PCOM: extremely low admission standards!

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BMBiology

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Pharmacy schools are desperate for students. Check out PCOM:

Doctor of Pharmacy Program Data | PCOM School of Pharmacy

Ave undergrad science GPA is 2.85! That means many of the bottom half of the class have a C average science GPA. If you got a C average GPA, you shouldn't be in a doctorate program!

Their stats is dropping like crazy. 832 applied in 2014 while only 481 in 2017 (a 42% dropped). They are scraping the bottom of the barrel for students!
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I think my school's average GPA is like 3.2 or something. I know I have to have a 3.2 minimum in order to waive my PCAT and be guaranteed an interview.

I kinda feel bad for all the people going to that school, however.

Also, unrelated question, what is the "good" score range for PCAT scores? I honestly have no idea. I thought the upper 30's figure was bad but wasn't sure.
 
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PCAT - All over the map. Some schools only use it as a tiebreaker or as confirmation for inconsistent performance (interview is crap, grades are great).

GPA - That's really low. If their 3rd year comps are so high, yet their NAPLEX passages are so low, the school has a curriculum problem.
 
It's a fall back option for med school, PA school, and dental rejects
 
There are nursing programs with higher admission standards than this. Then again look at their graduation and pass rates. 200k doesn't buy much anymore.
 
Doesn't get much more pathetic than students with an avg PCAT ~30 and science gpa 2.85 being part of our profession. Patients deserve better than that.

Can't say this is the only school doing it though, they are all running a business and dgaf.
 
Doktor_dud3 said:
I think my school's average GPA is like 3.2 or something. I know I have to have a 3.2 minimum in order to waive my PCAT and be guaranteed an interview.

I kinda feel bad for all the people going to that school, however.

Also, unrelated question, what is the "good" score range for PCAT scores? I honestly have no idea. I thought the upper 30's figure was bad but wasn't sure.
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What school do u go to
 
ValeUC said:
This is what happens when you open up a school for profit and an oversaturated market. They need to change to mandatory BS degree for admissions across the board. That's the only way.
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That will help, and will give students some more time to mature and consider if they really want to invest in pharmacy school. But the real driver of this greed (and of lowering the bar for pharmacy school) is the ease of taking out student loans for grad school. At some point the student loan bubble has to burst, though, right?
 
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WVUPharm2007 said:
Average indebtedness of graduates in academic year - $183,063

Whew.

Does anyone have the admission stats for Temple or USP? Just to compare?
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I don't know the exact stat, I know at least two students who got accepted in Temple with 2.5 gpa and very low PCAT score (one of them had a reading composite score of 10 I think), which was around 4 years ago.
 
Why in the world would the Philadelphia College of Osteopathic Medicine (PCOM) opened a pharmacy school in Georgia?


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Seriously, what has to happen for these schools to shut down?
 
BMBiology said:
Why in the world would the Philadelphia College of Osteopathic Medicine (PCOM) opened a pharmacy school in Georgia?
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They opened a DO school in an old warehouse and a few years later added the pharmacy program. The only nice thing about the program is they have a nice compounding lab, otherwise it is just a few large classrooms. I have not heard great things about the students and there are several major rotation sites in the Atlanta area that do not take their students.
 
Sad! How can you advocate for provider status when your average student couldn't even get into a top nursing program?
 
wait what... lol did i read that right? mean pcat score is 37?! lol how is that even possible?!
 
Peterpiper1 said:
Seriously, what has to happen for these schools to shut down?
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Mandate a bachelors and ~ 1500 hours of shadowing.

I’d say raise the academic bar but reality has it written that a business is a business no matter how much the “customer loan” is...Maybe the degree and working the min hours will simultaneously weed out just a few more people.
 
Well well, looks like the smart students are looking to other professions or better schools. The NAPLEX and MPJE are the only barriers to prevent substandard practitioners, but I feel sorry for those who wasted money and time on those bottom tier for-profit schools.
 
How can a school lobby for provider status and expanded medical privileges when PCAT scores are this low or not even accepted and gpas are at an all time low....oh yeah I forgot....Greed.
 
giga said:
One can only hope that the NAPLEX will protect the public and the profession, but it is a damm shame we cant hold the schools liable for this degradation.
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Is NAPLEX a challenging exam like the USMLEs?

I am working with a pharmacist right now and she is very knowledgeable...
 
W19 said:
Is NAPLEX a challenging exam like the USMLEs?

I am working with a pharmacist right now and she is very knowledgeable...
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lol no. It is a minimal competency exam.
 
W19 said:
Is NAPLEX a challenging exam like the USMLEs?

I am working with a pharmacist right now and she is very knowledgeable...
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No way...USMLE has 3 parts...step 1...step 2 and step 3...tons and tons of material and your score determines what specialty you can or cannot get into. It is super competitive and you're graded against others who take the exam.
 
Chill with the Bachelor's Requirements, lmao. I'm not as dumb as these kids or anything but I still want to finish in 6 years lol
 
Lnsean said:
We're up to PGY4 now
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Shooting for at least a PGY-1 after graduation is my goal. Hopefully a PGY-2 if I like working in a clinical environment. I'd be more than happy with a retail position, though.
 
This has shades of the HICP years, where those Nevadans got away scot free with a bankruptcy.
W19 said:
Is NAPLEX a challenging exam like the USMLEs?

I am working with a pharmacist right now and she is very knowledgeable...
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To be fair, USMLE is a minimum competency exam as well (the ABMS exams are not minimum competency and should force some basic study). It's just that the bar is set higher, but also, requires a practical demonstration of your skills, something that the NAPLEX no longer requires.

