWISE YOU'LL HATE EVERY DAY OF YOUR LIFE.

 

[ayocaptain628]

Img im literally shocked to see this complete bouleversement on ur part
But tbh good on u bc u know that u were doing it for ur parents and u need to think about what you want
Now, the only thing is: do you REALLY like dentistry?

 

[lazyindy]

Img im literally shocked to see this complete bouleversement on ur part
But tbh good on u bc u know that u were doing it for ur parents and u need to think about what you want
Now, the only thing is: do you REALLY like dentistry?

I haven't shadowed one yet but whenever I go see the dentist I can sense they have really good patient relationships. And the hours are much more reasonable

 

[snowys435]

Hey all,

So recently I have decided to not pursue medicine and go to dental school instead. I cannot see myself being happy as a physician and very turned off by the emotional and physical wear and tear of pursuing medicine. I took the MCAT and received a 34 so I know I absolutely have a shot but deep down I know I won't be happy in this field.

I told my parents about my situation and they are now enraged. They are typical controlling Indian parents who think the only way to achieve high status is to be a physician. They even had the audacity to tell me that "dentists have no respect" and "they don't make anything" -- verbatim from their mouths. I completely understand the sacrifices they made as immigrants and how hard they worked to put me through school and college. However I feel they're expectations at the moment aren't reasonable. I can't sacrifice my happiness just so they can tell their friends and family that "my son is a doctor". I have nothing but respect for them for putting a roof over my head and all but today their derogatory remarks have really hurt me -- calling me a "failure, loser, and an idiot" for even considering dentistry.

How do I handle a situation like this? I couldn't even find a job after graduating this May and my parents make me feel very guilty for free-loading off of them. What kind of jobs can I get with a B.S in biochemistry? and how on earth do I convince my parents that dentistry is not as bad as they make it out to be? I am so stressed right now, I can't even think straight.

The moment I saw the title of this thread I assumed you were Indian. sigh .Indian parents have such a bad reputation.

 

[Uafl112]

indian parents come around eventually, man. Stick to your guns. You just gotta keep saying what you want until they absolutely accept it. Thats worked for me when my desi parents were being unreasonable. They'll be furious at first and refuse to cooperate. Then come the guilt tricks in which they act as you have betrayed the family. Then they will realize that you're not gonna change your mind. At this point, you strike out and pull some cold hard facts about dentistry that make it sound cool as hell to them (say something like "well dentists also get to introduce themselves as 'Dr.______'." They will love that). They will still resist and continue to try to convince you that medicine would be cooler, however, their pestering and argument is gonna be much weaker. Eventually you will successfully convince them that Dentistry is just as cool as Medicine.

 

[Willy38]

Dentistry is different but still a really cool field in my opinion. I know many dentists who work 4 days per week, have families and pull ~150-250K per year. I don't know how many "life-saving" opportunities you would have as a dentist but as far as lifestyle, pay, and career fulfillment, the dentists I know absolutely love their professions. At the end of the day, you have to follow what you feel called to do. If that's dentistry then be the best dentist you can be! Best of luck in your predicament, I know it will work out for the best when its all said and done.


btw, almost every doctor I have shadowed has tried to convince me to go into dentistry or business so definitely don't do medicine just to fulfill a wish of your parents. Life is too short, they will come around eventually.

 

[deleted480308]

You should feel guilty for freeloading off them, you graduated in may ....it's december

Get out of their house. Even waiters can pay rent in most cities.

Pursue your dreams on your own dime

 

[Dr Van Helsing]

It took you four years and maybe more to figure out medicine was not right? Did you not shadow any doctors, explore other options, pursue interests? Actually don't answer those questions. Just LOL. From a school of hard knocks perspective, I would be pissed if I were your parents too. Let's trade.
Oh, and your parents can't force you to do anything if you are over 18.

 

[Psai]

Dentist > Doctor
You'll thank yourself when you are rolling in dough in your cash pay private office while the rest of us slave away in hospitals, surrounded by people dressed just like us and being dictated to by people with no idea what a sick person even looks like
Just don't be one of those insecure people who go "you know, dentists are doctors too"

Go forth young padawan

 

[aegistitan]

Are your parents willing to pay for your medical school, or will you have to take out loans either way? If you have to take out loans either way you should do whatever you want, but if your parents are in no way willing to support you at all through dental school I'd say go to medical school. Dental programs are quite expensive and government does not provide a stipend for dental residents. This shocked me when I first read it http://www.reddit.com/r/personalfin..._to_pay_off_about_1_million_in_student_loans/

I'm going to get a lot of hate for saying this, but at the end of the day medicine is a job. If you're tired of the competitiveness go for true P/F no internal ranking MD school followed by community IM/FM/Psych. Become a hospitalist, you'll have a guaranteed 6 figure income for the rest of your life, and a pretty good lifestyle, you'll be able to make your parents happy.

