Plaquenil for corona?

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VictorOfHungerGames

VictorOfHungerGames

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I'm hearing reports that Plaquenil with antibiotic help with treating coronavirus? Correct me if i'm wrong... but... what? lol we are using anti-malarial/RA and anti-bacterial drugs to treat viral infections now?

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

In Vitro Antiviral Activity and Projection of Optimized Dosing Design of Hydroxychloroquine for the Treatment of Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome Coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) - PubMed

Hydroxychloroquine was found to be more potent than chloroquine to inhibit SARS-CoV-2 in vitro.
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
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We can’t even get any for our regular patients that have been on it for RA now because it’s on backorder. Sad.
 
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BackRowChi said:


Here's the most recent paper from France. From a design standpoint, obviously not ideal. But if those results are legit, this could be a turning point.

Check out these guidelines!


Belgium isn't waiting on anyone. Very interested to see what comes of this in the next week.
Click to expand...

This whole coronabeerbongvirus is a circus lol next thing they'll say is it's found in mars lol what a joke.
 
For those that are visual learners:

1584631293795.png
 
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It helps with the cytokine storm that occurs in acutely ill patients. Since cytokine storms are something that also happens in...rheumatoid arthritis...I suppose it makes sense that a RA drug may help with surviving the coronavirus.
 
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President just made an announcement about hydroxychloroquine. I hope you guys get loud when the price gouging begins.
 
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My dad asked me this evening if I had ever heard of this, and if he could get any. I told him, "Yes, and you really don't want to HAVE to take that."
 
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BenJammin said:
?????
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Seems pretty straight forward.

First graph, percent positive of plaquenil vs nonplaquenil. Plaquenil in blue. Percent positive goes way down with plaquenil.

Second graph, percent positive of none vs plaquenil vs plaquenil+Zpak. Plaquenil alone in orange, plaquenil+Zpak in gray. Number of positives goes way down with plaquenil+Zpak.
 
rph3664 said:
My dad asked me this evening if I had ever heard of this, and if he could get any. I told him, "Yes, and you really don't want to HAVE to take that."
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Imagine telling this to your dad, and your dad gets it...

I told my family abroad to buy it just in case, it's dirt cheap in malaria country and still readily available now. No harm to keep some.

Does this mean anyone with RA + plaquenil inherently have higher chance of winning survival of the fittest vs. us normies? Got damn it, this is the first time I wanna have RA.
 
WVUPharm2007 said:
For those that are visual learners:

View attachment 299012
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These graphs come from an absolute cr*p study. 32 patients in total, single arm, open label, non-controlled. There were only 6 patients in the HCQ+zpak group, and they were chosen at physician discretion opening up a million different confounding variables. 6 patients total were “lost to follow up”, 3 of whom were admitted to the ICU and 1 who died (they literally excluded the sickest patients from their data). Not only that, but their “control group” was an entirely different patient population at another institution or that refused to participate in the study (again opening this study up to additional confounding variables, as asymptomatic patients are likely to refuse treatment). Rush to publication should not excuse terrible science.
 
Zebra Hunter said:
These graphs come from an absolute cr*p study. 32 patients in total, single arm, open label, non-controlled. There were only 6 patients in the HCQ+zpak group, and they were chosen at physician discretion opening up a million different confounding variables. 6 patients total were “lost to follow up”, 3 of whom were admitted to the ICU and 1 who died (they literally excluded the sickest patients from their data). Not only that, but their “control group” was an entirely different patient population at another institution or that refused to participate in the study (again opening this study up to additional confounding variables, as asymptomatic patients are likely to refuse treatment). Rush to publication should not excuse terrible science.
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I agree. Though it was controlled. They had a control, plaquenil, and plaquenil plus azith.

But in cases like this a case study is the best you are going to get. Giving it is low risk, high reward.
 
WVUPharm2007 said:
I agree. Though it was controlled. They had a control, plaquenil, and plaquenil plus azith.

But in cases like this a case study is the best you are going to get. Giving it is low risk, high reward.
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There are 16 trials currently regarding HCQ use for CoVID, this is not the best we are going to get, this is literally the worst we are going to get. No meaningful information can be gleaned from this study.
 
Zebra Hunter said:
There are 16 trials currently regarding HCQ use for CoVID, this is not the best we are going to get, this is literally the worst we are going to get. No meaningful information can be gleaned from this study.
Click to expand...

I mean...duh? This stuff takes time.

Calamity happens --> researchers try stuff --> Publish case studies ----WE ARE HERE----> better studies are done ---> treatment protocols made

So AT THIS POINT IN TIME, a case study is as good as we are going to get.
 
WVUPharm2007 said:
I mean...duh? This stuff takes time.

Calamity happens --> researchers try stuff --> Publish case studies ----WE ARE HERE----> better studies are done ---> treatment protocols made

So AT THIS POINT IN TIME, a case study is as good as we are going to get.
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“As good as we are going to get” implies that there was actually something useful about the study. The data is meaningless. This was just a rush to get published first. This study does more harm than good. Also, the use of plaquenil isn’t “low risk, high reward”, this is “risk completely depleting med, questionable reward”.
 
