PDs prefer Female residents over Males?

[Leukocyte]

I am looking at the web sites of the various OB/GYN residency programs, and EVERY program seems to have either:

-A predominence of female residents (10 females with 1 male)

-ALL females (No males at all)

So what is really going on here? Do Ob/Gyn PDs PREFER to have female residents instead of males? This looks more than a coincidence to me?

I am really re-considering my decision to go into Ob/Gyn. I really do not want to be in an enviroment/specilality were I am NOT WELCOME.

Dear residents/soon to be residents, what was your impression during the interviews?

I do not know, but there seems to be a lot of tension regarding gender issues in this speciality. Do you agree?

Thanks.

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[s101]

it has to do with decreasing male apps, not gender discrim.

I am looking at the web sites of the various OB/GYN residency programs, and EVERY program seems to have either:

-A predominence of female residents (10 females with 1 male)

-ALL females (No males at all)

So what is really going on here? Do Ob/Gyn PDs PREFER to have female residents instead of males? This looks more than a coincidence to me?

I am really re-considering my decision to go into Ob/Gyn. I really do not want to be in an enviroment/specilality were I am NOT WELCOME.

Dear residents/soon to be residents, what was your impression during the interviews?

I do not know, but there seems to be a lot of tension regarding gender issues in this speciality. Do you agree?

Thanks.

 

[Leukocyte]

it has to do with decreasing male apps, not gender discrim.

The number of male applicants must be really really really low to have 1 to no male residents in almost every Ob/Gyn program in this country!!!

Call me cray, but something is not adding up here.

 

[s101]

ok. you're crazy. not only are males wanted, they are heavily recruited by every program.

The number of male applicants must be really really really low to have 1 to no male residents in almost every Ob/Gyn program in this country!!!

Call me cray, but something is not adding up here.

 

[neilc]

the vast majority of programs that i have communicated with are actively seeking males. in fact, i have heard that male applicants get interview invites based on gender alone at many programs.

there are really not that many guys out there going for ob/gyn.

 

[calot's 3angle]

yeah, i think it's actually an advantage to be a guy and want to do ob/gyn because there are so few and though i guess the prevailing assumption is that women prefer women ob/gyn's, all of the male resident ob/gyn's i've worked with are really really excellent and patients have always been very happy with their care. i think that there just aren't that many men applying to ob/gyn. i definitely would not think of it as something that turns you away from ob/gyn.

 

[maleob]

I am looking at the web sites of the various OB/GYN residency programs, and EVERY program seems to have either:

-A predominence of female residents (10 females with 1 male)

-ALL females (No males at all)

So what is really going on here? Do Ob/Gyn PDs PREFER to have female residents instead of males? This looks more than a coincidence to me?

I am really re-considering my decision to go into Ob/Gyn. I really do not want to be in an enviroment/specilality were I am NOT WELCOME.

Dear residents/soon to be residents, what was your impression during the interviews?

I do not know, but there seems to be a lot of tension regarding gender issues in this speciality. Do you agree?

Thanks.

The others answered your question perfectly, but I figured I would share my experience.

I had average USMLE scores and I am an US-FMG. I applied to 20 programs and received 19 interviews (I didn’t get Vanderbilt).
While interviewing more than half of the PDs blatantly told me that they wanted male residents, but none apply. I was even told by female residents that too many females in a program can be overwhelming, and they wanted males too.

Basically as a male applicant you can write your own ticket in Ob.
Job offers are also very inviting and lucrative for male Obs.

 

[Leukocyte]

Thank you all for your contributions. Great posts!

 

[DrBuzzLightYear]

sometimes i wonder if this forum is giving me a skewed view of the situation... probably 90% of us are XY's coming to terms with our decision to do OBGYN, so the forum makes it seem like there are a lot more guys going into OBGYN then there really are. but then again, i'm at a solid med school right now and there are 5+ guys going into OBGYN, does this represent a change in the trend of female overrepresentation, or is my school just strange?

 

[minime]

I agree that males can write their own ticket in OB. Almost every PD begged me to come because all of their residents were going on maternity leave.

My medical school class was over 200 and there were only 3 guys who went OB. There were probably 15-20 females who did it. At my residency in my incoming class it is 50/50, so it seems based on what I see that guys are seeing that they are welcome in the field and a few more are going into it than in the past few years.

