Pregnant & can't start new residency on July 1st

[BoardingDoc]

Yes, I somehow lost my parentheses. It was just tadasha. My mom works in a high school and she says she also has 'ion. Can you guess how that is pronounced?

Apostrophion?

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[wysdoc]

I'm a MS4, pregnant w/ due date of June 28th 2019... few days prior to residency start date.
I am already near the end of my interview trail so I'm planning on matching this year to IM.

I've done my searches through the thread about the options w/FMLA, sick days etc. (Since I definitely would not have worked a full year w/ my new employer, I am not covered under FMLA)
However it seems the fact that I can't start residency on July 1st complicates the picture quite a bit.
Residencies can terminate the contract if I can't start, and I am unable to find anywhere if there's any protection for pregnancy.

I would like to match this year mostly for the fear of reduced match rate if I defer a year especially since I need to match in the most geographically competitive area in order to not be separated from my spouse (different job for spouse is not an option for financial reason). Also, I've already done all the interviews and everything so having to go through this again is quite a dread... but if I don't have any other choice well then I guess I'll have to suck it up.

My best hope is that the residency program I match into would allow me to start ~6 weeks after birth. I don't care if it delays the completion of my residency training.
But am I completely under the mercy of the individual program since I can't start on July 1st? Do I have any legal rights?
I plan on matching in the state of California. Am I eligible for Pregnancy Disability Leave even if I haven't started my work yet?

If you could tell me what are my rights as well as where I can find assistance, I would really appreciate it.

You might find these 2 videos released by NRMP helpful and definitely consider contacting them (at [email protected]) to find out how you can best conduct your match communications without violating Match policies.


NEW! Program Policy Pitfalls Videos: Waivers and Violation Investigations - The Match, National Resident Matching Program

 

[Piebaldi]

Apostrophion?

I like this possibility.

 

[LucidSplash]

When I was a medical student in Baltimore, I learned that ‘ was called “high comma.”

 

[raiderette]

Apostrophion?

Bingo.

 

[Piebaldi]

Bingo.

That is just - I have no words lol.

 

[BoardingDoc]

Bingo.

Outside the context of this thread, there is no reason why anyone would ever be able to correctly infer how to pronounce that child's name. These parents should seriously be ashamed of themselves.

 

[Piebaldi]

Outside the context of this thread, there is no reason why anyone would ever be able to correctly infer how to pronounce that child's name. These parents should seriously be ashamed of themselves.

Agreed. I would hope that parents want their children to thrive, naming their child something like that is just awful.

 

[mvenus929]

When I was a medical student in Baltimore, I learned that ‘ was called “high comma.”

Comma up high in my region.

I’ve since moved to the Midwest and get strange looks when I jokingly refer to it as that.

 

[MediCane2006]

When I was a medical student in Baltimore, I learned that ‘ was called “high comma.”

That’s an up-comma down here in the south

 

[Apollyon]

It's an okina in Hawai'i. (Well, close enough - the okina is actually a "glottal stop".)

 

[Dr. Stable-Genius]

I'm a MS4, pregnant w/ due date of June 28th 2019... few days prior to residency start date.
I am already near the end of my interview trail so I'm planning on matching this year to IM.

I've done my searches through the thread about the options w/FMLA, sick days etc. (Since I definitely would not have worked a full year w/ my new employer, I am not covered under FMLA)
However it seems the fact that I can't start residency on July 1st complicates the picture quite a bit.
Residencies can terminate the contract if I can't start, and I am unable to find anywhere if there's any protection for pregnancy.

I would like to match this year mostly for the fear of reduced match rate if I defer a year especially since I need to match in the most geographically competitive area in order to not be separated from my spouse (different job for spouse is not an option for financial reason). Also, I've already done all the interviews and everything so having to go through this again is quite a dread... but if I don't have any other choice well then I guess I'll have to suck it up.

My best hope is that the residency program I match into would allow me to start ~6 weeks after birth. I don't care if it delays the completion of my residency training.
But am I completely under the mercy of the individual program since I can't start on July 1st? Do I have any legal rights?
I plan on matching in the state of California. Am I eligible for Pregnancy Disability Leave even if I haven't started my work yet?

