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R2SS

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I wanted to write out what I am going through to ask everyone's opinion here and see if I should just give up on my dream and find something else or if I can still avenge myself...The situation is this:

I am going into my sophomore year of college. I started out as a neuroscience major but, after taking an upper level philosophy class, I realized I did very well at something else that I also really enjoyed, so I switched my major to philosophy with a pre-med track.

I am a brain tumor survivor. I underwent several operations and while I have removed the tumor, even several years later I am still dealing with obstacles including daily pain-some sever headaches on a weekly basis, AM nausea, etc. I struggled my freshemen year learning how to balance my pain and academics and have paid the price for it. My first semester GPA was a 2.3 and my second a 3.0. My grades in intro bio are a D- and a C and in Chem they are a D+ and a C-. Biology wasn't so much hard for me as I was simply never in class-they were VERY early AM and I was on a med schedule that often left me missing class to spend my AM hours throwing up or being super nauseous. Chemistry did not come so easily but it was harder to do well when dealing with some of my problems. In the last few months I have finally found something to keep most of my pain away and am much better than I have ever been.

My experience medically is what has made me want to become a doctor, specifically a neurologist, so as to help others who have had to deal with similar problems such as myself.

Recently, my adviser basically told me that I should stop trying now and that there is no way that I will get into an American Medical School.

I do not want to believe this as I am far too motivated and passionate. I realize that these are very poor grades. However, I am hoping that the philosophy will help some, as I have only gotten As and quite frankly am so confident in my abilities with it that I know I will not get lower than an A in any such class. I am moving on to molecular bio and organic chem in the fall and will be utilizing every possible resource to ensure that I pull as high a grade as possible in both, certainly no lower than a B if I can help it. They are also at later times and I am physically much healthier.

I thought/think that if I write very good essays (writing is one of my greatest strengths), have good LOTR and volunteer experience and a good MCAT score, that I may still have a chance....I also hope that some of life experience will allow me to stand out a little

My question to those of you at SDN is...is my goal of getting into medical school still attainable despite a poor start, or am I doomed to fail?

Thank you very much!
 
Two choices....

1. (harder choice) Get a 3.9+ for 4 years worth of class work, hence bring your GPA up. Def mention your reason for poor performance in your PS.

2. Retake those class and apply DO. Get a 3.5+ from here forward.
 
You're not "doomed to fail." My best advice is work hard to be exactly what you want to be with one caveat:

Don't force things. You'll know if your forcing things, and you may need to slow down or consider other avenues. Just remain self-reflective---you know, evaluate your situation periodically to make sure you are on the right path for you. Sounds like you have abilities in other areas (philosophy, writing, communication etc.) so move toward your personal career goal, just always have a backup plan.
 
I don't want to sugarcoat things, but sometimes life just doesn't let you do what you want. Those are some pretty hard hits, but if you truly believe that is what you want to do, then you have no choice but to try.
 
I don't think you're doomed because of your past grades, but I think what's going to hurt you is your health. Med school starts early and being a doctor starts early too. Most doctors are at work by 7 a.m., some as early as 5 a.m. If you have a problem with mornings, I don't think that's going to go over well with the adcoms. Also, you said you have chronic pain. How will you be expected to keep up with the rigors of med school? How will you be able to work a brutal third-year schedule, including call? How will you handle residency? I think these are all going to come up.

It doesn't matter how many A's you get in Philosophy classes if you can't get A's in the sciences, unfortunately.

I don't know what to tell you. I feel for you because I think you're an amazing person who's been dealt a bad hand in life and you're turning it into something selfless and noble. I hope you can make it, but first, I'd focus on getting yourself healthy enough to be able to withstand the difficulty of medical training.
 
I'm a firm believer in the idea that if you want something bad enough, the whole world will come together and make it happen for you! Yes, if that's what you want, then work hard and accomplish your dream of becoming a doctor. You are strong, you overcame a brain tumor and if you work diligently, you will become a doctor. It's just matter of when! Take more classes and do well and increase your GPA. Also try to get involved in a few EC's. Use your adversity to help you, in your application,
Demonstrate how your journey only increased your drive of becoming a doctor. Strong People like you should become doctors. Your story is one of the reasons medicine is worth studying.
 
@ Gabby...like I said, I've finally found a treatment that's improved my pain to where I've been alright, it has just taken forever. The AM nausea has also been eliminated, and the other treatments I was having were moved to later afternoon so I don't have to worry about other...Granted, I know that I still may have some issues and I will do what I can to get through them.

