Primaries- WHY WHY!!!

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Freakingzooming

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Why bother having us fill out primaries when you're just going to send another application automatically-w/o the screening? too many schools have figured out now that they can just send 100 % of their applicants secondaries and get more money from it.. we as the applicants should complain cuz it wastes our time, money, and energy to fill out those extra essays and money when they don't filter out the students in the first round.

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I think that you have already answered your own question: money.
 
It sucks.

But its nothing we can do about it. Not even the med students can really complain, because admissions doesn't really affect them once they're in, so the schools might be reluctant to listen.

All we can do is shell out the cash, and hope we will get an interview. :)
 
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Me thinks- the just desserts in this are that they will have to be the ones reading the lame secondary essays I will be writiing for them. mwahha.

I used to think that getting the secondaries was a big deal.. not it's really not.
 
I thinkk it is legit for a school to send a secondary to all applicants if they ask questions that are important to them in making a decision on interview/no interview.

The completely annoying ones are the secondaries that have NO questions. Just a please fill out your name, address, sign here, and of course don't forget to include the check for $60-$100.
:confused: :confused:
 
Are you just doing primaries now?
 
Originally posted by Trix
I thinkk it is legit for a school to send a secondary to all applicants if they ask questions that are important to them in making a decision on interview/no interview.

The completely annoying ones are the secondaries that have NO questions. Just a please fill out your name, address, sign here, and of course don't forget to include the check for $60-$100.
:confused: :confused:

And don't forget the ones that make you fill out the coursework again, in a similar, but slightly different format than the AMCAS primary.
 
Originally posted by JBJ
And don't forget the ones that make you fill out the coursework again, in a similar, but slightly different format than the AMCAS primary.

Ya...the dreaded UC application +pissed+
 
Originally posted by ckent
I think that you have already answered your own question: money.

Pretty hypocritical of the med schools. They claim to want diversity but set up an application system that effectively weeds out a lot of people from lowincome background w no relatives to bankroll the big$ process.
In many ways there is much more difference between a poor kid who's never gotten any thing given to him nor had any good family connections and a rich kid who has than there is between two rich upper middleclass kids--one black and one white.

BTW--It reminds me of the foreign exchange program in our uppermid class HS It was supposedly to find out about how kids from other countries lived So they had a rich kid come from Brazil who with his $, his brand name clothes and values was no different from us.--(except he had darker skin & was better at tennis)
:rolleyes: :rolleyes:
 
Originally posted by Trix
I thinkk it is legit for a school to send a secondary to all applicants if they ask questions that are important to them in making a decision on interview/no interview.

The completely annoying ones are the secondaries that have NO questions. Just a please fill out your name, address, sign here, and of course don't forget to include the check for $60-$100.
:confused: :confused:

Personally, those kinds would be my favorites! I hate personal statements & references. ;) ;)
 
Everything has a history. As physicians, when you see a patient for the first time you will ask for a medical history. As a general rule, knowing the historical development of anything and everything provides better understanding of why they are, how they evolved and how they work. Case in point: secondary applications.

In the good old days, when medical school was accessible mostly to the well-to-do and white Anglo-Saxon Protestants, the education was affordable and places available to the relatively few who met those requirements. A sea change took place shortly after World War II. Returning veterans had access to a number of the benefits a grateful Congress authorized, commonly known as the "GI Bill." College enrollments increased and a large pool of medical school aspirants appeared. About that time, the number of medical schools was too small to accomodate the wave. New medical schools developed, with larger class sizes, many of them funded by the individual states.

At the same time, rumblings of dissatisfaction grew over the irrelevant restrictions on who could become a physician. The first barrier to fall, about 1955, was anti-semitism. As all the religious barriers began to fall away, so did others. About 1965-1970, all the barriers based only on race and religion began to erode.

