PCOM vs allopathic gap year

[Dreamstoo]

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There's no problem going to an osteopathic school for most people. However, since crystal balls don't actually exist, there is no way to tell what one's future residency preference will be. Hence, you go to a school that will give you the most options.

I'm not a bitter DO graduate. I applauded PCOM above. I didn't get into any allopathic schools. That said, I picked the best of my options. Everyone should do this.

Agreed. If I got into an allopathic school, I would choose it in a heartbeat.

 

[Back 5]

There's no problem going to an osteopathic school for most people. However, since crystal balls don't actually exist, there is no way to tell what one's future residency preference will be. Hence, you go to a school that will give you the most options.

I'm not a bitter DO graduate. I applauded PCOM above. I didn't get into any allopathic schools. That said, I picked the best of my options. Everyone should do this.

So much talk on this forum recently has been calling for the "end of the world" by going to DO school. I think everyone understands MD will be the path of least resistance in so far as residency is concerned, but I think getting the conversation more focused on how to be a great DO student, or tips for DO students would be prudent.

The DO subforum has deteriorated into a forum where people seem to be stuck in a "if only I went MD" mindset that is not becoming.

 

[MDforMee]

I personally would only do anesthesia, radiology or pathology. If I couldn't do any of those I would do something other than medicine. I'm being 100% serious.

If you're a resident now, what specialty did you decide on? I might want to do anesthesia, myself.

 

[cliquesh]

If you're a resident now, what specialty did you decide on? I might want to do anesthesia, myself.

Anesthesia

 

[MDforMee]

Anesthesia

That's awesome. You are my bromance.

 

[fw5tape6kq]

For every DO resident who says "go MD" I can find an attending or resident who says "it doesn't really matter" so let's just consider the fact that it really boils down to what OP wants. I have even heard DO residents say that DO has an advantage because they have MD and DO residencies to choose from which gives them a bigger pool to apply to.

I'm not sure what I want. I have always been raised with the philosophy to strike while the iron is hot; if you're lucky enough to be given an opportunity in life, I am told to take it. My supreme fear is that I would take a gap year, reapply, only to have even less admission success in the cycle than I did this year. And let's say I didn't get into PCOM round 2 because I had rejected their offer a year prior. Then I'd really be screwed. This is exactly what I don't want to happen.

 

[fw5tape6kq]

OP....you called your essay unconventional, which just might mean it's killing you. Have you had an adcom or prehealth advisor look at it? Have you used the volunteer personal statement readers on SDN?

Sometimes what we call innovative in our own heads is insane in the minds of others. Also, it's january...plenty of time for waitlist movement

In retrospect, wish I had had more peer review. I feel my PS was very well written, but perhaps a little vague. I basically negated the idea that I had any one experience to point to that explained my desire to become a physician. As such, there was no "life examples" in the essay. This may have hurt me.

 

[fw5tape6kq]

Most of the DO residents on here usually say waiting a year or two for allopathic is worth it because it will open up more doors for strong residencies in competitive specialties, the Achilles heel of being a DO.

I'm going to say for a person with your stats, wait a year or two and get some clinical experience and volunteering in. However, I hope you've been doing this since you've first noticed it and are hopefully 6+ months into volunteering and anything clinically related. Also, rewrite all your secondaries, essays, and especially your personal statement.

Apply first day that the applications open and include both "low" and "mid" tier schools. Most of the low tier schools probably passed you for your lack of ECs and something in your application didn't fit with what they were looking for. I think you'll have more opportunities if you pad your resume.

I am doing my best to get as much clinical exposure and volunteering accrued in the next six months as possible. However, I was previously unaware that my application was so weak...only realized it over the past few months as the rejections started piling up. I have never had any delusions that I was some sort of supreme medical school candidate, but I thought I would have better luck than I have been having lately.

 

[Bacchus]

I'm not sure what I want. I have always been raised with the philosophy to strike while the iron is hot; if you're lucky enough to be given an opportunity in life, I am told to take it. My supreme fear is that I would take a gap year, reapply, only to have even less admission success in the cycle than I did this year. And let's say I didn't get into PCOM round 2 because I had rejected their offer a year prior. Then I'd really be screwed. This is exactly what I don't want to happen.

