Pre-med "machines" - How do they do it?

[gravitywave]

Just to be clear, I do not think hobbies, parties and other activities that do not add to your application are frivolous things. I think it's wonderful that people do fun things that do not add their applications.

I tend not to believe claims that some time frame is the only opportunity to do something. i.e. "do it because once you complete 12th grade or college you will never have a chance to do that again". And they mention something you can also do after you turn 30. For pretty much everything people do in college, people can also do the same thing after they are not students anymore.

eh, the neurobiologists tell us that lability in brain structure basically ends at ~25 yo. so to a certain extent, what Musclemass is saying has some scientific background. Social and emotional development happen early in life to an overwhelming degree.

It really won't all still be there waiting for you.

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[anbuitachi]

1% of the population only needs 5 hours of sleep a day, That's 1/100. That # is obviously higher in medical school or good college. That gets you a lot of extra time to do what you want. I need 11 hours of sleep a day so compared to me, the dood has an extra 5-6 hours everyday

 

[varsityblue]

It's purely a matter of what you choose to value in this short, short life. I have found that the premeds who are (undoubtedly) machines tend to appear perfect, determined, committed, and "smart" while sacrificing many things we well balanced premeds choose to prioritize. These could include time with family, time with friends, time for reflection and introspection, meaningful conversations of philosophical/religious/political origin, etc. The machines that I have known, have often had some personality flaw that drives them to immerse themselves in ideas of success (whether determined by societal standards or not is still TBD). My advice to you is this. Study hard, study as much as you can and try to truly remember the things that interest you. Make good grades, but don't let it consume your life. Study for the MCAT like nothing you've ever studied for in your life, but realize that come test day, you should rely more on your problem solving skills and your calm nerves to see you through. All in all, I am constantly saddened by those premeds that choose to let how others view them, how society views them, determine their work ethic. If you truly are passionate about that Goldwater, by all means I say go for it. But if you're gunning for the top because people will look fondly upon you, you might be wasting your life. Don't lose yourself in this process, like many 'machines' do. Ever wondered why there are such ridiculous rates of drug abuse, depression, alcoholism in practicing physicians? Probably because they didn't take time to truly value what their life means to them.

I couldn't have said this better myself. See www.studyhacks.com.

 

[druggeek]

Just to be clear, I do not think hobbies, parties and other activities that do not add to your application are frivolous things. I think it's wonderful that people do fun things that do not add their applications.

I tend not to believe claims that some time frame is the only opportunity to do something. i.e. "do it because once you complete 12th grade or college you will never have a chance to do that again". And they mention something you can also do after you turn 30. For pretty much everything people do in college, people can also do the same thing after they are not students anymore.

Yea you can, but a lot of things just lose their fun. I can go sit and play with toys right now, but is it as fun as it was when I was 8? Probably not.
Taking advantage of each stage in life is the crucial key.

 

[BluegrassDancin]

I tend not to believe claims that some time frame is the only opportunity to do something. i.e. "do it because once you complete 12th grade or college you will never have a chance to do that again". And they mention something you can also do after you turn 30. For pretty much everything people do in college, people can also do the same thing after they are not students anymore.

For most people, this is simply not the case. Unless you have a trust fund perhaps. College for 99% of people is the time in your life where you have the most freedom and least amount of responsibility. Responsibilities most certainly increase after you graduate college, even if you don't decide to get married or have a family and become accountable to people other than yourself. To "put off" taking advantage of this unique time in your life is very misguided in my opinion, especially considering the commitment we're making to a long career of hard work.

 

[BluegrassDancin]

I agree with the opinion you quoted because of thinking about every specific example of things people do in college. For some club or EC, what exactly do they do in it? What do people do at a bar or party? And so on.

There are people with full time jobs that are less demanding than their undergraduate course workload. There are people who retire from one job. There are people who quit one job and live off savings while figuring out what type of job to prepare for next. College is very structured, and they decide when the lectures are, when the exams are, what is the on the syllabus. People can have a lot more freedom than that after college.

I also think that mystical and romantic "the college experience" ideas influence some students to de-emphasize academics in a way that does harm.

