Pharmacy Residency after break

[tmac01]

Hi everyone I wanted to know what you guys thought my chances of getting a PGY1 residency after being out of pharmacy school for an entire year and no pharmacy work experience.

During my last year of pharmacy school I took a heavy load of clinical rotations such as cardiology, infectious disease, medication errors, clinical studies and I did fairly well in most of them.

My GPA is average but I dont have anything other than that to put on my CV.

I was wondering if I had a chance to get into a residency and what things I could do now to improve my CV. I have searched everywhere for volunteer opportunities but could not find any. I am working at the moment but not in pharmacy and I have not been searching for pharmacy related work yet because of personal problems I expect to be cleared by the time I plan to apply for residencies in Dec. 2013.

Anyway if you guys could please offer an honest opinion I would greatly appreciate it.

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[zelman]

Sounds like a tough sell. Maybe join your state pharmacists association or something to show involvement?

 

[Kenzi11611]

Can you find a per diem job or a part time pharmacy position? I would think being a year out of school with no continued pharmacy experience, you'd be perceived as "rusty" compared to other applicants. I know at least personally "use or lose it" applies to me.

 

[zelman]

Can you find a per diem job or a part time pharmacy position? I would think being a year out of school with no continued pharmacy experience, you'd be perceived as "rusty" compared to other applicants. I know at least personally "use or lose it" applies to me.

Probably not. I haven't found one within 50 miles in the last year. The economy is problematic at the moment.

 

[pillpharmer]

Hi everyone I wanted to know what you guys thought my chances of getting a PGY1 residency after being out of pharmacy school for an entire year and no pharmacy work experience.

During my last year of pharmacy school I took a heavy load of clinical rotations such as cardiology, infectious disease, medication errors, clinical studies and I did fairly well in most of them.

My GPA is average but I dont have anything other than that to put on my CV.

I was wondering if I had a chance to get into a residency and what things I could do now to improve my CV. I have searched everywhere for volunteer opportunities but could not find any. I am working at the moment but not in pharmacy and I have not been searching for pharmacy related work yet because of personal problems I expect to be cleared by the time I plan to apply for residencies in Dec. 2013.

Anyway if you guys could please offer an honest opinion I would greatly appreciate it.

You graduated a year ago from pharmacy school and haven't been able to find a job? Dear god...that's terrifying to me... I hope something comes your way.

 

[Rattlergirl53]

I'll let you know how it goes for me come match day. I graduated last year in 2012 applied this year and I got 7 interviews. I only had very minimal work experience at CVS as a pharmacist. I too also had personal issues that prevented me from applying last year.

Go for it just apply to a variety of programs not just big name teaching universities. They tend to favor the traditional applicant.

 

[Kenzi11611]

Probably not. I haven't found one within 50 miles in the last year. The economy is problematic at the moment.

I know the market is tough around here too. I'm staring down possible unemployment if the Match doesn't go my way (the company I've been interning with for 3.5 years only hired 2 interns and no one else wants to hire anyone either).

 

[tmac01]

What is considered a minimal applicant that may get accepted into residency?... As far as rotations, extracurricular activities, and GPA.

 

[tmac01]

I was also wondering where i can go to take part in journal clubs in my home city that may not be associated with a school or professional organization.

 

[zelman]

What is considered a minimal applicant that may get accepted into residency?... As far as rotations, extracurricular activities, and GPA.

Well, I've got a 3.73 GPA on a 4.0 scale, involved in residence life for 3 years, orientation for 2 years, student newspaper for 4 years, student government for 3 years, Doctor of Pharmacy degree in 2010, MS in Applied Pharmacoeconomics in 2012, licensed pharmacist in 2 states, 14 years of retail experience, 1 year of internship with VA clinical pharmacy dept.

That all added up to zero interviews before the match last year (11 applications), and two this year (16 applications). It's tough when you aren't the typical P4 applicant.

