- Joined
- Jul 24, 2000
- Messages
- 3,525
- Reaction score
- 323
😎 go!
--your friendly neighborhood fair and balanced caveman
--your friendly neighborhood fair and balanced caveman
colbgw02 said:chicks dig the uniform?
Homunculus said:😎 go!
--your friendly neighborhood fair and balanced caveman
orbitsurgMD said:No coding (of the ICD and CPT kind, anyway)
orbitsurgMD said:No coding (of the ICD and CPT kind, anyway)
Homunculus said:6) my daily decision on what to wear is easy
orbitsurgMD said:No billing staff (that you know about)
No coding (of the ICD and CPT kind, anyway)
No bad debt.
No collections issues.
orbitsurgMD said:No billing staff (that you know about)
No coding (of the ICD and CPT kind, anyway)
No bad debt.
No collections issues.
IgD said:On the other hand, none of my co-workers weigh 300 - 400 lbs like in the civilian world.
RichL025 said:None?
Try "few".
Myself, I have personally seen 2 O-6 medical officers that were 300+ lbs. One male, the other female. The female one - when she wore class B's, her belly would poke out between her trousers & shirt.
Plus, one other O-6 I who is batting around 275....
And I'm not even officially in the medical corps yet.
IgD said:Do you generally agree with my statement that active duty military are health conscious?
haujun said:Pros in the U.S. military are too numerous and just too many list when one compares U.S. military to other foreign military. Because U.S. military is all voluntary its benefits and pay levels are much higher than other countries to attract recruits. HPSP is very generous and most unique program to attract medical students who are concern about the debt. You won't find similar program elsewhere in the world. Period. WE ARE LUCKY.
The real problem with this "military bashing" is that these posters compare civilian life to military life. You don't see milmd compare his lifestyle with the military physician in the North Korea?! Simply put, living in the military is hard and difficult even more for those infantry soldiers. As a medical personnel wherether you are a physician or a medic you are there to provide the support those brave soldiers who place themselves in harms way. I know b/c I served as an enlisted for four years in the medical dept. However, I am confident to say that we have the best military in the world and those who disagreed with me can move to North Korea.
haujun said:Pros in the U.S. military are too numerous and just too many list when one compares U.S. military to other foreign military. Because U.S. military is all voluntary its benefits and pay levels are much higher than other countries to attract recruits. HPSP is very generous and most unique program to attract medical students who are concern about the debt. You won't find similar program elsewhere in the world. Period. WE ARE LUCKY.
The real problem with this "military bashing" is that these posters compare civilian life to military life. You don't see milmd compare his lifestyle with the military physician in the North Korea?! Simply put, living in the military is hard and difficult even more for those infantry soldiers. As a medical personnel wherether you are a physician or a medic you are there to provide the support those brave soldiers who place themselves in harms way. I know b/c I served as an enlisted for four years in the medical dept. However, I am confident to say that we have the best military in the world and those who disagreed with me can move to North Korea.
haujun said:You don't see milmd compare his lifestyle with the military physician in the North Korea?!
usnavdoc said:What in the hell are you talking about. No one here is debating whether the US military is better/worse than any other in the world. Everyone here who is "military bashing" has served honorably. Most have deployed numerous times to Iraq/afghanistan/ korea/ and elsewhere.
Pointing out flaws in military healthcare(that our troops rely on) is not unpatriotic. It is what should be done so that people can make intelligent decisions as to whether or not they wish to be a part of the US military. Recruiters will not give you this side of the story. They will outright lie.
Several posters here have sought to reform the military from within. That has all fallen on deaf ears. That is not unpatriotic. That is what is demanded of a good officer. Blindly continuing in a system that is flawed while never seeking to change things is in my opinion unpatriotic.
haujun said:...You also state that you have fought so hard on behalf of system and your chain of command ignored you concern. I think this indicates your lack of leadership. You lacked ability to influence others to accomplish an objective and directs the the medical organization in a way that makes it more efficient. It is so much easier to get out and blame the whole system as you and other posters yearn to do...
haujun said:You stated in your earlier posts about cons of military medicine that the loss of freedom hinders military physicians to threat to leave the broken system for the purpose of fixing the problem... I disagree b/c everyone in the military has to lose some basic rights to fuction as a soldier and your implication that military physicians have to be granted some special power to fix the problem indicates the lack of depth and maturity in your solution.
You also state that you have fought so hard on behalf of system and your chain of command ignored you concern. I think this indicates your lack of leadership. You lacked ability to influence others to accomplish an objective and directs the the medical organization in a way that makes it more efficient. It is so much easier to get out and blame the whole system as you and other posters yearn to do. Here are some questions..
1. You are so expert and at times creative at as pointing out the problems. If the system is so broken what are your solutions?
Finally, you indicated that you care about other soldiers who have become the victim of this broken system. If this is true you should encourage able medical students joining the military in order to fix the broken system. Certainly not discourage the prospective students because your own experience was so bitter in the Air Force.
Never doubt that a small group of physicians can help make the system work.
