Pitt good for OMFS?!

[headsup]

Hello upper classmen...
I got accepted to Pitt, and was wondering how would it pave my way into OMFS
residency. I am mostly interested in the 6 year programs, namely UCSF, OHSU, Harvard and the rest alike...
I understand that a very high NBDE I and good GPA+externship will pave my way into resid. but would a school like Harvard omfs consider a D.M.D from Pitt or are they mostly looking for IVY graduates?!?
Thanks in advance

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[gary_ruska]

Hello upper classmen...
I got accepted to Pitt, and was wondering how would it pave my way into OMFS
residency. I am mostly interested in the 6 year programs, namely UCSF, OHSU, Harvard and the rest alike...
I understand that a very high NBDE I and good GPA+externship will pave my way into resid. but would a school like Harvard omfs consider a D.M.D from Pitt or are they mostly looking for IVY graduates?!?
Thanks in advance

Gary Ruska has a few questions for you:

1. Why are you interested in these specific OMFS programs? You appear to be judging the programs based upon the affiliated medical school. That's a big no-no in Gary Ruska's book.

2. Are you aware that it doesn't make any difference where you go to dental school? A loser at Harvard will also be a loser at a state school, and vice versa. The only difference is that a loser at Harvard will be a poorer loser. Not Gary Ruska though, he's a WINNER.

If you want a good answer to this question, please talk to Gary Ruska's doggie, Patrick Wang.

 

[headsup]

I know Harvard is not great in OMFS... That was just an examle of an IVY school, but since for example, UCSF contributed residents to Harvard, itself and OHSU[+ one more that i dont remember] I was wondering whether there is some type of an agreement between some of these schools [ some with good names and some with good programs] also I think OHSU and SF have solid programs, don't they?

 

[Ron Burgundy]

Gary Ruska has a few questions for you:

1. Why are you interested in these specific OMFS programs? You appear to be judging the programs based upon the affiliated medical school. That's a big no-no in Gary Ruska's book.

2. Are you aware that it doesn't make any difference where you go to dental school? A loser at Harvard will also be a loser at a state school, and vice versa. The only difference is that a loser at Harvard will be a poorer loser. Not Gary Ruska though, he's a WINNER.

If you want a good answer to this question, please talk to Gary Ruska's doggie, Patrick Wang.

I got to admit...this Gary Ruska character is growing on me....

Sincerely,

Gary Ruska, I mean, Ron Burgundy

 

[esclavo]

I know Harvard is not great in OMFS... That was just an examle of an IVY school, but since for example, UCSF contributed residents to Harvard, itself and OHSU[+ one more that i dont remember] I was wondering whether there is some type of an agreement between some of these schools [ some with good names and some with good programs] also I think OHSU and SF have solid programs, don't they?

The best names to get you into school are the names at the bottom of your letters of recommendation (academic OMFS), there is no school name that will compensate for a solid board score, there is no extra curricular activity better than an externship (I know many are banking on "give a kid a smile" day but for OMFS that is worth negative points). I think you are working and thinking about the wrong things.

Here is my opinion about criteria for OMFS invitation to interview.
your board score is worth about 40% of your application
class rank about 20% (stay in the top 20-25% percent of your class)
Externships 15-20% (spend at least a month on externships-especially where you take alot of call and are exposed to full scope)
Good letters of rec 10-15% (no letters from your OMFS who took out your 3rds or your perio/pedo/gp/endo profs)
research 5%
school name, leadership, awards from elementary school about 0.000003-0.0000004%

Once you get the interview
Personality 40%
Ability to speak intelligently 40%
Clean/crisp appearance 20%

This is a rough breakdown for you to digest. I'm sure others will chime in...

 

[Ron Burgundy]

Hello upper classmen...
I got accepted to Pitt, and was wondering how would it pave my way into OMFS
residency. I am mostly interested in the 6 year programs, namely UCSF, OHSU, Harvard and the rest alike...
I understand that a very high NBDE I and good GPA+externship will pave my way into resid. but would a school like Harvard omfs consider a D.M.D from Pitt or are they mostly looking for IVY graduates?!?
Thanks in advance

In all seriousnes...Pitt is a great program, especially if you're thinking surgery. I think they are the only school still left with a sedation elective which would be good for a future OMS'er to have...Gary Ruska is right, do well in class and on boards and you can write your ticket to wherever you want to go...look beyond the name, find out the program that will get you where you want to go...