If you could tell me what are my rights as well as where I can find assistance, I would really appreciate it.

How do you know what your residency start date will be? It's my understanding this varies by specialty and location. Ex: My friend started at George Washington Anesthesiology last year and he had to report on like June 13th (they had some orientation and things to do). So can you really plan on what date residency starts?

 

[Dr. Stable-Genius]

How would you feel about her professionalism?

I'm totally with MedStudent9. I wouldn't feel this was a reflection of poor professionalism. OP has no idea where she will match and is not being dishonest by not mass emailing all the programs she interviewed at that she is going to need to start late.

 

[rokshana]

How do you know what your residency start date will be? It's my understanding this varies by specialty and location. Ex: My friend started at George Washington Anesthesiology last year and he had to report on like June 13th (they had some orientation and things to do). So can you really plan on what date residency starts?

The majority of residencies employ you as of July 1st...which is the important date...the date you are considered an employee.
Yes there are specialties like surgery that start a couple of weeks early but she is applying to IM so again, the vast majority start employment July 1st...none will start later and some may pay for orientation and so could be employed earlier so if early enough and she can attend then then she maybe able to take leave but still at many places she won’t be eligible for fmla.

For example, orientation started mid June for me but wanted employed until July 1st and insurance didn’t kick in until after a mo th of being employed.

 

[Ironheme]

You do you. Tell them after you match. Residents in my program did exactly that, and yes coverage was increased for the rest of us, but we managed. Your program would probably have done this before and would be a good resource for you. Residents in my program get 6 weeks of maternity leave and it delays graduation by that long as well.

...Just make sure you don't pick a malignant program.

 

[GonnaBeADoc2222]

Pretty disappointed in most of the responses to OPs post.

What, a woman can't be pregnant and have a child peri-residency/fellowship? Please.

I would 100% NOT tell a soul before match day.

They will manage....and GASP....maybe an attending will have to see a patient or two and put in a few order themselves!

 

[Piebaldi]

Pretty disappointed in most of the responses to OPs post.

What, a woman can't be pregnant and have a child peri-residency/fellowship? Please.

I would 100% NOT tell a soul before match day.

They will manage....and GASP....maybe an attending will have to see a patient or two and put in a few order themselves!

I think we all know that the attending wont' be doing that, hopefully OP can be started on an elective, but typically it's going to be the co-residents who will be affected.

 

[Psai]

It's an okina in Hawai'i. (Well, close enough - the okina is actually a "glottal stop".)

Oooh I got this one it's pronounced high why high comma eye

 

[Errollt]

Co-residents could and should manage too; I still don't get why one, in a situation like that of the OP, would put much thought on how anybody else's workload will be affected, residence is a lot of work anyways and the load of one resident not available does not put that much of an additional strain as some like to put it like.

 

[rokshana]

Co-residents could and should manage too; I still don't get why one, in a situation like that of the OP, would put much thought on how anybody else's workload will be affected, residence is a lot of work anyways and the load of one resident not available does not put that much of an additional strain as some like to put it like.

Seriously? I take it you have never been an intern, resident, or responsible for scheduling them.

 

[NITRAS]

Depends on the program size. I did scheduling for an IM program with 12-13 residents per years. Had a couple babies born that year. It sucked, but it wasn’t the end of the world. Larger programs have more residents to bear the burden.

Frankly, a brand new pgy1 isn’t exactly helpful. A pgy 2 or pgy 3 can easily do their ten notes and take the pages while the OP is off.

 

[PTPoeny]

As someone else said, from a legal standpoint, I believe they must give you maternity leave, so they will likely give you the 6 weeks off. obviously it's needless to say taht this will inevitably screw over your co-interns, and they will be taking more call, and working harder right from the get go, which will be unpleasant. It will also put you at a disdvantage as you will be starting residency 6 weeks late, and as a new mom, which will make things stressful for you, both from the fact that you are having a new infant to take care of, but also the need to learn a new system, being behind everyone else, with the potential for higher expectations since you will be compared to your co-residents who started before.

Also 6 weeks is more vacation than is given per year, so you will have no vacation for the rest of the year, and will likely have to extend your residency. You don't have to take the 6 weeks - as much as it sucks. Hopefully you have a supportive spouse who will help out.