IgD said:I think this is a great observation. My experience has been many of the posters here couldn't get it done in military medicine. They blame the system and come here to post. If all you do is irritate people around you instead of facilitate change its a failure of your leadership ability.
Homunculus said:enough.
once again y'all have derailed a thread. please refrain from bickering on this thread-- there are plenty down in the forum you can weigh in on. in the meantime i'm going to decide how far back to prune this thing.
--your friendly neighborhood disappointed caveman
Prune it. I think it probably needs it. But you should at least cut and paste the responses in the Cons section. I think people deserve to see how IGD and Haujun questioned my leadership ability and patriotism as well as see my responses. If you read their posts they arent even paying attention to what I have written yet they openly attacked.Homunculus said:enough.
once again y'all have derailed a thread. please refrain from bickering on this thread-- there are plenty down in the forum you can weigh in on. in the meantime i'm going to decide how far back to prune this thing.
--your friendly neighborhood disappointed caveman
usnavdoc said:Well first off (after I stopped laughing) I have never responded to the thread Cons of Military Medicine. So get your **** straight. Ive never said that a military physician deserves "to be granted some special power ." where are you getting this from?
"Lack of depth and maturity in my solution" ???? Solution to what problem? Why dont you respond directly to someones post so that you dont forget what that person said?
"You lacked ability to influence others to accomplish an objective and directs the the medical organization in a way that makes it more efficient. " My CO was relieved of command by his superiors for several violations of the UCMJ. He was then forced to retire early. Do you think you could have influenced him? He choked his adjudant and threatend to A..F... the chaplain. Go be buddies with him if you want.
I have stated what I thought might be solutions in many of my previous posts. Read them if you desire. I am not regurgitating for you simply because you cannot retain what you have read.
A small group of physicians can and do hold the sytem together. Thats not how it should be. For lack of character of the physician the system would fail.
So bitter in the AirForce? Dude I am in the NAVY. Hence the Name USNAVDOC. This is the most inteligent response I have ever seen. No wonder IGD thinks so highly of your post. (That is sarcasm, Just incase it flew over your head as everything else has)
cmeshy said:Granted I am not a physician or even a midlevel, but under the blanket of much training and military law, I was able to practice some pretty advanced paramedic medicine during my enlistment. I have great military physicians to thank for that confidence and training.
Here are a few of the perks I'm taking with this scholarship.
1. Money. Yes its shallow but very relevant especially in todays medicine. I think saving 483,000 dollars of total payments for the life of my loan for just a sacrifice of 4 years (although I don't view it as a sacrifice) of service is awesome. My 4 year student budget (living like a chump no less) over a twenty year consolidated payment program at the current federal interest rate would put me actually over the amount listed above. Its a rough estimate. Living a little higher on the horse during med school is also a plus. Being a nontrad student, I have gotten used to life with some money, and going back to being completely broke is really uninviting.
2. It's my understanding that the military residencies aren't quite as abusive. I could be wrong and that may not be what you are looking for, but I think even just a little more free time is nice. Not to mention being paid nearly double with more time off. Also that whole officer respect thing can also be a perk. I've read numerous times too that the EM programs (what I'm interested in) actually are ranked VERY high (top 5 programs) amoung the entire nation in board exam scores and pass rates. Not to shabby either.
3. For the most part, working with motivated and similar character of people. Only certain people consider these loans and even fewer join. I would account that that makes these people a cut above the rest. I disagree with much of the posts saying that the military gets only people looking for mediocrity. Having left the military for life as a civy for the past three years, I can honestly say that the recruiters are NOT lying about the remarkable friendships that will be made. Such sacrifice for the life as a soldier instills similar values and bonding while bitching about what you could otherwise be doing creates good times. They really would take a bullet for you. And in my case, I've seen that kind of sacrifice first hand in combat. It really is something special!!!! (google Robert's Ridge, Afghanistan and you'll know what I'm talking about).
4. I'd like to list just a couple of moments in time that I will forever take with me and consider character building.
-sipping freshly ground coffee brewed on an MSR stove mailed from home on the top of a bunker with three feet of snow on the ground with some of the greatest of friends while watching the sun set behind the 18 thousand foot mountain basin that is Bahgram Air Base. Words can't describe the beauty of the Hindu Cush mtns.
-the feeling of weightlessness in the back of an mh-60 while the pilots are goofing around pulling negative g dives. Oh yeah, the roar and flames coming out of a mini-gun are enough to make you howl like Tim the Toolman Taylor.
-the smell of diesel and human waste burning outside your door. (woops that was not a positive one, but can't say that I'll ever forget pulling poop duty. quite an interesting experience. I'd always have to have a sip of contraband vodka from Uzbek that I'd picked up the week earlier after that duty)
-the look in soliders eyes when you've flow into a hot LZ in the middle of the night in the middle of a landmine field in the middle of a firefight to pick him up to bring him to safety. Again words can't describe saving those guys lives. I know the Baghram FST staff know what I'm talking about too.
-the sweet smell of a significant others letters after being gone for 6 months. It's hard times but distance does make the heart grow fonder.
-Growing a 5 month beard and walking the streets of downtown Kabul only 6 months post 9-11. Eating some of the freshest rack of lamb I'd ever had and not getting some GI bug too was a plus.