 

[headsup]

Thanks to all
Escalvo, thanks alot for your detail information, those are what I orignially thought would be important, but then again you hear all these emphasis in predent on which school to go and if not you will not have a chance that makes you think...
good to hear the actual deal from the actual people in the field...
thanks again

 

[esclavo]

Thanks to all
Escalvo, thanks alot for your detail information, those are what I orignially thought would be important, but then again you hear all these emphasis in predent on which school to go and if not you will not have a chance that makes you think...
good to hear the actual deal from the actual people in the field...
thanks again

The ADA more tightly regulates dental school standards and accreditation than they do specialties. I believe the variation from dental school to dental school is much less, MUCH less, than the variations between specialty training programs. Go to dental school where it is cheap and solid. Try to go to OMFS programs that you feel are ahead of the pack. Denver is NOT a program which is ahead of the pack. I'd say it is in the back of the pack.

Do well your first two years and kick part I boards in the teeth and then you can start thinking of oral surgery. No experience will hide not doing well in dental school. Some party, slack, and think a little "death-bed repentence" will get them into OMFS kind of like it can sometimes get you into dental school, but I don't recommend this "back door" approach. It is fraught with illegitimacy and poor odds. Don't get the cart before the wagon. Focus on a good-cheap dental school and put your shoulder to the wheel...

 

[gary_ruska]

Hi Everyone,
Gary Ruska here; wanted to write to say that Gary Ruska agrees with this apparent Esclavo.

Also, please send your best wishes to Gary's friend Brent Hansen. He recently was mauled by an overly aggressive woman while in line at the Sizzler.

 

[headsup]

I will remember your advice Escalvo and commit to it...
Thanks again...

 

[robf]

I believe the variation from dental school to dental school is much less, MUCH less, than the variations between specialty training programs.

Without externing or interviewing at a program, is there any way to find out what the scope/emphasis of training is like there? That would save a lot of money, traveling, and headache during the application process.

Denver is NOT a program which is ahead of the pack. I'd say it is in the back of the pack.

What are some other programs to avoid?

 

[esclavo]

Without externing or interviewing at a program, is there any way to find out what the scope/emphasis of training is like there? That would save a lot of money, traveling, and headache during the application process.




What are some other programs to avoid?

There are three ways to find out information.

1. Apply and interview there
2. Do an externship there
3. Network with people who have done any of the two above. (Current residents-upper classman) The risk with this one is that if you talk to people who don't know their anus from a hole in the ground-you get bad information. I'd trust residents or hardcore pre-OMFS upper classmen

You'll be surprised how much information you can get. In many ways it is a small community.

 

[GatorDMD]

also I think OHSU and SF have solid programs, don't they?

i thought so. 😀

there is an upper level at OHSU from Pitt dental school... also Minnesota, Florida, Penn, UCSF, Harvard, Denver, etc.

 

[headsup]

i thought so. 😀

there is an upper level at OHSU from Pitt dental school... also Minnesota, Florida, Penn, UCSF, Harvard, Denver, etc.

You better be sure so!!! 😉
Congrats and hopefully you'll update me on how your residency goes...

 

[sevodes]

Hello upper classmen...
I got accepted to Pitt, and was wondering how would it pave my way into OMFS
residency. I am mostly interested in the 6 year programs, namely UCSF, OHSU, Harvard and the rest alike...
I understand that a very high NBDE I and good GPA+externship will pave my way into resid. but would a school like Harvard omfs consider a D.M.D from Pitt or are they mostly looking for IVY graduates?!?
Thanks in advance

OHSU is a big cancer surgery-based program. They operate out of Emanuel Hospital in Portland as well as the OHSU hospital. Lots of trauma at Emanuel too. If your goal is to do the big neck cut downs that sometimes go to ENT then OHSU is the right place for you. The dental school is nothing special, they have a fair amount of dentoalveolar, implants, for the OMS guys. Harvard is not such a hot program if you want to actually learn how to do oral surgery.

 

[mtheman]

The best names to get you into school are the names at the bottom of your letters of recommendation (academic OMFS), there is no school name that will compensate for a solid board score, there is no extra curricular activity better than an externship (I know many are banking on "give a kid a smile" day but for OMFS that is worth negative points). I think you are working and thinking about the wrong things.

