MSW Question About Practicums and Training for LCSW

[fl-art-teacher]

Good morning everyone!

I'm a high school art teacher, and I'm enrolling in an online program (part-time) to earn my MSW. It's mostly full-time working people in the program. I love my job teaching, and have no intention to stop teaching any time soon (so this isn't a dissatisfaction thing), but at some point we'll move (when my husband retires) and I'd like the flexibility of a few different career options. (And I've researched and the doors that a MSW opens appeal to me).

I'm not worried about fitting the classroom work into my schedule. But I am worried about the practicum time.

I can use a good part of my summers, I know - but our summers where I teach are pretty short, and I don't want to burn out during the summer so that I'm not excited or motivated to return to the classroom. Similarly with during the school year - I could do a practicum shift Saturday or Sunday, I suppose, but I really don't want my marriage or my teaching to suffer.

However, I'm in no hurry to get the degree, and I'm allowed to take as long as 7 years to earn it. So I wonder, can practicum hours be split over, even, a year or two, or must they always be completed within one year? I'll have a 400+ and a 500+ hour practicum. So if I did summers only, but also made sure I had family time etc, I could do each practicum over 2 summers easily.

Is that something you've heard of? Splitting a practicum over 2 summers? (So 2 200+ hour summers, and then 2 250+ hour summers). I'm just curious if this can be done, or if I have to be willing to burn out over a year to get the hours.

My second question (thank you for those still reading) is that I would eventually like to earn my LCSW. Now, I know I can't get those hours part-time while teaching (or, again, if I can, it'll be over summers, so it'll take a while). Is there a time limit, after receiving the MSW, within which you have to earn your LCSW certification, or you lose eligibility?

Say, if I complete my MSW in 2024, but I teach for another 5 years (maybe doing contract work as a MSW during summers), can I start the process of earning my LCSW certification in 2029, or 2030? Or will some statute of limitations have passed? I've searched, but everything I've found is how *quickly* one can get the LCSW - not how long one can take.

Thank you again! I apologize if I'm asking something that's been asked. I've searched and can't find either of these questions answered anywhere.

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[counselor2b]

Generally speaking you would not be able to spread your practicum in to two separate experiences. It is designed to have set clinical hours for a reason. Not only is it a large time commitment for you, but also for the site that agrees to let you get your training. They need to have someone that is willing to commit a set amount of time as it is a huge commitment for them to take on a student and need time to see growth as they are responsible to be gatekeepers for the profession. If you can only dedicate 200 hours each summer, that will likely not get you the clinical experience you need to grow as a clinician. It takes a lot of time and effort to get someone trained in for a practicum/internship and by the time you hit 200 hours you will just getting started and feeling comfortable. It is also unfair to your patients to just start and then stop if you are choosing a more clinical route. I can appreciate you wanting to have good balance and good for you for being proactive to avoid burnout, however, a graduate degree is a large investment and takes a lot of effort to complete, so you will likely have to make some sacrifices in either your professional or personal life. Also it is possible that your program might not offer the practicum classes during the summer term, so you would want to check on that as well.

As far as timeframe to the LCSW, that will likely be more flexible. There is usually a lower license in route to the LCSW which you can maintain until you get the required hours. In my state it is the APSW, which requires ongoin supervision. You would need to maintain continuing education credits and pass a state and national exam but is certainly doable to do over time.

Best of Luck and remember to take care of yourself through the process.

 

[fl-art-teacher]

Thank you for your response. I think I clearly need to run these questions though the admissions/advising people at the school (it's Florida State U in Tallahassee). My program (assuming I get in, of course, I'm still applying) is a part-time online program over (minimum) 3 years (though it can be longer if needed), for working people - I do know that some teachers do their practicums in the summer from a previous conversation with the admissions advisor, but it wasn't until I started crunching the numbers that I realized I probably wouldn't be able to complete one in the summer (since our breaks are short).

I absolutely agree that 200 hours alone wouldn't be enough training, I definitely don't begrudge the time needed to learn the skills. I just need to make sure I can fit them in with my teaching schedule - teaching is very flexible in that we have summers, but less flexible in that we can't, say, come in late, leave early, or reduce our hours to 80% or anything that might work in an office or other environment. And I am tremendously worried about burnout, just because I don't want my students to suffer any more than I'd want my clients to suffer. And I don't want to leave clients hanging - however, doesn't that happen when you finish a 300 or 400 hour practicum in any event? I guess I saw the practicum as closer to student-teaching, where a student teacher might come in and work with an established teacher, but when the hours are done the student teacher leaves and the established teacher continues the relationship with the students.