It may be best to commit and then possibly change your mind if offered admission at another school.
(I realize I'm changing my tone)

 

[misseskwee]

I'd pick PCOM in a heartbeat. You have it right there in your hand.

As far as I'm concerned, DO = MD. (essentially)

Do well on the COMLEX, and if you want, take the USMLE's too. Just work your butt off for the residency you want. At the hospital, nobody cares about the initials after your name and neither should you. I asked my mom who is an RN to give me a list of DOs in their hospital to shadow and she says she doesn't know who are DO's, they call them all "Dr." I recently discovered that her OB/GYN was a DO and she just said, "Oh really? I didn't know that. Well she's just a great doctor."

The end goal here (at least for me) is to be a good physician, whether that means I have MD or DO at the end of my name.

 

[user3]

I'd pick PCOM in a heartbeat. You have it right there in your hand.

As far as I'm concerned, DO = MD. (essentially)

Do well on the COMLEX, and if you want, take the USMLE's too. Just work your butt off for the residency you want. At the hospital, nobody cares about the initials after your name and neither should you. I asked my mom who is an RN to give me a list of DOs in their hospital to shadow and she says she doesn't know who are DO's, they call them all "Dr." I recently discovered that her OB/GYN was a DO and she just said, "Oh really? I didn't know that. Well she's just a great doctor."

The end goal here (at least for me) is to be a good physician, whether that means I have MD or DO at the end of my name.

Then lets say he goes to PCOM. Then winds up with only 205 on Step I. Only able to match in a handful of specialties for ACGME as a DO (primary care, pathology, pm&r, psychiatry, and neurology I believe), but would be completely fine as a US MD for nearly everything except the surgeries, rad onc, and dermatology.

 

[misseskwee]

Then lets say he goes to PCOM. Then winds up with only 205 on Step I. Only able to match in a handful of specialties for ACGME as a DO (primary care, pathology, pm&r, psychiatry, and neurology I believe), but would be completely fine as a US MD for nearly everything except the surgeries, rad onc, and dermatology.

Which is why OP needs to plan accordingly and know beforehand what he needs to do and what he needs to score for which specialty he wants to match in.
Another scenario is he still won't get into an MD program next year.
There will always be What-Ifs.

OP, everybody has a different preference, as well as a different situation. Everyone here is giving you their personal opinions and advice, but make sure you look at what is best for YOU and what you want to achieve in the long run for yourself.

 

[darklabel]

Which is why OP needs to plan accordingly and know beforehand what he needs to do and what he needs to score for which specialty he wants to match in.
Another scenario is he still won't get into an MD program next year.
There will always be What-Ifs.

OP, everybody has a different preference, as well as a different situation. Everyone here is giving you their personal opinions and advice, but make sure you look at what is best for YOU and what you want to achieve in the long run for yourself.

But there's no negative to trying at least one more year if his true goal is MD (which it is based on his post history). Nothing wrong with that, but he can concurrently apply to DO school at the same time. If he doesn't make it a second time then I'd suggest he go to the DO school that accepted him. He would only be ~23 when he starts school, which is still younger than the average MD matriculant.

Waiting for med school after college isn't a big deal, I took a year off and have no regrets.

 

[wjs010]

Then lets say he goes to PCOM. Then winds up with only 205 on Step I. Only able to match in a handful of specialties for ACGME as a DO (primary care, pathology, pm&r, psychiatry, and neurology I believe), but would be completely fine as a US MD for nearly everything except the surgeries, rad onc, and dermatology.

Then he freakin goes AOA. Lol dear god .

 

[group_theory]

Then lets say he goes to PCOM. Then winds up with only 205 on Step I. Only able to match in a handful of specialties for ACGME as a DO (primary care, pathology, pm&r, psychiatry, and neurology I believe), but would be completely fine as a US MD for nearly everything except the surgeries, rad onc, and dermatology.