 

[Conflagration]

Dentist > Doctor
You'll thank yourself when you are rolling in dough in your cash pay private office while the rest of us slave away in hospitals, surrounded by people dressed just like us and being dictated to by people with no idea what a sick person even looks like
Go forth young padawan

Dat Star Wars reference. <3

OP, were you always set on being a dentist, and you were afraid to tell them? Or is this a recent discovery?

Well, if you're interested in dentistry, you need to take a different test- the DAT. The DAT has scores from 1-30 in six different portions and two composite scores are made from that (Total Science and Academic Average).

You'll also need some dentist shadowing under your belt, too. (There's a pre-dent section of SDN that can be more specific.)

And,@aegistitan, it's not even the money. Four years of medical school + residency can crush people that want to be there. I couldn't imagine what it does to someone who doesn't want to be a physician in the first place.

 

[lazyindy]

Are your parents willing to pay for your medical school, or will you have to take out loans either way? If you have to take out loans either way you should do whatever you want, but if your parents are in no way willing to support you at all through dental school I'd say go to medical school. Dental programs are quite expensive and government does not provide a stipend for dental residents. This shocked me when I first read it http://www.reddit.com/r/personalfin..._to_pay_off_about_1_million_in_student_loans/

I'm going to get a lot of hate for saying this, but at the end of the day medicine is a job. If you're tired of the competitiveness go for true P/F no internal ranking MD school followed by community IM/FM/Psych. Become a hospitalist, you'll have a guaranteed 6 figure income for the rest of your life, and a pretty good lifestyle, you'll be able to make your parents happy.

That line of reasoning doesn't make sense. Just because my parents are willing to help me pay for med school doesn't make attending it a good idea. I will try my best to convince them into helping me finance dental school. Indian parents can be frustrating but they usually come around to help their kids (or so I'm hoping in my case).

Yes dental schools are more expensive but dental residents at least make more coming out of dental school as compared to med residents. Not to mention the more humane hours and a saner lifestyle.

 

[Conflagration]

That line of reasoning doesn't make sense. Just because my parents are willing to help me pay for med school doesn't make attending it a good idea. I will try my best to convince them into helping me finance dental school. Indian parents can be frustrating but they usually come around to help their kids (or so I'm hoping in my case).

Yes dental schools are more expensive but dental residents at least make more coming out of dental school as compared to med residents. Not to mention the more humane hours and a saner lifestyle.

Dentistry keeps a lot of that appeal for that reason- the hours are pretty nice, and it's definitely worth it if you've got the entrepreneurial spirit.

Is it something you're interested in, though? Or is it more of a compromise to meet with your parent's wants?

 

[Gurby]

Img im literally shocked to see this complete bouleversement on ur part
But tbh good on u bc u know that u were doing it for ur parents and u need to think about what you want
Now, the only thing is: do you REALLY like dentistry?

 

[Promethean]

If you explain to them that being a dentist will give you more time for family, that you can give them some grandkids sooner and get to spend more time with them, that might win them over. Only say those things if they are true, of course, but the dentists I know actually do have a lot more time to spend with their kids and their parents than the physicians/surgeons that I know.

EDIT: Whatever approach you use, if you stand firm and demonstrate to them that you have good reasons for your decision (whatever they are), they will come around.

Meantime, yeah, find a job. Even if you live with a bunch of roommates to make the budget work, paying your own way makes you a lot more free to make your own decisions.

 

[GavinThePremed]

Hey all,

So recently I have decided to not pursue medicine and go to dental school instead. I cannot see myself being happy as a physician and very turned off by the emotional and physical wear and tear of pursuing medicine. I took the MCAT and received a 34 so I know I absolutely have a shot but deep down I know I won't be happy in this field.

I told my parents about my situation and they are now enraged. They are typical controlling Indian parents who think the only way to achieve high status is to be a physician. They even had the audacity to tell me that "dentists have no respect" and "they don't make anything" -- verbatim from their mouths. I completely understand the sacrifices they made as immigrants and how hard they worked to put me through school and college. However I feel they're expectations at the moment aren't reasonable. I can't sacrifice my happiness just so they can tell their friends and family that "my son is a doctor". I have nothing but respect for them for putting a roof over my head and all but today their derogatory remarks have really hurt me -- calling me a "failure, loser, and an idiot" for even considering dentistry.

How do I handle a situation like this? I couldn't even find a job after graduating this May and my parents make me feel very guilty for free-loading off of them. What kind of jobs can I get with a B.S in biochemistry? and how on earth do I convince my parents that dentistry is not as bad as they make it out to be? I am so stressed right now, I can't even think straight.

