Primary care loan vs Public loan forgiveness

[AGK821199999]

Hello everybody,
My school financial aid adviser was talking to me about my options to pay back my loans. I have 280K in debt and I have an offer from PCL to cover it all however, that will disqualify me from loan forgiveness what do you guys think ?

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[KeikoTanaka]

What exactly is a PCL? I tried googling it but its long and complicated lol

 

[SXMMD]

Hello everybody,
My school financial aid adviser was talking to me about my options to pay back my loans. I have 280K in debt and I have an offer from PCL to cover it all however, that will disqualify me from loan forgiveness what do you guys think ?

Fwiw I don't trust PSLF, never have, and it is not really working well for >90% applicants whose time for the payout is here.

Do your homework carefully

 

[AGK821199999]

What exactly is a PCL? I tried googling it but its long and complicated lol

Primary care loan. In short, no interest during residency or fellowship then 5% interest fixed on 10 or 20 years terms. Not income driven !

 

[AGK821199999]

Fwiw I don't trust PSLF, never have, and it is not really working well for >90% applicants whose time for the payout is here.

Do your homework carefully

I have listened to multiple webinar from AAMC about it. They say it’s not scam ppl applied without reading the terms and that’s why they haven’t been approved. However, I get bad vibes from ppl and I personally don’t think it will last till 2030! What do you think about PCL ?

 

[KeikoTanaka]

Is there ever a reason not to choose PCL if you're planning on doing GIM or FM?

 

[AGK821199999]

Is there ever a reason not to choose PCL if you're planning on doing GIM or FM?

You will be disqualified from PSLF

 

[SXMMD]

I have listened to multiple webinar from AAMC about it. They say it’s not scam ppl applied without reading the terms and that’s why they haven’t been approved. However, I get bad vibes from ppl and I personally don’t think it will last till 2030! What do you think about PCL ?

They're wrong and peddling the bullsh*t that the dept of education is putting out to justify denials of pay out. Read more about it. PSLF requires constant documentation being sent to loan service provders who confirm eligibility year to year. People were being told, for 10 years, that their paperwork was in order, then at the time of payout dept of education retroactively denied eligibility to these same folks who, for 10 years, were told everything was in order.

Don't know enough about pcl to advise, sorry.

 

[Make Or Break]

I’ve got pcl. As another poster said no interest in residency and it’s capped at 5% after when you’re ready to pay it off. If you die your debt is forgiven also. Only stipulation is you have to practice more than 50% of your time doing primary care for the remainder of the loan so doing anything else will disqualify you.

https://bhw.hrsa.gov/sites/default/files/bhw/grants/pclfaqs.pdf

Primary Care Loan

The Primary Care Loan Program offers you a variety of deferment and forbearance options. You are possibly entitled to have the repayment of a loan deferred

www.midwestern.edu

Financing Medical School | Ohio University

www.ohio.edu

 

[KeikoTanaka]

You will be disqualified from PSLF

But why do you need the PSLF if you can just do the PCL and work in PC For 10 years? I don't get it

 

[brianmartin]

SXMDD your information appears to be out of date. PSLF is not a scam. If you follow all procedures and document everything, keep all paperwork, and make the full 120 qualifying payments on your loans, the remaining balance will be forgiven. This is in writing from a government agency. If they do not follow through, then you have a legal case. There have been several legal cases already brought against the dept. of education, where they tried to retroactively deny that the participant was making qualifying payments, but the participants had letters from the department of education saying explicitly that they WERE making qualifying payments. The judge ruled in favor of the participants and they got their loan balances forgiven (and in this case, it was large balances).
reference: 3 Borrowers Win Case on Eligibility for Public Service Loan Forgiveness

In many cases PSLF is a better option than other loan payment assistance programs.

 

[AGK821199999]

But why do you need the PSLF if you can just do the PCL and work in PC For 10 years? I don't get it

Because if PSLF works, you will save much more money. I did the math and if I did PCL I'll save around 70K in the long term while PSLF will save me around 160k

 

[AMEHigh]

SXMDD your information appears to be out of date. PSLF is not a scam. If you follow all procedures and document everything, keep all paperwork, and make the full 120 qualifying payments on your loans, the remaining balance will be forgiven. This is in writing from a government agency. If they do not follow through, then you have a legal case. There have been several legal cases already brought against the dept. of education, where they tried to retroactively deny that the participant was making qualifying payments, but the participants had letters from the department of education saying explicitly that they WERE making qualifying payments. The judge ruled in favor of the participants and they got their loan balances forgiven (and in this case, it was large balances).
reference: 3 Borrowers Win Case on Eligibility for Public Service Loan Forgiveness

In many cases PSLF is a better option than other loan payment assistance programs.

Ok but seriously, who has the time to hire a lawyer and go through a lawsuit. I think scam is probably the wrong word, but I know highly educated people who read terms carefully, were told they were doing the right thing and then bam somehow their paperwork is incorrect. If the acceptance rate to actually get your loans forgiven is so low that barely anyone qualifies then there is clearly something wrong with the process and not something wrong with the people who applied.

 

[SXMMD]

SXMDD your information appears to be out of date. PSLF is not a scam. If you follow all procedures and document everything, keep all paperwork, and make the full 120 qualifying payments on your loans, the remaining balance will be forgiven. This is in writing from a government agency. If they do not follow through, then you have a legal case. There have been several legal cases already brought against the dept. of education, where they tried to retroactively deny that the participant was making qualifying payments, but the participants had letters from the department of education saying explicitly that they WERE making qualifying payments. The judge ruled in favor of the participants and they got their loan balances forgiven (and in this case, it was large balances).
reference: 3 Borrowers Win Case on Eligibility for Public Service Loan Forgiveness

In many cases PSLF is a better option than other loan payment assistance programs.