Here is my opinion about criteria for OMFS invitation to interview.
your board score is worth about 40% of your application
class rank about 20% (stay in the top 20-25% percent of your class)
Externships 15-20% (spend at least a month on externships-especially where you take alot of call and are exposed to full scope)
Good letters of rec 10-15% (no letters from your OMFS who took out your 3rds or your perio/pedo/gp/endo profs)
research 5%
school name, leadership, awards from elementary school about 0.000003-0.0000004%

Once you get the interview
Personality 40%
Ability to speak intelligently 40%
Clean/crisp appearance 20%

This is a rough breakdown for you to digest. I'm sure others will chime in...

Darn it! I was counting on my many elementary school accolades to land me an interview 😡

 

[OMFSCardsFan]

Darn it! I was counting on my many elementary school accolades to land me an interview 😡

Unfortunately, M, medalling in the Special Olympics isn't going to be quite the attention-grabber that you were expecting either...better get on those externships...

 

[mtheman]

Unfortunately, M, medalling in the Special Olympics isn't going to be quite the attention-grabber that you were expecting either...better get on those externships...

Unfortunatley, I was not able to medal at the Special Olympics, those guys do a ton of roids.

 

[OMFSCardsFan]

Unfortunatley, I was not able to medal at the Special Olympics, those guys do a ton of roids.

Nice...that had me laughing out loud. Better to not mention it at all then, eh?

 

[toofache32]

Unfortunately, M, medalling in the Special Olympics isn't going to be quite the attention-grabber that you were expecting either...better get on those externships...

Just for the record....we're now officially all going to hell.

 

[OMFSCardsFan]

Just for the record....we're now officially all going to hell.

My mother has been telling me that for years--I'm getting used to the idea. Warm weather, third-world conditions, Satan...sounds like residency in Shreve with TX...it's not so bad...

 

[6897729]

Harvard is not such a hot program if you want to actually learn how to do oral surgery.

At least their residents aren't ******* who are worried about failing OMSSAT and being kicked out.

FYI - I externed there two summers ago. They do operate quite a bit there. Sure, not as much as Parkland or LSU, but certainly enough to "learn how to do oral surgery."

 

[toofache32]

At least their residents aren't ******* who are worried about failing OMSSAT and being kicked out.

FYI - I externed there two summers ago. They do operate quite a bit there. Sure, not as much as Parkland or LSU, but certainly enough to "learn how to do oral surgery."

Simma down!

 

[esclavo]

At least their residents aren't ******* who are worried about failing OMSSAT and being kicked out.

FYI - I externed there two summers ago. They do operate quite a bit there. Sure, not as much as Parkland or LSU, but certainly enough to "learn how to do oral surgery."

My PD is a Harvard alum. While he is thankful for what he did learn there, he thinks that the surgical scope and volume aren't impressive. He scrubbed in on 4 ZMC's his entire residency and two of them were on his plastics rotations! He did a ton of orthognathics and TMJ....though.

 

[esclavo]

Just for the record....we're now officially all going to hell.

or you already are there. Nothing is sacred on this forum: race, disability, gender, nationality, poor cosmesis (toof and myself), ignorance, innocence, halitosis, attire, cryptid orchidism, offspring, spouses (except Ruska can't talk about my wife...off limits!) ...its all fair game

 

[headsup]

I don't understand how Harvard can't be a good choice for OMS especially when two of the most famous people in the field where trained there, or maybe they are only famous to me, so correct me if I am wrong, but I believe Dr Kaban and also Dr Posnick were both Harvard OMS trainees, and both are significant figures in the OMS field... So I believe it does have enough qualities to make an exceptional OMS

 

[Extraction]

I don't understand how Harvard can't be a good choice for OMS especially when two of the most famous people in the field where trained there, or maybe they are only famous to me, so correct me if I am wrong, but I believe Dr Kaban and also Dr Posnick were both Harvard OMS trainees, and both are significant figures in the OMS field... So I believe it does have enough qualities to make an exceptional OMS

Why do you lookup all the chairmen and program directors across the country and look at where they trained and then come back and repost.

 

[rrc]

I don't understand how Harvard can't be a good choice for OMS especially when two of the most famous people in the field where trained there, or maybe they are only famous to me, so correct me if I am wrong, but I believe Dr Kaban and also Dr Posnick were both Harvard OMS trainees, and both are significant figures in the OMS field... So I believe it does have enough qualities to make an exceptional OMS

They trained a long time ago. Programs can change for the better or worse. However, when you get into private practice and say you went to medical school and did your training at Harvard, patients will be very impressed, regardless of the quality of the program.