 

[timtye78]

I am not an OB resdident, but I rotated with an excellent private practice OBGYN male MD who told me that "going into OB as a male these days is the worst decision a guy could make." Before everybody slices me to pieces, saying that this is only one person's perspective (I agree), EVERY male OBGYN doc I have ever rotated with told me that the general trend is "Females as a group prefer female OBGYN."
Why?--because they CAN.

This particular MD told me that his solution to this problem he decided was to "go to a small town where they were just happy to get ANYONE." This didn't work out, he's stayed in a larger metro area, but moans about how light his load is compared to the female docs. This guy doesn't seem to have any technical or personality problems that I could see.

Now, my best friend in medical school is a guy, and he is completing his OBGYN intern year now at Indiana Univ. He tells me that he's hearing this:
"If you want a busy practice as a male obgyn, stay in academics/large univ med center, If you don't want a busy practice, go into private practice."

However, even at large university setting, he still has to deal with even indigents demanding a female physician EVERY DAY. Seems like unfriendly territory to me!

Food for thought.

 

[Leukocyte]

"going into OB as a male these days is the worst decision a guy could make.".....EVERY male OBGYN doc I have ever rotated with told me that the general trend is "Females as a group prefer female OBGYN."

........

However, even at large university setting, he still has to deal with even indigents demanding a female physician EVERY DAY. Seems like unfriendly territory to me!

Food for thought.

Seems like you are not the only one who thinks that going into OB/GYN as a male is a bad idea.....

A survey of male ob/gyns by Duke University seem to confirm my fears (read pages 11 to 15).......

http://www.smbs.buffalo.edu/RESIDENT/CareerCounseling/pdf/Obstetrics_Gynecology.pdf

 

[neilc]

in my home town, it is about 50/50 male to female ob/gyn. the males are by far the more busy of the groups...

you will hear people bitch and moan about everything under the sun in all specialties. it is your life, and you will make of it what you want. if you want to be busy, and you are nice, intelligent, have good results, and are available, you will get more patients than you can handle. if you sit back, expect the patients to come knocking down your door, don't actively make your opportunities happen, you can expect to have a lot of down time. this is true in all specialties!

 

[Celiac Plexus]

there is a reason why marginal male applicants are being courted by name residency programs....

graduating male ob/gyn chiefs will far worse in job-hunting. when i was a med student there weere 2 guy chiefs and 2 female chiefs. the women both had solid offers in major mettro areas, as well as the standard rural offers. the guys had z.e.r.o. metro offers between them, and only a handful of rural offers. both guys told me that males, although desirable for residency prgram directors, were highly undesirable in the ob/gyn new-hire market. this seemed to demoralize them somewhat, and they told every guy on the service to avoid ob/gyn as a career choice (then again so did most of the female residents...) unfortunately this trend is not limited to one area of the us because it is the same story at my residency university, and at other places...

in fact one of my (female) attendings in med school who trained at a world-class ob/gyn program, that even the guys graduating there were offered 20-30% less compensation that the women.

consider that you will also have to deal with patients passing you over simply because you are a man, and one can understand why practically no men are going into ob/gyn these days... not to mention all of the other downsides of the field today.

if you are truly a diehard though, and you can't think of anything else to do, don't mind making significantly less money because you are a man, then by all means go for it.

best of luck.

 

[neilc]

Do women prefer female obstetricians?
Obstet Gynecol 2002 Jun;99(6):1031-5 (ISSN: 0029-7844)
Howell EA; Gardiner B; Concato J
Department of Obstetrics and Gynecology, Mount Sinai Medical Center, New York, New York 10029-6574, USA. [email protected].
OBJECTIVE: To investigate gender preferences for obstetricians in a hospital setting and to examine its relationship to patient satisfaction. METHODS: Using methods of qualitative analysis, we interviewed a convenience sample of 67 obstetric patients during their postpartum hospital stay, asking open-ended questions about gender preferences of health care providers and satisfaction with health care. RESULTS: Overall, 58% of patients (n = 39) had no preference for physician gender, 34% (n = 23) preferred female physicians, and 7% (n = 5) preferred male physicians. Physicians' interpersonal style, communication style, and technical expertise were considered important characteristics by patients. Although most patients had no preference for physician gender, the majority of patients preferred a female nurse. Patient satisfaction scores were not associated with physician gender. CONCLUSION: Our study found that a majority of women did not prefer a female obstetrician. Our results suggest that physician gender is less important to patients than other physician characteristics.
Comment In: Comment In: RefSource:Obstet Gynecol. 2002 Oct; 100(4):827-8; author reply