Yes I know this too...I do think that being a Honors Phil candidate sets you aside in that your not the same old science major. I will be retaking all of these classes so that they're replaced with higher grades however, I do believe I still have to report the old scores on the AMCAS anyway.

And I refuse to do as poorly as I did the first time around, so I will make the As or at least Bs happen from here on out, I just don't want my past to ruin me.

@sonia-Thank you very much. I was hoping that my adversity will in some ways help, but I also refuse to allow it to be a reason for me to not perform better. 🙂
 
First off, having survived brain cancer is quite a feat...I applaud you:clap:

You've already overcome a lot, why give up now? The advice given above was very sound. In a nutshell, "if there's a will then there IS a way." I suppose it all comes down to how much you want it, so first do a little self-evaluation and decide what you want to do with your life.

Plenty of people have poor freshmen years. Use your current grade status as motivation to completely rock 3-4 more years of classes. I'm not an expert, but DO schools seem to be more forgiving of course grades, as in they let you retake classes and only count the higher attempt. MD schools just average the two. I would shoot for the stars and go for the MD school. Enter your sophomore year with something to prove and let nothing (even the nerdiest of the premeds) get in your way. Peace and good luck brother!

P.S. Gosh darn it, I absolutely hate to say this but here goes: You will have a killer personal statement.
 
If anyone else could provide input that'd be helpful
 
I think if you can make a good enough grade to make pass the computer screenings, you are very likely to find sympathetic audiences in adcom. Best of luck :luck:
 
the world is your oyster. think of it this way: there are people out there with your exact same dream - only they already have 150+ credits of 3.0 cgpa work. your situation, so far as becoming a physician is concerned, is far more encouraging.

your future is yet unwritten (sorry 90's popstar with that same lyric :laugh:) you could still elevate to a 3.6+ cgpa, which is plenty adequate. with a marvelous life story to boot. at 19yo, everything is still possible. let no one tell you otherwise.
 
I'm going to interject a bit of reality into the lovefest. If you're barely passing in sophomore level undergrad, where I PROMISE the course load is so much lighter than medical school, what makes you think you can handle medical school. Yeah, love your story, choked me up . . . but simply having a tumor and wanting really, really, really, really bad does not a doctor make.

Glad you survived, but get a grip, you are NOT special. Get the grades to be competitive or don't. You don't need our help, you need to come to Jesus and see what's what.
 
I'm going to interject a bit of reality into the lovefest. If you're barely passing in sophomore level undergrad, where I PROMISE the course load is so much lighter than medical school, what makes you think you can handle medical school. Yeah, love your story, choked me up . . . but simply having a tumor and wanting really, really, really, really bad does not a doctor make.

Glad you survived, but get a grip, you are NOT special. Get the grades to be competitive or don't. You don't need our help, you need to come to Jesus and see what's what.

OP didn't need to be slapped, he needed encouragement. he asked if his goals were

still attainable despite a poor start

and they are. right now, as a sophomore, he doesn't need your attitude.

come back when he posts about his 2.7 cgpa as a 5th year senior.
 
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You have a good point. But some undergrad pre-med classes are setup to weed out ppl, so the supposedly easy class is made harder than they should be. Classes tend to get easier when you get to upper level.

I'm not denying med school has crazy courseload, just that OP has a long time to learn to manage his condition. If things can work out, I still think he has a decent chance.
 
I'm going to interject a bit of reality into the lovefest. If you're barely passing in sophomore level undergrad, where I PROMISE the course load is so much lighter than medical school, what makes you think you can handle medical school. Yeah, love your story, choked me up . . . but simply having a tumor and wanting really, really, really, really bad does not a doctor make.

Glad you survived, but get a grip, you are NOT special. Get the grades to be competitive or don't. You don't need our help, you need to come to Jesus and see what's what.

I don't recall saying "I'm special" throughout ANY of what I wrote. I have no problem with someone trying to give their honest opinion. However, to say what you said is uncalled for and also offensive and I don't intend to not respond to it. My story was, in all honesty, merely to provide a reason for why I got them and I certainly think it a better reason than just saying "I partied too much and didn't care enough."

I also never utilized my story as an excuse to continue to perform poorly and still hope to get somewhere. I had hoped that my determination and resolve to do whatever I can to do better would shine through my words.

Also, what does coming to Jesus have to do with anything? I will say this much to you as you are obviously a bit ignorant...I have had quite a serious taste of mortality and learned "what's what" from it all-perhaps it is you who has yet to do so. To me, affliction is affluent and is the means through which one can develop a resolute comprehension of our existence.