As the number of medical schools increased--now standing at 106--so did the number of individual applications and fees.
The American Association of Medical Schools (AAMC) looked into the problem; out of that came AMCAS. The original idea was to have a single application and a single fee. The application would consist of the basic information all the medical schools might be able to agree on. But 106 different independent entities could not agree; the solution was to use the AMCAS application as the basis and each medical school was left free to devlop secondaries if they desired. Of course, the more paperwork, the higher the financial cost of dealing with it.

Admission offices usually have to cover their own expenses. There are personnel costs, computer costs, telephone and other bills to pay. Admission Committees depend on voluntary faculty time for interviewing and decision making.

Some medical schools send secondaries to everyone who files an AMCAS application. That, of course increases applicants' cost. One rationale I have heard, and I can understand it: if students are not selective in where they apply, including to medical schools where they never had a chance of being admitted, that's too bad. The cost to the medical schools for just processing their applications remain.

Agree or not, this is the basic history and rationale.

If you still think how AMCAS handles this is not to your liking, consider what the alternative will become: individual, different applications to each medical school, and still with fees that may or may not exceed what the AMCAS system costs.

Beoming a physician entails large outlays of money throughout the trail to medical doctorhood. Most of you are looking to a future where the outlay will eventually pay big dividends. This is a deferred payout: you invest heavily now, even going into debt, in anticipation of recouping more than you invested. I am not writing of monetary reward alone; how many justify your ambition of saving lives as being reward enough? As you expect to be paid for your services, all the steps--from kindergarten to license--involve thousands of entities and people who do not earn their keep through altruism, even the cleaner who sweeps the Admission Office floor. In a way, even that lowly office, by being involved in your medical education, indirectly contributes to saving lives! It ill becomes those who whine about their costs on their way to a "rewarding" career to carp about the relatively tiny expense of applying to medical school. You still have an alternative; forget medical school and get a job.

I have no connection with medical education, nor am I a physician, nor have I ever been wealthy.
 
Thanks 4 the hx lesson but it still didnt answer my accusation re diversity--
"Pretty hypocritical of the med schools. They claim to want diversity but set up an application system that effectively weeds out a lot of people from lowincome background w no relatives to bankroll the big$ process."
I am pretty sure that adm depts make mucho $ from Ks of secondary apps that they throwaway after removing the check as simple math would indicate. But even if they didnt, why should adm depts be the one dept in med schools that has to pay its own way??
If other med school depts operated this way the students would have to go out and dig up their own corpses for gross anatomy:rolleyes:

Also--if these schools want applicants to be more selective and to not apply to schools where they "have no chance of being admitted", then why dont they openly say what those cutoff points are so that neither applicant nor school is bothered by useless & expensive paperwork?:confused:
 
I don't think it's right to defend something, a really stupid system just cuz there isn't a better more viable alternative.

I was thinking I should form my own medical school- USMC (United States Medical College)- accept the lower average students. rake in the dough. haha. Kinda like how Wright State and Finch is doing it right now.
 
The system can still me made more efficient, so there is no reason to defend it. In fact, the defense is what causes it not to be changed.
If schools still want to find out specific info from their applicants, the AMCAS can be made that when you select certain schools, their specific questions will show up and the perspective applicant has to answer them. The cost would be lower because now you don't have an extra app to process, it is centralized, and you don't have to keep track of all that mail. More efficient therefore lower cost. I am sure if they really looked into it they can make it much more efficient.
You want to change it, start writing letters to the medical schools. Don't say it can't be changed.....everything can be changed. Figure out a better solution, write a draft, send it to all the medical schools. Eventually someone will listen.

X
 
I agree entirely with X. A combination of his system of each school adding on their extra ?s(so there would be no secondaries at all) and mine of each school posting their cutoff pts would significantly reduce the enormous volume and expense (and time) of the effing process for everyone.

BTW-Because an obviously flawed system has a historical background does not mean it should be perpetrated forever.

:mad: :mad: :mad:
 
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