Burnt out? Man, Dental school is just as hard, if not harder than Medical School. In D-School you have to see patients and do your studying for your subjects at the same time, at least in Medicine it's split up.

And more than that, to a certain degree, Medicine has a greater degree of job security than Dentistry. In Medicine you don't have to go around looking for a job, it's basically given to you.


I think you really have to re-think this thought. Dentistry shouldn't be a "Fall-back" to Medicine. If you haven't thought about this seriously, sitting over some dude's face and tinkering around in there could easily make you the most miserable person ever.

 

[HinduHammer]

Hey all,

So recently I have decided to not pursue medicine and go to dental school instead. I cannot see myself being happy as a physician and very turned off by the emotional and physical wear and tear of pursuing medicine. I took the MCAT and received a 34 so I know I absolutely have a shot but deep down I know I won't be happy in this field.

I told my parents about my situation and they are now enraged. They are typical controlling Indian parents who think the only way to achieve high status is to be a physician. They even had the audacity to tell me that "dentists have no respect" and "they don't make anything" -- verbatim from their mouths. I completely understand the sacrifices they made as immigrants and how hard they worked to put me through school and college. However I feel they're expectations at the moment aren't reasonable. I can't sacrifice my happiness just so they can tell their friends and family that "my son is a doctor". I have nothing but respect for them for putting a roof over my head and all but today their derogatory remarks have really hurt me -- calling me a "failure, loser, and an idiot" for even considering dentistry.

How do I handle a situation like this? I couldn't even find a job after graduating this May and my parents make me feel very guilty for free-loading off of them. What kind of jobs can I get with a B.S in biochemistry? and how on earth do I convince my parents that dentistry is not as bad as they make it out to be? I am so stressed right now, I can't even think straight.

Hey man I can seriously empathize. My parents are Indian. As you can see on my MDApps, I had an awful GPA and spent about 250k getting there. Not that my parents are wealthy and I still shudder when I think to the loans that my father will be paying until the day he dies. My parents never really got mad at me like you, but the quiet disappointment was worse. Yes I know the embarrassment of everyone else's kids becoming doctors, but you're the black sheep bc you want to do something else. It sucks.

However, it is absolutely YOUR life, not theirs. After coming from this background, I seriously, seriously suggest you get some therapy and some sort of life coach or something to help you take charge of your life. Me? I used Tony Robbins, Brian Tracy, Eckhart Toelle's The Power of NOW, Brad Blanton's Radical Honesty, David Deida's The Way of the Superior Man, and much more. I also had many caucasian and non-indian friends when I worked at Home Depot for the first year of my deciding to do pre-med. I suggest getting a crappy minimum wage job... I know it sucks, I went to Wash U, but man, it was some of the most eye-opening days of my life. I would never go back, but I wouldn't trade those days and shifts for anything.

You need to feel good about yourself to get out of their shadow and stand up for yourself. You only feel good about yourself by being self-efficacious and self-effective/self-fulfilling. You need to start paying for your own gas money, start networking with dentists and working at their offices as admins, start exercising and feeling good about your body.

I was the cousin out of all my 10+ aunts and uncles who was a fat, jobless loser until age 26 when I decided to do pre-med. It kinda sucked, sure, but again, IT DOESN'T MATTER. None of it matters, its YOUR life. I hope I'm not rambling here...

Anyway, how to convince your parents:
- Find other dentists of the same caste as your (If you're a Patel, find other Patel dentists that are successful) and try to reach out to them...then tell your parents that "See, Dr. Patel/Dr. Singh/Dr. Khan is a practicing dentist, he's happy, he has a beautiful family, and he has a nice house..." -- This should get your parents to shut up
- Show them the earnings/debt-load/work-life of dentists and how dentists can be successful entrepreneurs (my good friend's wife is in Surg residency at Baylor and her twin brother is making like 10-15k/day sometimes as a dentists doing orthodontics....yeah, he's going to make way more money than her over their lifetime)
- Join shaadi.com or jeevansathi.com and say you're a dentists, ...show them all the many indian women and their parents who want you to marry them.

I think/hope this post should really help you with your problem

 

[lazyindy]

Burnt out? Man, Dental school is just as hard, if not harder than Medical School. In D-School you have to see patients and do your studying for your subjects at the same time, at least in Medicine it's split up.

And more than that, to a certain degree, Medicine has a greater degree of job security than Dentistry. In Medicine you don't have to go around looking for a job, it's basically given to you.

I think you really have to re-think this thought. Dentistry shouldn't be a "Fall-back" to Medicine. If you haven't thought about this seriously, sitting over some dude's face and tinkering around in there could easily make you the most miserable person ever.

oh really? you're telling me medical students don't have to study for their shelf exams third year..while you know..doing clinical rotations too?