Has anyone here split a practicum?

Also, can people just tell their practicum stories, so I get a bit of a handle? How did find it? What did you do? If you were part time or working, when did you fit it in, and how many hours a week?

Again thank you all for any advice. I definitely want to do this, but I want to do it wisely.

 

[counselor2b]

Practicum experiences are likely similar to what you described as being like a student teaching experience, in that your are closely monitored and observed by someone with experience in the field. The degree of independence you get will likely depend on what setting your in and how comfortable your supervisor is with you. However, it is not completely uncommon for people to complete their practicum and internship at the same placement, though this may vary by program. Two of the health care systems in my region require a 9 month commitment for training and encourage 12 months. Certainly there are other more flexible options but depending on the setting you are interested in, you may run in to that. Generally, I encourage people to try and vary their experiences and learn from more than one clinical supervisor. This also gives you the opportunity to try out different settings. I was fortunate to be able to do practicum in an inpatient setting and then completed a 9 nine month internship at a private practice.

Regarding my own experience, I was working 36 hours per week (12 hour days) while doing 16 hours per week for practicum. Internship was similar except I was doing 20 hours per week (10 hour days) instead of 16. This was also in addition to attending classes in the evening. I am not going to lie, it was brutal and if I had to do it now with three children and being slightly older, I imagine I would probably not take on so much. However, at the time, I knew there was an end in sight and I really enjoyed both my practicum site and internship site which made it a little more tolerable. As far as locating placements, my school had a list of different placements in the area but I found my internship through networking.

 

[foreverbull]

Just generally speaking when it comes to graduate degrees, practicum/internship experiences should take precedence over your day job because this is on-the-job training to do what you will be licensed to do later. I understand that we have online degrees and there are programs that offer some flexibility and night classes, but graduate school by its very nature requires sacrifices that people need to be willing to make to get the degree and license because it is specialist training.

Folks planning to keep their day jobs the entire time they go through grad school for a mental health specialty l/SW are better off not going to grad school; it’s just not possible. In my masters program, I was only able to work part-time because my classes and then the addition of practicum took up the rest of my time. That is just how it is.

Most practica will be time-limited and have set requirements/expectations around weekly hours (I.e. 12-20 hours/week every week for 9 months or so, usually aligning with semesters). I’ve never heard of a practicum in two distinct “chunks” of time in summers only. That’s not likely to happen, so you will need to stop teaching full time for at least a few years to do this, most likely. Perhaps not want you want to hear, but realistic, at least.

 

[fl-art-teacher]

I am looking for info, so what's real, and I appreciate your input (everyone).

I do wonder at the concept - be it with this training, or medical residencies, or anything that is a lot of training compressed into a short amount of time, and all other life activities must be curtailed in the meantime - that it must be pushed through at an intense rate, and cannot be taken at a more manageable pace. If one has completed 1000 practicum hours, one has completed 1000 practicum hours - the experience is no less valuable if it takes 1 year or 5 years to complete those hours (or so it seems to me). It just means one person is trained after 1 year, and the second person is equally trained after 5 years.

I understand some people are in a hurry to graduate, to start earning money or practicing on their own, but I'm not in that position. I don't mind how long it takes to get my training, but I want it to fit within my current schedule as much as possible. I understand that programs might not accommodate me wanting my training in the summers only - if so, I'll have to figure that out. I don't, however, understand people thinking that my training in the summers only (or primarily) will give me a worse education; it seems to me it would only get me a slower education.

 

[foreverbull]

I don’t personally think that slower training = lower quality, but graduate programs are designed to be intensive because they are specialist training and by their very nature, require a time commitment. They can train and graduate folks faster with full-time commitment, which is actually cheaper in the long run for the student anyway, and cohorts are supposed to go through together.

