post match

[whispers]

---

Members don't see this ad.

To those who have recently matched. Could we start a thread to help some folks down the pipeline? I have a few thoughts on programs I'd love to go to but I want to be realistic.

--Board Scores:
--AOA and class rank: if known
--Reputation of medical school: (top 10, top 25, etc)
--Research:
--Honors in /coursess: (especially path)
-- Did away rotations:
--# of programs you applied to:
--Where invited for interviews:
--Where matched:
--Anything that helped your app: (ie:, big-wig letter of recs, MD/PhD, other degree, SDN Forum, etc)
--Any other useful info dress size, hair color, did you wear your lucky shirt to the interview? Okay people please don't take this last ? so seriously 😉

 

[yaah]

I don't think you're going to get a ton of success getting people to admit this stuff, to be honest. And there really isn't a lot of it that's going to help, because every application is different and it isn't just about the numbers. Balance is important - a high board score in isolation doesn't mean much, etc.

Reputation of med school is so completely overrated (at least when it comes to US med schools) I don't even know where to start with that one.

Basically though, if you are AOA with board scores above 240 you should be able to match almost anywhere you want if you interview well and have good references. If you don't have all of these, you probably still stand a good chance of matching where you want.

 

[jeff2005]

I really wanted to know this kind of stuff when I was in your shoes, so I'll bite.

--Board Scores: 246 & 248
--AOA and class rank: middle third
--Reputation of medical school: Jefferson - don't know rank
--Research: some before med school
--Honors: Path, Histo, Physio, Biochem, Neuro, Pharm, no 3rd year honors.
--Did away rotations: No
--# of programs you applied to: 30
--Where invited for interviews: 25 - Duke, UNC, MGH, WashU, Yale, MUSC, UAB, Vandy, UCSD, Utah, UMASS, Dartmouth, Brown, etc.
--interviews attended: 8
--Where matched: Iowa (my first choice)
--Anything that helped your app: 2 great path letters, path honors project, one path publication.

 

[cjw0918]

I'll post my stuff just to make those less than stellar candidates feel better

Boards- 201 and 218
Med School- small midwestern MD school, bottom of top 50 for primary care
Class rank and grades- third quartile, no honors, no AOA, no research in med school, one non-scientific independent study in undergrad, no pubs
LORs- one from practicing pathologist, one from med school's head of path dept, and one from internal med doc
Activites in med school- none, no offices held, no awards won
Interview offers: Minnesota, UT-Knoxville, UT-Memphis, Colorado, Drexel, Pennsylvania Hospital, Temple, George Washington, LSU-Shreveport, MUSC, UMass
Rejected: Vanderbilt, UTSW, Arkansas (that hurt!), Utah, OHSU, New Mexico, Baylor-Dallas, Jefferson
Ranked 7 programs, matched GW (choice #3)

Best advice: Do a rotation where you think you'd like to go.

Also, lots of posters on here have incredible stats and get interviews at all the elite programs. Remember, for all the superstars on here there ARE "average" people applying to path, too. Good luck!

 

[DasN]

average is good

 

[DasN]

I like big wigs

 

[PathOne]

All of us are a part of SDN path. And we all f*cking rock!

Amen, Brother.... 😎

 

[whispers]

SDN selects for some quite neurotic people . . . We tend to be high-achievers. These are the folks that will be the most visible on SDN.

All of us are a part of SDN path. And we all f*cking rock![/QUOTE]


There are some non over acheivers floating around hmm myself included I was hoping they would speak up a bit more.

And yes SDN path is a special place 👍

Thanks to everyone who has posted

 

[LADoc00]

Board Scores:220 (when that was actually decent), Step 2 about the same.
No AOA, top 1/3(honored about half my stuff, high passed the rest) at solid med school (top 3), tons-o-research experience but bailed out of my MD/PhD(Path) program early. Got the best recommendations I could.
Tons of away path rotations (like 5 months worth)
Applied to BWH, Stanford, UCSF, MGH and Hopkins. Declined to enter the match (has to be okay'd by your Dean of Students).
Only showed up to BWH, MGH and Stanford interviews, received the acceptances from all places in late November/Early December.
PS-OooO didnt completely read the OP, I didnt match recently, like 6 years ago. But I can add, I applied to 20 Dermpath fellowships and only received uno interview.