Yes you're 'given' a job after medical school but what if its in the specialty you didn't want but had to end up there anyway because you didn't do so hot on step 1? With dentistry atleast you have to commit to the fact that you will end up in GPR most likely and still make more than a decent living. While having reasonable hours and a more flexible schedule.

If you're already talking about career stability as a pre-med, that tells me you're going into medicine with the viewpoint that it will be a job. In that case I would highly advise YOU to re-think your career choice while you still have time. From what I've experienced through shadowing and the words of wise physicians, medicine will pretty much be your life. And yes it will be soul-sucking even if you are passionate about it.

 

[GavinThePremed]

oh really? you're telling me medical students don't have to study for their shelf exams third year..while you know..doing clinical rotations too?

Yes you're 'given' a job after medical school but what if its in the specialty you didn't want but had to end up there anyway because you didn't do so hot on step 1? With dentistry atleast you have to commit to the fact that you will end up in GPR most likely and still make more than a decent living. While having reasonable hours and a more flexible schedule.

If you're already talking about career stability as a pre-med, that tells me you're going into medicine with the viewpoint that it will be a job. In that case I would highly advise YOU to re-think your career choice while you still have time. From what I've experienced through shadowing and the words of wise physicians, medicine will pretty much be your life. And yes it will be soul-sucking even if you are passionate about it.

But...medicine is a job haha. So I don't know what you're talking about there.

Dude, in the end, if you're trying to convince me why you're so into Dentistry, I don't know why you can't just say this to your folks. If you're financially dependent on them, stop that, move out, do things for yourself. Why is your happiness so attached to theirs? Heck, beyond 18 they should be happy with a few visits each year, why are your major life decisions dependent upon their approval?

 

[zero0]

Ok, here's what you do. Go actually shadow a dentist and see if that's what you want to do for 30-40 years. Also, spend some time on the dentistry forums getting to know the profession and the issues associated with it, then weigh your options. Personally, I made the switch from dentistry to medicine because it bored me to tears and I could not see myself doing that my entire life.

 

[deleted388502]

It is your life and your parents WILL come around. They simply want the best for you and want you to show some sort of direction.

If you're hell bent on pursuing dentistry now and really commit to that, I promise you your parents will step back and understand in time. However, you seem like you've waffled quite a bit about medicine and you really just need to find whatever you're willing to make these sacrifices for. What makes you come alive and what career works with your future. Whatever that may be is what's really going to get you to 150% commit and fight to the fullest to make it happen. I'm happy that you've found out that wasn't medicine because I feel like I've seen so many physicians who end up miserable because they don't realize it early on. While dentistry may sound appealing for the money and lifestyle (it is quite cushy, both of my best friends are pursuing dentistry), it has its own nuisances. There are so many other options in healthcare to look into as well - physicians assistant, for example. Just make sure dentistry is REALLY what you want because it's a gigantic commitment to make on such a whim.

Everything happens for a reason, and take this time to do some soul searching before you jump into another test and another career path. Get a job (even if it may not be the best paying thing) - as a scribe, EMT to figure out if you really hate medicine, or if you want to pursue dentistry, something paid in that field. Just do some soul searching. This is the age to do it and I guarantee you'll be happy in ten years that you took some time to do this instead of running into another career option.

You're clearly intelligent and capable, your parents know that and want you to fulfill your potential. Now go find what it is that will really get you to use the best of your skills on the daily.

 

[lazyindy]

It is your life and your parents WILL come around. They simply want the best for you and want you to show some sort of direction.

If you're hell bent on pursuing dentistry now and really commit to that, I promise you your parents will step back and understand in time. However, you seem like you've waffled quite a bit about medicine and you really just need to find whatever you're willing to make these sacrifices for. What makes you come alive and what career works with your future. Whatever that may be is what's really going to get you to 150% commit and fight to the fullest to make it happen. I'm happy that you've found out that wasn't medicine because I feel like I've seen so many physicians who end up miserable because they don't realize it early on. While dentistry may sound appealing for the money and lifestyle (it is quite cushy, both of my best friends are pursuing dentistry), it has its own nuisances. There are so many other options in healthcare to look into as well - physicians assistant, for example. Just make sure dentistry is REALLY what you want because it's a gigantic commitment to make on such a whim.

Everything happens for a reason, and take this time to do some soul searching before you jump into another test and another career path. Get a job (even if it may not be the best paying thing) - as a scribe, EMT to figure out if you really hate medicine, or if you want to pursue dentistry, something paid in that field. Just do some soul searching. This is the age to do it and I guarantee you'll be happy in ten years that you took some time to do this instead of running into another career option.

You're clearly intelligent and capable, your parents know that and want you to fulfill your potential. Now go find what it is that will really get you to use the best of your skills on the daily.

thanks Avenlea

keep me updated on your progress!

