Post Bacc vs. Masters in Bio

[saxyukie]

Hi,

I have a question:

I recently sent an e-mail to someone who got into med school the non-traditionally way.. he have said that despite a high post-bacc gpa, I might still get rejected because of my undergrad grade (3.1 from a top tier university). He also said that when i get reject, i should go and complete a masters of biology and try again...

My question is.. is it better to then do a post-bacc or a masters of biology? I am working full-time and can not afford to take classes during the day (i'm figuring a M in biology might require day time classes) I'm torn - because if the biology gives me a better chance, then I'll have to decide, but if there's no difference..i'll like to keep with post-bacc ( i also heard that the post-bacc gets factor into my undergrad grade)

Another question - how good are my chance of getting into med school if my post bacc if I have a 3.6gpa and a MCAT of 31

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[mshheaddoc]

is your post-bacc meaning you do not have the pre-reqs? If you are serious about medical school and already have your pre-reqs done, an upper level post-bacc/special masters program like BU, Georgetown, etc would be the way to go. Sometimes to make up for a low undergrad you have to make sacrafices. Many have done it while working full time but if you do, I warn you to spread it out and don't overwhelm yourself.

We can't advise you on whether you would get in with your stats because every school is different. I'm sure you would have a chance.

 

[relentless11]

If you can get into the well known special masters programs (SMPs) like at Georgetown etc, that would be good. However please note, if you are taking upper division undergrad courses as post-bacc, then that should increase your overall undergraduate GPA. That is the ONLY way to go if you are intent on bring up your undergrad GPA.

Traditional masters programs (e.g. not SMPs), the majority of your courses will be graduate level, and thus not included in your undergraduate GPA. The only reason why SMPs work is because you take med school courses, and obviously doing well in med school courses can shake away any adcom fears of you not performing well in med school.

Most of the time, for those with low undergrad GPA, the best route is post-bacc since SMPs are far and few on the west coast, competative to get into, and quite expensive. Doing a masters degree aftering being rejected is an odd recommendation considering you have a 3.1 GPA. As I stated in other threads, that is quite low, and might even cause you to be screened out if the GPA cut-off is >3.1. One exception (that i know of) to this masters thing is for UCLA. They state that if you reapply, you should do post-bacc or a graduate program to boost your chances of getting in. However the vast majority of input i've received from other school's (rest of the UC's, and Stanford) recommend doing post-bacc over any grad program.

 

[Sol Rosenberg]

Another question - how good are my chance of getting into med school if my post bacc if I have a 3.6gpa and a MCAT of 31

I'm not totally sure of what you are saying here. Are you saying that you think you will raise your previous 3.1 GPA to a cumulative 3.6 GPA through your postbac classes? Or, are you saying you only expect to get a 3.6 in your postbac classes?

First off, I think it would be mathematically impossible to raise the 3.1 to a 3.6 with 1 or 2 years of post-bac, so I am not going to consider that possibility.

If your post-bac GPA was a 3.6, you would raise your overall GPA to, at most, a 3.2. A 3.2 with a 31 MCAT does not give you very good chances for allopathic schools (Here in TX, the average matriculant had a 3.65 GPA with a 28 MCAT.) Nevertheless, if I recall, there WERE people accepted with stats like yours, so it is not IMPOSSIBLE to get in with those stats. If you could manage to get a 4.0 in your postbac, I think it would send signals that you are SERIOUS about going to medical school, and that MIGHT win you some points (in addition to boosting your GPA more, of course)

From what I have read here, I am not sure how higher (i.e. Master's) degrees are looked upon by ADCOMS. Many assert that they don't really help you, but, to me, that violates the law of common sense. When comparing two applicants, I would think that someone who has gone on and earned an advanced degree (let's assume that they do very well in their Master's program) would be looked upon more favorably. Others claim that this is not the case <shrug>. Of course, I'm biased because I have a Master's degree

Also, have you already taken the MCAT (i.e. is the 31 your real score, or a hypothetical score?) If you haven't already taken it yet and think you might be able to get a 35+ that would also help (again, here in TX, the average score for matriculants was a 28)

Good Luck,

Jota

 

[relentless11]

I think hypothesizing GPA and MCAT scores is worthless..haha. Considering even with high stats, you may not get into the school you want, and secondly one is assuming you are getting those stats. I'd personally focus on getting the best possible score, rather than base them on "what, if, ands, ors".