 

[neilc]

It ain't necessarily so: most women do not strongly prefer female obstetrician-gynaecologists.
J Obstet Gynaecol Can 2002 Nov;24(11):885-8 (ISSN: 1701-2163)
Fisher WA; Bryan A; Dervaitis KL; Silcox J; Kohn H
Department of Obstetrics and Gynaecology, University of Western Ontario, London, ON, Canada.
OBJECTIVE: To examine whether Canadian women seeking care from obstetrician-gynaecologists prefer to see female or male physicians or have no strong preference in this regard. METHODS: A self-administered questionnaire assessing women's "strong preference" for female or male obstetrician-gynaecologists, or their lack of a strong preference in this area, was completed by 409 women (93.8% response rate) attending two hospital-based obstetrics and gynaecology outpatient clinics in London, Ontario. RESULTS: Overall, 75% of women stated that they had no strong preference concerning the gender of their obstetrician-gynaecologist; 21% strongly preferred a female obstetrician-gynaecologist; and 4% strongly preferred a male obstetrician-gynaecologist. Women who were single, pregnant, or had a history of abortion, sexual coercion, relationship violence, sexual dysfunction, or sexually transmitted disease were no more likely to prefer to see a female obstetrician-gynaecologist than were women without these characteristics. CONCLUSION: A clear majority of women expressed no strong preference for the gender of their obstetrician-gynaecologist, and preference for a female obstetrician-gynaecologist was not associated with a history of sensitive gender-related medical concerns. Nationally representative research is needed to clarify women's preferences in this domain across the regions of Canada and to determine the strength and correlates of any such preferences. Patient care and human rights implications of women's preference for the gender of their obstetrician-gynaecologist will need to be carefully considered as well.

 

[Leukocyte]

Thanks Neilc!

 

[neilc]

i could find no salary data describing any real difference between male and female providers. however, given that billing would be the same, it holds to reason that a busy male provider would make as much as a busy female provider.

perhaps some current male residents could share there personal experience with job offers and salary, especially as compared to the females in the program_?

i am not overly impressed with the anecdotal evidence, because i have heard so many different stories from so many different students, residents and attendings. what the real bottom line seems to come down to, is are you busy? if you are, you make money...and, while there may be a preference in some instances, parts of the world or whatever for a female ob-gyn, the evidence simply does not bear that out as a universal truth. and, in the regions i have looked into, they are looking for ANY ob-gyn, and happy to pay a guy to show up and work.

 

[Celiac Plexus]

i could find no salary data describing any real difference between male and female providers. however, given that billing would be the same, it holds to reason that a busy male provider would make as much as a busy female provider.

perhaps some current male residents could share there personal experience with job offers and salary, especially as compared to the females in the program_?

i am not overly impressed with the anecdotal evidence, because i have heard so many different stories from so many different students, residents and attendings. what the real bottom line seems to come down to, is are you busy? if you are, you make money...and, while there may be a preference in some instances, parts of the world or whatever for a female ob-gyn, the evidence simply does not bear that out as a universal truth. and, in the regions i have looked into, they are looking for ANY ob-gyn, and happy to pay a guy to show up and work.

i posted regarding the new-hire market. these are the first jobs that you will be offered out of residency. if you manage to be a busy ob/gyn then conceivably you will make as much as your female peers. but initially, you will be less desirable as a male to established practices.

further, it's not just reimbursement per se, but location as well. the most desirable locations are already competitve markets. as a male, you will be at an even greater disadvantage if you wish to practice in a remotely desirable location. of course, if you are satisfied working in a less desirable location, then this may be less of a concern for you. for many people, this is a big concern.

do women prefer female gyns? well, yes. there are many women (especially younger women) who do (regardless of what one study found), and the fact that women regularly request to be seen by a female physician is disheartening from my male perspective. in my third year med school rotation, this happened on a daily basis. if you don't mind having your training in this setting, then have fun. to many male residents, this is disheartening, and i believe it negatively impacts your training.

furthermore, many states (maybe all) have laws about having a female chaperone in the room whenever a male gyn examines a woman. though, even if there was no requirement for this, it is an excellent idea to protect the male physician/resident from a lawsuit. to many males, this is a poor construct, and is, yes, disheartening.

the malpractice climate is also the worst of medical specialties. although i don't think this should stop the dedicated ob/gyn hopeful from becoming an ob/gyn, it is another down side to the profession. in many places in florida the rate is over 200k/yr. every year, some of the top 10 civil suit settlements are ob/gyn cases.

all of these things add up to a discouraging picture for most male us med students. this is evidenced by the low number of us male seniors going into ob/gyn. this is good only if you're a male applying for an ob/gyn residency, because regardless of your qualifications, you will get strong consideration from programs.

either way, best of luck with your career choice.