 

[LADoc00]

double post ack

 

[CameronFrye]

I was under the impression that you did your residency at WashU. Was that your med school?

Board Scores:220 (when that was actually decent), Step 2 about the same.
No AOA, top 1/3(honored about half my stuff, high passed the rest) at solid med school (top 3), tons-o-research experience but bailed out of my MD/PhD(Path) program early. Got the best recommendations I could.
Tons of away path rotations (like 5 months worth)
Applied to BWH, Stanford, UCSF, MGH and Hopkins. Declined to enter the match (has to be okay'd by your Dean of Students).
Only showed up to BWH, MGH and Stanford interviews, received the acceptances from all places in late November/Early December.
PS-OooO didnt completely read the OP, I didnt match recently, like 6 years ago. But I can add, I applied to 20 Dermpath fellowships and only received uno interview.

 

[big_worm]

Board Scores: 250, 274
AOA and class rank: nominated for AOA, not elected
Reputation of medical school: middle tier midwestern
Research: nope
Honors in /courses: about 40%H, 40% NH preclinical
all H third year except NH in family
Did away rotations: only for the military
# of programs you applied to: 18
Where invited for interviews: UWash, VCU, UVA, MUSC, Case, Clev Clinic, Duke, UNC, Rochester, Dartmouth, UMich, BID, Brigham, Hopkins, Rush, UFlorida.
Rejected at UChicago
Where matched: Clev Clinic
Anything that helped your app: good letters, maybe one bigwig

 

[LADoc00]

Board Scores: 250, 274

274?! WTF Goodwill Hunting, I didnt know the boards scaled that high.

Is your name John Nash perhaps? Dude, I loved your biographical movie.

 

[scootad.]

wow 274 is obscene, but amazingly enough theres a bunch of 265+ folks hangin 'round these parts here on sdn. makes you wonder what they're doin' in path or medicine in general. they should use 'em brains to help fix our nations f*cked up health system or discover the obesity gene or something. and leave the deciphering ADH from DCIS to the rest of us ordinary folk 🙄 ok, so im jealous.

 

[yaah]

I knew someone with a 280+ step II last year...

my stats from last year, when in Rome...

Step I 257 Step II 261
Honors all of 1st and 2nd year except genetics and pharm
One outstanding (surgery) 3rd year, 2 above expected (OB, Med) 3 expected (psych, pedes, FP). 4th year all outstanding except ID elective and neuro which were too late to count.
Class rank: No clue but I think it was top 25%. Not AOA (AOA at Umass based a lot on volunteer activities).
4th year away elective at Mayo (got outstanding). Reference letters from AP chair and PD at UMass, and from a bigwig at Mayo.
Other stuff: PSF at UMass with one pending publication at time of application, multiple seminars and presentations. Occasional volunteer activities.

Applied to 18, offered interviews at all (UMass, BIDMC, MGH, BWH, UVM, Dartmouth, Penn, JHU, Wash U, Utah, UVA, Mich, Rush, U Chi, NW, Iowa, Indiana, Mayo) interviewed at 12 of them, ranked to match at a few (MGH and UMass I know, Utah, NW and Dartmouth I am assuming based on high pressure).

 

[beary]

I have a dumb question. I see that several of you were "ranked to match" at certain institutions. What does that mean and how do you know this? I thought you submit your list, and they submit their list, and all you end up knowing is where you go - not where you were on any program's list.

 

[yaah]

I have a dumb question. I see that several of you were "ranked to match" at certain institutions. What does that mean and how do you know this? I thought you submit your list, and they submit their list, and all you end up knowing is where you go - not where you were on any program's list.

Well, some programs will call you before the rank lists are due to let you know you are ranked highly there. I think it will sway some people to rank them higher because they know that they will match there and they won't have to worry about anything. It really shouldn't influence choices at all, though.

But basically they will call and tell you. Or write to you and tell you. I would advise not taking it completely as fact though, I have heard some sort of horror stories about it, people being told they were ranked to match (or something like that) and not ranking enough programs.

Some programs don't say anything though. They might tell you you're a good candidate but that's probably it. Then there are the occasional programs that try to manipulate you by telling you you won't be ranked highly unless you do the same. That's illegal by the rules of the match, but no one calls them on it out of fear.