Good luck!

No, if you deliver before starting work you don't get anything.

 

[geripalgal]

Also dont forget that if you use up all your vacation days right away you have nothing left over for the rest of the year - newborns have lots of doctors appointmentsand are at risk for getting sick etc during that first year - hope you have someone reliable who can manage those times for you since you wont be able to take off (which is the hardest thing as a new mom, not being able to be there when your kid is sick)


In the end, while the timing is not advisable, its certainly do-able. Residents have done this in the past. Make sure you have a clear caregiving with backup plan for your infant before you start.

dont expect any of your colleagues to understand or go above and beyond for you. You will, unfortunatley be the one who will have to go above and beyond to show that you are capable of pulling your own weight as a pgy1. All while trying to do the best for your baby. There is a physician mom group on facebook - consider joining to discuss with other moms balancig work and life.

 

[Psai]

Co-residents could and should manage too; I still don't get why one, in a situation like that of the OP, would put much thought on how anybody else's workload will be affected, residence is a lot of work anyways and the load of one resident not available does not put that much of an additional strain as some like to put it like.

One resident out of the call pool means everyone has to do their calls. It's really annoying for a large call pool, it is that much worse for small programs.

 

[precisiongraphic]

Also dont forget that if you use up all your vacation days right away you have nothing left over for the rest of the year - newborns have lots of doctors appointmentsand are at risk for getting sick etc during that first year - hope you have someone reliable who can manage those times for you since you wont be able to take off (which is the hardest thing as a new mom, not being able to be there when your kid is sick)


In the end, while the timing is not advisable, its certainly do-able. Residents have done this in the past. Make sure you have a clear caregiving with backup plan for your infant before you start.

dont expect any of your colleagues to understand or go above and beyond for you. You will, unfortunatley be the one who will have to go above and beyond to show that you are capable of pulling your own weight as a pgy1. All while trying to do the best for your baby. There is a physician mom group on facebook - consider joining to discuss with other moms balancig work and life.

Yes, unless you have a Stay at home partner for the first year, I think it will be too hard. You should consider a live-in grandparent or perhaps a college-aged niece or nephew. Otherwise a live in nanny or an au pair.

The difficulty as a working parent (which I was) with potential round-the-clock work hours, irregular work hours, unexpected hours and weekend hours (which I wasn't) is that a day care center or in-home caregiver won't cut it. Babies can't go to daycare with a fever or vomiting or even or 24 hours later. Even most caregivers who operate their own in-home daycares likely won't provide round-the-clock care and often aren't able to take sick kids.

 

[PremiumKale]

I came into residency super pregnant. Do NOT tell anyone you are pregnant. It is not fair that this should be a strike against you, life happens and the match is too important. I did not tell anyone at my residency until I signed my contract. I let them know when we had to choose our schedule preferences.

Two of my coresidents had to start late and my PD didn't bat an eyelash. I think you should consider if you are willing to go in for orientation type stuff such as EMR lessons, tours and whatnot as it will be difficult to start work at all without these. Personally I would plan to go to these even with a brand new baby. However, these are all things that will be sorted after the match.When I was pregnant 4th year, I discussed with a PD that I was nervous, and he laughed and told me one of his accepted fellows was due on July first and their only worry is that she would be able to sign up for their health insurance on time.

Hopefully you got a good feel about how family friendly your programs are. Mine was very supportive


Breathe, and good luck in the match

 

[swoopyswoop]

What I fail to see is how this is ANY DIFFERENT than a resident getting pregnant during residency - people get pregnant, they have babies, they take leave, and the rest of the program covers the workload. Unless you're going to claim that no one should ever get pregnant and take maternity leave during pregnancy, no one should be telling this medical student to forego her match this year and apply after she's had the baby. The only difference here is the fact that July of PGY1. Sure, missing the first month of residency puts you at a disadvantage but guess what - she'll recover from it. And don't say there's not enough fair warning for the program - **** happens and people make it work (breaking an ankle, finding out you're pregnant in August and delivering 9 months later during the same academic year when the "schedule" has already been made)...