Agree to disagree. I'm guessing we just had different college experiences and different philosophies. One of the reasons why I feel that I had more freedom was that I was free to look at syllabi and choose from hundreds of classes exploring topics that interested me, and didn't have the feeling that "they" decided the structure for me. I understand that everybody wants different things, but I'm posting here because I'm just an example of someone who had the "mystical and romantic college experience" and don't believe it caused me harm. In fact, I'm pretty sure that the balanced person that mystical experience helped me become is one of the main reasons I was admitted to med school. But hey, that's just me.

 

[scarshapedstar]

There are people with full time jobs that are less demanding than their undergraduate course workload. There are people who retire from one job. There are people who quit one job and live off savings while figuring out what type of job to prepare for next. College is very structured, and they decide when the lectures are, when the exams are, what is the on the syllabus. People can have a lot more freedom than that after college.

This has been the experience of most people I graduated with. There aren't that many real-world analogues to a freshman chemistry class where the professor is removed if he doesn't fail 20% of the students. It Gets Better!

 

[Koosalagoosagoo]

Is there anything wrong with being a machine anyways, I enjoy working, studying and going to school?...I guess I'm not the cool kid who likes to party...

 

[45408]

Maybe some people realize that they are going to live beyond the ripe old age of 22 and have set their sights on bigger things.

You're also going to realize that you should stop and smell the roses along the way.

And I said it once, I'll say it again: the idea that "machines" don't socialize as much as the next person is laughable and only shows your ignorance or serves as a petty attempt to make yourself feel better.

I'll say it just once - no need to say it again - "machines" don't socialize as much as the next person. You just sound like you're bitter.

The idea that being a "machine" means little to no social life is a very narrow view. It comes off as a justification for why YOU can't be as focused as these people.

subtle views self as machinist post

 

[45408]

Just to be clear, I do not think hobbies, parties and other activities that do not add to your application are frivolous things. I think it's wonderful that people do fun things that do not add their applications.

I tend not to believe claims that some time frame is the only opportunity to do something. i.e. "do it because once you complete 12th grade or college you will never have a chance to do that again". And they mention something you can also do after you turn 30. For pretty much everything people do in college, people can also do the same thing after they are not students anymore.

Wait until you're a resident/attending, and you decide it would be nice to go study abroad for a semester.

Hell, just wait until you have kids, or a house, or $200K in student loans.

 

[scarshapedstar]

Wait until you're a resident/attending, and you decide it would be nice to go study abroad for a semester.

Hell, just wait until you have kids, or a house, or $200K in student loans.

Not everyone even has the opportunity to study abroad in the first place. The silver spoons are starting to choke me here.

IMO: if you've graduated college and you haven't yet thrown a coke orgy or climbed Kilimanjaro, kill yourself, because everyone else has and it's too late for you!

 

[MyBffPutin]

I actually found that taking morning yoga classes or hitting the treadmill in the morning helps my concentration. It wakes me up.

 

[chiapet874]

You're also going to realize that you should stop and smell the roses along the way.


I'll say it just once - no need to say it again - "machines" don't socialize as much as the next person. You just sound like you're bitter.


subtle views self as machinist post

1). "Stopping to smell the roses" is a luxurious notion commonly held by people who either a). have no direction in life and can afford that or b). don't understand the conditions of the rest of the world. You have 60 years to smell those roses, I'll happily sacrifice 4.

2). You just sound like you're jealous. Fundamentally, you've still failed to prove the 100% of "machines" socialize less or "miss out". The mere existence of 1 "machine" who can do all the social activities that you claim they will miss, disproves your whole premise.

3). I don't need to be subtle- I am proud to fall under the category of a "machine". I love what I do and have no regrets, which is far more than most "non-machines" can say.

You are free to believe whatever you want, it's your opinion. But don't fool yourself and claim people who are driven and work hard (people you label as "machines") will regret this later on. I can just as easily claim your "non-machines" will regret not working as hard come application time.

It's far easier to say that the "machine"-route is the wrong way to go because one can imagine the instant, short-term, gains. It's harder to see the benefits of being a "machine" because it involves longer, farther reaching, consequences.

I believe the misconception here is that "machines" decided to be "machines" purely to become a good pre-med student/applicant. That may be the case for some of them, but I feel the majority of these people who consistently follow the OP's schedule do so because that's what they would have done no matter what field they went into.

It is sad when a community looks upon a group of dedicated hard-workers and the first thing they do is try to find a reason to mock them or belittle their accomplishments.