 

[LADoc00]

Board Scores: 250, 274
AOA and class rank: nominated for AOA, not elected
Reputation of medical school: middle tier midwestern
Research: nope
Honors in /courses: about 40%H, 40% NH preclinical
all H third year except NH in family
Did away rotations: only for the military
# of programs you applied to: 18
Where invited for interviews: UWash, VCU, UVA, MUSC, Case, Clev Clinic, Duke, UNC, Rochester, Dartmouth, UMich, BID, Brigham, Hopkins, Rush, UFlorida.
Rejected at UChicago
Where matched: Clev Clinic
Anything that helped your app: good letters, maybe one bigwig

Dude, if you scored 274 on the boards and are in the military, please stop posting here and fooking find Osama Bin Laden. I thank you and the babies thank you. Pathology would be an absurd waste of your time.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

I have a dumb question. I see that several of you were "ranked to match" at certain institutions. What does that mean and how do you know this? I thought you submit your list, and they submit their list, and all you end up knowing is where you go - not where you were on any program's list.

I'll draw on my experience with Hopkins. The PD there called me up one evening (while I was out drinking, of course) and said, "The committee has decided to rank you in our top 8. That means that if you wanted to come here (i.e., rank us #1), you would end up here." So basically if a program has a certain quota and you fall within that number on the top of their rank list, you are ranked to match. As I was going through the whole process this year, I was not very trusting of phone calls like this although they made me feel good about myself. Overall, my feeling is that verbal reassurances can mean little. Think about it, how easy it would be for a PD to call many people up with the same message since verbal correspondences are in essence not binding at all, right? Fortunately, Hopkins had sent me an overnight Fedex letter from the department chair that same day because the Fedex delivery guy woke my ass up the next morning to sign for a letter. I think if a program calls you up and then follows it up in writing, you can pretty much trust it. Anything short of writing, I would advise you to be cautious.

Just as an FYI for those interested in Brigham in the future...I never received a "You are ranked to match" correspondence from them. Brigham pretty much played by the rules, at least with me, and I got no pressure from them whatsoever. I have no idea where they ranked me (nor do I care at this point because it's a moot point) but the only word I heard from them was along the lines of, "having finished all our interviews, you remain a top contender for a position in our program...we hope that you choose to train here." No harassing or threatening phone calls. No pressure. Very professional.

And to all of you, do NOT let these correspondences affect where you will rank programs. But at the same time, protect yourselves during this whole process when it comes down to correspondences between you and the programs. This has been the topic of quite some discussion during this application cycle and I'm sure it will come up again and again when you are going through this during the upcoming year. I've bitched about this incessantly in the past.

 

[big_worm]

Dude, if you scored 274 on the boards and are in the military, please stop posting here and fooking find Osama Bin Laden. I thank you and the babies thank you. Pathology would be an absurd waste of your time.

LMFAO as usual, LaDoc
kind of reminds me of that scene in First Blood part II when Col. Trautman goes to the prison camp and offers Rambo freedom if he agrees to go on another mission. Except with me, it wouldn't be prison camp, but slapping glass and moving the meat. Hopefully Afghanistan isn't preferable to path residency i might actually think about it if we were talking medicine residency though.

 

[quant]

Hey Andy
Thanks for your candidness......Being on SDN path is quite intimidating sometimes (The reason i assume many lurk....), but it definitely gives you an idea of the standards out there.....
And man!........ are they high!!!!

Regards
Quant

 

[caffeinegirl]

Ok, I'll bite...

--Board Scores: Step 1 216, Step 2 223
--AOA and class rank: no way jose
--Reputation of medical school: top 10
--Research: one year of basic science research during med school, two years during undergrad. no publications, but have had presentations at reputable conferences.
--Honors in /courses: passed basic science, honored all clinicals except family med and psych
-- Did away rotations: autopsy at stanford (recommend doing surg path instead!!)
--# of programs you applied to: 9
--Where invited for interviews: UCSF, UC Davis, Stanford, BWH, MGH, BIDMC, NEMC, UMass
--Where matched: MGH
--Anything that helped your app: (ie:, big-wig letter of recs, MD/PhD, other degree, SDN Forum, etc) decent letter of rec's from PI and path attendings at home institution. a year of research helped, as well as a strong interest amd enthusiasm for pathology (which is confirmed during your surg path elective). didn't get any chair letters or anybody calling for me anywhere. Second looks helped a ton!! I believe not having a PhD was a detriment in the academic powerhouses (BWH and UCSF).
--Any other useful info dress size, hair color, did you wear your luck shirt to the interview? dress professionally...leave your jeans and sneakers at home 😉