 

[deleted480308]

Hey man I can seriously empathize. My parents are Indian. As you can see on my MDApps, I had an awful GPA and spent about 250k getting there. Not that my parents are wealthy and I still shudder when I think to the loans that my father will be paying until the day he dies. My parents never really got mad at me like you, but the quiet disappointment was worse. Yes I know the embarrassment of everyone else's kids becoming doctors, but you're the black sheep bc you want to do something else. It sucks.

However, it is absolutely YOUR life, not theirs. After coming from this background, I seriously, seriously suggest you get some therapy and some sort of life coach or something to help you take charge of your life. Me? I used Tony Robbins, Brian Tracy, Eckhart Toelle's The Power of NOW, Brad Blanton's Radical Honesty, David Deida's The Way of the Superior Man, and much more. I also had many caucasian and non-indian friends when I worked at Home Depot for the first year of my deciding to do pre-med. I suggest getting a crappy minimum wage job... I know it sucks, I went to Wash U, but man, it was some of the most eye-opening days of my life. I would never go back, but I wouldn't trade those days and shifts for anything.

You need to feel good about yourself to get out of their shadow and stand up for yourself. You only feel good about yourself by being self-efficacious and self-effective/self-fulfilling. You need to start paying for your own gas money, start networking with dentists and working at their offices as admins, start exercising and feeling good about your body.

I was the cousin out of all my 10+ aunts and uncles who was a fat, jobless loser until age 26 when I decided to do pre-med. It kinda sucked, sure, but again, IT DOESN'T MATTER. None of it matters, its YOUR life. I hope I'm not rambling here...

Anyway, how to convince your parents:
- Find other dentists of the same caste as your (If you're a Patel, find other Patel dentists that are successful) and try to reach out to them...then tell your parents that "See, Dr. Patel/Dr. Singh/Dr. Khan is a practicing dentist, he's happy, he has a beautiful family, and he has a nice house..." -- This should get your parents to shut up
- Show them the earnings/debt-load/work-life of dentists and how dentists can be successful entrepreneurs (my good friend's wife is in Surg residency at Baylor and her twin brother is making like 10-15k/day sometimes as a dentists doing orthodontics....yeah, he's going to make way more money than her over their lifetime)
- Join shaadi.com or jeevansathi.com and say you're a dentists, ...show them all the many indian women and their parents who want you to marry them.

I think/hope this post should really help you with your problem

Why would your dad be paying back your loans till he's dead? You will be a doctor and should pay them back yourself

 

[HinduHammer]

Why would your dad be paying back your loans till he's dead? You will be a doctor and should pay them back yourself

My dad took on non-transerrable loans onto his name only; he has explicitly made the loans in such a way that he plans to pay as little as possible per month because these are loans that die with him. So if he has 20K left to pay at the time of his death, the debt goes away. That is why he will be paying them until he dies. He is also 72 and not in great health, while it will be about 10 years from now before I start making any money.

Does that answer your judgmental question

 

[DoctorInASaree]

Oh India my India

Can some medical students and residents speak to how they balance their personal lives while attending medical school / completing their residency?

Perhaps @sb247 @DermViser

Now, if you'll excuse me, because I'm Indian I need to perform a dance routine near the closest river.

 

[deleted480308]

My dad took on non-transerrable loans onto his name only; he has explicitly made the loans in such a way that he plans to pay as little as possible per month because these are loans that die with him. So if he has 20K left to pay at the time of his death, the debt goes away. That is why he will be paying them until he dies. He is also 72 and not in great health, while it will be about 10 years from now before I start making any money.

Does that answer your judgmental question

you are a rare med student with a 72yr old father...(I'm nontrad too). and yes my question was judgmental based on the assumption that most med students don't have parents in their seventies, if you are blessed enough to have your father survive your training I would suggest you take over the payments unless they are low enough in relation to your father's wealth that they are inconsequential

*edit....on a side note, I have a friend with end stage kidney failure and a very short life expectancy who has been signing up for new credit cards and using them to pay off his daughter's school loans.

 

[deleted480308]

Oh India my India

Can some medical students and residents speak to how they balance their personal lives while attending medical school / completing their residency?

Perhaps @sb247 @DermViser

Now, if you'll excuse me, because I'm Indian I need to perform a dance routine near the closest river.

it's hard, I don't see my kids nearly as much as I want to. I choose to do all my studying at school as it's more productive and then strictly focus on them when I'm home

 

[fancymylotus]

Hey all,

So recently I have decided to not pursue medicine and go to dental school instead. I cannot see myself being happy as a physician and very turned off by the emotional and physical wear and tear of pursuing medicine. I took the MCAT and received a 34 so I know I absolutely have a shot but deep down I know I won't be happy in this field.