 

[dartmed]

1). "Stopping to smell the roses" is a luxurious notion commonly held by people who either a). have no direction in life and can afford that or b). don't understand the conditions of the rest of the world. You have 60 years to smell those roses, I'll happily sacrifice 4.

2). You just sound like you're jealous

3). I don't need to be subtle- I am proud to fall under the category of a "machine". I love what I do and have no regrets, which is far more than most "non-machines" can say.

You are free to believe whatever you want, it's your opinion. But don't fool yourself and claim people who are driven and work hard (people you label as "machines") will regret this later on. I can just as easily claim your "non-machines" will regret not working as hard come application time.

It's far easier to say that the "machine"-route is the wrong way to go because one can imagine the instant, short-term, gains. It's harder to see the benefits of being a "machine" because it involves longer, farther reaching, consequences.

I believe the misconception here is that "machines" decided to be "machines" purely to become a good pre-med student/applicant. That may be the case for some of them, but I feel the majority of these people who consistently follow the OP's schedule do so because that's what they would have done no matter what field they went into.

I agree with this post.

Personally, I am a very hard-working person, but I also socialize.

I don't think I will ever regret anything looking back. I love doing what I am doing. If anything, when I look back, I probably wish I had done more. For instance, I was unsuccessful for the Truman scholarship because I did not prepare of the interview whatsoever. If I had better prepared myself instead of going-out and hooking-up with a random chic the night before, I probably would have been successful.

Not saying that the chic wasn't worth losing 30,000 dollars or anything...

 

[dartmed]

 

[LupaCupcake]

Passion

that..

just that...

If you have passion for something, you will push harder. One person has a passion to be a doctor, great. One person has a passion to be a doctor that is a leader within their field. Nothing wrong with either person.

Yea stuff like time management, organization and everything else I mentioned earlier and others said. Yes, that does matter as well, but something has to DRIVE that need to organize, schedule, be disciplined

I have a few passions, some of the things I passionately want are not easy to get. Some people have told me not to aim that high because I am nontrad. (those are haters btw...haters are easy to spot, they give dirty looks to the machines) Whether or not I achieve these things is up to me and I know that. I am passionate about what I want and I don't accept excuses. I like to think that will propel me to the status of so called "machine" one day lol. BTW, I don't have a very large social network I do a lot and it does have effects, but I don't really care if I have a lot of friends and go out on the weekend. I have a husband and child, the other stuff is just fluff. Unlike some of you I don't need to go out

 

[American Shero]

I'm sorry but what is this "great" college experience that everyone keeps raving about? Is it the partying, clubbing, one-night stands? Please clue me in here, because I think I'm missing something. I've tried all of these things and I personally thought they were pretty lame.

Getting drunk and acting like an idiot isn't my idea of a good time. And one-night stands are always horrible, in my opinion.. (but that could just be b/c I'm a chick and 20 year old guys tend to suck in bed. )... not to mention that the STD rate is through the roof at my school (but no one ever wants to talk about THAT ).

I dont know. The whole thing just seems overrated to me. The things that I actually enjoy will still be doable when I'm older. I don't think the "machines" are missing out on anything if they, like me, find the aforementioned activities to be grossly overrated.

Just my $0.02

 

[45408]

Not everyone even has the opportunity to study abroad in the first place. The silver spoons are starting to choke me here.

IMO: if you've graduated college and you haven't yet thrown a coke orgy or climbed Kilimanjaro, kill yourself, because everyone else has and it's too late for you!

Yes, because the only things that you won't be able to do as a resident and parent are the expensive things that are only afforded to the wealthy.

1). "Stopping to smell the roses" is a luxurious notion commonly held by people who either a). have no direction in life and can afford that or b). don't understand the conditions of the rest of the world. You have 60 years to smell those roses, I'll happily sacrifice 4.

We don't live in the rest of the world, so why is that relevant? You have the option to stop and smell the roses, so I would recommend doing it.

It's also laughable that you think this is only 4 years. There are another 4 years to follow those 4 years, and another 4-7 years after that. You will have less and less time for a long time.

2). You just sound like you're jealous. Fundamentally, you've still failed to prove the 100% of "machines" socialize less or "miss out". The mere existence of 1 "machine" who can do all the social activities that you claim they will miss, disproves your whole premise.

LOL, you're completely wrong. I'm jealous of the people who did more of the partying and rose-smelling. I did the whole pre-med shtick already. I took prep courses, did research, volunteering, clinical employment, working out at the gym early in the morning, studying late into the night. If anything, I was too much machine and not enough socialite.