A 205 usmle score is pretty uncompetitive, even for US MD. He'll still have trouble with a lot of specialties. Any specialty that is biased against US DOs would also be biased against anyone with a low USMLE score (barely pass, less than 1 standard deviation below the average USMLE score for 2013). For IM, for US MD students, the average USMLE score for those who matched was 226 (for the 2011 match year), while the average score for US MD students who didn't match in IM was 210.

Now would he receive more interview invites if he was a US MD student with a 205 step 1 score compare to if he was a US DO student? Probably but the difference will be small. Programs that would be interested in him would also be interested in the same US DO student.


The difference comes when the same US MD student scores 240 compare to a US DO student scoring 240. There will be more specialities and more programs that will show more interest to that US MD student than the DO student.

 

[user3]

A 205 usmle score is pretty uncompetitive, even for US MD. He'll still have trouble with a lot of specialties. Any specialty that is biased against US DOs would also be biased against anyone with a low USMLE score (barely pass, less than 1 standard deviation below the average USMLE score for 2013). For IM, for US MD students, the average USMLE score for those who matched was 226 (for the 2011 match year), while the average score for US MD students who didn't match in IM was 210.

Now would he receive more interview invites if he was a US MD student with a 205 step 1 score compare to if he was a US DO student? Probably but the difference will be small. Programs that would be interested in him would also be interested in the same US DO student.


The difference comes when the same US MD student scores 240 compare to a US DO student scoring 240. There will be more specialities and more programs that will show more interest to that US MD student than the DO student.

http://b83c73bcf0e7ca356c80-e8560f4...tent/uploads/2013/08/chartingoutcomes2011.pdf

US MD students with 201-210 Step I match rates:
Anesthesiology: 94%
Emergency Medicine: 82%
Radiology: 80%

Would such a high % of DO students be able to match in these specialties with only 205 Step I? I doubt it

 

[Silent Cool]

Then lets say he goes to PCOM. Then winds up with only 205 on Step I. Only able to match in a handful of specialties for ACGME as a DO (primary care, pathology, pm&r, psychiatry, and neurology I believe), but would be completely fine as a US MD for nearly everything except the surgeries, rad onc, and dermatology.

That's exactly right.

 

[Silent Cool]

http://b83c73bcf0e7ca356c80-e8560f4...tent/uploads/2013/08/chartingoutcomes2011.pdf

US MD students with 201-210 Step I match rates:
Anesthesiology: 94%
Emergency Medicine: 82%
Radiology: 80%

Would such a high % of DO students be able to match in these specialties with only 205 Step I? I doubt it

Yup. The bottomline is that if the OP has a bad day and bombs the Step 1 as an MD, the only specialties that are realistically out are Derm, Ortho, ENT, Ophtho, N-surg, RadOnc, and high end IM programs. That's a small percentage of the total residency pack. Even then, I would bet that the OP, as an MD with a weak step 1, could match into some of those fields with additional research, etc.., provided he applies to every ACGME program in the country.

OP, please go MD if you have the choice.

 

[Silent Cool]

I'm not sure what I want. I have always been raised with the philosophy to strike while the iron is hot; if you're lucky enough to be given an opportunity in life, I am told to take it. My supreme fear is that I would take a gap year, reapply, only to have even less admission success in the cycle than I did this year. And let's say I didn't get into PCOM round 2 because I had rejected their offer a year prior. Then I'd really be screwed. This is exactly what I don't want to happen.

I don't think they would know if you denied them or any DO school previously. You could always do something like volunteering for a year and deferring your acceptance. Not rocket science here.

 

[darklabel]

Then he freakin goes AOA. Lol dear god .

But AOA is still pretty competitive for the competitive specialities and with the new rule that the ACGME instituted that Fellowships only accept AOA-trained physicians if they are "extraordinary", I think its in every DO's best interest to say "F U" to the AOA and go into the ACGME match and avoid their nonsense.