Also, USMLE's examining committee is on an effort to get rid of those trick questions. There's enough serious material that those sorts of things are not needed. The trick diagnoses though will stay are part of Step II.
 
W19 said:
Is NAPLEX a challenging exam like the USMLEs?

I am working with a pharmacist right now and she is very knowledgeable...
Click to expand...

Is the pharmacist you are working with right now by any chance residency trained and/or board certified (or has many years of clinical experience)? Pharmacy board certification exams are significantly more challenging than the NAPLEX. Although not a perfect proxy of one's clinical competency, pharmacy board certification is a pretty good indication that a pharmacist has more than minimal knowledge of pharmacotherapy.
 
giga said:
Is the pharmacist you are working with right now by any chance residency trained and/or board certified (or has many years of clinical experience)? Pharmacy board certification exams are significantly more challenging than the NAPLEX. Although not a perfect proxy of one's clinical competency, pharmacy board certification is a pretty good indication that a pharmacist has more than minimal knowledge of pharmacotherapy.
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She is residency trained... I am not sure if she is board certified.
 
W19 said:
She is residency trained... I am not sure if she is board certified.
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Residencies are actually quite competitive to land, although there seem to be some who fall through the cracks and fail the NAPLEX despite having the credentials to match.
 
W19 said:
Is NAPLEX a challenging exam like the USMLEs?

I am working with a pharmacist right now and she is very knowledgeable...
Click to expand...

There's a practice test that's supposed to show you how unprepared you are for the real thing and I passed it rather easily without studying.

I then studied for like 3 days or something and got like 50 points over passing (75 is passing, I believe) on the real thing

It is really, really easy.

The law test was way more tricky.
 
sdh02 said:
I don't know the exact stat, I know at least two students who got accepted in Temple with 2.5 gpa and very low PCAT score (one of them had a reading composite score of 10 I think), which was around 4 years ago.
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You do know Temple has a pretty high pass rate for the NAPLEX.......
 
maybe it is a requirement for pharmacy schools to look at test scores and grades but if they are scrambling for money and can set their own standards, why even bother to specify the "cut-off" points? Just say they will consider it "case-by-case" basis.
 
going into pharmacy school is a joke now among young pharmacists. I think its the worst option in healthcare field thinking about job market and tuition. It is indeed a suicidal attempt.
 
if you're willing to pay, u will get in pharmacy, its that easy.
 
stoichiometrist said:
Residencies are actually quite competitive to land, although there seem to be some who fall through the cracks and fail the NAPLEX despite having the credentials to match.
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Usually yes, residencies are competitive and say something about the student accepted. But the fall through the cracks you mentioned...two examples from my class: one girl was not the “class idiot,”...but was, well you know. She landed a residency and is now the DOP of some rural hospital with like one other pharmacist. The other girl was exceptionally qualified (GPA, research, padded resume with student orgs, etc). She didn’t get in and has been verifying scripts at the three letter chain since getting licensed. I know that preferencing and other factors, but I was always surprised by the disparity in this case.
 
What a joke pharmacy has become. Think it's time to just revert this back to a bachelors degree like nursing since the stats are comparable anyway.
 
Rouelle said:
Usually yes, residencies are competitive and say something about the student accepted. But the fall through the cracks you mentioned...two examples from my class: one girl was not the “class idiot,”...but was, well you know. She landed a residency and is now the DOP of some rural hospital with like one other pharmacist. The other girl was exceptionally qualified (GPA, research, padded resume with student orgs, etc). She didn’t get in and has been verifying scripts at the three letter chain since getting licensed. I know that preferencing and other factors, but I was always surprised by the disparity in this case.
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In my experience it's honestly closer to 30% bad

One person who got accepted to residency was loud, obnoxious, and often brought a pillow to class to sleep on the floor in the back during lecture. I'm not joking.
They were once savagely beaten in our P2 year by another student's significant other for infidelity.
Dunno where they ended up.

Yet another classmate was Literally one of the least intelligent people I've ever met.

They were accepted to an unaccredited residency and now work in academia at a college of pharmacy.
 
My dream: make the naplex harder, separate the chaff, and if you school does not have a pass rate of 95%, good bye accreditation......

Maybe if the score of the Naplex were considered in hiring, and HR looked for more than a warm body with a license , the value of the profession would be recognized and the how-in-the-f— did-they pass crowd would find themselves in positions where they can do little or no harm ......

Just a dream, I know....
 
farm4real said:
My dream: make the naplex harder, separate the chaff, and if you school does not have a pass rate of 95%, good bye accreditation......

Maybe if the score of the Naplex were considered in hiring, and HR looked for more than a warm body with a license , the value of the profession would be recognized and the how-in-the-f— did-they pass crowd would find themselves in positions where they can do little or no harm ......

Just a dream, I know....
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Wasn't the NAPLEX revised to be more difficult, or has that not happened yet? Current pass rates are laughable at many schools. IIRC 10 years ago the passing average was something like 94%. It's really pathetic to have to rely on a minimal competency exam like the NAPLEX to uphold the quality of graduate practitioners, but if the ACPE isn't going to do anything I guess it's the only option we have.
 
farm4real said:
My dream: make the naplex harder, separate the chaff, and if you school does not have a pass rate of 95%, good bye accreditation......

Maybe if the score of the Naplex were considered in hiring, and HR looked for more than a warm body with a license , the value of the profession would be recognized and the how-in-the-f— did-they pass crowd would find themselves in positions where they can do little or no harm ......

Just a dream, I know....
Click to expand...

My dream is that the accreditation is based on the percentage of grads getting full time jobs in the last two years, since this is what the schools promise.
 
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