It's also laughable and ignorant on your part to think that an exception disproves the rule.

You are free to believe whatever you want, it's your opinion. But don't fool yourself and claim people who are driven and work hard (people you label as "machines") will regret this later on. I can just as easily claim your "non-machines" will regret not working as hard come application time.

It's far easier to say that the "machine"-route is the wrong way to go because one can imagine the instant, short-term, gains. It's harder to see the benefits of being a "machine" because it involves longer, farther reaching, consequences.

I believe the misconception here is that "machines" decided to be "machines" purely to become a good pre-med student/applicant. That may be the case for some of them, but I feel the majority of these people who consistently follow the OP's schedule do so because that's what they would have done no matter what field they went into.

It is sad when a community looks upon a group of dedicated hard-workers and the first thing they do is try to find a reason to mock them or belittle their accomplishments.

I'm not sure why I'm arguing with a pre-med, but let's just say I'd like to see your thoughts on this matter when you're a resident/parent/etc.

In general, I live life with no regrets. I plan my moves out pretty far in advance, and I've achieved what I wanted to achieve. But if I did it all over again, I would take some extra time along the way.

 

[scarshapedstar]

In general, I live life with no regrets. I plan my moves out pretty far in advance, and I've achieved what I wanted to achieve. But if I did it all over again, I would take some extra time along the way.

Free will is an illusion anyway.

Yeah, I went there.

 

[druggeek]

I'm sorry but what is this "great" college experience that everyone keeps raving about? Is it the partying, clubbing, one-night stands? Please clue me in here, because I think I'm missing something. I've tried all of these things and I personally thought they were pretty lame.

Getting drunk and acting like an idiot isn't my idea of a good time. And one-night stands are always horrible, in my opinion.. (but that could just be b/c I'm a chick and 20 year old guys tend to suck in bed. )... not to mention that the STD rate is through the roof at my school (but no one ever wants to talk about THAT ).

I dont know. The whole thing just seems overrated to me. The things that I actually enjoy will still be doable when I'm older. I don't think the "machines" are missing out on anything if they, like me, find the aforementioned activities to be grossly overrated.

Just my $0.02

Sex is only important to those who don't get it regularly (pretty much anyone without a gf/wife).
STDs should never be an issue for getting laid, we have something called condoms now. Of course most people don't use one... hence why 99% of STD carriers have them.

 

[druggeek]

Yes, because the only things that you won't be able to do as a resident and parent are the expensive things that are only afforded to the wealthy.


We don't live in the rest of the world, so why is that relevant? You have the option to stop and smell the roses, so I would recommend doing it.

It's also laughable that you think this is only 4 years. There are another 4 years to follow those 4 years, and another 4-7 years after that. You will have less and less time for a long time.


LOL, you're completely wrong. I'm jealous of the people who did more of the partying and rose-smelling. I did the whole pre-med shtick already. I took prep courses, did research, volunteering, clinical employment, working out at the gym early in the morning, studying late into the night. If anything, I was too much machine and not enough socialite.

It's also laughable and ignorant on your part to think that an exception disproves the rule.


I'm not sure why I'm arguing with a pre-med, but let's just say I'd like to see your thoughts on this matter when you're a resident/parent/etc.

In general, I live life with no regrets. I plan my moves out pretty far in advance, and I've achieved what I wanted to achieve. But if I did it all over again, I would take some extra time along the way.

Couldn't agree more with this post. Although I'm not a resident/attending/parent, it's always hilarious how people who have yet to become older think they know how it is.

 

[BluegrassDancin]

This. I'm only a couple years out of college, but sometimes I just want to shake people and tell them they still have time to change their attitude and enjoy life more! Just because you want to go to med school doesn't mean you have to be a machine.

 

[URHere]

I've always had a schedule that other people consider somewhat insane (and reminiscent of what the OP has described).

A few thoughts:

1) If you try to do this for the wrong reasons, you will be miserable. For example, if you have a genuine interest in taking 8 interesting classes, playing a sport, working part-time, being a fraternity officer, bodybuilding, and participating in student government (and you decide to do all of those things because you just don't want to choose between them), you will be far happier than someone pursuing the same activities for the sake of resume-padding.