 

[pink/\floyd]

If time is not an issue reapply to MD schools and add in a few DO schools next round. Personally, I would reapply because those stats are very competitive! Ask for feedback from schools that rejected you and improve your application accordingly. I have nothing against DO schools and I will be applying to some next year since my MCAT is not a good as yours, however if I get into an MD school I will pick it in a heartbeat. There is nothing wrong in having options.

 

[Postictal Raiden]

But AOA is still pretty competitive for the competitive specialities and with the new rule that the ACGME instituted that Fellowships only accept AOA-trained physicians if they are "extraordinary", I think its in every DO's best interest to say "F U" to the AOA and go into the ACGME match and avoid their nonsense.

I do agree that every DO student should strive to match ACGME residencies. However, saying that doing an AOA residency would prevent one from pursuing an ACGME fellowship is seeing the glass half empty. Many of the AOA residencies are dually accredited. In fact, every single position that was added last year was accredited by both AOA and ACGME. I am aware that someone will reply to my statement with something along the lines of "all dually accredited residencies are at smaller, community programs and that may affect your chances of matching your desired fellowship". My response to this would be that at least for the programs that I know of at least two dually accredited programs that are considered among of the best in the AOA world, Arrowhead and Riverside Regional.

 

[VisualEvolution]

Your friend isn't cutting you any deals, your stats are already good enough to get you into any DO school. His "deal" will only cause you to weaken your relationship with him once you get into a MD program next cycle, assuming you don't get into one this cycle. Trust me, and applicant like you doesn't need to know any faculty members to receive an acceptance. Just find the bug in your application, fix it, and reapply to both MD and DO school next cycle if things don't work out this cycle.

 

[darklabel]

I do agree that every DO student should strive to match ACGME residencies. However, saying that doing an AOA residency would prevent one from pursuing an ACGME fellowship is seeing the glass half empty. Many of the AOA residencies are dually accredited. In fact, every single position that was added last year was accredited by both AOA and ACGME. I am aware that someone will reply to my statement with something along the lines of "all dually accredited residencies are at smaller, community programs and that may affect your chances of matching your desired fellowship". My response to this would be that at least for the programs that I know of at least two dually accredited programs that are considered among of the best in the AOA world, Arrowhead and Riverside Regional.

I agree with you, but the whole Fellowship thing should be a worry for those who go to ONLY AOA specialties. Dually accredited would probably circumvent that right? Since being ACGME certified means you don't have to be considered "exceptional" for a DO student but in line with other MDs.

 

[Postictal Raiden]

I agree with you, but the whole Fellowship thing should be a worry for those who go to ONLY AOA specialties. Dually accredited would probably circumvent that right? Since being ACGME certified means you don't have to be considered "exceptional" for a DO student but in line with other MDs.

The whole thing is up in the air now. I try to be as optimistic as I can be. There's no reason to over stress or worry about things that are years down the road.

I don't deny the fact that MD remain the golden standard. The system has been in place for much longer time than the history of DO. Therefore, no one could argue the fact that MD schools are more established. However, is the "glory" of the MD degree worth delaying one's education by an entire year? This is the debate here.

 

[darklabel]

The whole thing is up in the air now. I try to be as optimistic as I can be. There's no reason to over stress or worry about things that are years down the road.

I don't deny the fact that MD remain the golden standard. The system has been in place for much longer time than the history of DO. Therefore, no one could argue the fact that MD schools are more established. However, is the "glory" of the MD degree worth delaying one's education by an entire year? This is the debate here.

True, but then the debate boils down to what the OP or any person wants. Are they ok with delaying their education a year or two for MD? Ok then, but if they're not then they hopefully are competitive for DO that they can start soon enough. As you said, SDN is always referring to "What if OP wants to do Radiology Oncology or other subspecialties?". Even as person not going to a top MD school, I see ridiculous rankings for specialities like Top 25 MD > Top 50MD > MD > Top 10 DO > DO > IMG etc, so it never really ends. A message board shouldn't stop someone pursing their dream of medicine and only on here do people care if a school can get them into a top 5 residency program or not.

But DO can most likely match people into the specialty of their choice ~ 3 years from now with hard work. For instance, I know you're interested in Surgery and with hard work I know you can be a surgeon in the future.