 

[toofache32]

I don't understand how Harvard can't be a good choice for OMS especially when two of the most famous people in the field where trained there, or maybe they are only famous to me, so correct me if I am wrong, but I believe Dr Kaban and also Dr Posnick were both Harvard OMS trainees, and both are significant figures in the OMS field... So I believe it does have enough qualities to make an exceptional OMS

What is Kaban famous for? Other than throwing instruments at people in the OR...

 

[6897729]

What is Kaban famous for? Other than throwing instruments at people in the OR...

Are you joking or just ******ed?

How about developing and advancing many of the modern techniques in pediatric OMFS/Craniofacial Surgery? How about writing 5 textbooks on pediatric OMFS and complications in OMFS? How about having a surgical case load that would rival even your precious E Ellis III? How about contributing to OMFS across such a wide array of topics, from nerve injuries to interferon therapy for giant cell lesions?

You really do have a habit of pissing all over Harvard. Given that it may not be the *best* program for what you want to do, it still is a solid program.

He's just as famous (if not more) than Sinn, Ellis, Zuniga, or whomever else you have down there. He is famous for his contributions to OMFS, as well as his eccentric behavior, both in and out of the operating room.

Also - have you ever been in the OR with Kaban? If not, then you're just supporting rumors...You know about that one about the divorce rate and happiness of residents at Parkland, right? And how you really only get to do what Rohrich (or Sinn's wife) lets you do...

 

[toofache32]

Are you joking or just ******ed?

How about developing and advancing many of the modern techniques in pediatric OMFS/Craniofacial Surgery? How about writing 5 textbooks on pediatric OMFS and complications in OMFS? How about having a surgical case load that would rival even your precious E Ellis III? How about contributing to OMFS across such a wide array of topics, from nerve injuries to interferon therapy for giant cell lesions?

You really do have a habit of pissing all over Harvard. Given that it may not be the *best* program for what you want to do, it still is a solid program.

He's just as famous (if not more) than Sinn, Ellis, Zuniga, or whomever else you have down there. He is famous for his contributions to OMFS, as well as his eccentric behavior, both in and out of the operating room.

Also - have you ever been in the OR with Kaban? If not, then you're just supporting rumors...You know about that one about the divorce rate and happiness of residents at Parkland, right? And how you really only get to do what Rohrich (or Sinn's wife) lets you do...

Anyone remember that Macguver guy who used to post around here?

 

[Extraction]

Anyone remember that Macguver guy?

Of course I do CHRIS! How could anyone forget someone who could save the world with a paper clip, a stick of chewing gum and without a gun. Did he go to Harvard? I can't remember

 

[OMFSCardsFan]

You really do have a habit of pissing all over Harvard.

As does everyone else who knows anything about OMFS--and doesn't go to Harvard. I think you'd have a hard time finding someone that is in or has been through OMFS training (outside of Harvard) to say that Harvard should be in a list of even the top 20 programs in the country. Then, if you ask the same group who WENT to Harvard, they'll all claim to be in the top 5. Must be something in the Ivy League genes.

Another interesting thing to note is that people in great programs, such as Toof, don't have to get on SDN and post about how great their program is. It's always the Harvard guys doing that...

 

[WestCoast]

As does everyone else who knows anything about OMFS--and doesn't go to Harvard. I think you'd have a hard time finding someone that is in or has been through OMFS training (outside of Harvard) to say that Harvard should be in a list of even the top 20 programs in the country. Then, if you ask the same group who WENT to Harvard, they'll all claim to be in the top 5. Must be something in the Ivy League genes.

Another interesting thing to note is that people in great programs, such as Toof, don't have to get on SDN and post about how great their program is. It's always the Harvard guys doing that...

When I was applying to programs last year, the advice I got from the chairman of UCLA's program was to not apply to harvard. And he did his residency at harvard. go figures.

 

[6897729]

Another interesting thing to note is that people in great programs, such as Toof, don't have to get on SDN and post about how great their program is. It's always the Harvard guys doing that...

Of course you do, all the time - you guys just do it by bashing other programs. Six of one, half a dozen of the other.

BTW, I don't go to Harvard, but can empathize because my program takes it on the chin from you guys all the time as well.

Finally, maybe if you ask your PD, he wouldn't put Harvard in the top 20, but there are many people who would.

 

[toofache32]

Of course you do, all the time - you guys just do it by bashing other programs. Six of one, half a dozen of the other.

Hahvard is the only program I can specifically remember bashing but I could be wrong. Then there is a lot of well-intended fun we all poke at each other around here. Otherwise there are a lot of plain ol' observations people throw around from interviews/externships when dental students ask about specific programs. And as long as it's accredited, what is there to bash anyway?

