Please advise me!

[rkschun]

Hi, this is my first time posting on SDN after lurking for about a year and a half. I am a nontrad 29 year old, who is finishing his a la carte post bacc at Uni. Did horrible in undergrad, worked for 3 years, decided to try to do dental, did the a la carte post bacc for 3 semesters to finish prereqs. Here are the stats.

uGPA: 2.2
post bacc GPA: 3.7(calc, stats, 2 orgo, 2 chem, 2 bio, 2 physics, a/p)

cGPA (now): 2.5
sGPA: 3.15

cGPA(aacomas using retakes) : 2.9
sGPAaacomas using retakes): 3.3

ECs: a few
Volunteer: 45 hrs
Shadow: only a dentist

So, I wanted to do dental, but with my stats I feel depressed everyday. Looking into DO programs gives me some kind of hope and motivation. I just want to start my career and have a focus where I can see light at the end of the tunnel.

I did very poorly in UG b/c I was lazy and didn't think that college was important. I had F's in fitness walking, lots of W, and just by looking at the transcript it should be known that I didn't give a %$#@. But I do now. I did well in high school, had a 1410 SAT, and AP credits for Spanish, Physics, Calc, and Psychology.

So, I was going to take the DAT this summer, but I feel like I have a better chance applying to DO schools because of their aacomas GPA retake policy. Without it, my cGPA would be stuck forever around 2.5.

So my question to you guys is: "What should I do?"

1) Should I keep taking courses a la carte? I can retake possibly 2 classes from UG to raise my cGPA a few more points, although they aren't premed related. In the mean time I can take higher level bio courses. Should I try to raise my cGPA to >3.0?

2) Should I take the DAT or MCAT? Is it a good idea for me to continue pursuing dentistry? Are my chances ok with DO programs? What about Podiatry or optometry?
I know I am jumping around to different professions, but right now I just want to start my life. I am completely happy studying any of these professions. I am 29 btw.

3) Should I go to an SMP, with all their loans and risk?

Thanks in advance. I know this is a long thread, but I wanted to be thorough so that you guys know my exact situation. That way you can give me better advice. Please take my 3 years of time off from school into account.

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[maybemed2013]

Dental and Medicine are two different fields, you need to decided if you want to work primarily with teeth or not.

 

[rkschun]

I understand that they are different. Understand my situation.

 

[DolFAN]

I understand that they are different. Understand my situation.

No, you need to understand. Dental and Medicine are different things. If you want the lifestyle of a dentist, medicine may not be for you. You need to be 100% sure MEDICINE is what you really want to do and not a backup for your dental career.

 

[aburnet2]

I understand that they are different. Understand my situation.

We cant tell you what you should do with your life. You first have to decide if you want to work with teeth all the time or do you want to practice medicine? Its not all about what you can get into, its what you want to do. What is going to make you happy?

I am not sure what it takes to get into a Dental School but with the MORE grad replacement and a decent/good MCAT (28+ b/c your low cGPA) you could potentially get into a DO school. But you will have to do a lot more besides the MCAT to get into a med school....volunteer, shadowing A DOCTOR, gain some clinical experience, write a great personal statement, improve interview skills, spend lots of money, and of course bathe babies at the Vatican, you know all those bs hoops that premeds have to jump through. Do some more research on EC's on SDN to get a better understanding of what I mean. It will take a whole lotta work regardless but since your four years older than me I'm sure you know that. Bottom line, if you want it bad enough you will make it happen. It is not impossible with your situation.

 

[rkschun]

Thanks for the replies. I definitely know what you guys mean when you say do something that makes you happy. I enjoy learning. I also enjoy relaxing. But I really enjoy focus and a purposefulness. I want a career. Something where I am investing in myself and as I progress I can become more valuable in. I taught English abroad for three years, but I knew that there was no potential after that. Yes, it does seem like I am trying to get what I can, but that's what I am working with. With professional schools, there is no limit to my potential as a professional or as a business person. I have confidence in my work ethic. I just want confidence in my career path which is the most frustrating and oppressing aspect due to my situation. Please don't judge me! . I want to redeem myself.