In my graduate program, I sacrificed being in the work force making a decent income for 5 years (my doctoral program) and another two of you count my masters degree that I earned prior to the PhD. So 7 years of not working full-time. It certainly was a sacrifice to be penny-pinching the entire time. When I left my grad program, I entered the work force as a “new” early career psychologist who hadn’t had the opportunity to build my income or command a high salary, while my colleagues who didn’t go to grad school had built up their income and advanced in their careers over the past 5-7 years. But I chose this path because it was what I wanted to do and was willing to make that sacrifice.

We live in a world in which folks increasingly expect to be able to do graduate school “on top of” life/work demands. This is just not congruent with the graduate school experience in a mental health or social work focus, generally speaking, although in the first semester or year when there’s class and no practicum, it’s possible. But graduate school traditionally has been the main focus of people entering grad school, rather than life/work being the focus and grad school comes second.

Thus, I don’t personally think it’s fair for folks to think they should be able to get a specialist degree “on top of” work, etc. (clearly I also disagree with the rise in these programs that encourage this “get a masters while you work” mindset). Grad school in my opinion isn’t something for people to just casually attend where they can but intensive training that requires a huge commitment for the duration. This is more of a general statement than just to you specifically, because there are many folks in here who have mindsets that the graduate education itself comes second to work. That makes me question whether folks are ready for grad school at all, because these programs that promise a degree while you work tend to have high dropout rates.

 

[fl-art-teacher]

Thank you foreverbull for your personal insight. I really appreciate hearing different viewpoints. Maybe more of my personal situation might help explain my motivation (?) ... then again, maybe not! I'm a high school art teacher (I have my Masters in Fine Arts - obviously a completely different type of Masters, but some experience with getting an advanced degree). I love my job - literally love it. But on one hand, I'm not thrilled with the direction of public education these days, and while I want to keep teaching, I recognize changes might make that not the case at some point. On the other hand, at some point (about 10 years) my husband will retire, and we'll move, and art teaching positions are not ubiquitous. Additionally, I won't want to retire, but I will want to perhaps not be a full time teacher at that point (and teaching doesn't really allow for part time).

So in considering what I'd want to do, I realized that a M.S.W. degree will allow me to do private counseling (after I earn a LCSW) - so I can continue working with kids, though in a different capacity - and perhaps some part-time hospice work (my father-in-law died last year, and I felt like the hospice care I saw was something I could do that would be fulfilling and helpful). I'm not considering this to get rich, but more to have a means to continue to work with kids and people in need, in something I think I'd be good at, but with the ability to work a reduced number of hours as my husband will be retired.

I suppose I could wait until that point to pursue my M.S.W., and I might, but I have summers free now, and would love to be using them to good purpose in working toward future goals. And I like to be busy.

So your comments definitely make me think, but I do know the program I'm applying for doesn't have a cohort of students, is variable in length (3-7 years), and (for better or worse) is designed for working adults. It's a highly regarded program from all I've read, which was important to me - I do want to do this well, not in a half-assed way (which is why I prefer giving it time when I truly have time to give).

On another note, the more I read, the more I see people say that the market is flooded. I know that here, where I live in Florida, I would have a hard time making a living as a M.S.W. but we intend to move when my husband retires, and will have a lot of freedom as to where we go. My thought would be a somewhat rural place where a therapist who takes insurance, or a sliding scale, and works with children, will find a niche.

Am I being completely unrealistic? I really appreciate all thoughts, even those that might give me pause.

 

[foreverbull]

I hear what you’re saying. If you do go on, an LCSW is far more portable than a LPC, so if there’s a possibility of moving out of state, a SW license is easier to transfer and is seen as equivalent to counseling master’s degree in terms of ability to provide therapy services.

The market is flooded generally, but there are still areas in which it’s not as saturated (rural areas, cities without several counseling/SW programs there). Even with the market being flooded, the portability of the SW license across states trumps the non-portable LPC license, by far. Training-wise, it’s a different philosophy (MA = more extensive counseling theory background, MSW = social work background/theory), although both lead to the same outcome.

Working with children is a high demand area that is desirable in many areas because most therapists work exclusively with adults or teens and adults. It requires more specialized experience along the way (make sure practicum or internship is child-focused/working with kids). Working with kids also means reporting child abuse far more often and having to call parents and notify them that you’re reporting them, but that is part of the job and doesn’t deter some folks. Just something you have to get used to doing here and there.

Hope that helps!