Really, in terms of the averages reported by the University of California, a post-bacc GPA of 3.6 and MCAT of 31 may not get you far. They are showing an overall UG GPA of 3.7 (not post-bacc), and MCAT of 33. The national average shows an overall GPA of like 3.5-3.6, and an MCAT of 30. So all you're saying is based on just post-bacc GPA, and MCAT, you are average. But since med schools count all undergrad grades, your GPA will be <3.6. Trends are good, but how much it'll help you depends on the classes you take, how many classes you take (e.g.: workload), and how well you do in those classes. Then factor in, the person reviewing your application.

 

[moranwoods]

I got into Colorado on my first try with the following stats:

Undergrad GPA (electrical engineering): 3.51
Graduate GPA (electrical engineering): 3.79
Post-Bac courses GPA: 3.87

MCAT: PS10, BS:9, VR:9, Writing-R

I applied to schools located only in the mountain west/pacific NW.

There's no steadfast formula, but it sounds like you're best bet is applying at state schools.

Good luck!

 

[phoenix33]

Moranwoods,

Where did you do your post-bacc?

I got into Colorado on my first try with the following stats:

Undergrad GPA (electrical engineering): 3.51
Graduate GPA (electrical engineering): 3.79
Post-Bac courses GPA: 3.87

MCAT: PS10, BS:9, VR:9, Writing-R

I applied to schools located only in the mountain west/pacific NW.

There's no steadfast formula, but it sounds like you're best bet is applying at state schools.

Good luck!

 

[chrisjohn]

Had a split undergraduate career several years a part, military service. First half sucked. Second half rocked. Took all pre-med courses again, A'd them all, history degree, 30 + MCAT, no love from my state school.

Two years later, MS Biology w/ thesis 30+ MCAT but higher, love from my state school.

There isn't a formula other than being tenacious.

 

[trigirl24]

If you can get into the well known special masters programs (SMPs) like at Georgetown etc, that would be good. However please note, if you are taking upper division undergrad courses as post-bacc, then that should increase your overall undergraduate GPA. That is the ONLY way to go if you are intent on bring up your undergrad GPA.

Traditional masters programs (e.g. not SMPs), the majority of your courses will be graduate level, and thus not included in your undergraduate GPA. The only reason why SMPs work is because you take med school courses, and obviously doing well in med school courses can shake away any adcom fears of you not performing well in med school.

Most of the time, for those with low undergrad GPA, the best route is post-bacc since SMPs are far and few on the west coast, competative to get into, and quite expensive. Doing a masters degree aftering being rejected is an odd recommendation considering you have a 3.1 GPA. As I stated in other threads, that is quite low, and might even cause you to be screened out if the GPA cut-off is >3.1. One exception (that i know of) to this masters thing is for UCLA. They state that if you reapply, you should do post-bacc or a graduate program to boost your chances of getting in. However the vast majority of input i've received from other school's (rest of the UC's, and Stanford) recommend doing post-bacc over any grad program.

If you are enrolled in a master's program, is it possible to take general post bac classes concurrently that wouldn't count towards fulfilling any of the master's requirements, but WOULD count towards improving undergrad gpa? For example, can one take general biology classes, while enrolled in an MPH program, and have those classes boost your undergrad gpa?. . .I've heard conflicting stories.

 

[relentless11]

If you are enrolled in a master's program, is it possible to take general post bac classes concurrently that wouldn't count towards fulfilling any of the master's requirements, but WOULD count towards improving undergrad gpa? For example, can one take general biology classes, while enrolled in an MPH program, and have those classes boost your undergrad gpa?. . .I've heard conflicting stories.

According to our pre-med advisors at UCD AND director of admissions at UCDSOM, the answer is yes. Aslong as these courses are upper division undergraduate level. This should also apply regardless if the undergrad class was required for your graduate degree. Besides it makes sense. AMCAS classifies coursework as undergrad, post-bacc and graduate. Undergrad are classes taken when you were trying to earn a BS/BA degree. Post-bacc are non-grad level coursework taken after getting your BS/BA degree. Graduate is of course grad level classes. Therefore since these undergrad courses are after your BS/BA degree, and not considered grad level, they should be post-bacc, and thus post-bacc adds into your overall undergrad coursework GPA.

The important thing is these classes should be upper division undergrad. For one, some grad programs won't give you a grade if you take a lower division class. My program gives me an "X" grade for lower div coursework..lol. However adcoms may understand that there may be classes that require a lower division class. I did a few lower division classes to allow me to take upper division BME classes. The director of admissions said that was no problem aslong as the vast majority of my post-bacc work was upper div. So yea...hope that helps.