 

[rkschun]

Another thing...Unless we are in the profession or have been shadowing for many plus hours, we can not fully appreciate or understand the scope of what any of these professions do. I know dentists work with teeth, opts with eyes, pod with below the knee. I have a general understanding of all these professions. But how do I know what will make me happy? My happiness comes from doing a good job at whatever I am doing. I know for a fact I won't enjoy being a server or a construction worker. I think I will be happy with a profession that helps people, earns a good salary, is stable financially in the long run, is respectable...

 

[rkschun]

But objectively, what should I do? THANKS!

 

[aburnet2]

Another thing...Unless we are in the profession or have been shadowing for many plus hours, we can not fully appreciate or understand the scope of what any of these professions do. I know dentists work with teeth, opts with eyes, pod with below the knee. I have a general understanding of all these professions. But how do I know what will make me happy? My happiness comes from doing a good job at whatever I am doing. I know for a fact I won't enjoy being a server or a construction worker. I think I will be happy with a profession that helps people, earns a good salary, is stable financially in the long run, is respectable...

no judging, SDN just tends to fire back at comments like "understand my situation."

Medicine is not a light career choice. It takes a very long time to become a full fledge doctor, at least 7 years after undergrad! It will take you a good year more than likely to get yourself even ready to apply for med school, then another year of waiting to begin if accepted. So the reason you get comments like "make sure" "is it what you want" is because if you start this journey, it is all or epic failure! Really hard to come back from one useless year of med school and 40k of addition debt.

You say one cant know what will make them happy unless they experience some of it, I would agree for sure. Therefore, go out and shadow a DO or MD (preferrable DO if going to DO school) and get that exposure before you decide. It is usually pretty easy, just call one doctor's office and ask if you can shadow. Or just hang out at a hospital and ask one when the walk by....I've done both lol.

 

[ensuii]

But objectively, what should I do? THANKS!

It's impossible to answer this is the thing. You're basically asking what you should do with your life and noone can give you a better answer to that than you. Dentistry and medicine are different and the first thing you need to do is figure out where your passions lie. I love medicine; the science behind physiology and disease, interacting with people, etc. really make what I invest into it worthwhile. A lot of people have similar interests and that's why they go on to med school.

The thing is, if you don't like it and you go in to medicine because you wanted a 6-figure salary and couldn't do dentistry/law/engineering/etc., it REALLY sucks. The hours are long, the stakes are high, and your dedication to your craft is tested routinely.

I know you were probably hoping for a more straightforward answer, but people are trying to do you a service by not just saying to you: "yeah bro medicine is awesome, take the MCAT and go DO!"

 

[aburnet2]

But objectively, what should I do? THANKS!

start shadowing if your still unsure.

If you want to get a headstart before your sure...
1 Sign up for classes to boost your cGPA a little.
2 Start preparing to take the MCAT
3 Start volunteering somewhere in the community, preferrable both medically related and some unrelated.
4 Work on making some good Doctor friends (phd's, MD's, DO's) for those letter of recs. You will need some from your old undergrad profs too so start that relationship again.
5 start thinking about what life experiences will make a good comeback story for you personal statement. Experience comes through better than bs, and you should have plenty experience since your nontrad. Use it to your advantage.

not necessarily in that order..

 

[thepoopologist]

If I were 29 years old I'd be more interested in getting a degree that will result in a job w/o a need for residency. Dentistry and Optometry would be my focuses. My person preference if I were in your situation would be Optometry since it's a cleaner job. You can make an argument for going into Podiatry too, but a lot of them are heading into residency, which will then make it the standard if you want any hope of a well paying job. Do not go into medicine unless you have the burning desire to do medicine. It is a seriously difficult even when you hold some interest in it. If you were to matriculate at 30, you would be pulling down a full physician paycheck at 37 at the earliest if you went to a 3 year residency. And that's assuming you don't fail and repeat a year. Still, if your app is cleaner on AACOMAS then I suppose you should apply to it.

But that's assuming you get into anything. Your grades are terrible. I'd spend another year taking courses a la carte to get that cGPA and sGPA up because you need to apply when you stand a realistic chance of acceptance, not before. Then you'll have to see how the standardized tests go before you decide. Frankly, I'd pick two or three professions that have an easier entry and go with those if your numbers have improved.