 

[neilc]

i posted regarding the new-hire market. these are the first jobs that you will be offered out of residency. if you manage to be a busy ob/gyn then conceivably you will make as much as your female peers. but initially, you will be less desirable as a male to established practices.

further, it's not just reimbursement per se, but location as well. the most desirable locations are already competitve markets. as a male, you will be at an even greater disadvantage if you wish to practice in a remotely desirable location. of course, if you are satisfied working in a less desirable location, then this may be less of a concern for you. for many people, this is a big concern.

do women prefer female gyns? well, yes. there are many women (especially younger women) who do (regardless of what one study found), and the fact that women regularly request to be seen by a female physician is disheartening from my male perspective. in my third year med school rotation, this happened on a daily basis. if you don't mind having your training in this setting, then have fun. to many male residents, this is disheartening, and i believe it negatively impacts your training.

furthermore, many states (maybe all) have laws about having a female chaperone in the room whenever a male gyn examines a woman. though, even if there was no requirement for this, it is an excellent idea to protect the male physician/resident from a lawsuit. to many males, this is a poor construct, and is, yes, disheartening.

the malpractice climate is also the worst of medical specialties. although i don't think this should stop the dedicated ob/gyn hopeful from becoming an ob/gyn, it is another down side to the profession. in many places in florida the rate is over 200k/yr. every year, some of the top 10 civil suit settlements are ob/gyn cases.

all of these things add up to a discouraging picture for most male us med students. this is evidenced by the low number of us male seniors going into ob/gyn. this is good only if you're a male applying for an ob/gyn residency, because regardless of your qualifications, you will get strong consideration from programs.

either way, best of luck with your career choice.

1) again, if you can show some data that support the statement that men have a harder time finding jobs in competitive markets. i know what you have stated is your experience...but, in my experience far more men have an abundance of offers for a variety of reasons (ie; men tend to work longer (per week and to retirement), they don't get pregnant, etc..). these reasons seem to offset the fact that some women prefer female practioners

2) i posted 2 studies (not one) and if you do a medline search you will come up with far more. the few articles i saw that stated there was a female preference were case studies. the literature seem to support the position that if a preference exists, it is very small.

3) all practitioners (male or female) in the hospitals that i have rotated in have had chaperones. it is not very good practice to do any sensitive exam without a chaperone, plus it is handy to have a nurse to assist you. so, i don't see how this is disheartening, or bad practice, or bad news for the men

4) ob/gyn is horrible in terms of malpractice. however, so are many specialties (including GS, neurosurg, anesthesia, etc...). currently, it is an issue that needs to be dealt with. i am cautiously optimistic about the future, simply because of the law of supply and demand...less obs practicing due to high insurance costs will require some sort of change. while i am not completely confident that the government can and/or will do something to eliminate the problem, i do see that there will be a need to reign in the costs and liability in the future


while ob/gyn is certainly not for everyone, it is not the death trap that many make it out to be. you can find people in every specialty to claim the sky is falling, that it is impossible to make a living or find patients, etc....but, while there certainly may be some truth to these statements, in my opinion they are blown way out of proportion.

perhaps i have been fortunate to see only the good side of ob/gyn? i don't think so, because i heard the same horror stories in most clinics and hospitals. but, i also heard these stories in IM, GS, peds, FP, etc...the real truth is different for each of us, of course. but, there are PLENTY of excellent opportunities for males to build a large and prosperous practice, all over the country right now.

 

[Celiac Plexus]

1) again, if you can show some data that support the statement that men have a harder time finding jobs in competitive markets. i know what you have stated is your experience...but, in my experience far more men have an abundance of offers for a variety of reasons (ie; men tend to work longer (per week and to retirement), they don't get pregnant, etc..). these reasons seem to offset the fact that some women prefer female practioners

2) i posted 2 studies (not one) and if you do a medline search you will come up with far more. the few articles i saw that stated there was a female preference were case studies. the literature seem to support the position that if a preference exists, it is very small.