-Jumping out of perfectly good airplanes and getting paid extra to do it. Need I say more?
-Last but not least, the respect and thankfullness appreciative citizens give you for your sacrifice. A heartfelt had shake from a WWII vet is enough to bring tears to your eyes. They truly were the greatest generation.
cmeshy said:1. Money. Yes its shallow but very relevant especially in todays medicine. I think saving 483,000 dollars of total payments for the life of my loan...
dry dre said:Off topic but relevant:
I don't mean to be rude, but don't let the glare of the numbers fool you. Pick up an econ book and learn about opportunity costs, inflation, and finance. I'm on a 30-year repayment, $900 a month. My last payment will "feel" like $475 in today-dollars. At my interest rate, the loan is essentially interest free when taking inflation into account. If I stay civilian I can sign a contract now that will pay twice my student loan in first year salary. If I signed HPSP, I might not have ever been able to get into my specialty (ortho). Thus, regarding finances, HPSP doesn't per se help you (much or at all) and it may hurt you. Besides, my HPSP classmates still took some loans ($1k/month isn't much to live on).
On topic:
I'm an enlisted veteran on the fence re: FAP. The military offers life experience that you simply can't get elsewhere. Navy recruiting had a line that goes something like "if someone was to write a book about your life, would anyone want to read it?" Veterans here will relate that non-military types are often fascinated by military experience/stories. I don't mean to imply that one should go in for recognition etc, but rather that in the service you get to experience many aspects of life that you didn't know even existed. This is the biggest draw (again) for me regarding signing again.
👍mac61 said:So, I'm not a doc, so my pros of military medicine are more pros of the military in general. (BTW so I don't get accused of hiding my identity as other have rightly been: 10 years enlisted as an EOD tech, 4 years as a medical service corps officer, now at USUHS with a contract that guarantees retirement at 30 years after my eternal committment, which I'm happy with)
My pros:
Soldiers (aka sailors, marines, etc.). Soldiers continue to be my motivation for staying Army. Soldiers do amazing things on both ends of the intelligence scale. I've seen soldiers get thier hand crushed by a 2000lb bomb and go on to win the EOD team of the year contest. I've seen soldiers push themselves to heat stroke becuase motivation outweighed sense of self. I've seen soldiers get hit in the face by a piece of frag from an 8" projectile and want nothing more than to continue with the mission. I've seen soldiers get drunk and put thier head through a wall. The good, the bad, and the ugly, the soldiers are what it's all about. This is the population that I want to practice medine for and with.
Experience. I've taken showers in freezing water from melted snow (my first in 29 days, and I was elated for my 30 seconds of painful bliss). I've worked in the White House and been on numerous missions to protect the President, VP, First lady, etc. including shows at the Kennedy Center, resorts in Argentina, and some crap-holes that no one should have to crawl into. I've lived on all but 2 continents in my life, 4 before I was 25. I've blown so much stuff up, that it started to get boring.
Comraderie (no one said I was literate): I have never made closer friends than the people I have lived and deployed with. Once you've burned **** with someone, dragged someone into the back of a HMMWV after half of thier face is gone, poured a 5 gallon water jug over your boss because it's the closest thing to a shower you have, every other relationship can become trivialized.
The beauracracy: Believe it or not, I kind of like it. It makes me mad as hell, but knowing that I am probably smart/stubborn/dedicated enough to make the system work for my soldiers, it makes all the stupid things a little easier to laugh at once you realize it's part of the game called the military. I have a million stories about how my pay was (is) screwed, how my household goods got jacked up, etc. that the times that I've helped my soldiers out of similar situations almost makes my pain worth it.
I think I've said my piece, but I could go on for days...in both pros and cons. I just can't help loving what I do, despite how screwed up it can be.
MeBen said:I served some time in a hospital in Iraq (as a patient). It is 100% different than a stateside emergency room. Every specialty of doctor is there, all the time. MRIs, CT, ECHO, hell everything. Everything is quick paced. The speed is amazing. 20 Guys will come wounded from an IED. While the hospital is under a rocket attack the nurses & docs are triaging you. Your burned, a Derm checking you out while an Ortho is checking your broken leg and a Nuero is asking you to follow his finger. Then bring the X-ray to you. They rush you of to get an MRI. It not like a civvie hospital where you have half of the people in the ER that are uninsured and using the ER as a clinic, coming in with a cold or a splinter in their finger.
You get all the heart attacks, gallbladders, traffic accidents, strokes and all the other stuff that happens in the 'real' world. You also in the down time work with the thousands of Iraqis that need attention.
If you are going to do this go Active Duty first. If you go in the reserves you are going to be activated anyway. And if you are going to join volunteer for IRAQ. That is were you are needed. Ok, maybe Afghanistan, Germany or Walter Reed. But you dont want to go to Fort Nowhere. I would imagine anyone wanting to be a doctor would want to be the best. Chicago and LA will keep you busy, but you will learn far more in Iraq. And you are needed there.
Physicians, nurses, PA, Pharmacists, PT, Techs, & basically everything medical.