I told my parents about my situation and they are now enraged. They are typical controlling Indian parents who think the only way to achieve high status is to be a physician. They even had the audacity to tell me that "dentists have no respect" and "they don't make anything" -- verbatim from their mouths. I completely understand the sacrifices they made as immigrants and how hard they worked to put me through school and college. However I feel they're expectations at the moment aren't reasonable. I can't sacrifice my happiness just so they can tell their friends and family that "my son is a doctor". I have nothing but respect for them for putting a roof over my head and all but today their derogatory remarks have really hurt me -- calling me a "failure, loser, and an idiot" for even considering dentistry.

How do I handle a situation like this? I couldn't even find a job after graduating this May and my parents make me feel very guilty for free-loading off of them. What kind of jobs can I get with a B.S in biochemistry? and how on earth do I convince my parents that dentistry is not as bad as they make it out to be? I am so stressed right now, I can't even think straight.

Sigh.

My Indian physician colleagues are more than respectful and nice. No one I've ever met thinks I'm an idiot for being a dentist. Most people, aforementioned physician colleagues included, tell me that they wish their children would become dentists. When I was single, my parents were getting "marriage" requests from other Indian families all over the place, most of whom had physician sons.

If you dont think you will be happy as a physician, make damn sure you'll be happy as a dentist. I work a lot, and I deal with a lot of crap because of the business aspect to my profession that maybe working in a hospital you may not have to deal with firsthand, but to me, its worth it.

PS: their tune may drastically change when you are rolling in the $$$$$. Its a fact of life. Just saying.

 

[NervousNerd]

I'm just going out on a limb, but if they are pushing medicine because they think you will be making lots of $$$$$ they may be surprised to find out dentistry is really where the $$$$ is

 

[HinduHammer]

you are a rare med student with a 72yr old father...(I'm nontrad too). and yes my question was judgmental based on the assumption that most med students don't have parents in their seventies, if you are blessed enough to have your father survive your training I would suggest you take over the payments unless they are low enough in relation to your father's wealth that they are inconsequential

*edit....on a side note, I have a friend with end stage kidney failure and a very short life expectancy who has been signing up for new credit cards and using them to pay off his daughter's school loans.

Appreciate the more reasonable, less judgmental response.

 

[azumzz]

I haven't shadowed one yet but whenever I go see the dentist I can sense they have really good patient relationships. And the hours are much more reasonable

Hey man, in response to this sentence, I just wanted to say that there are many specialties where you can have reasonable hours and build strong relationships. One example: psychiatry, in that field you can have whatever hours you damn well please, live wherever you want, and build really strong relationships. Other example: derm or rad onc. Even family medicine if u don't mind taking less patients. I'm sure lifestyle can be crazy in some types of dentistry.

I am in no way agreeing with you parents, I think you should do what makes you feel good. However, just make sure you are not leaving medicine for the wrong reasons. For example, you might be romantisizing medicine and dentistry. Make sure u are getting your ideas from real life experiences and not sdn. A lot of ppl on sdn like to whine about how depressed they are but remember, those who are upset, yell the loudest.

 

[texan2414]

Yo dude,

I feel bad for your situation. I know parents can sometimes have unreasonable expectations that can sometimes force them into delusion.
My best recommendation for you would be to move out (even for a semester really). Go back and take post-bacc classes while at the same time shadowing physicians and dentists. You REALLY need time away from home life to make this decision and I feel that right now your perspective is really warped that you won't be able to make a rational decision at this point in time.

Taking a little time off before making such an important decision will do wonders for you. It will give you a broader perspective (hopefully strengthen your resolve for either medicine or dentistry through more shadowing). Also, speak with some med/dent students and explain your dilemma. I myself have met countless MS1/MS2 who have felt the same way (perhaps not as extreme as yours) but eventually, they realized their thoughts were just muddled up and all they needed was time (gap year, etc) to set their priorities straight.

I would also like to point out that your clinical science years are going to be miserable no matter how strong your resolve/determination is for either career. But eventually it all works out (statistically for a huge majority of people). Being passionate about your career is one thing but you should also be realistic. Don't think you will feel slap-happy all the time in med school while studying for your block exams, etc. But at the end of the day, it should be where your heart is.

 

[lazyindy]

Hey man, in response to this sentence, I just wanted to say that there are many specialties where you can have reasonable hours and build strong relationships. One example: psychiatry, in that field you can have whatever hours you damn well please, live wherever you want, and build really strong relationships. Other example: derm or rad onc. Even family medicine if u don't mind taking less patients. I'm sure lifestyle can be crazy in some types of dentistry.