 

[rkschun]

If I were 29 years old I'd be more interested in getting a degree that will result in a job w/o a need for residency. Dentistry and Optometry would be my focuses. My person preference if I were in your situation would be Optometry since it's a cleaner job. You can make an argument for going into Podiatry too, but a lot of them are heading into residency, which will then make it the standard if you want any hope of a well paying job. Do not go into medicine unless you have the burning desire to do medicine. It is a seriously difficult even when you hold some interest in it. If you were to matriculate at 30, you would be pulling down a full physician paycheck at 37 at the earliest if you went to a 3 year residency. And that's assuming you don't fail and repeat a year. Still, if your app is cleaner on AACOMAS then I suppose you should apply to it.

But that's assuming you get into anything. Your grades are terrible. I'd spend another year taking courses a la carte to get that cGPA and sGPA up because you need to apply when you stand a realistic chance of acceptance, not before. Then you'll have to see how the standardized tests go before you decide. Frankly, I'd pick two or three professions that have an easier entry and go with those if your numbers have improved.

Thanks, I appreciate the objective response. Obviously, I'd prefer a shorter route, as in Dentistry or Optometry. But I am ready for a longer route. I am ready for anything that gives me a chance. I've even looked seriously into Caribbean schools, but with talk of the lack of residency matching in the future, limited loans, and riskiness, I decided not to. Without the AACOMAS gpa retakes, my cGPA is 2.5. Is that competitive for any professional school? With what I've seen, no. I know I've got some work to do...just point me in the right direction.

 

[rkschun]

Please more advice! I love the responses.

 

[thepoopologist]

Thanks, I appreciate the objective response. Obviously, I'd prefer a shorter route, as in Dentistry or Optometry. But I am ready for a longer route. I am ready for anything that gives me a chance. I've even looked seriously into Caribbean schools, but with talk of the lack of residency matching in the future, limited loans, and riskiness, I decided not to. Without the AACOMAS gpa retakes, my cGPA is 2.5. Is that competitive for any professional school? With what I've seen, no. I know I've got some work to do...just point me in the right direction.

I see your point. It would take another two years at least to get the cGPA to a 3.0.

Also...

You sound like you are seeking confirmation for a choice you've already made, which is to head for DO schools. By all means go for it and see where it takes you.

 

[Goro]

Look, Medicine (note the capitol "M") is a calling, like being a priest or a fireman. There's lots of other things you can do to have a life and a career. Get an MS in a lab science and be a lab mgr. Big Pharma and Academia are always starved for technicians, and they can make up to 60K/year.

I guarantee you that if you showed up at a medical school interview with attitude you have now, you'd be rejected before you left the room.

Thanks for the replies. I definitely know what you guys mean when you say do something that makes you happy. I enjoy learning. I also enjoy relaxing. But I really enjoy focus and a purposefulness. I want a career. Something where I am investing in myself and as I progress I can become more valuable in. I taught English abroad for three years, but I knew that there was no potential after that. Yes, it does seem like I am trying to get what I can, but that's what I am working with. With professional schools, there is no limit to my potential as a professional or as a business person. I have confidence in my work ethic. I just want confidence in my career path which is the most frustrating and oppressing aspect due to my situation. Please don't judge me! . I want to redeem myself.

 

[rkschun]

Look, Medicine (note the capitol "M") is a calling, like being a priest or a fireman. There's lots of other things you can do to have a life and a career. Get an MS in a lab science and be a lab mgr. Big Pharma and Academia are always starved for technicians, and they can make up to 60K/year.

I guarantee you that if you showed up at a medical school interview with attitude you have now, you'd be rejected before you left the room.

Is it a destiny? Were you born into it? Was it many peoples first thought as an occupation? I don't think so. Maybe, because their parents told them to do it, or they saw it as a respected profession. I respect the work, time, and effort that goes into med school to produce a doctor. And that's is probably one of the reasons that you say that it is a "calling". It's because of all the sacrifices you have to make to become a doctor, priest, or fireman. I'm upset that you are condescending to me because of my lack of options to be the best that I can be and do not fully understand my attitude.