Perusing through your old posts, there isn't a single one where you aren't pissing and moaning or belittling other people. This pretty much defines troll which is why I haven't paid much attention to you until now. I'm still wondering why you're so pissy about everything.

 

[headsup]

I certainly didn't mean this thread to be moving in the current direction!!
I guess I have to apologize for stirring up some of you guys...
But thanks for all of your thoughts....
but I have another question...
Let's say and OMFS is looking forward to fellowships, like cranio or micro. [the one's that require MD], would going to Harvard for OMS enhances their chances of getting into a good fellowship?! or it doesn't matter where you get your MD, or where you do your residency...
Hopefully we'll get some straight answers this time, without judging anyone's character...
Regards

 

[headsup]

I certainly didn't mean this thread to be moving in the current direction!!
I guess I have to apologize for stirring up some of you guys...
But thanks for all of your thoughts....
but I have another question...
Let's say an OMFS is looking forward to fellowships, like cranio or micro. [the one's that require MD], would going to Harvard for OMS enhances their chances of getting into a good fellowship?! or it doesn't matter where you get your MD, or where you do your residency...
Hopefully we'll get some straight answers this time, without judging anyone's character...
Regards

 

[Extraction]

Seriously dude, YOU need to do some research and stop fixating what going to Harvard OMFS training program will or won't do for you. The people in this forum have definate bias based on their personal career goals and the programs they preferenced and matched. Your repetetive line of questioning lead me to believe you will not be convinced by anyone's response. Your career goals are not clear from your brief postings. No one here knows your intentions or goals better than yourself. This is what I propose YOU do:

Pickup a dozen or so JOMS and look thru lookup the names of people publishing
Look at the authors of some of the oral surgery texts and the authors of the individual chapters. Peterson's principles or Fonseca's series of books would be a good start. Match these people with the programs/fellowships at which they trained and their mentors. ie X trained at Y and Z's fellowship.

Then look at the residency directors and chairmen of the various programs across the country. Pay attention to who trained where and what their area of interest is...

A pattern will emerge and you will have YOUR answer, which YOU can believe. You should be able to narrow down the programs that meet your interests whether it is having a big name institute behind your degree, learning a specific area of OMFS you are most interested in, preparing you for an academic career with or without a fellowship, or giving you the best skills to make money in private practice. You would also learn alot about the field and the people which will be beneficial when you apply.

 

[headsup]

You are right Extraction about the bias people have... and I learned it the funny way!!!
But anyhow, thanks for your great advice and I will definitely look into JOMs, and various publications...

 

[Swamp Yankee]

He's just as famous (if not more) than Sinn, Ellis, Zuniga, or whomever else you have down there. He is famous for his contributions to OMFS, as well as his eccentric behavior, both in and out of the operating room.

Famous? Why would you say any oral surgeon is FAMOUS?
That just doesn't sound right. By "eccentricity" you mean "insecurity."

And there you go again, talking about programs and their players
like the sports heros we never grew out of:
"I'll trade you my Ed Ellis rookie card for your limited edition Kaban All-Star."

 

[El Guapo78]

Famous? Why would you say any oral surgeon is FAMOUS?
That just doesn't sound right. By "eccentricity" you mean "insecurity."

And there you go again, talking about programs and their players
like the sports heros we never grew out of:
"I'll trade you my Ed Ellis rookie card for your limited edition Kaban All-Star."

I'll trade you my copy of KISS Saves Santa for an Ed Ellis autograph. 👍

 

[OMFSCardsFan]

BTW, I don't go to Harvard, but can empathize because my program takes it on the chin from you guys all the time as well.

I don't have any idea what program you're referring to. Like Toofache, I don't recall anyone bashing any other program, either. The only other program that I can recall having talked negatively about was UMKC. However, I never said that it was a bad program--I only mentioned what I didn't like about it while I was there, and I only mention it when people ask questions on here. I've also mentioned things I didn't like about UAB, but I still think they have a GREAT program. If I've said something about your program that you think is unfair, feel free to PM me and set the record straight. Then, you don't have to reveal to everyone where you are...

 

[toofache32]

I'll trade you my copy of KISS Saves Santa for an Ed Ellis autograph. 👍

I'll give 2 Ed Ellis autographs for an Esclavo Limited Edition Donkey-Punch.

 

[6897729]

Famous? Why would you say any oral surgeon is FAMOUS?
That just doesn't sound right. By "eccentricity" you mean "insecurity."