3) all practitioners (male or female) in the hospitals that i have rotated in have had chaperones. it is not very good practice to do any sensitive exam without a chaperone, plus it is handy to have a nurse to assist you. so, i don't see how this is disheartening, or bad practice, or bad news for the men

4) ob/gyn is horrible in terms of malpractice. however, so are many specialties (including GS, neurosurg, anesthesia, etc...). currently, it is an issue that needs to be dealt with. i am cautiously optimistic about the future, simply because of the law of supply and demand...less obs practicing due to high insurance costs will require some sort of change. while i am not completely confident that the government can and/or will do something to eliminate the problem, i do see that there will be a need to reign in the costs and liability in the future


while ob/gyn is certainly not for everyone, it is not the death trap that many make it out to be. you can find people in every specialty to claim the sky is falling, that it is impossible to make a living or find patients, etc....but, while there certainly may be some truth to these statements, in my opinion they are blown way out of proportion.

perhaps i have been fortunate to see only the good side of ob/gyn? i don't think so, because i heard the same horror stories in most clinics and hospitals. but, i also heard these stories in IM, GS, peds, FP, etc...the real truth is different for each of us, of course. but, there are PLENTY of excellent opportunities for males to build a large and prosperous practice, all over the country right now.

neilc: best of luck in your career.

to other male us seniors considering ob/gyn: carefully consider the choice. there are a lot of residencies to choose from.

 

[neilc]

neilc: best of luck in your career.

to other male us seniors considering ob/gyn: carefully consider the choice. there are a lot of residencies to choose from.

thanks a lot...and, the advice to carefully consider the choice of residency applies to EVERYONE....your residency trains you for what you will do the rest of your life, and it is not a decision to be made by flipping a coin...find your own personal perspective of each, look at the real data, talk to a wide variety of attendings and residents, and look specifically at the part of the world you want to wind up in. all of these things can help guide you-but, at the end of the day, you want to enjoy (at least as much as you can) what you will do for the greater part of the rest of your life.

best of luck to all!

 

[jvarga]

Fortunately, for every misguided pariticipant in these forums, there are several of us who first handedly know the real state of affairs. Thank you Neilc for helping out in stopping the dissemination of misguided information when it comes to this forum.

Addressing the various issues raised by this thread would take entirely too much time! As such, I will only touch on a couple of points which I feel need to be reiterated:

1. Any person who states that males have no future in ob/gyn is flat out looney. To say or even believe this, one has to be incredibly short sighted. Just consider the numbers: today, many if not most "established" gyns are male and most gyn residents are females. Logically, the job market today for male residents will be at a slight disadvantage when compared to female residents as the "established" gyns attempt to diversify. Despite this slight disadvantage, the market for male gyns is still good (luckily for me, many metropolitan areas have not received the same memo that celiac plexus has gotten, as I have been actively courted by several practices in metropolitan areas that are seeking males only). As time inevitably progresses and as more of the "established" male gyns retire for one reason or another, the field will inevitably become predominantly female. Following the basic supply and demand concept, the male gyn market (a little less than half the female population, despite celiac's anecdotal evidence) will be underserved and, logically, male gyns will again be at an advantage when it comes to job availability.

2. Most programs are actively recruiting medical students (especially males) as part of a nationwide effort encouraged by ACOG. This does not mean that you are guaranteed a spot during the match if you are male, but does make it a little bit less competitive. If you have an interest or love of ob/gyn, now is the time to pursue!

3. Any person, male or female, who performs a breast or pelvic exam without a chaperone is setting themselves up for a nice lawsuit. In most hospitals nowadays, this would actually be a violation of policy. Look into your hospital's policy before you wish to examine by yourself, and good luck to you if you do!

4. Be careful who you talk to...there are numerous miserable doctors out there, regardless of specialty, who would gladly talk any one out of pursuing their particular field. Although, one has to wonder, if they were really as miserble as they act, why do they continue to practice? Hhhmmm! Most of these docs to me seem like pathologic attention seekers straight from the DSM IV! Oh, woe is me!