 

[SammyJR]

Hi, this is my first time posting on SDN after lurking for about a year and a half. I am a nontrad 29 year old, who is finishing his a la carte post bacc at Uni. Did horrible in undergrad, worked for 3 years, decided to try to do dental, did the a la carte post bacc for 3 semesters to finish prereqs. Here are the stats.

uGPA: 2.2
post bacc GPA: 3.7(calc, stats, 2 orgo, 2 chem, 2 bio, 2 physics, a/p)

cGPA (now): 2.5
sGPA: 3.15

cGPA(aacomas using retakes) : 2.9
sGPAaacomas using retakes): 3.3

ECs: a few
Volunteer: 45 hrs
Shadow: only a dentist

So, I wanted to do dental, but with my stats I feel depressed everyday. Looking into DO programs gives me some kind of hope and motivation. I just want to start my career and have a focus where I can see light at the end of the tunnel.

I did very poorly in UG b/c I was lazy and didn't think that college was important. I had F's in fitness walking, lots of W, and just by looking at the transcript it should be known that I didn't give a %$#@. But I do now. I did well in high school, had a 1410 SAT, and AP credits for Spanish, Physics, Calc, and Psychology.

So, I was going to take the DAT this summer, but I feel like I have a better chance applying to DO schools because of their aacomas GPA retake policy. Without it, my cGPA would be stuck forever around 2.5.

So my question to you guys is: "What should I do?"

1) Should I keep taking courses a la carte? I can retake possibly 2 classes from UG to raise my cGPA a few more points, although they aren't premed related. In the mean time I can take higher level bio courses. Should I try to raise my cGPA to >3.0?

2) Should I take the DAT or MCAT? Is it a good idea for me to continue pursuing dentistry? Are my chances ok with DO programs? What about Podiatry or optometry?
I know I am jumping around to different professions, but right now I just want to start my life. I am completely happy studying any of these professions. I am 29 btw.

3) Should I go to an SMP, with all their loans and risk?

Thanks in advance. I know this is a long thread, but I wanted to be thorough so that you guys know my exact situation. That way you can give me better advice. Please take my 3 years of time off from school into account.

sounds like you answered your own question

don't go into medicine because you feel like dental schools won't accept your and DO is the easier route

take it one step at a time, ace the DAT, contact dental adcom and ask what you can improve on, continue to strive and follow your dream

good luck!

 

[HalfListic]

well, just some input:

You need to figure out what you want to pursue. No one can tell you what you want to be.


If I had to guess, Id say optometry would be a great choice for you. Get your GPA up, take the OAT, or whatever it is, and pursue that career. You will have a fulfilling life with a good earning potential and some control over your free time.

Its sort of too bad that you didn't take Goro's comment for what it was: insight from a medical school adcom member. Getting into medical school can be grueling, and then school, and then residency. Its a long road not to be fully committed to from the get go.

 

[drshark]

Is DO really much easier to get into than dental school? B/c I don't think this is necessarily true at all.

 

[IslandStyle808]

Look, Medicine (note the capitol "M") is a calling, like being a priest or a fireman. There's lots of other things you can do to have a life and a career. Get an MS in a lab science and be a lab mgr. Big Pharma and Academia are always starved for technicians, and they can make up to 60K/year.

I guarantee you that if you showed up at a medical school interview with attitude you have now, you'd be rejected before you left the room.

A professor of mine told me they make up to 80k/year (those with at least a masters), especially in Big Pharma.

 

[rkschun]

well, just some input:

You need to figure out what you want to pursue. No one can tell you what you want to be.


If I had to guess, Id say optometry would be a great choice for you. Get your GPA up, take the OAT, or whatever it is, and pursue that career. You will have a fulfilling life with a good earning potential and some control over your free time.

Its sort of too bad that you didn't take Goro's comment for what it was: insight from a medical school adcom member. Getting into medical school can be grueling, and then school, and then residency. Its a long road not to be fully committed to from the get go.

Respect be to Goro. I'm sure he has seen many people in my situation and knows what he's talking about. And in my situation anxiety and impatience run high making my thought process a bit irrational. I've done more research on what kind of path I want to take and how much work and time it will take to get there. Maybe optometry would be a good route for me. Thanks for all the replies!

 

[HalfListic]

Respect be to Goro. I'm sure he has seen many people in my situation and knows what he's talking about. And in my situation anxiety and impatience run high making my thought process a bit irrational. I've done more research on what kind of path I want to take and how much work and time it will take to get there. Maybe optometry would be a good route for me. Thanks for all the replies!

Good luck on whatever path you take!

 

[touchpause13]

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