2) If you do decide on a "machine"-like schedule, don't think about it too much or you will end up stressing yourself out for no reason. I know many people who decided not to take an extra class or try out a new EC because they were convinced that they would fail if they tacked it on. Personally, I have always preferred to give it a try, assume that it will work, and then cut back later if things don't seem to be panning out.

3) It is very easy to keep up a "machine" schedule if you do it consistently, but if you give yourself too many rebound breaks (e.g. a whole weekend in bed watching netflix), it will be very difficult to get back into the routine. It's worth being aware of that.

For what it's worth, I enjoy having a busy schedule, and I've never had trouble squeezing in a social life (sometimes sleep ends up on the chopping block, but it's worth it).

 

[Jennet]

There's a pretty fantastic post on Pre-Med Hell about productivity. If you are trying to have a more structured life, think about it like a diet. In order to diet and maintain lifelong health you need to make a plan and execute it with precision.

Start out by analyzing what you do. It takes a dose of self realization to objectively critique your work and school performance. You may think you are studying a lot, but the hours won't add up. First, write down how much you think you study for coursework. Include how much time you spend for yourself, going out, being lazy, time online, etc. Next, keep a log of your schedule and study habits during a normal school week. Make sure to include the time you are online, chatting on Facebook, email, etc. I plugged my numbers into an excel pie chart and viola! Apparently I was spending WAY more time online than I anticipated and not enough studying. These numbers can help you analyze your bad habits as well as the time of your preferred study hours.

I took my numbers and realized that I work better at night and my attention runs in 1.5 hour cycles. I modified that plan to including studying for 1.5 hour increments with 15 minute breaks and 30 minutes at meals. This makes my study time more productive. By utilizing my time wisely during the week, I can afford to go out on weekends.

Other hints? Study for exams early. Like 1-2 weeks early. Make sure to get in 30 minutes - 1 hour of exercise 4 times a week to improve your mental clarity and focus. Forgive yourself if you miss a scheduled study time, but don't make it a habit. Eat well, read the chapters before lecture during, and get enough sleep. If you limit any binge drinking and cut back on regular drinking, your study time with vastly increase. Hangovers can really kill a Saturday study session.

Also, I'd really recommend reading "What Smart Students Know" by Adam Robinson. Book really helped me learn how to approach studying. Meta-cognition for the win! I'm post bacc so I work 40 hours, have 2 classes with lab, volunteer at a local hospital, and do unpaid work at a research lab. This is made possible by utilizing my time wisely. And yes, I still have fun with friends and go out!

 

[American Shero]

Sex is only important to those who don't get it regularly (pretty much anyone without a gf/wife).
STDs should never be an issue for getting laid, we have something called condoms now. Of course most people don't use one... hence why 99% of STD carriers have them.

Condoms don't protect you from everything. Herpes and genital warts can be contracted from skin-to-skin contact.

 

[SteveJMarist]

learn to prioritize
time management and organization is crucial
figure out what motivates you and use it

I would say healthy eating actually helps a lot. It might seem easier to grab fast food when you are busy, but if you try to eat healthy you will have more energy that doesn't burn out and crash. Don't wake up and eat lucky charms cereal, wake up and eat some oatmeal or whole wheat toast with low fat peanut butter and some fruit. I am not a health nut by far, but it does make a difference. If someone wakes up and hits the gym, has a healthy breakfast then is off to his/her day they will feel "pumped up" and ready to go. Not that I hit the gym in the morning, but I used to .

A+ - couldn't agree more. This is extremely crucial in my experience (not that I'm a machine, but I simply find that I can get more done if I eat healthy). Darn, shouldn't have just bought Chipotle. At least it is Friday .

 

[druggeek]

Condoms don't protect you from everything. Herpes and genital warts can be contracted from skin-to-skin contact.

brb staying a virgin and not enjoying the best thing in life so I don't run the risk of getting herpes or HPV herp derp.

HPV is extremely common, but warts is not. Your odds of getting it while wearing a condom arent too high... neither is the herp. Unless you plan on banging the same sluts over and over again, having one nighters with a condom presents a very low risk of catching anything.

A lot of people raw dog sluts (no condom) regularly and manage to stay clean for years, and even when they get burnt... it's something minor.

 

[45408]

2) If you do decide on a "machine"-like schedule, don't think about it too much or you will end up stressing yourself out for no reason. I know many people who decided not to take an extra class or try out a new EC because they were convinced that they would fail if they tacked it on. Personally, I have always preferred to give it a try, assume that it will work, and then cut back later if things don't seem to be panning out.