Now the debate is if OP cares that programs like General Surgery at Hopkins is out of reach as a DO matters to him or not.

 

[ohioguy]

OP, I was in the same situation 2 years ago. Pretty much the same stats with an outcome of 3 unfruitful wait lists. I realized I had weaknesses in my application and flipped them to make them my strengths. I'm now an MS1 at a fantastic MD school. I'd reapply especially if this was your first time filling out a primary.

And it seems like the majority of my class didn't come straight from undergrad or took multiple years off. You'll be in good company.

I got some great advice from an SDN poster about my primary when reapplying. OP, I'd be willing to look yours over if you want.

 

[Dr Yiot]

Definitely shore up your weaknesses and reapply

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Anesthesia

So can you tell us a little about what made you interested in those 3 specifically? Also isn't path really uncompetitive these days?

 

[cliquesh]

So can you tell us a little about what made you interested in those 3 specifically? Also isn't path really uncompetitive these days?

I enjoyed all 3 for different reasons. I guess the underlying theme is less paperwork and not having to deal with non-medical social issues.

I actually liked pathology the best because it's was the most intellectually satisfying speciality for me and there are so many subspeciality areas of pathology ( there's like 20 different fellowships for path). I also liked the routine of pathology. Sit in your comfortable office, drink some coffee, look at some slides, dictate a report, and repeat 20 to 50 times then go home. I didn't pursue it because I was worried about the job market. Pathology is in the middle of the road for competitiveness, at least from a board score point of view. The average step 1 score for path is a 226, which is the same for internal medicine and anesthesia. Top tier programs are competitive, like any top programs.

I liked radiology for similar reasons. I liked the routine, but I thought the material was kind of boring. It was too vague for me. Instead of diagnosing an epithelioid gastrointestial tumor in the stomach, you'd, as a radiologist, just say "a mass measuring 4 x 3 x 3 cm is identified in the anterior wall of the stomach." You might add "suggestive of a GIST," but you'd never know if you're right, unless you looked up the path report later. I also didn't like the pace. Its non-stop work, at least from my limited experience.

I like anesthesia for completely different reasons. Its actually the least intellectually satisfying, but I think it's fun and exciting. Lots of procedures. Helping people when they are the verge of death. Good hours. I also like critical care medicine.

You will find that you like the day to day work for some specialites and completely hate other specialities. I, for instance, could never do any surgical speciality. I just dislike surgery that much.

 

[Back 5]

How's the market for anesthesia? Any reduction in work due to nurse anesthetists? I have read their job market is becoming very saturated.

 

[cliquesh]

How's the market for anesthesia? Any reduction in work due to nurse anesthetists? I have read their job market is becoming very saturated.

Finding a job in major cities can be hard, but that's true for nearly all specialities. I can tell you the peds and cards fellows are getting jobs in the 500k range and the pain fellows are in the 600k range, so it's not the end of the world or anything.

 

[pietachok]

I'm actually surprised that you guys are actually serious about advising the OP to waste a year of his/her future career go to an MD school. Do you guys think that having a DO degree instead of an MD would hinder the OP from pursuing Psychiatry/Neurology/Radiology/Oncology?

OP, take it from me. Go with PCOM and be 200K+ richer. Also, in 2018 you will be called a doctor. To me that's priceless.

Funnily enough, some of us are looking beyond earning potential. Regardless of the field, you have more options/interview if you apply to residency as an MD. More options means you have more say in where you end up, and you are likelier to match somewhere you felt was a good fit. As someone who has been down a career path I hated, I can confidently say that it is worth $200k lifelong earning to spend your residency in a location you like and among people you like. It may not be fair, but even in less competitive fields, there are plenty of programs that are biased against osteopathic applicants.

 

[happypremed1]

Then lets say he goes to PCOM. Then winds up with only 205 on Step I. Only able to match in a handful of specialties for ACGME as a DO (primary care, pathology, pm&r, psychiatry, and neurology I believe), but would be completely fine as a US MD for nearly everything except the surgeries, rad onc, and dermatology.