I am in no way agreeing with you parents, I think you should do what makes you feel good. However, just make sure you are not leaving medicine for the wrong reasons. For example, you might be romantisizing medicine and dentistry. Make sure u are getting your ideas from real life experiences and not sdn. A lot of ppl on sdn like to whine about how depressed they are but remember, those who are upset, yell the loudest.

thanks for your reply but I've really thought about this and it seemed I was honestly going to medicine for the wrong reasons. In addition to long term patient relationships, lifestyle, respect, and finances are also really important to me. In this day and age with the new ACA passing and the implementation of socialized medicine that is simply not possible anymore IMHO.

A lot of the physicians I shadowed echoed my sentiments: Health Administrators who have no clue what a sick person looks like tell you how to practice medicine, a good chunk of your day is spent battling with insurance corps over bills for procedures, the severe overload of paperwork cuts down time spent with patients. All of this combined will drive any sane person to burnout quickly and severe disappointment after they realized the hundreds of thousands of dollars they spent on a medical education and slaving away for minimum wage during residency, only to not achieve what they set out to.

It's no wonder many doctors are leaving medicine altogether:

http://www.reportingonhealth.org/20...etire-or-flee-doctors-are-leaving-health-care

http://www.jacksonhealthcare.com/me...doctors-to-leave-medicine-within-next-decade/

 

[BurbyPrep89]

Unless you're talking about private practice, I've never met a doctor who was "battling with insurance corps." There are people who deal with billing in a hospital. And maybe the doctors I work with are special - they are, but this is still sarcasm - but somehow they manage to practice medicine despite the beaurocracy.

Anyway, please don't go into medicine. There are literally thousands of students who would gladly take your place in the applicant pool. Do what makes you happy, just don't come on here to describe how you're dodging the bullet of medicine.

Also, please shadow a dentist first, because it isn't a walk in the park. Everything good takes sacrifice.

 

[Lamel]

This is the first time I've heard of Indian parents not being happy with "just" dentist.

 

[notbobtrustme]

saving lives is overrated. so much of medicine is keeping turds afloat.

go into what you like, don't **** around with things you don't like. simple as that. if your parents can't handle that, it's their problem, not yours.

 

[lazyindy]

well, thats that.

Just cancelled my Jan 10 reservation for the re-take and I am done with MCAT and AAMC forever. 20 years ago I would've been the first applicant to all medical schools as I have a deep passion for this profession, but in present day socializedmedicine, I won't be able to achieve my goals. It is almost becoming a punishment to become a medical doctor and many of them are planning to retire early or leaving medicine altogether

I have nothing but the utmost respect for you guys who are sitting for the mcat soon. You all will sacrifice a lot but we will be needing compassionate doctors like you in the future.

Good luck everyone

 

[zero0]

it seemed I was honestly going to medicine for the wrong reasons. In addition to long term patient relationships, lifestyle, respect, and finances are also really important to me. http://www.jacksonhealthcare.com/media-room/news/one-third-of-doctors-to-leave-medicine-within-next-decade/

Sharp guy. Props for taking a good look at yourself and figuring this out on your own.

Fact is, medicine isn't as sound of a financial investment as it was a decade ago. It's more of a sacrifice now than ever.

 

[Ailleurs]

Sorry to hear that. I've seen some of your posts and as a fellow Desi, I was rooting for you.

Hey man I can seriously empathize. My parents are Indian. As you can see on my MDApps, I had an awful GPA and spent about 250k getting there. Not that my parents are wealthy and I still shudder when I think to the loans that my father will be paying until the day he dies. My parents never really got mad at me like you, but the quiet disappointment was worse. Yes I know the embarrassment of everyone else's kids becoming doctors, but you're the black sheep bc you want to do something else. It sucks.

However, it is absolutely YOUR life, not theirs. After coming from this background, I seriously, seriously suggest you get some therapy and some sort of life coach or something to help you take charge of your life. Me? I used Tony Robbins, Brian Tracy, Eckhart Toelle's The Power of NOW, Brad Blanton's Radical Honesty, David Deida's The Way of the Superior Man, and much more. I also had many caucasian and non-indian friends when I worked at Home Depot for the first year of my deciding to do pre-med. I suggest getting a crappy minimum wage job... I know it sucks, I went to Wash U, but man, it was some of the most eye-opening days of my life. I would never go back, but I wouldn't trade those days and shifts for anything.

You need to feel good about yourself to get out of their shadow and stand up for yourself. You only feel good about yourself by being self-efficacious and self-effective/self-fulfilling. You need to start paying for your own gas money, start networking with dentists and working at their offices as admins, start exercising and feeling good about your body.

I was the cousin out of all my 10+ aunts and uncles who was a fat, jobless loser until age 26 when I decided to do pre-med. It kinda sucked, sure, but again, IT DOESN'T MATTER. None of it matters, its YOUR life. I hope I'm not rambling here...