 

[PTPoeny]

What I fail to see is how this is ANY DIFFERENT than a resident getting pregnant during residency - people get pregnant, they have babies, they take leave, and the rest of the program covers the workload. Unless you're going to claim that no one should ever get pregnant and take maternity leave during pregnancy, no one should be telling this medical student to forego her match this year and apply after she's had the baby. The only difference here is the fact that July of PGY1. Sure, missing the first month of residency puts you at a disadvantage but guess what - she'll recover from it. And don't say there's not enough fair warning for the program - **** happens and people make it work (breaking an ankle, finding out you're pregnant in August and delivering 9 months later during the same academic year when the "schedule" has already been made)...

July 1st is different because she may not be able to get health insurance. She likely will get no paid maternity leave at all even if the program offers 6 weeks of paid maternity leave to residents who have officially started, she won't be eligible. Even in states like New York and California where the state offers paid maternity leave she won't be eligible. I didn't think it is unreasonable for people to point out that she has the option of considering extending her medical schooling for another year and taking a longer maternity leave. It may not be the right choice for her and her family, but it is an option and one that she may not have considered given her comments about being in the match a year after graduating. I had a co resident who started residency one week after having a baby and one that took a year off to be able to spend more time with her baby and feel more ready to start residency. They both did well and both clearly made the correct choice for their own families.

 

[hallowmann]

To be completely honest, she's at the mercy of the program. That said, most places don't finalize who will be on what service until after the match. Programs that plan ahead already have "tracks" of schedules so they could just put her in one that starts with an outpatient/off-service/elective rotation, whereas others actually ask for input or send you a requirements form. My schedule wasn't finalized until the end of May before I started residency. If she tells programs in March, it should be adequate time to prepare, and at worst, it would affect a handful of weekend call shifts.

The issue is that it may create some bad blood if the program isn't supportive, and the program could absolutely request a waiver from the match agreement or if they were vindictive could accuse OP of a match violation. I would hope most programs would understand, be a bit annoyed at the little bit of extra work and just make the adjustments to the schedule.

I think delaying graduation an extra year is also an option, because at most OP will get 6 wks, whereas she could potentially get months off if she extended her graduation. If that's not ideal, so be it.

When it comes to maternity/paternity, residency sucks. You're not under FMLA because you're a trainee with an annual contract, you're usual subject to different rules than other university employees because you're a trainee, and unless you have a universal GME policy or resident union, you have very limited recourse. To give you an idea, in one program at the university where I'm training, you get the option of taking 4 wks off for maternity or 6 wks off in the form of a parental elective. You can take more, but it will extend your residency. For another program, you can take up to 2-3 months off/parental elective without it extending residency. For paternity, both programs offer 5 days off, but only the first offers a 2 wk parental elective without an LOA that would extend residency. In another specialty (a surgical specialty), the max you can get is 4 wks maternity before extending your residency (if they even give you that option) and you lose your vacation time for that, and I think they also give 5 days for paternity.

 

[droliver]

Assuming you match, I would inform the program immediately of your condition. I would NOT mention a thing about IVF, and just tell them it was unplanned and may interfere with your start date. If you get into that IVF story, they might make some negative impressions of your honesty and judgement on timing during the process that you did not bring it up. (keeping it real....I would.)

If I was you, I might see if they would defer your start date until July 2020 quite honestly rather then try to hustle back into a busy intern year with a newborn. That's undesirable for both of you.

 

[arto22]

The OP shouldn’t have to sit out a year if she doesn’t want to. If I were OP, I would tell immediately after match and ask for accomodations re start date.

What Doktormom states about changing the rank of a pregnant applicant is completely illegal and discriminatory. However, I personally wouldn’t feel comfortable enough as an applicant to disclose prior to the Match for that reason. So waiting until immediately after you know where you match is completely reasonable and normal.

There’s never gonna be an ideal time to have kids. You just have to live your life. I would work on making sure you have good childcare arrangements in for when you actually start. You likely need two nannies (1 won’t work 80 hours) or daycare plus nanny or family member plus nanny.

2 nannies on a resident's income? Are you serious?

 

[emergentmd]

How this topic even lasted this long or have this many debates has shown me how far some of my fellow Americans just looks out for themselves no matter what.