5. The malpractice situation has been pretty much beaten to death and everybody seems to agree that gyns get the shaft when it comes to lawsuits. No argument here, although neilc does make a good point to mention that we are not alone in the prestigious category of "high risk" (legal not medical) specialties. Definitely food for thought when making that residency decision. Remember that the situation will get better. Just think, do you buy stocks when they are at their peak or their nadir?

Well, I have officially run out of time. Hope this helped!

 

[sakura181]

As a woman, I can say that I personally have no preference in gender when it comes to my gynecologist. What I do prefer is a doctor I am comfortable with and who I feel respects me as both a patient and a woman, which in my experience both male and female doctors have done. Those are the doctors who I think make the best OBGYNs.

The abstracts showing gender non-preference amongst women were interesting but not very surprising to me. Most women I know feel the same way. BUT these studies don't seem to take into account other reasons involved in preference - there may also be cultural reasons.

Though I have not started medical school (I will be starting in the fall) and don't have the experience of OBGYN rotations as so many of you posting have, I currently work in an OBGYN clinic with all women practitioners. Many of our patients, especially those of Chinese and Indian backgrounds, come to our office because their husbands don't want male doctors to examine/deliver their wives. With an all-female practice, they don't have to worry about a male doctor being on-call and potentially treating their wives. I feel like OB, more so than other specialities, is one that involves not only the patient but also their partner/spouse. There are some extreme husbands who even refuse referrals for their wives to see any male specialist.

I hope this doesn't discourage you all and other men from pursuing OBGYN, but it is something to consider. The most passionate advocate of women's health I've ever met has been a man and I hope he doesn't change his decision to pursue OBGYN b/c of the current "male unfriendliness" of the field. But in my opinion, with all of the docs in my clinic strongly urging me not to go into OB, this field seems to be unfriendly to and difficult for both genders.

 

[Leukocyte]

... their husbands don't want male doctors to examine/deliver their wives. With an all-female practice, they don't have to worry about a male doctor being on-call and potentially treating their wives. I feel like OB, more so than other specialities, is one that involves not only the patient but also their partner/spouse. There are some extreme husbands who even refuse referrals for their wives to see any male specialist.

WTF!!!!!!

Husbands do not have the right to decide who their wives see or do not see. They are not children.

Health-care is a private matter. They should make their own choices!

Hey "Extreme husbands",.....Fu*k You.

And Yeah....Don't you DARE go to a FEMALE urologist when your pathetic little "fireman" is burning. Because you never know, she might fall in love with you and give you Filthy Sanchez you dumb F*cks.

 

[maleob]

there is a reason why marginal male applicants are being courted by name residency programs....

graduating male ob/gyn chiefs will far worse in job-hunting. when i was a med student there weere 2 guy chiefs and 2 female chiefs. the women both had solid offers in major mettro areas, as well as the standard rural offers. the guys had z.e.r.o. metro offers between them, and only a handful of rural offers. both guys told me that males, although desirable for residency prgram directors, were highly undesirable in the ob/gyn new-hire market. this seemed to demoralize them somewhat, and they told every guy on the service to avoid ob/gyn as a career choice (then again so did most of the female residents...) unfortunately this trend is not limited to one area of the us because it is the same story at my residency university, and at other places...

in fact one of my (female) attendings in med school who trained at a world-class ob/gyn program, that even the guys graduating there were offered 20-30% less compensation that the women.

consider that you will also have to deal with patients passing you over simply because you are a man, and one can understand why practically no men are going into ob/gyn these days... not to mention all of the other downsides of the field today.

if you are truly a diehard though, and you can't think of anything else to do, don't mind making significantly less money because you are a man, then by all means go for it.

best of luck.

When I read some of the posts on this forum I wonder if some people are trying to revive the theory "if you say enough unfounded negative thoughts then maybe you can convince others".
In the late 90's a very organized national group of Anesthesiologists started to come up with several negative aspects in their field. A memo was discovered from this group to several docs
stating that if medical students stopped going into gas than the demand for gas docs would rise. With a rise in demand you get a rise in mucho dinero.
It seemed to work for them so I wonder if some of these "students" are subconsciously doing the same. Most of the posts are just pessimistic opinions with no facts to back them up.
Well hopefully it does work because I do have several loans to pay off , because I will continue to be a maleOb.