Agreed. I feel tired and stressed just reading about people's med school surgery rotations, despite the fact that I've been a surgery resident for almost a year and a half.

If you're doing something challenging, don't look too far down the road. It will always just be one foot in front of the other.

 

[45408]

Free will is an illusion anyway.

Yeah, I went there.

That doesn't change anything about what I said, and the fact that you only noted that is pretty juvenile.

 

[American Shero]

brb staying a virgin and not enjoying the best thing in life so I don't run the risk of getting herpes or HPV herp derp.

HPV is extremely common, but warts is not. Your odds of getting it while wearing a condom arent too high... neither is the herp. Unless you plan on banging the same sluts over and over again, having one nighters with a condom presents a very low risk of catching anything.

A lot of people raw dog sluts (no condom) regularly and manage to stay clean for years, and even when they get burnt... it's something minor.

This post is beyond ignorant; I don't even know where to start.

Actually, I think it's best to just avoid the whole argument and go study for my finals instead. This is pointless. Later dude..

 

[docbrill]

A lot of people associate being a "machine" having no social life/ being awkward, etc. However, that's just them rationalizing them having a lower gpa/less impressive resumes, believing that they're make room for a social life.

The truth is, there are "machines" walking around and you aren't even aware of it. They're experts at what they do. They know how to study efficiently in the day so that they can party at night. They can balance straight A grades, friendships, and still get 7 or 8 hours of sleep.

Sure there are people who only read in the library and only focus on school, and justify their lack of social life by convincing themselves they do it for their future. But I've met people that you could have never guessed were rocking a 4.0 majoring in biochemistry because they don't fit the "smart guy" stereotype. It's incredible

You just described me .

 

[druggeek]

This post is beyond ignorant; I don't even know where to start.

Actually, I think it's best to just avoid the whole argument and go study for my finals instead. This is pointless. Later dude..

Sounds more like "I'm mad I don't get poon, so I use STDs as an excuse" (srs)

 

[Dawn1980]

But if I did it all over again, I would take some extra time along the way.

THIS. I have to agree with Prowler.

I'm currently a fellow, and I have always been the "machinist." In some ways, I still am. I lived my 20's as a traditional medical student/resident trainee, and I wished I took some more time out to "smell the roses." Unfortunately, it takes going through medical training and taking a retrospective look at your life to figure out how true this is.

Please take this advice.

 

[blkshrtdynasty]

I haven't had a carb since 2004.

 

[MartletMD]

Sounds more like "I'm mad I don't get poon, so I use STDs as an excuse" (srs)

Dude, why do you continually harp on getting laid? There are other things in life that "machines" could possibly be missing out on - other interpersonal relationships, experiences, whatever. I feel like you're kind of undermining your position here.

Now, I happen to be of the opinion that true machines strive to do EVERYTHING to the best of their abilities, including going out and having friends, enjoying life, so I may be biased.

 

[chiapet874]

Yes, because the only things that you won't be able to do as a resident and parent are the expensive things that are only afforded to the wealthy.


We don't live in the rest of the world, so why is that relevant? You have the option to stop and smell the roses, so I would recommend doing it.

It's also laughable that you think this is only 4 years. There are another 4 years to follow those 4 years, and another 4-7 years after that. You will have less and less time for a long time.


LOL, you're completely wrong. I'm jealous of the people who did more of the partying and rose-smelling. I did the whole pre-med shtick already. I took prep courses, did research, volunteering, clinical employment, working out at the gym early in the morning, studying late into the night. If anything, I was too much machine and not enough socialite.

It's also laughable and ignorant on your part to think that an exception disproves the rule.


I'm not sure why I'm arguing with a pre-med, but let's just say I'd like to see your thoughts on this matter when you're a resident/parent/etc.

In general, I live life with no regrets. I plan my moves out pretty far in advance, and I've achieved what I wanted to achieve. But if I did it all over again, I would take some extra time along the way.

I would argue more, but the fact that a current resident lacks the depth to see what I am actually getting at is too depressing.

"We don't live in the rest of the world, so why is that relevant?", I just gave up reasoning with you after reading this.