 

[deschutes]

Well then, guess I'll have to skew the curve a little:

--Board Scores: Step 1 217. I can't tell you Step 2 because I haven't written it yet, so take my word that Step 2 is not required to be ranked by programs.
--AOA and class rank: N/A, see below
--Reputation of medical school: Pass/Fail Canadian school. The so-called "worst" Canadian school does not differ much from the "best" Canadian school, although I would put us in the top half if not top third. Reputation in the US is anyone's guess.
--Research: Only started end of 1st year - ongoing. Presented at one Canadian meeting (but we all know that doesn't count for anything in the US 🙄 ) and accepted to USCAP although the abstract was only submitted after my application went into ERAS. I did update a few programs re: the acceptance via email. It didn't get me any more invites, although I hope it made them rank me higher.
--Honors in /coursess: (especially path) No longitudinal path course at my school. How do you count honours? Because my clinical grades are Pass/Fail as well, although I did get several Above Average to Outstanding evals on an odd assortment of sub-rotations, including Path electives. As well as one not-so-great eval coinciding with ERAS opening (that's my story and I'm sticking to it 😀 ).
-- Did away rotations: None - I only had 10 weeks of elective time and decided to babysit my research project.
--# of programs you applied to: 25 (I knew it was in the 20's but couldn't remember and had to go look this up on ERAS! Was it really that long ago? 😳 ) Limited by visa requirements. Did not apply to NY or Cali. Only applied to university-based programs.
--Where invited for interviews: 7 total - UMinnesota, Northwestern, UIowa, MUSC, Ohio State, Wayne State, UKentucky. I practically had to invite myself to Northwestern, Iowa and UKY.
--Where matched: #1
--Anything that helped your app: (ie:, big-wig letter of recs, MD/PhD, other degree, SDN Forum, etc) 4 letters, all Path from my home institution. I had a dept chair/research supervisor letter, although apart from the fact that he had done a fellowship at my #1 back in the 70's I really don't think it fit the "big-wig letter" prototype. SDNPath helped. TONS! And I am only half-joking.
--Any other useful info dress size, hair color, did you wear your luck shirt to the interview? In retrospect I was ultra-conservative by the standards I saw on the trail. I conceded a point to the pragmatism of the pantsuit (black, despite Iserson's), but I even considered a collared shirt too modern. It was evident as time went on that very few others had the same reservations, however.

I maintain that the key to success is shoes! 😉 I figured if my shoes were detracting from the charm of my presence then they really did not deserve to be there. Those stairwells. And connecting tunnels. And rainnnnn....

And for those thinking of academics, think of yourself making conversation on the interview day as if you were a prof in the making. I don't know how to put it less cornily/more elegantly (maybe others can chip in here), but they must be able to picture your brilliant future as they sit and converse with you even if you are a non-US/non-Canadian nobody. And not because of anything you are verbally promising them. They must be totally blown away and wish you much success even if you do not choose to train there.

So there you have my story. Not quite the straight line! (Did anyone really read all that?)

Good luck all!

 

[LADoc00]

LMFAO as usual, LaDoc
kind of reminds me of that scene in First Blood part II when Col. Trautman goes to the prison camp and offers Rambo freedom if he agrees to go on another mission. Except with me, it wouldn't be prison camp, but slapping glass and moving the meat. Hopefully Afghanistan isn't preferable to path residency i might actually think about it if we were talking medicine residency though.

Dude, do you have extracurricular activites that include Marine Combat Diver (MCD) qualifications, Jump wings, basic UDT, more than a passing familiarity with the M24 SWS?

Do you have a Liberation of Kuwait Medal?