Live life and just do the right thing. If OP has to ask this question, thus shows me she has some maturity/honesty, then do the right thing. If you do the right things in life, everything works out.

Not telling the program director is the worse you could do. Be honest and there will be programs that will be sympathetic and rank you higher due to your honesty.

If I was a program director and you were honest about this situation, I would move you up because I know I will get getting a mature resident who thinks of others/the program eventhough there is personal risk.
Don't tell me, and you are a marked person your whole residency and would in no way get a recommendation from e.

 

[emergentmd]

Assuming you match, I would inform the program immediately of your condition. I would NOT mention a thing about IVF, and just tell them it was unplanned and may interfere with your start date. If you get into that IVF story, they might make some negative impressions of your honesty and judgement on timing during the process that you did not bring it up. (keeping it real....I would.)

If I was you, I might see if they would defer your start date until July 2020 quite honestly rather then try to hustle back into a busy intern year with a newborn. That's undesirable for both of you.

If I were the PD and come March 16th I get this call..... this is what I will hear

"Hi Program Director, I just want to tell you that I am pregnant and will be delivering right before July 1st. I was a dishonest coward and wanted to hide this from you because I am the kind of person who care more about my well being. I guess I could have told you after I found out, but I am not mature enough. But regardless, I need special accommodations and will not be there for atleast 6 wks. I hope there is no complication with my birth because it very well could be longer. Sorry for screwing you and the program because I was selfish"

 

[atomi]

2 nannies on a resident's income? Are you serious?

Hard truth:

Working 80 hours a week for 6 years straight and raising a baby at the same time are mutually exclusive. It may be technically possible if you have a stay at home spouse, but not necessarily a good idea.

You can’t always have your cake and eat it too.

I want to be an transpacific airline pilot who is home every other weekend. But I also want to have a baby. Can I do both? The TV and internet told me it’s the 21st century and this is normal, right?

It’s not a dog. You can’t just drop it off at the kennel.

Sometimes you have to choose between two things in life as to which you want more. We have an entire generation coming up that thinks they get everything exactly their way all the time with no compromises and automatic accommodations for whatever they want because they want it.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

Hard truth:

Working 80 hours a week for 6 years straight and raising a baby at the same time are mutually exclusive. It may be technically possible if you have a stay at home spouse, but not necessarily a good idea.

You can’t always have your cake and eat it too.

I want to be an transpacific airline pilot who is home every other weekend. But I also want to have a baby. Can I do both? The TV and internet told me it’s the 21st century and this is normal, right?

It’s not a dog. You can’t just drop it off at the kennel.

Sometimes you have to choose between two things in life as to which you want more. We have an entire generation coming up that thinks they get everything exactly their way all the time with no compromises and automatic accommodations for whatever they want because they want it.

Nah.

Its hard and takes the right set of circumstances, but its very possible.

 

[deleted480308]

Nah.

Its hard and takes the right set of circumstances, but its very possible.

Exactly.

The other parent can chip in time/money. Family can move with you and watch kids. Older kids can self watch. You can choose a shorter residency with less hours

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

Exactly.

The other parent can chip in time/money. Family can move with you and watch kids. Older kids can self watch. You can choose a shorter residency with less hours

Daycare with a spouse/family who can stay home if kids are sick.

Nanny with spouse/family who can stay with kids if sick.

Daycare with back up nanny.

Quite a lot of ways to make this work.

 

[Mad Jack]

As someone else said, from a legal standpoint, I believe they must give you maternity leave, so they will likely give you the 6 weeks off. obviously it's needless to say taht this will inevitably screw over your co-interns, and they will be taking more call, and working harder right from the get go, which will be unpleasant. It will also put you at a disdvantage as you will be starting residency 6 weeks late, and as a new mom, which will make things stressful for you, both from the fact that you are having a new infant to take care of, but also the need to learn a new system, being behind everyone else, with the potential for higher expectations since you will be compared to your co-residents who started before.

Also 6 weeks is more vacation than is given per year, so you will have no vacation for the rest of the year, and will likely have to extend your residency. You don't have to take the 6 weeks - as much as it sucks. Hopefully you have a supportive spouse who will help out.