Thanks for your input, though.


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OP didn't need to be slapped, he needed encouragement. he asked if his goals were



and they are. right now, as a sophomore, he doesn't need your attitude.

come back when he posts about his 2.7 cgpa as a 5th year senior.


Thank you for this...I'm also female 😉
 
I don't recall saying "I'm special" throughout ANY of what I wrote. I have no problem with someone trying to give their honest opinion. However, to say what you said is uncalled for and also offensive and I don't intend to not respond to it. My story was, in all honesty, merely to provide a reason for why I got them and I certainly think it a better reason than just saying "I partied too much and didn't care enough."

I also never utilized my story as an excuse to continue to perform poorly and still hope to get somewhere. I had hoped that my determination and resolve to do whatever I can to do better would shine through my words.

Also, what does coming to Jesus have to do with anything? I will say this much to you as you are obviously a bit ignorant...I have had quite a serious taste of mortality and learned "what's what" from it all-perhaps it is you who has yet to do so. To me, affliction is affluent and is the means through which one can develop a resolute comprehension of our existence.

Thanks for your input, though.


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dude, take it easy.

Apparently you haven't hang around this forum long enough, there's always a lot of colorful opinions, and a lot of trolls. After all, this is an internet forum, don't take these offenses too seriously.

Edit: My bad, not dude =]
 
dude, take it easy.

Apparently you haven't hang around this forum long enough, there's always a lot of colorful opinions, and a lot of trolls. After all, this is an internet forum, don't take these offenses too seriously.

Edit: My bad, not dude =]

I'm very open to all opinions and harsh criticism is always appreciated. When someone throws the specialness crap at me, I think it's worth it that I clarify, that's all. Not real bothered 😎

🙂
 
Statistically speaking, it's unlikely you'll be accepted MD if you apply directly after undergrad, even assuming 3.9+ for the rest of your college career. However, if you want it badly enough, there are avenues available to you. There's always a way.

If by the end of undergrad your stats aren't baseline competitive (say, at least a 3.5 GPA and a 33Q MCAT) I would suggest you seek out a post-bac program or take a few years to get some experience in the medical field. I realize it is difficult to put off something you want so badly, but it'll open more doors for you if you work to prove that you really do want this. If you can manage it, maybe apply to graduate schools or get licensed as an EMT at that point.

However, if your stats are competitive (end of senior year, not junior; that wouldn't give nearly enough time), I think there should be nothing holding you back. You'll have a heck of a PS, from the looks of things, and assuming you involve yourself in things you enjoy, you'll probably have a great interview. You'll have as much a chance as any of us.

The advice I'd give you is: retake your chem and bio. Get amazing grades. Take other science and math classes (if you feel they're at your level) to boost the sGPA and give you a firmer grasp of information that might be on the MCAT. Study hard and keep your goal in mind.

So can you do it? Yes. You most certainly can. But keep in mind, it's going to be hard. It might be the hardest thing you'll ever do, and there's no getting around how much effort it'll take. But with drive and dedication, I think in ten years, you can go back to your premed adviser in your shiny new lab coat with your doctorate under your arm and let her know how wrong she was.
 
Have you looked into academic forgiveness/renewal through your school due to your health problems?

You need A's in your pre-reqs. You need to retake the BIOs and CHEMs. Organic and Physics are only going to be more difficult. If you apply for DO then your sciGPA will be more competitive after the retakes.
It is definitely doable. You're a survivor. Make sure you take the classes to not only get A's but to master and retain the info for the MCAT.
 
OP didn't need to be slapped, he needed encouragement. he asked if his goals were

and they are. right now, as a sophomore, he doesn't need your attitude.

come back when he posts about his 2.7 cgpa as a 5th year senior.

I have yet to interject any "attitude". I merely laid a heavy dose of what I thought reality was in this situation. Wish and dream into one hand and crap into the other and tell me which fills up first.
 
I don't recall saying "I'm special" throughout ANY of what I wrote. I have no problem with someone trying to give their honest opinion. However, to say what you said is uncalled for and also offensive and I don't intend to not respond to it. My story was, in all honesty, merely to provide a reason for why I got them and I certainly think it a better reason than just saying "I partied too much and didn't care enough."

I also never utilized my story as an excuse to continue to perform poorly and still hope to get somewhere. I had hoped that my determination and resolve to do whatever I can to do better would shine through my words.