Anyway, how to convince your parents:
- Find other dentists of the same caste as your (If you're a Patel, find other Patel dentists that are successful) and try to reach out to them...then tell your parents that "See, Dr. Patel/Dr. Singh/Dr. Khan is a practicing dentist, he's happy, he has a beautiful family, and he has a nice house..." -- This should get your parents to shut up
- Show them the earnings/debt-load/work-life of dentists and how dentists can be successful entrepreneurs (my good friend's wife is in Surg residency at Baylor and her twin brother is making like 10-15k/day sometimes as a dentists doing orthodontics....yeah, he's going to make way more money than her over their lifetime)
- Join shaadi.com or jeevansathi.com and say you're a dentists, ...show them all the many indian women and their parents who want you to marry them.

I think/hope this post should really help you with your problem

But...medicine is a job haha. So I don't know what you're talking about there.

Dude, in the end, if you're trying to convince me why you're so into Dentistry, I don't know why you can't just say this to your folks. If you're financially dependent on them, stop that, move out, do things for yourself. Why is your happiness so attached to theirs? Heck, beyond 18 they should be happy with a few visits each year, why are your major life decisions dependent upon their approval?

@HinduHammer: Glad to hear you have looked into self-help material. Struggling to improve from the inside out is one of the best things one can do. I am struggling myself! I have a few demons to slay myself. Which Brian Tracy books if you don't mind? Also I lol'd at shaadi.com hahha. My mom actually wanted me to make a profile...... I'm 26, still hoping to have few more years before resort to the site lol

@GavinThePremed Sometimes, it is hard to understand different cultures. Many traditional East Indian families are rooted in different traditions than the ones we as Americans are comfortable and akin to do. For example, such parents simply aren't satisfied with a "few visits" a year. Family bonding and togetherness is more common than the independent lifestyle many lead. For parents rooted in tradition it's not easy to just accept different ways of living.

With that said, @lazyindy, I do think your parents will come around. I know so many families who have had to deal with some kind of "scandal" where their daughter/son had to attend D.O. or go to the Caribbean (reaaaal scandalous I know). It might not be an U.S. MD school but the person still gets to be a physician. In similar fashion, you will still get to be a doctor, just with a DDS degree instead. As others have said, they will come around. Most desi parents aren't this heartless to completely shun you. Try to seek independence. Maybe the distance will make them miss you and realize you are serious and working toward these goals!

 

[texan2414]

Unless you're talking about private practice, I've never met a doctor who was "battling with insurance corps." There are people who deal with billing in a hospital. And maybe the doctors I work with are special - they are, but this is still sarcasm - but somehow they manage to practice medicine despite the beaurocracy.

Anyway, please don't go into medicine. There are literally thousands of students who would gladly take your place in the applicant pool. Do what makes you happy, just don't come on here to describe how you're dodging the bullet of medicine.

Also, please shadow a dentist first, because it isn't a walk in the park. Everything good takes sacrifice.

Don't dismiss his comments - I don't think you are adequately familiar with the Asian micro-culture when it comes to medicine and it being a status symbol. I think this thread might be helpful to many viewing it who may not necessarily post their own concerns on forums.

I do agree with your point that insurance billing and coding is not the primary task on the list of the physician but I do concede to the point he is making - there are numerous instances where physicians can be consumed by the insurance hassles and thus have little time left for adequate patient interaction. This leads to an unsatisfactory patient-physician encounter.

 

[azumzz]

thanks for your reply but I've really thought about this and it seemed I was honestly going to medicine for the wrong reasons. In addition to long term patient relationships, lifestyle, respect, and finances are also really important to me. In this day and age with the new ACA passing and the implementation of socialized medicine that is simply not possible anymore IMHO.

A lot of the physicians I shadowed echoed my sentiments: Health Administrators who have no clue what a sick person looks like tell you how to practice medicine, a good chunk of your day is spent battling with insurance corps over bills for procedures, the severe overload of paperwork cuts down time spent with patients. All of this combined will drive any sane person to burnout quickly and severe disappointment after they realized the hundreds of thousands of dollars they spent on a medical education and slaving away for minimum wage during residency, only to not achieve what they set out to.

It's no wonder many doctors are leaving medicine altogether:

http://www.reportingonhealth.org/2014/03/10/whether-it’s-retire-or-flee-doctors-are-leaving-health-care

http://www.jacksonhealthcare.com/me...doctors-to-leave-medicine-within-next-decade/

Seems like you did a lot of great research and that's good, but I am pretty sure all those things you don't like can be avoided given the right specialty, practice setting, patient load, ancillary staff, etc.

As for the articles you cited, is it really a big surprise that 50 or 60 year olds would rather retire a bit sooner than make all those changes?

 

[question25]

Congrats on taking ownership of your life !! Consider finding a job at a dental office