Good luck!

FMLA is the legal framework that allows for maternity leave and it doesn't kick in until one year of employment. As a starting employee you have no legal protections, aside from potentially claiming discrimination had they not hired you in the first place. But as an employer, they could demand you start work a few days post-delivery and fire you if you are not compliant from a legal perspective. However, most hospitals and residencies have nuanced maternity leave policies in their contracts that OP will have to review to determine if she is going to be compliant. Since she is technically delivering prior to her start date, she would likely not legally be covered under these policies and she will be at the mercy of her PD and HR since she will be in violation of the match terms, and they can either delay her start or release her entirely at their discretion.

 

[Raryn]

FMLA is the legal framework that allows for maternity leave and it doesn't kick in until one year of employment. As a starting employee you have no legal protections, aside from potentially claiming discrimination had they not hired you in the first place. But as an employer, they could demand you start work a few days post-delivery and fire you if you are not compliant from a legal perspective. However, most hospitals and residencies have nuanced maternity leave policies in their contracts that OP will have to review to determine if she is going to be compliant

I will point out that this isn't true universally. On a state level, CA mandates unpaid leave immediately assuming your employer has at least 50 employees. Some other states do the same. Some states have the equivalent to FMLA kick in after 6 months. Some simply require 1000 hours of work within the last year. Or 500. Or 2000. Etc.

Regardless though, even in CA, it only kicks in once you start working. Hence my comment earlier in the thread that a baby born in June is the absolute possible worst timing for a graduating medical student.

 

[Mad Jack]

I will point out that this isn't true universally. On a state level, CA mandates unpaid leave immediately assuming your employer has at least 50 employees. Some other states do the same. Some states have the equivalent to FMLA kick in after 6 months. Some simply require 1000 hours of work within the last year. Or 500. Or 2000. Etc.

Regardless though, even in CA, it only kicks in once you start working. Hence my comment earlier in the thread that a baby born in June is the absolute possible worst timing for a graduating medical student.

Lol, I actually edited my post to add that stipulation right before your response. The big issue is timing, which really puts her at the mercy of her program. I should have read the whole thread to see you'd already made this point

 

[atomi]

Exactly.

The other parent can chip in time/money. Family can move with you and watch kids. Older kids can self watch. You can choose a shorter residency with less hours

The last option is a reasonable option.

 

[atomi]

Daycare with a spouse/family who can stay home if kids are sick.

Nanny with spouse/family who can stay with kids if sick.

Daycare with back up nanny.

Quite a lot of ways to make this work.

Look, I'm not telling the OP to drop out and become a stay at home mom, I'm just making a general observation.

I just have a slight problem with people who want to be both a mom and a subspecialist surgeon and plan to have a child right before residency and then dump it off in daycare.

Obviously this doesn't apply to everyone and there are exceptions. People who accidentally get pregnant despite being responsible. People who have kids but get divorced are now a single mom, etc. But you can't deny that there are those where both parents are doctors who strategically plan to have kids before and during residency knowing accomodations will be made and then immediately dump them in daycare to be cared for by minimum wage workers so they can get back to their careers. Again, it's a child, not a dog or a hobby. Just a slight pet peeve of mine how people diminsh the value and importance of full-time child rearing in modern i-can-have-it-all society.

 

[Raryn]

Look, I'm not telling the OP to drop out and become a stay at home mom, I'm just making a general observation.

I just have a slight problem with people who want to be both a mom and a subspecialist surgeon and plan to have a child right before residency and then dump it off in daycare.

Obviously this doesn't apply to everyone and there are exceptions. People who accidentally get pregnant despite being responsible. People who have kids but get divorced are now a single mom, etc. But you can't deny that there are those where both parents are doctors who strategically plan to have kids before and during residency knowing accomodations will be made and then immediately dump them in daycare to be cared for by minimum wage workers so they can get back to their careers. Again, it's a child, not a dog or a hobby. Just a slight pet peeve of mine how people diminsh the value and importance of full-time child rearing in modern i-can-have-it-all society.

There's no good time to have a child - everyone plans as best they can (or doesn't) and then make it work. Dual professional couples have just as much right to kids as anyone else.