Also, what does coming to Jesus have to do with anything? I will say this much to you as you are obviously a bit ignorant...I have had quite a serious taste of mortality and learned "what's what" from it all-perhaps it is you who has yet to do so. To me, affliction is affluent and is the means through which one can develop a resolute comprehension of our existence.

Thanks for your input, though.

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My goal was to give a dose of reality, not be offensive. It's rather unfortunate that you took offense, but your feelings are your own and I'm not responsible for them.

Your story reeked to me of trying to get across that you were special because you've had a tumor. If this was not your intent, then I believe you, but I would also point out if this is what I heard, others will too. Perhaps you need to change your presentation of this topic.

Come to Jesus . . . urban dictionary is your friend. Sometimes I forget my audience in here consists of kids, and they may not get my references unless they are obvious.

If you find such value in affliction, a noble philosophy, then I wish you much pain.

I don't think you have a snowball's chance in hell. Prove me wrong. Good luck.
 
I'm going to interject a bit of reality into the lovefest. If you're barely passing in sophomore level undergrad, where I PROMISE the course load is so much lighter than medical school, what makes you think you can handle medical school. Yeah, love your story, choked me up . . . but simply having a tumor and wanting really, really, really, really bad does not a doctor make.

Glad you survived, but get a grip, you are NOT special. Get the grades to be competitive or don't. You don't need our help, you need to come to Jesus and see what's what.

^ You're an A-hole

I don't think you're doomed because of your past grades, but I think what's going to hurt you is your health. Med school starts early and being a doctor starts early too. Most doctors are at work by 7 a.m., some as early as 5 a.m. If you have a problem with mornings, I don't think that's going to go over well with the adcoms. Also, you said you have chronic pain. How will you be expected to keep up with the rigors of med school? How will you be able to work a brutal third-year schedule, including call? How will you handle residency? I think these are all going to come up.

OP said he's got his pain under control, so assuming s/he continues to keep a handle on it, medical school should be doable. I'm sure there are plenty of other med students dealing with illnesses. If you are really motivated to do something, there isn't much that can keep you from it.

Two choices....

1. (harder choice) Get a 3.9+ for 4 years worth of class work, hence bring your GPA up. Def mention your reason for poor performance in your PS.

2. Retake those class and apply DO. Get a 3.5+ from here forward.

This! Besides, OP is only a sophomore. There is plenty of opportunity to improve GPA, plus a damn good reason for the poor grades freshman year.

Go for it OP!
 
I have yet to interject any "attitude". I merely laid a heavy dose of what I thought reality was in this situation. Wish and dream into one hand and crap into the other and tell me which fills up first.


dude, who pissed you off today that you have to take it off here? 😕

Honest opinions are good but they don't have to be so confrontational.
 
dude, who pissed you off today that you have to take it off here? 😕

Honest opinions are good but they don't have to be so confrontational.

I told why I posted in the first place, and I kind of thought it was obvious.

You don't like my style. It's been noted in the minutes.
 
How nice to find a resident who wishes pain on others. That's great. I'd never say such a thing to anyone.

I do find great value in overcoming affliction or more broadly, adversity. Go ask people like Ben Carson or Fred Epstein or Dr. Alfredo Quinones-Hinojosa, etc.

Not getting a reference has nothing to do with being a kid. I also suggest you not be so presumptuous.


Thanks and I will. Your confrontational attitude, which is exactly what it is, is uncalled for. Have a good night



My goal was to give a dose of reality, not be offensive. It's rather unfortunate that you took offense, but your feelings are your own and I'm not responsible for them.

Your story reeked to me of trying to get across that you were special because you've had a tumor. If this was not your intent, then I believe you, but I would also point out if this is what I heard, others will too. Perhaps you need to change your presentation of this topic.

Come to Jesus . . . urban dictionary is your friend. Sometimes I forget my audience in here consists of kids, and they may not get my references unless they are obvious.

If you find such value in affliction, a noble philosophy, then I wish you much pain.

I don't think you have a snowball's chance in hell. Prove me wrong. Good luck.
 
I'm going to interject a bit of reality into the lovefest. If you're barely passing in sophomore level undergrad, where I PROMISE the course load is so much lighter than medical school, what makes you think you can handle medical school. Yeah, love your story, choked me up . . . but simply having a tumor and wanting really, really, really, really bad does not a doctor make.

Glad you survived, but get a grip, you are NOT special. Get the grades to be competitive or don't. You don't need our help, you need to come to Jesus and see what's what.