The logic that your argument is more valid because YOU regret your past doesn't even make sense as the original debate is that "machines" either don't socialize as much or regret that they missed out. How you feel is irrelevant because you fit that argument. If one "machine" doesn't fit, than that makes the original argument invalid.

And, please- don't presume to think that because you are a resident and older, that suddenly makes you wiser and more correct. You've been in too isolated of a world if you truly believe that.

 

[chiapet874]

Couldn't agree more with this post. Although I'm not a resident/attending/parent, it's always hilarious how people who have yet to become older think they know how it is.

Oh the irony...

 

[equinsu ocha]

And, please- don't presume to think that because you are a resident and older, that suddenly makes you wiser and more correct. You've been in too isolated of a world if you truly believe that.

 

[Copernicium]

 

[45408]

I would argue more, but the fact that a current resident lacks the depth to see what I am actually getting at is too depressing.

"We don't live in the rest of the world, so why is that relevant?", I just gave up reasoning with you after reading this.

You would argue more....but you're wrong and are looking foolish. We're discussing American college students who are aspiring to become American physicians. The rest of the world's travails aren't the issue here.

The logic that your argument is more valid because YOU regret your past doesn't even make sense as the original debate is that "machines" either don't socialize as much or regret that they missed out. How you feel is irrelevant because you fit that argument. If one "machine" doesn't fit, than that makes the original argument invalid.

"In general, I live life with no regrets." Re-read that as many times as necessary. Just a minute ago, I was jealous.

I'm just cautioning all of you guys to realize that it doesn't end when you hit med school. You're making ignorant comments like "it's only 4 years," when it's not only 4 years. The kids in hSDN think it's only 4 years, then you pre-meds think it's only 4 years, then the med students think it's only 4 more years, and suddenly, I've been doing this sh-t for well over a decade.

And, please- don't presume to think that because you are a resident and older, that suddenly makes you wiser and more correct. You've been in too isolated of a world if you truly believe that.

It's better to be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt. In your case, I'm not presuming.

 

[docbrill]

 

[chiapet874]

You would argue more....but you're wrong and are looking foolish. We're discussing American college students who are aspiring to become American physicians. The rest of the world's travails aren't the issue here.


"In general, I live life with no regrets." Re-read that as many times as necessary. Just a minute ago, I was jealous.

I'm just cautioning all of you guys to realize that it doesn't end when you hit med school. You're making ignorant comments like "it's only 4 years," when it's not only 4 years. The kids in hSDN think it's only 4 years, then you pre-meds think it's only 4 years, then the med students think it's only 4 more years, and suddenly, I've been doing this sh-t for well over a decade.


It's better to be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt. In your case, I'm not presuming.

Whose the bigger fool? The fool or the person arguing with the supposed fool?

I stand by my arguments; I think you should re-read the OP and consider what the point of this thread is actually about. Than perhaps you will see my point better. And at the end of the day, if I really am foolish for believing hard-workers should pursue their own path- so be it, I'll happily take the title of the tom-fool.

 

[davidb25]

Whose the bigger fool? The fool or the person arguing with the supposed fool?

I stand by my arguments; I think you should re-read the OP and consider what the point of this thread is actually about. Than perhaps you will see my point better. And at the end of the day, if I really am foolish for believing hard-workers should pursue their own path- so be it, I'll happily take the title of the tom-fool.

To be honest, your perspective on life sounds very reminiscent of an unappreciative, narrow-minded, poorly parented friend of mine I used to know.

What I believe people are trying to convey to you in this thread is this. Hard-work has it's time and place, but it would be unwise to sacrifice things that make you happy when your youth is, quite honestly, the most precious resource.

I came to a interesting thought the other day while I sit here studying for finals like a mad-man. I was looking across the library, at all the students preparing to become the world's future, so much ambition, so much promise. Then it struck me. In about 50 years maybe less, almost everyone in the room (myself included) will probably no longer be in the work force, and we'll all be looking back at the time we had and what we made of it. This, of course, is assuming I'm still alive in 50 years.

Ask any 70 year old, they'll say the same thing. They could have sworn they were 20 yesterday.

 

[chiapet874]

To be honest, your perspective on life sounds very reminiscent of an unappreciative, narrow-minded, poorly parented friend of mine I used to know.

What I believe people are trying to convey to you in this thread is this. Hard-work has it's time and place, but it would be unwise to sacrifice things that make you happy when your youth is, quite honestly, the most precious resource.

