Question about matching in the army.

[Tommyguns89]

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So I looked at some of the statistics for the army match and it seems like there is a lot of variance from year to year in how competitive each specialty is. For example in EM one year it was 1.8 applicants/spot and the next 1.4 and a year before 1.14. So basically I have two questions.

1) How is it determined who gets the spots? Lets use the 1.4 apps/spot year. That is about 70% getting their specialty of choice. I understand prior service is one of the selection factors. Are most of those guys prior service? Does a non-prior service applicant have a reasonable shot at being in that 70% provided they do well in things that are within their control?

2) Lets say you are in the 30%, from what I understand you have to do a transitional year and you can reapply, how often do people fail in the match again at this point? If you end up failing and spending your entire payback as GMO, are you boned applying for civilian residency programs being that far removed from school?

Thanks in advance guys.

 

[jabreal00]

So I looked at some of the statistics for the army match and it seems like there is a lot of variance from year to year in how competitive each specialty is. For example in EM one year it was 1.8 applicants/spot and the next 1.4 and a year before 1.14. So basically I have two questions.

1) How is it determined who gets the spots? Lets use the 1.4 apps/spot year. That is about 70% getting their specialty of choice. I understand prior service is one of the selection factors. Are most of those guys prior service? Does a non-prior service applicant have a reasonable shot at being in that 70% provided they do well in things that are within their control?

2) Lets say you are in the 30%, from what I understand you have to do a transitional year and you can reapply, how often do people fail in the match again at this point? If you end up failing and spending your entire payback as GMO, are you boned applying for civilian residency programs being that far removed from school?

Thanks in advance guys.

The people who have the greatest advantage are those who have done a utilization tour with decent resume (above average boards, no red flags or PT test failures), ie GMO for one to two years. They have those points that someone out of medical school will not have. Many also have seniority based on rank (depending on how long they were out prior to reapplying). If one is competitive out of medical school they have a good chance the first time applying and even greater after a utilization tour.

 

[Armymed2015]

I was fortunate enough to match into EM this year straight out of medical school. There were a lot of great applicants who were vying for the spots. My advice is not to stress too much about the exact statistics and how they fluctuate from year to year, and instead to realize that if you are going to be applying for any residency position that you should do everything in your power to increase your chances of matching.

My personal strategy consisted of the following.
1. Work hard in medical school, and learn as much as possible. Develop good habits early and it will help you in the future.
2. If you are lucky enough to know early on in your third year what specialty you want to go into, get a solid review book and read a chapter or two from it a week. This will help you prepare for your upcoming Sub-I's.
3. I personally feel that if somebody is truly committed to a field and if there are a few locations to choose from (4 for Army EM) then the applicant should at least make an appearance at every site for an in person interview at the least. I do not understand why anybody would apply for something competitive and not give themselves the best chance for success. Would you really rather spend an extra year as a TY then 2 extra years as a GMO because you did not want to live in Texas?
4. Go into your sub-I's with the right attitude. Work hard, don't whine, learn as much as possible and have fun. Also, I would attend every social event official or unofficial that you can.

Lastly I cannot speak to this from personal experience, but if you do match into a TY spot this is not the end of the road. We have excellent residents in my program who did a TY before matching into the program. Many of the best residents worked as GMO for a few years before coming in.

 

[ROTC_sucks]

The people who have the greatest advantage are those who have done a utilization tour with decent resume (above average boards, no red flags or PT test failures), ie GMO for one to two years. They have those points that someone out of medical school will not have. Many also have seniority based on rank (depending on how long they were out prior to reapplying). If one is competitive out of medical school they have a good chance the first time applying and even greater after a utilization tour.

So I actually think it's the opposite, at least in the Army. The BOLC presentation about the match process and my discussions with program directors have explained it as not a point-based system but a computer algorithm (just like the NRMP) based on the applicants' and programs' rankings. There are no points on the programs' side, unless they have internal points that they make up on their own (perhaps based on personality, work ethic, etc.). There is apparently a point system with fellowships though that incorporates things like tours, step scores and publications.

You have the best shot to match as a senior medical student, not after doing a TY or GMO tour. Actually, non-medical students don't even participate in the initial FYGME match. The only way that they are able to get a residency spot is by either taking an unfilled spot or if a program matches a medical student that they essentially refuse to take. This system may have been different in the past, but this is how it works currently. I say this after helping my program make a rank list of medical students. TYs and GMOs were not included.

Additionally, to lend some more transparency into this process, attached here are the GME slideshows for the last several years.

TL;DR: best chances of successful match as a medical student; near impossible to match competitive programs on the 2nd go.

 

[backrow]

So I actually think it's the opposite, at least in the Army. The BOLC presentation about the match process and my discussions with program directors have explained it as not a point-based system but a computer algorithm (just like the NRMP) based on the applicants' and programs' rankings. There are no points on the programs' side, unless they have internal points that they make up on their own (perhaps based on personality, work ethic, etc.). There is apparently a point system with fellowships though that incorporates things like tours, step scores and publications.

You have the best shot to match as a senior medical student, not after doing a TY or GMO tour. Actually, non-medical students don't even participate in the initial FYGME match. The only way that they are able to get a residency spot is by either taking an unfilled spot or if a program matches a medical student that they essentially refuse to take. This system may have been different in the past, but this is how it works currently. I say this after helping my program make a rank list of medical students. TYs and GMOs were not included.

Additionally, to lend some more transparency into this process, attached here are the GME slideshows for the last several years.

TL;DR: best chances of successful match as a medical student; near impossible to match competitive programs on the 2nd go.

The GME1 and GME2 selection boards work a little different. The GME1 board went to a much more algorithmic system that is more like what you describe. The GME2 match is still done the old fashioned way. How many slots are available for which ones GME1/GME2 is variable on the service and the specialty. For Example: the Navy is still almost exclusively without straight through contracts, except for some FP and psych (maybe OB? I forget these days). The Army on the other hand has many more straight through positions, so would have fewer selections to worry about in the GME2+ match.

 

[HighPriest]

I can't speak for all programs, but as I have said before there was definitely no point system at my program - which only matched at the PGY1 year (contracted otherwise). if there was a point system, it wasn't even mentioned. It was solely based upon scores, personality at rotations, extracirriculars, and letters of recommendation, and mostly in that order. We had some years with a 25% match rate and others with just shy of 1:1. It seemed to come in waves because students would see the 25% match rate and the following year applications would plummet because everyone was scared away. It is possible to match after failing to match the first time, assuming you tried to match the first time against great odds (the 25% year). If you failed to match in a year that was 1.5:1, then you'll probably continue to fail to match. There are exceptions, of course, and that may be different for different specialties. We actually had very few prior service applicants. We had a few Westpoint people, but they all went straight through WP->USUHS->residency. Prior service was certainly a benefit rather than a burden, but it didn't come up often, and it paled in comparison to scores, personality, and research.

 

[jabreal00]

The GME1 and GME2 selection boards work a little different. The GME1 board went to a much more algorithmic system that is more like what you describe. The GME2 match is still done the old fashioned way. How many slots are available for which ones GME1/GME2 is variable on the service and the specialty. For Example: the Navy is still almost exclusively without straight through contracts, except for some FP and psych (maybe OB? I forget these days). The Army on the other hand has many more straight through positions, so would have fewer selections to worry about in the GME2+ match.

That is true. I am actually thinking of the GME2 (fellowship) match. If one is a strong candidate out of medical school, that is their best shot to match in a competitive GME1 residency.