I didn't say it was a scam, the OP did. I am suggesting it is a joke, and advise anyone who is seriously considering it to research it appropriately. While the above is reassuring for those the 3 applicants, it is not reassuring about the program in general. ALL applicants have that papertrail. Are ALL applicants expected to sue in 10 years?

I don't trust PSLF, never have, never will.

 

[Sardonix]

They're wrong and peddling the bullsh*t that the dept of education is putting out to justify denials of pay out. Read more about it. PSLF requires constant documentation being sent to loan service provders who confirm eligibility year to year. People were being told, for 10 years, that their paperwork was in order, then at the time of payout dept of education retroactively denied eligibility to these same folks who, for 10 years, were told everything was in order.

Don't know enough about pcl to advise, sorry.

This needs to be said more. I have a soapbox to stand on for PSLF--10,000s of people are being screwed by it despite doing everything correctly. There are many naive "defenders" of it who make blanket claims that the 99% of people being denied "didn't do their homework" or "just wanted a handout." In reality, in system that denies 99% of people it was originally created to help shows there is something wrong at an institutional or political level.

 

[Sardonix]

SXMDD your information appears to be out of date. PSLF is not a scam. If you follow all procedures and document everything, keep all paperwork, and make the full 120 qualifying payments on your loans, the remaining balance will be forgiven. This is in writing from a government agency. If they do not follow through, then you have a legal case. There have been several legal cases already brought against the dept. of education, where they tried to retroactively deny that the participant was making qualifying payments, but the participants had letters from the department of education saying explicitly that they WERE making qualifying payments. The judge ruled in favor of the participants and they got their loan balances forgiven (and in this case, it was large balances).
reference: 3 Borrowers Win Case on Eligibility for Public Service Loan Forgiveness

In many cases PSLF is a better option than other loan payment assistance programs.

The fact of the matter is, you should not have to hire a lawyer/participate in a class action lawsuit to get what is contractually yours. For the people who's 10 year obligation has matured and are currently stuck in payment limbo, they don't have much choice. For med students seeing the clearly intentional mess that bad faith bureaucrats and politicians (Betsy DeVos) have turned PSLF into at this point, who in their right mind would say, "Sounds great, let me get in on that!"

 

[Make Or Break]

The fact of the matter is, you should not have to hire a lawyer/participate in a class action lawsuit to get what is contractually yours. For the people who's 10 year obligation has matured and are currently stuck in payment limbo, they don't have much choice. For med students seeing the clearly intentional mess that bad faith bureaucrats and politicians (Betsy DeVos) have turned PSLF into at this point, who in their right mind would say, "Sounds great, let me get in on that!"

exactly. Do pcl people. You don’t get a free ride with psfl. Do the math and see how much you will “save” over those 10 years instead of just paying off the loans with pcl at no interest in residency and 5% cap rate.

 

[TableMD]

"The fact of the matter is, you should not have to hire a lawyer/participate in a class action lawsuit to get what is contractually yours."

The issue is that there is no contract. People in PSLF are being assured that if they do this something good (loan forgiveness) will occur. I'm doing PSLF but I am also investing so that if it doesn't work out and litigation get me know where that there is a plan B. You can make the qualifying payments and then either invest or go after the principal. I'm vesting because long term the market generally does better than the rate of interest on the loan, otherwise I'd go after the principal. If you DO go after the principal, there will be less "debt forgiveness income" when/if you are forgiven as debt forgiveness is a taxable income.

Good luck

 

[NITRAS]

Going PSLF puts you having to rely on the government for (in most cases) several hundred thousands dollars of taxpayer money.

1. Relying on the government puts you in a precarious position.
2. 10 years is a long time.. . . . that at 4-5 congressional elections. 1.66 senatorial elections, and 2.5 presidential elections.
3. You know as a doctor, you are rich. It doesn't matter that your a PCP who is an idiot feels compelled to practice in a saturated market and has lots 10 productive years, and gone several hundred thousand dollars into debt.

Bottom line. You can depend on PSLF. If it all works out, you might come out ahead. I think its a terrible idea because there is an awful amount of risk. I think colleges and med schools peddled this bull**** to desensitize students to taking increasingly large debt loads. It encourages people to get degrees where the job doesn't pay enough to justify it.

This doesn't even take into account the moral question of why should you be taking my money (as a taxpayer) to go to an overpriced school?

 

[Make Or Break]

Going PSLF puts you having to rely on the government for (in most cases) several hundred thousands dollars of taxpayer money.

1. Relying on the government puts you in a precarious position.
2. 10 years is a long time.. . . . that at 4-5 congressional elections. 1.66 senatorial elections, and 2.5 presidential elections.
3. You know as a doctor, you are rich. It doesn't matter that your a PCP who is an idiot feels compelled to practice in a saturated market and has lots 10 productive years, and gone several hundred thousand dollars into debt.

Bottom line. You can depend on PSLF. If it all works out, you might come out ahead. I think its a terrible idea because there is an awful amount of risk. I think colleges and med schools peddled this bull**** to desensitize students to taking increasingly large debt loads. It encourages people to get degrees where the job doesn't pay enough to justify it.

This doesn't even take into account the moral question of why should you be taking my money (as a taxpayer) to go to an overpriced school?

The idea is you are working in a non profit institution therefore benefiting the welfare of everyone else so your “reward” is loan forgiveness. Whether or not that is true remains up for debate.

 

[NITRAS]

Non-profit is a tax designation. Not a moral statement.

A non-profit has to make a profit or they go close down.