 

[Celiac Plexus]

3) all practitioners (male or female) in the hospitals that i have rotated in have had chaperones. it is not very good practice to do any sensitive exam without a chaperone, plus it is handy to have a nurse to assist you. so, i don't see how this is disheartening, or bad practice, or bad news for the men

there are at least 4 states that i know of that allow female ob/gyns to examine patients without a chaperone, but require a male ob/gyn to have a chaperone.

to all the random, undecided, male u.s. seniors visiting this forum. get all the facts you can from the residents, and attendings at your own institution. try to answer the question: why are so few people going into ob/gyn today? (less u.s. seniors applying for the field than there are first year training spaces available) why are so few men going into ob/gyn? just focus on getting the answers to these 2 questions, and that will help you make any decision about the field. there are many residency choices available, best to really explore all of your options.

 

[neilc]

there are at least 4 states that i know of that allow female ob/gyns to examine patients without a chaperone, but require a male ob/gyn to have a chaperone.

to all the random, undecided, male u.s. seniors visiting this forum. get all the facts you can from the residents, and attendings at your own institution. try to answer the question: why are so few people going into ob/gyn today? (less u.s. seniors applying for the field than there are first year training spaces available) why are so few men going into ob/gyn? just focus on getting the answers to these 2 questions, and that will help you make any decision about the field. there are many residency choices available, best to really explore all of your options.

state law does not dictate good medical practice. it is smart for all docs, regardless of their gender and regardless of patient gender, to have a chaperone in the room for sensitive exams.

and, there are prob lots of reasons for folks not going into ob/gyn, especially males. but, it seems that misinformation is also out there and playing a role.

it is a great idea to get good, accurate info before choosing a field. but, you also have to make sure that it is as accurate and unbiased as you can get. it sounds to me like celiac is sure ob/gyn is bad, but he is basing this on purely anecdotal evidence. ask the recruiters what salaries you can expect. ask the graduating residents what kind of offers they are getting. ask practicing docs if they are making what their female counterparts are...

i think that the rumors are far, far worse than the reality

 

[juddson]

1. Any person who states that males have no future in ob/gyn is flat out looney. To say or even believe this, one has to be incredibly short sighted. Just consider the numbers: today, many if not most "established" gyns are male and most gyn residents are females. Logically, the job market today for male residents will be at a slight disadvantage when compared to female residents as the "established" gyns attempt to diversify. Despite this slight disadvantage, the market for male gyns is still good (luckily for me, many metropolitan areas have not received the same memo that celiac plexus has gotten, as I have been actively courted by several practices in metropolitan areas that are seeking males only). As time inevitably progresses and as more of the "established" male gyns retire for one reason or another, the field will inevitably become predominantly female. Following the basic supply and demand concept, the male gyn market (a little less than half the female population, despite celiac's anecdotal evidence) will be underserved and, logically, male gyns will again be at an advantage when it comes to job availability.
!

As a male med student interested in OB/GYN I have ben following these sorts of threads closely. And as much as I want to believe everything that jvarga says, It seems to me that the reasoning set forth above is probably wrong. As he admits (and I agree with) no doubt over the next 20 years, as the established OB/GYNs (who are mostly male) retire, the field will be taken over almost entirely by female docs. These docs will be the ONLY OB/GYNS that the younger generation of patients are going to see going forward. Doesn't it stand to reason that these patients (ie., all new patients) will increasing prefer female docs? After all, the current studies posted by NeilC include patient groups who largely "grew up" with male docs as these were by and large the only docs available. It's no wonder a 55 year old patient doesn't mind seeing a male OB/GYN when she's been seeing one for 30 years. But what of the younger patients who have had a choice from day one. What preference (if any) do they have?

My guess is that going forward, as the percentage of OB/GYNs increases, the percentage of women who prefer them will also increasing, starting with the younger generation and continuing with each successive one.

Just a thought.

Judd

 

[timtye78]

I would like to agree with most of the people here in that as a med student evaluating a field, the best way to find a fit is a very personal one. I think some people choose a field out of natural and very idealistic mindsets, and there isn't anything wrong with that. I tried to ask every doc I met how happy they were with their choice in retrospect, since it is common to discover nuances or even big differences after being in the field for several if not many years. Every bit of advice you get will be really a small representative sample, and personal opinions abound. That being said, it is valid as well to take a hard look at every field, and ask the questions, where is this specialty headed, can I handle these changes, can I handle the patient population or even better do I love this pt population?

