Poll: Did you apply to both MD and DO?

[labgirl]

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For current DO students or those who have been accepted to a DO program, did you apply only to DO programs or to both MD and DO programs?

 

[labgirl]

Thanks to all who have voted! Lets see some more votes--so far there have been 121 views and only a handful of votes. Anyone else??

 

[snurpy]

What is the point of this thread?

 

[MichiganDO]

The AAMC published a study comparing the MD, DO, and IMG applicant pools. The article was published earlier this year.

It showed around 2/3 (~66%) of DO applicants applied to both MD and DO schools. There were around 12,000 applicants for 4000 DO slots (give or take) and of these applicants around 7000- 8000 applied MD as well.

Interestingly with a 4000 MD seat increase, what will this do to our DO applicant pool? The AOA should must get serious about degree change soon, as more and more potential applicants will shift into MD programs over the next 10 years. Why? Simply bc of this unmarketable degree we refuse to give up.

Its no surprise we have seen the Dean of NOVA and TCOM both suggest title change to a degree with the letter M for the MEDICINE we all practice, over the O for the osteopathy none of us practice.
The schools will be the first part to feel the MD expansions impact on the applicant pool. Then, our job market will suffer as well as more and more MDs enter the workforce with titles recognizable to more than 15% of the country.

I know this isnt the sunshine everyone wants to hear, but medicine is a business, and we dont have the upper hand with a degree that misrepresents our scope of practice simply for historical purpose and pride. Im sure these remarks will offend someone, but we can no longer look away from this issue.

 

[Doctor Bob]

Its no surprise we have seen the Dean of NOVA and TCOM both suggest title change to a degree with the letter M for the MEDICINE we all practice, over the O for the osteopathy none of us practice.

Dean Silvagni said that? Wow. He was always so steadfast in his support of the individuality of the profession and the need to keep it's distinctiveness.

I wonder... if all the DO schools and the AOA come together and decided to change the degree they granted... what would happen to all the alumni? Would their degree change as well?

 

[MichiganDO]

NOVAs dean suggested a title change at last years AOA convention, it was shot down. TCOM is in the midst of a heated MD program debate until August.

I would think the profession could make this massive change if a few leaders would just step up and address that the profession simply stands separate today due to history. The schools teach the same medicine as allopathic schools and MDs and DOs all practice by the same standards.

For one, this already happened once, in Cali. That merge was DO driven.

Second, other proffessions have done the same as of recent. Chiros unified under the DC degree and Pods changed to the DPM degree, including those that were already in practice. Both of these professions did so to clarify their scope of practice/designation so that the public would better recognize their training and what they practice (we practice medicine).

If we practiced osteopathy as AT Still did in 1910 the DO degree would make sense. The reality of today is the system is separate due to politics, history, pride, and money, NOT bc of the way we all practice medicine. With todays growing "doctorate for everything" in healthcare movement, I personally believe we are shooting ourselves in the foot not to consider better representing ourselves with a different designation, or simply just merging the AOA under the AMA and unifying physician providers.

I dont see how we preach the need for a separate system, especially when our current, past, and new AOA presidents are specialists (Ortho, Opthal, GI). Really? Are they practicing osteopathic medicine?

If we as DOs could get over this hump of separation from MDs, instead of this nonsense separate but equal system, we could better represent ourselves, training and scope of practice with a more correct title. Again, thats on our leadership who as of today seem fit endorsing for profit DO schools and burning TCOM for even considering this idea of an MD degree.

Oh yeah, were not bone doctors either.

 

[linkDO]

yes, Dean Silvagni wants "MDO". we had an article about it in our quarterly med school paper a while back.

 

[Dissected]

Im not too worried about it. Name change or no name change, we'll all be doctors someday.

 

[liquid8r]

If this degree/name change would take effect (unlikely any time soon IMO) what would happen to the 60,000 DO's currently practicing? Would their degrees be changed retroactively? Also, while the proposed MDO degree (DOM anyone?) better represents the current trend of osteopathic education, I feel it would still confuse the public and accomplish little overall. I guess I feel that the only worthwhile shift to occur would be DO ----->MD and be done with it.

John Doe, MD, OMM

This seems easier for the public and still maintains individuality from our allopathic counterparts. Plus it looks pretty cool. My .02.