Im curious what the utlimate application might look like:
270 Step1/Step2
Harvard Med AOA
MIT PhD in Nanotechnology (Thesis: "The creation of small molecules that one day will save humanity")
Princeton Undergrad, Summa cum laude of course
Marine Corps Officer, Combat Diver, Force Recon Btn (awarded Purple Heart and Silver Star during hand-to-hand combat to save a bus load of children during a terrorist hostage situation)
Navy Seal Sniper (awarded Navy Cross, Operation Desert Storm)
LORs: Juan Rosai, James Watson and Ronald Reagan, R.I.P. (of course with a cover letter signed by all sitting members of the US Senate)
Personal: Dating both Bush daughters, simultaneously.

 

[quant]

So there you have my story. Not quite the straight line! (Did anyone really read all that?)

Good luck all!

I did Deschutes......and thanks a lot for the information.....I think this is fast turning into the most useful thread for potential 2006 ers.......

Including LaDOC's witticisms.... 🙂

 

[deschutes]

Rosai probably wouldn't write letters, would he? I imagine he'd be listed as a reference. But what a reference!

 

[LADoc00]

Rosai probably wouldn't write letters, would he? I imagine he'd be listed as a reference. But what a reference!

He does write letters and Ive read one (only one). Im fairly certain if you want to be the supreme pimp of pre-Paths, you can do a rotation in Milan with Rosai if you had the connections...no idea if he signs out in English though. I did know a guy who had a LOR from Ronald Reagan for med school. I would keep using that one for the rest of my life! Had a little brother who got a letter from Chuck Norris for Harvard grad school, he got in so I guess it worked.

In terms of LORs, I always wondered what a PD would do with a letter from say Michael Jordan or Kim Jong Il (that would be sick!) or better yet Nina Hartely....

Some enterprising med student should write Britney Spears and tell her you want to "help the children" and you need a solid LOR to do so. Just dont get an OJ or Michael Jackson one at the moment, dats bad.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

In terms of LORs, I always wondered what a PD would do with a letter from say Michael Jordan or Kim Jong Il (that would be sick!) or better yet Nina Hartely....

I got a letter from Kim Jong Il. The letter practically wrote itself!

 

[bananaface]

My mom got asked to write a letter once. I had to write it for her.

 

[AnnaLee]

Thank you guys for being brave! The next generation is appreciative, especially since the terms "competitive" etc. don't help much in terms of realistically matching at one or the other school next year.

 

[geddy]

I got a letter from Kim Jong Il. The letter practically wrote itself!

That guy is whacked out of his gourd. I can only imagine what it would have said. At the DMZ, N Korea has a speaker system blaring propaganda all the time, and there are signs posted facing the south saying things like "South Korea is an American puppet" and "Come North to Prosperity and Paradise". Uhh... yeah. Now, viewed from the Chinese side (at the Tumen river), North Korea is just barren mountains - literally brown land stripped completely bare.

My favorite story from the DMZ was Operation Paul Bunyan. In the 70s, a couple ROK and US soldiers were trimming a tree in the DMZ and the N Korean soldiers told them to stop. When they didn't, the N Korean soldiers ambushed them and killed them with the axes they were using to trim the tree. The US responded with Operation Paul Bunyan, where they went and cut down the poplar tree, replacing it with a monument. Cold War diplomacy at it's finest 🙄

 

[b&ierstiefel]

I already know this geddy. He's my dad.

 

[geddy]

I already know this geddy. He's my dad.

All hail the dear leader!

 

[trent05]

.

 

[LADoc00]

If anyone wants to come clean, right here, right now and admit they supplied sexual favors to move up on the rank list of their top program, admit it on this thread. Or if you were the subject of inappropriate touching, you can mention that too. Andy, I saw you walking with limp near Brookline ave. after your BWH interview, so youve been caught.


...the truth will set you free.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

If anyone wants to come clean, right here, right now and admit they supplied sexual favors to move up on the rank list of their top program, admit it on this thread. Or if you were the subject of inappropriate touching, you can mention that too. Andy, I saw you walking with limp near Brookline ave. after your BWH interview, so youve been caught.


...the truth will set you free.

shh f*cker...i told you to keep that to yourself.

veritas vos liberabit

 

[LADoc00]

shh f*cker...i told you to keep that to yourself.

veritas vos liberabit

Its cool bro, I went to my first interview and it ended with uncomfortable all too familiar scenario
Faculty: Ok, I think we're done, but before you leave I want to see It.
Me:It? What do you mean?
Faculty: dont play stupid with me boy, this is a residency spot we are talkin about, those dont come cheap, now bust it out.
Me:Ummmm, I have a lesion at the moment, its not pretty.
Faculty: Nice try. I have IRB approval on my genitals study so this is all part of academics, dont worry no one has to know.
Me: Really? Just between us?
Faculty: (getting more irritated) Yes. Its between us and the webcam I have on top of my monitor....