Zebra Hunter said:
“As good as we are going to get” implies that there was actually something useful about the study. The data is meaningless. This was just a rush to get published first. This study does more harm than good. Also, the use of plaquenil isn’t “low risk, high reward”, this is “risk completely depleting med, questionable reward”.
Click to expand...

Ok, that's fine. I think giving it to COVID-19 positive patients until the two larger studies are published won't hurt anything.
 
Zebra Hunter said:
“As good as we are going to get” implies that there was actually something useful about the study. The data is meaningless. This was just a rush to get published first. This study does more harm than good. Also, the use of plaquenil isn’t “low risk, high reward”, this is “risk completely depleting med, questionable reward”.
Click to expand...

Do you have another treatment in mind?
 
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mentos said:
Do you have another treatment in mind?
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Supportive care, as most patients that test positive will be fine. Our hospital currently reserves plaquenil only for those w/ severe disease. Lack of other treatment should not be an indication for unproven treatment until there is more robust data for efficacy.
 
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DoctorCuadrado said:
You too get a life dude!!! Take the PCAT and go to pharm school. You need to study
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Uh, I've been a pharmacist for 6 years. Weren't you the one that hasn't been accepted to pharmacy school yet? This forum is for pharmacy students and pharmacists.

Let me direct you to the pre-pharm forum:
forums.studentdoctor.net

Pre-Pharmacy

Join the prepharmacy student community. 1000s of pre-pharmacy (PharmD) students just like you.
forums.studentdoctor.net forums.studentdoctor.net

I wish you luck in getting accepted into pharmacy school in 2020, I hear it's hard.
 
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Well the pharmacy I worked at said plaquenil is on backorder for them. Apparently the doctors area the area have all been writing it for themselves or something. Heard something from one of the patients of the doctors writing for 30 days, patient keeps around 10-20 tablets while the mds take 40 for office use. Even better for the doctors if the insurance pays for 90 days.
 
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This is really irritating. Forget that actual patients need this for non COVID issues. I'm just really annoyed that doctors would panic like this and grasp at something with poor evidence to support it, and contribute to the hysteria and hoarding around it.
 
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At least in my region, its been put out that the Oregon Medical Board does not advocate for Hydroxychloroquine as an appropriate alternative action (not that I think it would necessarily stop the continued prescribing)

COVID-19

"The Board has received reports from pharmacies regarding physicians inappropriately prescribing hydroxychloroquine (Plaquenil). The Board does not approve of inappropriate or false prescribing, especially in times of crisis.

Further, the Medical Board and the Board of Pharmacy provide the following reminders of some of the risks related to administering unproven therapies:

  • Creating the risk of adverse effects and additional harm.
  • Creating shortages of therapies for patients who have legitimate medical need for the drug's intended purpose and use.
  • Confounding the interpretation of efficacy (particularly when randomized controlled studies are necessary and are currently underway).
  • Providing false hope to patients or a false sense of security."
 
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When was the last time people hoarded like this? When Furbys came out?
 
Sparda29 said:
Isn't Plaquenil in this case just to prevent cytokine storm syndrome in coronavirus patients? It's not like it's gonna stop you from getting infected.
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yeah so i guess people will just use it like imitrex. at onset of covid.
 
Sparda29 said:
Isn't Plaquenil in this case just to prevent cytokine storm syndrome in coronavirus patients? It's not like it's gonna stop you from getting infected.
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That's probably why we use it. We believe it decreases destruction of lung parenchyma due to its anti-inflammatory effect. I used it in one of my patients with COVID-19 who has multiple comorbid conditions and she recovered. We know it has good safety profile, but we need more rigorous study to find out if it is really effective. As of now, it's just a hail mary pass.
 
The theory/speculation behind it.
academic.oup.com

COVID-19: a recommendation to examine the effect of hydroxychloroquine in preventing infection and progression

Abstract. A novel coronavirus disease (COVID-19), caused by infection with SARS-CoV-2, has swept across 31 provinces in China and over 40 countries worldwi
academic.oup.com academic.oup.com

I don't know about you but I'm glad I have #30 now before all the boards/chains restricted it... We are the front line at this crisis. There is a pretty darn good chance I'm gonna get this beer virus.

If I didn't get it in USA, I was about to order it online and import it or have my family ships it to me.
 
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In a world after covid-19 are we going to see these meds used for other coronavirus infections (not this novel virus)
 
The answer has been in front of us all this time. Did anybody try using lime juice?
 
Xenophylia said:
The answer has been in front of us all this time. Did anybody try using lime juice?
Click to expand...

If only we could get Trump to say provider status has shown promising results... all problems would be solved.
 
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Yesterday, I had this lady for some crazy reason act grateful we would fill her HCQ for RA as other pharmacies claimed they ran out. Scaredy-cat prescribers can piss off, i.e., radiologists and anesthesiologists who probably aren't even working right now.
 
There was a code blue/death (torsades) last night on a patient who was suspected of Covid19 but ultimately the test said covid19 negative. They were given the cocktail for 4 days. Troponin was elevated (2). They never received a cardiac cath, I think there was no mention of chest pain in the complaint. Patient was also upper 80s and was uncompliant diabetic (sugars in the 200s).

My guess a demand myocardial infarction misdiagnosed as covid19? And then the cocktail pushes the patient over the edge?
 
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