Remember:There may be reasons why certain specialists aren't happy in their fields. Recommendation: Ask them why or why not. Do these issues pose any problem for you? If not, go after it! If you love the OBGYN field and are a man, by all means don't let us pessimists change your mind-but don't say later we didn't warn you j/k

 

[neilc]

As a male med student interested in OB/GYN I have ben following these sorts of threads closely. And as much as I want to believe everything that jvarga says, It seems to me that the reasoning set forth above is probably wrong. As he admits (and I agree with) no doubt over the next 20 years, as the established OB/GYNs (who are mostly male) retire, the field will be taken over almost entirely by female docs. These docs will be the ONLY OB/GYNS that the younger generation of patients are going to see going forward. Doesn't it stand to reason that these patients (ie., all new patients) will increasing prefer female docs? After all, the current studies posted by NeilC include patient groups who largely "grew up" with male docs as these were by and large the only docs available. It's no wonder a 55 year old patient doesn't mind seeing a male OB/GYN when she's been seeing one for 30 years. But what of the younger patients who have had a choice from day one. What preference (if any) do they have?

My guess is that going forward, as the percentage of OB/GYNs increases, the percentage of women who prefer them will also increasing, starting with the younger generation and continuing with each successive one.

Just a thought.

Judd

here is a more recent study, in the april journal...it does acknowledge your point about younger patients having a higher potential to prefer female doctors, but i still think that the numbers are far from discouraging. just based on the fact that there will be so few males in the field in the future, and the fact that more than half of the women currently have no preference or prefer males..even if that drops a lot, there will still likely be lots of work for us males.

Obstetrics & Gynecology
April 2005 ( Volume 105, Number 4 )

Patient Gender Preferences in a Large Military Teaching Hospital
Lund JD, Rohrer JE, Goldfarb S
Obstetrics & Gynecology. 2005; 105 (4) : 747-750
Medicine is a field that is redefined on a continuous basis. This is no more apparent than with regard to the gender of practicing physicians. Continuously increasing numbers of women are entering what was once a highly male-dominated field. The entire face of gynecology has been changing, with women representing the majority of new recruits in the past several years. In gynecology in particular, this change may have significant impact on the delivery of care as many women may have gender preferences for their provider. Indeed, several studies have demonstrated a preference for female gynecologic providers in the past several years.[1-3]

Since patient preference frequently drives the healthcare market, implications of patient preference studies may help to dictate recruitment in gynecologic practices. Additionally, this will help physicians be more sensitive to the needs of their patients by understanding the importance that gender may play.

In this study by Dr. Lund and colleagues, patients in a large California military teaching hospital administered a questionnaire regarding patient preferences for female providers; 1544 obstetric and gynecologic patients responded over a 2-month period. Of the respondents, 60% reported no provider gender preference or preferred a male. The subgroup analysis revealed a female gender preference among Asians, Pacific Islanders, Native American women, junior officers, and wives and daughters of service members.

This study is unique because of the large number of patients that were polled. The results are significant for showing that the majority of women do not have gender preferences. However, the external validity of this study is questionable as it involved a very specific group of individuals and a specific geographic area. Whether preferences among a military hospital differ greatly from civilian hospitals is difficult to assess. The fact that they provide services to family members of military personnel helps to support the potential extrapolation to the general population.

Of critical importance in this study was the demonstration of specific preferences among certain ethnicities. These results should be used to help guide the care of these patients that present for care and may be embarrassed to express their gender preferences. They also noted that there was a gender preference trend among junior officers, which possibly suggests that younger and more educated patients may desire female providers. The authors comment that they cannot determine whether this is a general trend or specific to their group.

This study provides some insight into the gender preferences of women seeking gynecologic care. Although the majority of women do not have a female preference, this is something that should potentially be accounted for. Additionally, attempts should be made to provide women with their preferences when feasible, and physicians should be sensitive to their patients' wishes in this regard.

References
Ekeroma A, Harilal M. Women's choice in the gender and ethnicity of her obstetrician and gynaecologist. Aust N ZJ Obstet Gynaecol. 2003;43:354-359.
Plunkett BA, Kohli P, Milad MP. The importance of physician gender in the selection of an obstetrician or a gynecologist. Am J Obstet Gynecol. 2002;186:926-928.
Howell EA, Gardiner B, Concato J. Do women prefer female obstetricians? Obstet Gynecol. 2002;99:1031-1035.


Abstract