 

[G0S2]

PhD mentor knew you for only three years?? Quick PhD.

 

[jeff2005]

We need more people with average stats posting. We're going to give up-coming MSIV's panic attacks.

 

[scootad.]

We need more people with average stats posting. We're going to give up-coming MSIV's panic attacks.

I agree, or good candidates with average matches. You see, not everyone plays the game to a tee. Although I applied in a more competitive field (rads), I am an example of the latter - a good candidate who was suprised by my match (#7) on my list. I am very happy with my match, dont get me wrong, and probably should have ranked my matched program higher for a variety of reasons, but I still must concede that I must not have played the game very well. I think people underestimate the interview. It is VERY important, and I'm afraid I'm not the greatest interviewer. I am very personable, etc. but there are little things you need to do to sell yourself, and make them want you, and there are good questions to ask, that I guess I never caught onto.

maybe the successful matchers could shed light on these details. now that they have their diamonds, they dont have to worry about keeping these secrets.

 

[jeff2005]

I think people underestimate the interview. It is VERY important

I agree. The interview is extremely important. I don't generally interview well either. Fortunately, I had my **** together at my #1.

 

[LADoc00]

I agree. The interview is extremely important. I don't generally interview well either. Fortunately, I had my **** together at my #1.

Would that be your revealing top and short skirt?

 

[jeff2005]

Would that be your revealing top and short skirt?

Why is your mind always in the gutter? Are you not getting any? Nevermind, I don't want to know!

 

[LADoc00]

Why is your mind always in the gutter? Are you not getting any? Nevermind, I don't want to know!

Just trying to think what having your shiat together would mean for a MS applying in path, its not like you can get all verbose on aggressive angiomyxomas or WHO classification of AML.

Sheesh all this pent up aggresion towards little old me....

 

[cjw0918]

If there is one talent I have, I am fan*******tastic at charming people, and I can't say it helped me a whole lot in the Match. I think a lot of places INTEND to use the interview to see who will "fit" with their program, but that's a very labor intensive process. I think most of the time interviewers just chat and then think, 'Well, she seems nice and was not frankly psychotic. Let's rank her.' Then they sit down at the rank meeting with their pile of 'not frankly psychotic' candidiates, which are about 95% of people, and say 'What were her board scores again? I need to separate these people out.'

However, I think I may be a tad bitter that I did not get my top choice in the Match, so maybe I'm using a defense mechanism to deflect blame from myself. Or maybe I'm not as charming as I think?! Dear God, that's worse!!!!

Good luck to all. 🙂

 

[LADoc00]

If there is one talent I have, I am fan*******tastic at charming people, and I can't say it helped me a whole lot in the Match. I think a lot of places INTEND to use the interview to see who will "fit" with their program, but that's a very labor intensive process. I think most of the time interviewers just chat and then think, 'Well, she seems nice and was not frankly psychotic. Let's rank her.' Then they sit down at the rank meeting with their pile of 'not frankly psychotic' candidiates, which are about 95% of people, and say 'What were her board scores again? I need to separate these people out.'

However, I think I may be a tad bitter that I did not get my top choice in the Match, so maybe I'm using a defense mechanism to deflect blame from myself. Or maybe I'm not as charming as I think?! Dear God, that's worse!!!!

Good luck to all. 🙂

In my dream residency program for every high board score type accepted, I would let in one hottie...And frankly thats the kind of affirmative action Pathology is in bad need of.

 

[yaah]

We have a pretty good hottie coming here next year. I had lunch with her during her interview. She is married though.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

We have a pretty good hottie coming here next year. I had lunch with her during her interview. She is married though.

Um yeah...when you reach old fart status like us, all the hotties tend to be married.

 

[yaah]

Um yeah...when you reach old fart status like us, all the hotties tend to be married.

Tell me about it, soul sister.

But I have a date on friday and I don't think she is married so 😛

 

[geddy]

Tell me about it, soul sister.

But I have a date on friday and I don't think she is married so 😛

Key words in bold.