You stated that by writing this, you wanted to inject some reality into this thread, right? Let me show you how you could've done it without it coming off as an attack:

I hate to sound negative when everyone's so optimistic, but I think that your chances aren't that good. Undergraduate coursework is going to be much easier than medical school coursework, and it seems like you're having trouble as it is. Are you sure you'd be equipped to handle the amount of work medical school requires? I realize you've had health problems, but it seems like there may be other problems that might surface later.

It's amazing that you beat cancer, but medical schools get a lot of applicants with extraordinary situations. It's not as unique as some people are making it out to be, and it won't help you that much when their stats are better than yours. It's up to you to earn the grades required to make you competitive. Maybe instead of asking us for help, you should look at your own situation a little closer and see what other factors might be involved in the past and in the future.

Now, would that have been so difficult?
 
To the OP: Pre-allo is an open forum, and you have to expect, given the nature of your question, that some folks will answer the "WAMC" question you asked with "not good." It would be nice if they did so gently, but it isn't mandatory.

If you would like to ensure that those types of responses are not posted, then you can ask for your thread to be moved to Confidential Consult and you won't get hostile responses because we won't post them. However, you won't get as MANY responses either. It is your choice.

As far as your question is concerned, no one can answer it until you've taken more classes and the MCAT, etc. Certainly it is possible to improve your GPA and take the MCAT and do well. Your life story will be of great interest to adcom members, but you must still have reasonable numbers for your overall GPA and MCAT like anyone else. I suggest you move forward with classes and see how this next year goes academically and health wise and then reevaluate.

Best of luck
 
How nice to find a resident who wishes pain on others. That's great. I'd never say such a thing to anyone.

I do find great value in overcoming affliction or more broadly, adversity. Go ask people like Ben Carson or Fred Epstein or Dr. Alfredo Quinones-Hinojosa, etc.

Not getting a reference has nothing to do with being a kid. I also suggest you not be so presumptuous.


Thanks and I will. Your confrontational attitude, which is exactly what it is, is uncalled for. Have a good night

I wished you pain within a certain context. You can try and go back see what that context was, and this time try not to be offended by it.

You're not a kid? Ok, but most people in here are. That also was not meant to offend you.

The world is kind of a confrontational place quite often, especially in medicine. You seem to get offended easily.
 
Now, would that have been so difficult?

I don't know if difficult is the right question . . . it's not my style. You post the way you do and I post the way I do. It's an extension of personality. I would not more expect you to post the way I do, any more than I think you should expect me to post the way you do. Unrealistic expectations are one of the biggest sources pain for many, many people. I accept there are people like you, perhaps it is not too much to suggest you accept there are people like me.

EDIT:
they_live_deal_w_It.gif
 
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OP,

My dad often gives me advice in a blunt fashion w/o regard to my feelings. What I've learned to do is this: Ignore the tone of his advice, but look for any truth that might be in it. The tone of offered advice is of no use to you (except insofar as your reaction to it can be telling)---but you can use truth.

Best of luck to you. 🙂
 
lol, now you are asking to get banned. :laugh:

Insinuating that someone made cupcakes for an admin is enough to get banned?! 😱

What is this world coming to?!
 
You need a letter from the dean that gives you medical accommodations, it'll take so much stress off your plate.
 
You need a letter from the dean that gives you medical accommodations, it'll take so much stress off your plate.


I'm not sure how useful medical accommodations is in college, but in high school, it's just a paperwork so that the teachers don't fail the student, and most teachers have no clues how the accommodations work. If it works similarly in college, I'm not sure how helpful it is.
 
I'm not sure how useful medical accommodations is in college, but in high school, it's just a paperwork so that the teachers don't fail the student, and most teachers have no clues how the accommodations work. If it works similarly in college, I'm not sure how helpful it is.

I was dx'ed with Crohn's when I was 11. Ileostomy in sophomore year. Through middle school and high school I had a 504 plan that gave me the ability to miss however much school i needed to and reasonable time to make up whatever work I missed.

In college I now have a letter from the dean excusing me from class if i need to due to illness, time and a half on any and all exams (if i need to be late to an exam due to complications, pain from stress as a large part is also psychological, etc), and anything else i may need. Being in college I've realized that I can't miss class just for a stomach ache as it's incredibly hard to catch up if you miss a lecture, but it's still an option.

So the accommodations are definitely there. If they aren't willing to help you out, there are tons of lawyers who would jump on your case to help you out.
 
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