(Now, some times are better than others, and my personal opinion is that doing IVF 9 months before you're supposed to start residency is dumb, but that's an opinion).

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

There's no good time to have a child - everyone plans as best they can (or doesn't) and then make it work. Dual professional couples have just as much right to kids as anyone else.

(Now, some times are better than others, and my personal opinion is that doing IVF 9 months before you're supposed to start residency is dumb, but that's an opinion).

But she wasn't doing IVF 9 months before starting. She was doing it for 3 years and this one cycle happened to take.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

Look, I'm not telling the OP to drop out and become a stay at home mom, I'm just making a general observation.

I just have a slight problem with people who want to be both a mom and a subspecialist surgeon and plan to have a child right before residency and then dump it off in daycare.

Obviously this doesn't apply to everyone and there are exceptions. People who accidentally get pregnant despite being responsible. People who have kids but get divorced are now a single mom, etc. But you can't deny that there are those where both parents are doctors who strategically plan to have kids before and during residency knowing accomodations will be made and then immediately dump them in daycare to be cared for by minimum wage workers so they can get back to their careers. Again, it's a child, not a dog or a hobby. Just a slight pet peeve of mine how people diminsh the value and importance of full-time child rearing in modern i-can-have-it-all society.

Physicians aren't the only ones who use daycare from 8 weeks or so. Not sure why she's any different than any other dual-working couple in that regard.

As for those who plan better, the OP says that she's been doing IVF for 3 years and this is just the one cycle that took. Its bad luck. Now you could argue that she should have stopped IVF for the several months that would have resulted in a baby right at the start of residency but that's foolish. What if her due date was Sept 1 and the baby came 10 weeks early?

 

[atomi]

Physicians aren't the only ones who use daycare from 8 weeks or so. Not sure why she's any different than any other dual-working couple in that regard.

And that's equally as wrong, in my opinion, if your career requires very long hours and travel. In my opinion there are certain careers and lifestyles that are simply incompatible with raising children. Sorry.

Sometimes you just have to choose.

Within medicine, there are some specialties that allows moms to be moms to a reasonable degree. There are others that absolutely do not.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

And that's equally as wrong, in my opinion, if your career requires very long hours and travel. In my opinion there are certain careers and lifestyles that are simply incompatible with raising children. Sorry.

Sometimes you just have to choose.

Within medicine, there are some specialties that allows moms to be moms to a reasonable degree. There are others that absolutely do not.

Why are you blathering about long hours and travel?

If you have 2 bankers that work 8-5 M-F you'll still need childcare.

My mother was a teacher but someone still had to watch me from 8-3.

 

[Mad Jack]

Physicians aren't the only ones who use daycare from 8 weeks or so. Not sure why she's any different than any other dual-working couple in that regard.

As for those who plan better, the OP says that she's been doing IVF for 3 years and this is just the one cycle that took. Its bad luck. Now you could argue that she should have stopped IVF for the several months that would have resulted in a baby right at the start of residency but that's foolish. What if her due date was Sept 1 and the baby came 10 weeks early?

And what if delaying cost her the only cycle that would have stuck? It's a game of chance

 

[Mad Jack]

And that's equally as wrong, in my opinion, if your career requires very long hours and travel. In my opinion there are certain careers and lifestyles that are simply incompatible with raising children. Sorry.

Sometimes you just have to choose.

Within medicine, there are some specialties that allows moms to be moms to a reasonable degree. There are others that absolutely do not.

I'd rather have a physician mother that is less available and forced to utilize child care raise children than many of the questionable parents I've come across that do more damage by their presence than their absence. There is no right way to parent and being there (or not) for years for child will mostly not remember isn't the biggest make or break factor in how good of a parent you are or how well your kids will turn out

 

[atomi]

Why are you blathering about long hours and travel?

If you have 2 bankers that work 8-5 M-F you'll still need childcare.

My mother was a teacher but someone still had to watch me from 8-3.

Never mind. You can totally be a neurosurgeon and work a hundred hours a week a raise 4 kids.

If you can’t you’re just weak and lazy!

Want to be a solider and deploy to Afghanistan for a year? You can totally have a few babies and raise them at the same time.

Sigh.