THIS ^

Know the nature of the beast before you take on it.

 

[happypremed1]

Funnily enough, some of us are looking beyond earning potential. Regardless of the field, you have more options/interview if you apply to residency as an MD. More options means you have more say in where you end up, and you are likelier to match somewhere you felt was a good fit. As someone who has been down a career path I hated, I can confidently say that it is worth $200k lifelong earning to spend your residency in a location you like and among people you like. It may not be fair, but even in less competitive fields, there are plenty of programs that are biased against osteopathic applicants.

One-year gap is nothing in the great scheme of your life a physician. 10 years from now when you look back, that one-year gap might have saved you from burning out.

200k is easy to make up with some gains from prudent investments or passive stream of side business income.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

I enjoyed all 3 for different reasons. I guess the underlying theme is less paperwork and not having to deal with non-medical social issues.

I actually liked pathology the best because it's was the most intellectually satisfying speciality for me and there are so many subspeciality areas of pathology ( there's like 20 different fellowships for path). I also liked the routine of pathology. Sit in your comfortable office, drink some coffee, look at some slides, dictate a report, and repeat 20 to 50 times then go home. I didn't pursue it because I was worried about the job market. Pathology is in the middle of the road for competitiveness, at least from a board score point of view. The average step 1 score for path is a 226, which is the same for internal medicine and anesthesia. Top tier programs are competitive, like any top programs.

I liked radiology for similar reasons. I liked the routine, but I thought the material was kind of boring. It was too vague for me. Instead of diagnosing an epithelioid gastrointestial tumor in the stomach, you'd, as a radiologist, just say "a mass measuring 4 x 3 x 3 cm is identified in the anterior wall of the stomach." You might add "suggestive of a GIST," but you'd never know if you're right, unless you looked up the path report later. I also didn't like the pace. Its non-stop work, at least from my limited experience.

I like anesthesia for completely different reasons. Its actually the least intellectually satisfying, but I think it's fun and exciting. Lots of procedures. Helping people when they are the verge of death. Good hours. I also like critical care medicine.

You will find that you like the day to day work for some specialites and completely hate other specialities. I, for instance, could never do any surgical speciality. I just dislike surgery that much.

So essentially less actual patient interaction and less independent practicing/working with insurances etc?

 

[cliquesh]

So essentially less actual patient interaction and less independent practicing/working with insurances etc?

Thats part of the reason. It's mostly the day to day work, though. Each speciality has a different routine. You'll like some and you'll hate some. I really only liked the day to day work of those 3 specialities. Medicine is a normal job for most people. You try to find something you find tolerable, or enjoyable if your lucky, for the next 40 years.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Thats part of the reason. It's mostly the day to day work, though. Each speciality has a different routine. You'll like some and you'll hate some. I really only liked the day to day work of those 3 specialities.

What was your opinion of psych and neuro as a whole in terms of routine and work?

 

[cliquesh]

What was your opinion of psych and neuro as a whole in terms of routine and work?

I only did inpatient pyschiatry for long term pysch patients. I thought it was cool. You round on the patients in the morning and come up with a very focused plan for the day. Then you have some afternoon therapy sessions. Then you go home. No one improved, though. They were all still severely ill when my month was over.

I only did inpatient neuro. It was basically just consults for strokes and mental status changes. It was okay, I guess. I never really liked neurology as a subject, so i am biased. Neurology is a big field and it has a lot of subspeciality areas. I'm sure some would be fun.

 

[Mad Jack]

But AOA is still pretty competitive for the competitive specialities and with the new rule that the ACGME instituted that Fellowships only accept AOA-trained physicians if they are "extraordinary", I think its in every DO's best interest to say "F U" to the AOA and go into the ACGME match and avoid their nonsense.

If you don't plan on doing a fellowship it isn't a big deal. If you plan on doing a fellowship, AOA is a just plain stupid way to go.

The only things I'd try matching AOA are derm, EM, and ortho. None really require a fellowship to secure a decent position. Other than that, I think the ACGME match is the way to go.