 

[labgirl]

Hey everyone, thanks for voting in my poll! 😀

What is the point of this thread?

The reason I was curious is that on three different campus tours at DO schools, all the student tour guides that I spoke with said they applied only to DO schools. I was just trying to ascertain whether applying to my instate MD school was going to have a negative effect on my DO applications since I have a strong DO preference. Considering the results of the poll, and of the study posted above in this thread, it doesn't sound like it is going to be detrimental to my apps.

 

[engineeredout]

It showed around 2/3 (~66%) of DO applicants applied to both MD and DO schools.

INteresting that the pool is showing the same results.

 

[jmanpatsfan]

If this degree/name change would take effect (unlikely any time soon IMO) what would happen to the 60,000 DO's currently practicing? Would their degrees be changed retroactively? Also, while the proposed MDO degree (DOM anyone?) better represents the current trend of osteopathic education, I feel it would still confuse the public and accomplish little overall. I guess I feel that the only worthwhile shift to occur would be DO ----->MD and be done with it.

John Doe, MD, OMM

This seems easier for the public and still maintains individuality from our allopathic counterparts. Plus it looks pretty cool. My .02.

The MD, OMM degree sounds very interesting. I would go for that.

 

[MichiganDO]

Hmmm.... I wouldnt bring it up unless asked, but if so, be honest.

We should run this question in the MD blogs and see how many applied to DO schools🙂

 

[rkaz]

Hmmm.... I wouldnt bring it up unless asked, but if so, be honest.

We should run this question in the MD blogs and see how many applied to DO schools🙂

The percentages would be much smaller. Not because there is anything necessarily wrong with DO education, but simply because many of us have only recently heard about it (if at all). I only heard about DOs about 6 years ago, but still knew very little about them (as I'd never been to a DO physician that I knew of). I never even considered a DO program as a viable medical school option until less than 2 years ago. I would guess that many people who have never been a patient of a DO would (ignorantly) consider them midlevels... only after we visit a DO physician in practice do we realize there isn't much difference, or that some DOs are even better than MDs (if they use the psychosocial 'good bedside manner' attentive approach with their patients).

I went to a potluck a few months ago, and was talking to this physician (who did her MD education and residency at Hopkins). She was almost 40 years old. I told her I was most likely going to matriculate at a DO school this year, and she asked "Why wouldn't you just get an MD instead? Don't DOs get paid much less?" She was stunned to hear that DOs make the same amount of money as MDs and could participate in the same MD residencies, as she said when she was at Hopkins there weren't any DOs in her program. I told her it might be possible for DOs as a whole to get paid less than MDs (for the simple reason that DOs as a whole may be more likely to go into primary care fields). But within a specialty, the pay is the same. This really surprised her. I think that's a good reason why everyone should get an MD degree (with a certificate in osteopathy for those of us who go through osteopathic coursework). The problem is simply that there isn't visibility of DOs nationally or internationally. And people just call DOs as 'osteopaths' instead of 'medical doctors'.

 

[link2swim06]

Hmmm.... I wouldnt bring it up unless asked, but if so, be honest.

We should run this question in the MD blogs and see how many applied to DO schools🙂

I would think a lot have

 

[Styria]

For one, this already happened once, in Cali. That merge was DO driven.

The shenanigans in California only hurt the former DOs there.

 

[TeamZissou]

The shenanigans in California only hurt the former DOs there.

Could you elaborate?

 

[Bacchus]

I applied to both. Going to undergrad in Philadelphia and having my stats I didn't have much of a choice. I knew I'd end up in Philly for my medical education despite getting offers across the state and in VA. I probably could have going to IA or IL too, but withdrew from interviews. It really doesn't make a difference from me. I had a shot of going to Jefferson, but the admissions office got to me too late (wanted to interview 4/1) so I politely declined. I'll probably stay in PA or the surrounding states so the degree shouldn't be too much of a public hindrance since all of the states surrounding PA sans MD and DE have DO schools.

 

[tatstyl]

MD,DO is better than MDO OR DOM. if you specialize in OMM, then call your self MD,DO if you are just a physician or surgeon, call yourself MD. Why saying DO when you don't manipulate? why bother anyway? who cares?