 

[Rattlergirl53]

Well, I've got a 3.73 GPA on a 4.0 scale, involved in residence life for 3 years, orientation for 2 years, student newspaper for 4 years, student government for 3 years, Doctor of Pharmacy degree in 2010, MS in Applied Pharmacoeconomics in 2012, licensed pharmacist in 2 states, 14 years of retail experience, 1 year of internship with VA clinical pharmacy dept.

That all added up to zero interviews before the match last year (11 applications), and two this year (16 applications). It's tough when you aren't the typical P4 applicant.

Wow I don't have half your stats but I got a good number of interviews. Do you think it's the programs you applied too? You do not seem like a bad candidate the fact that you got 2 interviews is shocking to me and pretty messed up if they're holding it against you for graduating in 2010.

I know a few programs did act like it was the end of the world and such a big deal that I graduated last year like I've been out of pharmacy for years when in actuality I was just studying for boards a few months ago. I just wrote them off. Some programs want only the traditional applicant but they're are many that don't think that way.

 

[Skrumpy]

Well, I've got a 3.73 GPA on a 4.0 scale, involved in residence life for 3 years, orientation for 2 years, student newspaper for 4 years, student government for 3 years, Doctor of Pharmacy degree in 2010, MS in Applied Pharmacoeconomics in 2012, licensed pharmacist in 2 states, 14 years of retail experience, 1 year of internship with VA clinical pharmacy dept.

That all added up to zero interviews before the match last year (11 applications), and two this year (16 applications). It's tough when you aren't the typical P4 applicant.

Holy crap.. what is the "typical P4 applicant"? Where did you graduate from?

 

[Skrumpy]

I know the market is tough around here too. I'm staring down possible unemployment if the Match doesn't go my way (the company I've been interning with for 3.5 years only hired 2 interns and no one else wants to hire anyone either).

Whereabouts are you located?

 

[Kenzi11611]

Whereabouts are you located?

Upstate NY, but I can't really move from where I am at the moment because I have a husband who has a job here and a 16 mo old baby (having a baby in the middle of a semester will prepare you for anything!)

 

[UES Girl]

Yay more New York people here !

 

[zelman]

Wow I don't have half your stats but I got a good number of interviews. Do you think it's the programs you applied too? You do not seem like a bad candidate the fact that you got 2 interviews is shocking to me and pretty messed up if they're holding it against you for graduating in 2010.

I know a few programs did act like it was the end of the world and such a big deal that I graduated last year like I've been out of pharmacy for years when in actuality I was just studying for boards a few months ago. I just wrote them off. Some programs want only the traditional applicant but they're are many that don't think that way.

Holy crap.. what is the "typical P4 applicant"? Where did you graduate from?

I honestly have no idea why I'm apparently a terrible candidate. I have two concrete deficiencies in my resume: a lack of hospital pharmacy work experience and lack of publication. Maybe I could have been more successful applying to community/am care programs, but I was trying to get into an inpatient setting. I figured that programs might not think I was necessarily stellar, but I figured my application was unique enough to land a few interviews out of curiosity.

I graduated with my PharmD from Massachusetts College of Pharmacy and Health Sciences (Boston) and MS from the University of Florida.

I guess I don't understand residency directors as well as I had assumed.

(though I don't know what my recommendations said. I expect they are pretty good)

 

[rxlea]

I honestly have no idea why I'm apparently a terrible candidate. I have two concrete deficiencies in my resume: a lack of hospital pharmacy work experience and lack of publication. Maybe I could have been more successful applying to community/am care programs, but I was trying to get into an inpatient setting. I figured that programs might not think I was necessarily stellar, but I figured my application was unique enough to land a few interviews out of curiosity.

I graduated with my PharmD from Massachusetts College of Pharmacy and Health Sciences (Boston) and MS from the University of Florida.

I guess I don't understand residency directors as well as I had assumed.

(though I don't know what my recommendations said. I expect they are pretty good)

With an MS in pharm econ, why are you trying to go into clinical pharmacy? You can go into industry and make way more.