I came to a interesting thought the other day while I sit here studying for finals like a mad-man. I was looking across the library, at all the students preparing to become the world's future, so much ambition, so much promise. Then it struck me. In about 50 years maybe less, almost everyone in the room (myself included) will probably no longer be in the work force, and we'll all be looking back at the time we had and what we made of it. This, of course, is assuming I'm still alive in 50 years.

Ask any 70 year old, they'll say the same thing. They could have sworn they were 20 yesterday.

Is it more appreciative to your parents, who are paying for your college education, if you spend your time partying? Is it narrow-minded to recognize the unequaled opportunities in front of you and grabbing them with both hands? I'm not sure I see how self-discipline equals "poorly-parented".

From my understanding of this thread, the definition of a "machine" is a person who does all these things because they WANT to. They aren't sacrificing anything (in their minds) if this is the path they freely wanted to take.

This thread has shifted from a "how do they do it" to a "why don't they do it". I presume the point you are trying to make is: life is too short. Fair enough, if life is too short, you should do what you want to do. Maybe "machines" don't want to participate in your social protocols. If that's the case, then they are doing what makes them happy. They aren't missing out in anything.

 

[ss123]

similar thread: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=859726

seems like a common goal among pre-meds

 

[DISCOSTEW]

The idea that being a "machine" means little to no social life is a very narrow view. It comes off as a justification for why YOU can't be as focused as these people.

qft x 3

 

[druggeek]

Oh the irony...

Not really considering I'm speaking on behalf of what every older person says.

 

[chiapet874]

Not really considering I'm speaking on behalf of what every older person says.

 

[nygiants fan]

Wait until you're a resident/attending, and you decide it would be nice to go study abroad for a semester.

Hell, just wait until you have kids, or a house, or $200K in student loans.

TheProwler,

I just finished my first semester of med school! I had my final this morning, did well on it, and will start with organ modules next month (cardio is first). It's useless arguing with the pre-meds. I did the traditional route and came to med school straight of of undergrad. Sure I played a varsity sport in college and had fun and was involved in other things but there are times when I wish I took a year off. It is just outside of the pre-med view to understand just how crushing and awful med school is. It doesn't matter who you are or what you did. You don't enjoy it and it's not fun but when you get to 3rd year, you will be happier because you're actually being taught how to be a doctor then. Studying 50 hours a week every week just to stay on top of all the material, being tested on an entire textbook every 2 or 3 weeks, having most of the people in class addicted to sleeping pills or alcohol to help them go to bed every night and adderal for studying. As a pre-med in college, I wouldn't have believed you if you told me the grind, misery, sleep deprivation, loss of relationships, and sacrifice that would come from "only 4 years" of med school. And yet I still do well in school because I want to be the best physician that I can and med school is the hurdle that needs to be jumped. The pre-meds will understand when they are MS1s. Until then, I'm sorry to say that you're just wasting your breath.

 

[SnappleApple]

TheProwler,

I just finished my first semester of med school! I had my final this morning, did well on it, and will start with organ modules next month (cardio is first). It's useless arguing with the pre-meds. I did the traditional route and came to med school straight of of undergrad. Sure I played a varsity sport in college and had fun and was involved in other things but there are times when I wish I took a year off. It is just outside of the pre-med view to understand just how crushing and awful med school is. It doesn't matter who you are or what you did. You don't enjoy it and it's not fun but when you get to 3rd year, you will be happier because you're actually being taught how to be a doctor then. Studying 50 hours a week every week just to stay on top of all the material, being tested on an entire textbook every 2 or 3 weeks, having most of the people in class addicted to sleeping pills or alcohol to help them go to bed every night and adderal for studying. As a pre-med in college, I wouldn't have believed you if you told me the grind, misery, sleep deprivation, loss of relationships, and sacrifice that would come from "only 4 years" of med school. And yet I still do well in school because I want to be the best physician that I can and med school is the hurdle that needs to be jumped. The pre-meds will understand when they are MS1s. Until then, I'm sorry to say that you're just wasting your breath.

Are you one of those med students who tries to look tough by selling horror stories to other people? No one is impressed. Don't bother trying to speak for every med student, some of us, including me, enjoyed our first two years. You're not even in your second semester, what do you actually know about the final years of medical school? In my books, you're barely better than these pre-meds.

The only people who really had problems remotely close to yours were those who slide through undergraduate life without a care in the world.