And there you go again, talking about programs and their players
like the sports heros we never grew out of:
"I'll trade you my Ed Ellis rookie card for your limited edition Kaban All-Star."

Okay, let's get into a semantic argument. What I meant by famous was exactly what a previous poster on here aluded to - looking for the names that keep popping up in JOMS, PRS, etc. and the people who a presenting the cases at the national conferences. Nobody here will argue that people choose programs based upon faculty, and that's what I meant by "famous".

This is the last I'll post on this topic (much to the pleasure of many of you, I'm sure). I guess I just wanted to point out that most of you say negative things about a program without knowing anyone currently in that program or having spent any significant time there. If I'm wrong, I have yet to see someone provide evidence of their beliefs about MGH without saying "well, I heard from my PD," or "this guy who graduated from there 4 years ago said...". The bottom line is that programs change over time, and while change can occur within a program sometimes quickly, changes in bias and perception take much longer to correct, as seen on this board.

I just thought I would speak up for MGH, since none of their residents seem to post on this board (perhaps they are actually busy treating patients or trying to "learn oral surgery").

I'll let you boys have your fun though. I suppose that Parkland, LSU, and whatever programs you guys think are great must be, the rest of us are just going to be periodontists.

Peace.

 

[Doggie]

I just thought I would speak up for MGH, since none of their residents seem to post on this board (perhaps they are actually busy treating patients or trying to "learn oral surgery").

Not to be a b!tch or anyting, but from what I've gathered, they mostly "learn oral surgery" by reading about it in textbooks such as Ellis'. Booyah!

 

[6897729]

Not to be a b!tch or anyting, but from what I've gathered, they mostly "learn oral surgery" by reading about it in textbooks such as Ellis'. Booyah!

See, Patrick Wang has hit on exactly what I was talking about. "From what I've gathered..." Way to provide some specifics, Pat.

 

[omfsStud]

If I'm wrong, I have yet to see someone provide evidence of their beliefs about MGH without saying "well, I heard from my PD," or "this guy who graduated from there 4 years ago said..."..

I can respond to this. I regretably interviewed at MGH during the application process. While there, I has a conversation with Dr. Troulis (she is the residency director...and smokin HOT, by the way). I asked her straight-up if her OR schedule was light. She responded by bragging about how she had done at least 20 OR cases in the past 2 months. Bottom line...MGH sucks hard. I interviewed at a lot of programs and they are the only one I didn't rank. Kaban was a tool and most of his residents followed suit.

 

[Doggie]

See, Patrick Wang has hit on exactly what I was talking about. "From what I've gathered..." Way to provide some specifics, Pat.

The fact that you keep trying to defend MGH (even though you dont attend that program) makes one wonder about your motive and why a good program such as MGH needs any defending at all justifies my point all that much more.

 

[Swamp Yankee]

Okay, let's get into a semantic argument. What I meant by famous was exactly what a previous poster on here aluded to - looking for the names that keep popping up in JOMS, PRS, etc. and the people who a presenting the cases at the national conferences. Nobody here will argue that people choose programs based upon faculty, and that's what I meant by "famous".

This is the last I'll post on this topic (much to the pleasure of many of you, I'm sure). I guess I just wanted to point out that most of you say negative things about a program without knowing anyone currently in that program or having spent any significant time there. If I'm wrong, I have yet to see someone provide evidence of their beliefs about MGH without saying "well, I heard from my PD," or "this guy who graduated from there 4 years ago said...". The bottom line is that programs change over time, and while change can occur within a program sometimes quickly, changes in bias and perception take much longer to correct, as seen on this board.

I just thought I would speak up for MGH, since none of their residents seem to post on this board (perhaps they are actually busy treating patients or trying to "learn oral surgery").

I'll let you boys have your fun though. I suppose that Parkland, LSU, and whatever programs you guys think are great must be, the rest of us are just going to be periodontists.

Peace.

i agree with you entirely.
most of us are operating on an old stereotype
and speculation... but that one about the chairman
being an insecure a-hole, well, that's very true
and i can't imagine that not having an effect on
the program day-to-day. i too would like to save
the world, but oral surgery is not the means by
which to do it. tell that to their chairman... and tell him
to spend more time with the family and to treat his
residents kindly. tell him to thank his nurses and
anesthesia staff for their invaluable support, without whom
there would be no surgery. tell him that his applicants
are the future of the specialty and remind him to treat
us kindly so that when he's gone, we don't have
to read his name, his books, and his articles in such distaste.