Also, I'm surprised you aren't published. That would be a big, fat question mark for me since you have both degrees.

 

[thephoenician88]

I honestly have no idea why I'm apparently a terrible candidate. I have two concrete deficiencies in my resume: a lack of hospital pharmacy work experience and lack of publication. Maybe I could have been more successful applying to community/am care programs, but I was trying to get into an inpatient setting. I figured that programs might not think I was necessarily stellar, but I figured my application was unique enough to land a few interviews out of curiosity.

I graduated with my PharmD from Massachusetts College of Pharmacy and Health Sciences (Boston) and MS from the University of Florida.

I guess I don't understand residency directors as well as I had assumed.

(though I don't know what my recommendations said. I expect they are pretty good)

I see you're looking for inpatient. Some good advice my preceptor gave me is to try starting out just as a staff pharmacist and then show them from there that you can move into a clinical position.

But what do i know...

 

[KARM12]

We've interviewed some applicants that were out of school...depends on their motivation and what they are looking for. However, not working at all during this time will hurt you. All of these applicants were working in retail or hospital full time since graduation.

 

[zelman]

With an MS in pharm econ, why are you trying to go into clinical pharmacy?

It's not wasted expertise in patient care settings. Hospitals have formularies to manage.

You can go into industry and make way more.

Because it's not all about having the most money. It's about personal satisfaction...and enough money.

 

[rxlea]

It's not wasted expertise in patient care settings. Hospitals have formularies to manage.

Because it's not all about having the most money. It's about personal satisfaction...and enough money.

Right but the first question is your motivation (as someone pointed out above).

Sites will undoubtedly want to know the answers to the questions I asked above... Why not something else? Why clinical pharmacy? Especially since you got a MS first and then decided to pursue residency.

 

[zelman]

Right but the first question is your motivation (as someone pointed out above).

Sites will undoubtedly want to know the answers to the questions I asked above... Why not something else? Why clinical pharmacy? Especially since you got a MS first and then decided to pursue residency.

When I was graduating, I couldn't imagine taking a $30,000 position when I had a six-figure student loan debt and a $140,000 job offer. Also, I didn't imagine that my application postponement would be such a contentious issue, especially if I were to remain involved in academics. I want to let the OP (and others who stumble upon this thread) know that decent credentials before graduation may not be enough two years later.

Oh, and the best way to realize the superiority of clinical pharmacy is to work for a major chain as a pharmacy manager in a state with no pharmacist friendly laws.

 

[Skrumpy]

With an MS in pharm econ, why are you trying to go into clinical pharmacy? You can go into industry and make way more.

Also, I'm surprised you aren't published. That would be a big, fat question mark for me since you have both degrees.

How much is way more?

 

[thephoenician88]

How much is way more?

it's not really "way more" until you've moved up the ladder

 

[iwannapushpills]

Listen, if you want to go for a residency, just go for it. Do not fear what you are lacking but strengthen what you already have.

I fall under what many consider "the non residency type" category. But to me my whole journey was an uphill battle. When I started my prereqs, I had not been in school for over 10 years and all I had was a GED, not even a H.S. diploma. Everyone kept telling me how hard and competive pharmacy was and I did not stand a chance considering I didn't even have a H.S. education. But I manage to to get into a program through hard work and dedication.

Once in the program I had to work twice as hard and even fell a year behind. My gpa at the end was not the greatest when I applied to my residencies (it was below a 3.0). But when I did my interviews at PPS during midyear (I strongly recommend PPS), I proved that even though my gpa was not high that I still have what it takes like any other candidate with a high gpa or that was highly active.

I took several rotations like the ones you did and I let them know what I learned from them and how I felt those skills could help me succeed in a residency. I also created a very detailed portfolio of all the projects and presentations I did during each rotation and presented it to them and sold them all my capabilities as I read the portfolio to them.

By the end of Febuary I had applied to 9 residencies and got five on site interviews, and now it is just a waiting game for me to se if I place. If i don't place I can live with that, but I know I tried my best which is better than not trying and not ever knowing. And to think that people were whispering in my ear that I would not get any interviews because of my gpa and lack of activity.