 

[Dr. Zombie]

If you don't plan on doing a fellowship it isn't a big deal. If you plan on doing a fellowship, AOA is a just plain stupid way to go.

The only things I'd try matching AOA are derm, EM, and ortho. None really require a fellowship to secure a decent position. Other than that, I think the ACGME match is the way to go.

Exactly exceptttttt EM though. EM is good through ACGME. Therefore, go ACGME for everything except DOOU (Derm, Ophthalmology, Orthopedics, Urology).

Why is Orthopedics so damn popular anyways?

 

[Mad Jack]

Exactly exceptttttt EM though. EM is good through ACGME. Therefore, go ACGME for everything except DOOU (Derm, Ophthalmology, Orthopedics, Urology).

Why is Orthopedics so damn popular anyways?

There's some solid osteo EM programs. I'd prefer to go ACGME for it, but if you bomb Step 1 and do okay on the COMLEX, AOA EM is better than matching a bottom tier ACGME IM or FP program.

 

[Dr. Zombie]

There's some solid osteo EM programs. I'd prefer to go ACGME for it, but if you bomb Step 1 and do okay on the COMLEX, AOA EM is better than matching a bottom tier ACGME IM or FP program.

Are we obligated to release USMLE scores to AOA?

 

[Mad Jack]

Are we obligated to release USMLE scores to AOA?

I believe so. But the scores you need to be competitive are already so much lower. EM had an average COMLEX of 492. That corresponds to the 39th percentile of students that took the COMLEX, or roughly a 211 on the USMLE Step 1. Independent applicants to ACGME EM programs had an average Step 1 of 218, while MD applicants had an average Step 1 score of 223, corresponding to the 53rd and 61st percentiles, respectively. If you have a marginal Step 1 score, you are a good deal better off trying to match AOA.

 

[cliquesh]

You must report usmle scores to Acgme programs. You do not need to report them to aoa programs.

 

[costales]

Exactly exceptttttt EM though. EM is good through ACGME. Therefore, go ACGME for everything except DOOU (Derm, Ophthalmology, Orthopedics, Urology).

Why is Orthopedics so damn popular anyways?

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/19/health/patients-costs-skyrocket-specialists-incomes-soar.html

The following are median annual compensation by specialty for physicians who are paid by hospitals or health networks.

$920,555
Orthopedic surgery: hip and joint

$820,569
Orthopedic surgery: spine

$707,252
Surgery: neurological

$583,837
Cardiology: invasive-interventional

$516,081
Dermatology: Mohs surgery

$488,200
Gastroenterology

$425,006
Hematology/Oncology

$378,009
Anesthesiology

$345,726
Ophthalmology

$300,000
Obstetrics/Gynecology: General

$264,863
Neurology

$220,000
Internal Medicine: General

$166,754
Pediatrics: child development

Source: Medical Group Management Association

 

[Postictal Raiden]

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/19/health/patients-costs-skyrocket-specialists-incomes-soar.html

The following are median annual compensation by specialty for physicians who are paid by hospitals or health networks.

$920,555
Orthopedic surgery: hip and joint

$820,569
Orthopedic surgery: spine

$707,252
Surgery: neurological

$583,837
Cardiology: invasive-interventional

$516,081
Dermatology: Mohs surgery

$488,200
Gastroenterology

$425,006
Hematology/Oncology

$378,009
Anesthesiology

$345,726
Ophthalmology

$300,000
Obstetrics/Gynecology: General

$264,863
Neurology

$220,000
Internal Medicine: General

$166,754
Pediatrics: child development

Source: Medical Group Management Association

I must say, Ortho looks very healthy.

 

[Dr. Zombie]

You must report usmle scores to Acgme programs. You do not need to report them to aoa programs.

Do we need to report COMLEX scores to ACGME programs?

 

[cliquesh]

Do we need to report COMLEX scores to ACGME programs?

Yes.

 

[Dr. Zombie]

I dont see myself doing surgery. I don't think I have the smarts or the hand skills for it, so thankfully I won't have to worry about it lol.