My point is that if you beleive in yourself and if you feel like you reallly did learn a lot from your rotations it will show when you present yourself to the places you decide to apply for. Don't ever go by what other people tell you are the standards beacause we all have unique situations. If a residency is what you want to go for then go for it, the worse that can happen is that they will say no and you will make 100k instead 40k (the down side really isn't that much of a down side, lol).

Good Luck

 

[rxlea]

it's not really "way more" until you've moved up the ladder

I'd say 50K-80K more is way more? Then when you move up, you earn even more.

Not to mention the mobility into other sectors.

 

[thephoenician88]

I'd say 50K-80K more is way more? Then when you move up, you earn even more.

Not to mention the mobility into other sectors.

i'm not sure what area of industry you're looking at, but I don't think they get in and start making 160K+

 

[TotemsFan]

Hi everyone I wanted to know what you guys thought my chances of getting a PGY1 residency after being out of pharmacy school for an entire year and no pharmacy work experience.

During my last year of pharmacy school I took a heavy load of clinical rotations such as cardiology, infectious disease, medication errors, clinical studies and I did fairly well in most of them.

My GPA is average but I dont have anything other than that to put on my CV.

I was wondering if I had a chance to get into a residency and what things I could do now to improve my CV. I have searched everywhere for volunteer opportunities but could not find any. I am working at the moment but not in pharmacy and I have not been searching for pharmacy related work yet because of personal problems I expect to be cleared by the time I plan to apply for residencies in Dec. 2013.

Anyway if you guys could please offer an honest opinion I would greatly appreciate it.

We've interviewed some applicants that were out of school...depends on their motivation and what they are looking for. However, not working at all during this time will hurt you. All of these applicants were working in retail or hospital full time since graduation.

On the preceptor side, we have had many students who did not match the previous years come to us for assistance in re-applying for residency. They fall in many categories:

- Graduates of accelerated programs where the APPE rotations fall late in the school year, so the students discover a love/aptitude for acute care after the application deadlines, or they realize their initial search/focus was too broad and generic. Working in the profession certainly helps, but it's a catch-22 - how do you find that position? Some temp agencies offer positions in hospitals (usually graveyard). This is an opportunity to discover different aspects of hospital life, and to see if you really want this work environment. Or if you are working in retail, but want an acute care residency, what other extra things are you involved with? Projects? Volunteering in patient care activities (med recon, DI questions, health fairs)? Taking classes in ACLS, PALS, CDE, ASPEN, etc?

- Students who have worked in the retail/ambulatory setting but are not satisfied. In this regard, they are better positioned, as they are employed, and can better articulate what they are not getting in their current position, what they hope to learn, skills they can provide the program, and their vision for their career.

- Students whose career has been interrupted due to illness, family, military obligations, etc. We've had some students who have applied to residency over 5 years after graduation and a few have actually completed PGY-1 programs.

So there is hope. My advice is to get over your GPA - it's done, and not changing. (Mine was in the bottom half of my class, too, but I did a PGY-1) You can change you, however. Show some improvement, make fantastic impressions of people who will support you in your applications. One of our students did not work in pharmacy during the interval from graduation to application to PGY-1 (2 years). But they worked in their (non pharmacy) professional organization, became president of the organization and showed leadership, project management skills and time management skills, which got them interviews, and matched last year.

 

[zelman]

Well, I've got a 3.73 GPA on a 4.0 scale, involved in residence life for 3 years, orientation for 2 years, student newspaper for 4 years, student government for 3 years, Doctor of Pharmacy degree in 2010, MS in Applied Pharmacoeconomics in 2012, licensed pharmacist in 2 states, 14 years of retail experience, 1 year of internship with VA clinical pharmacy dept.

That all added up to zero interviews before the match last year (11 applications), and two this year (16 applications)...

...and not matching this year.

Any residency directors out there looking for a scrambler?