Re-applicant who matched - advice and encouragement

[QOTSA]

Hi everyone - I'm posting my experience of re-applying to help others. I found it helpful to read re-applicants' experiences on SDN, so hopefully others will find this post useful and encouraging. I'm happy to answer any questions!

Stats

• AMG from a top 30 med school
  
• Grades: bottom quartile
  
• Step 1: 200<X<210, first attempt
  
• Step 2 CK: 215<X<225, first attempt
  
• Step 2 CS: passed on second attempt. I didn't prepare at all before taking CS, and I barely failed. I prepared before retaking and easily passed. I definitely recommend preparing for CS and scheduling it earlier, so you have time to retake if necessary.
  
• Other red flags: repeated MS1

What happened the first time

My school didn't give me the best advice, so I didn't apply to enough psych programs (29) and didn't get enough interviews (nine). I also didn't rank two programs. I thought I would rather not match than end up at those two programs.

I tried to SOAP, but accidentally failed to assign my documents to programs. (Right after submitting, I double checked one program, and I had assigned documents to it. It just so happened that I had only assigned documents to that one program and no others.) By the time I discovered my error, it was too late. It was a brutal week to say the least, and I didn't get any offers through SOAP.

Not matching and not SOAPing felt very, very ****ty. My first piece of advice is to keep your chin up and stay positive. Make a plan. Don't give up!

What I did the second time

After graduating, I began a full-time, paid research position at my home institution. I also volunteered / shadowed in clinic twice a week. I was fortunate to have a job during my year off, and they accommodated all of my subsequent interviews.

My school recommended re-applying to 30-40 FM programs. This time, I didn't follow their advice. Because I didn't want to risk not having enough interviews, I re-applied to 112 FM programs (a good mix of competitiveness and based on my geographical preferences).

I ended up getting 18 interviews and went on all except one. I found out on Monday that I matched!

Ultimately, I am glad that I didn't rank those two psych programs or SOAP successfully the first time around. By reapplying, I had more control over my future and more programs to choose from. I was very happy with all the programs on my rank list this time around, and I can't wait to find out where I'm going on Friday!

Below are some of my tips / learnings.

Application

• Over-apply to programs. I thought I had drastically over-applied with 112 FM programs, but I only received 18 interviews. (The matching stats for AMG re-applicants aren't great.) You're better off over-applying than under-applying. If you have to turn down some invites, so be it. Better than wishing you had more!
• Get your ERAS app in right BEFORE programs can begin viewing them. I spoke to many PDs who said they downloaded all their applications on September 15. Because programs receive hundreds if not thousands of applications, they don't need to go back into ERAS to download more. So they would only go through the initial stack of applications (which was more than enough) and send interview invites from there. I received most of my invites in October.
• Make sure your ERAS app is 100% complete when you submit (except for CS). I also heard from several PDs that they only granted interviews to applicants with complete applications - meaning all LORs uploaded and Step 2 CK available. Request your LORs early so your letter writers have plenty of time (follow up with them if necessary!). Step 2 CS just needs to be available before the rank list opens.
• Don't diminish your chances because of monetary reasons. I was fortunate enough to have the financial resources for my ERAS application fees and travel costs. But even if you don't, you should do whatever you can to over-apply and go on all the interviews you can. Go into credit card debt if you must. Your chances drastically diminish the further out you are from graduation. Your best shot at re-applying is the first time, so maximize it. Otherwise, you risk not ever becoming a physician.
• Email PDs and PCs / call PCs early on to get more interviews! I secured eight interviews alone by emailing the PD and copying the PC. I mentioned any personal connections I had (e.g. family in the area) and where my interests aligned with the program's mission statement. Timing-wise, I sent my emails the earlier of: after I saw that the program had already sent interview invites on SDN (so some as early as September 24) or after MSPE was released / mid-October. I also landed one interview by calling the program coordinator (to follow up on my email). It seemed like she had a waitlist (she looked up my name) and gave me an interview slot on the spot (likely a cancellation). If you're polite and sincere, it can't hurt to reach out!

Interview scheduling

• Schedule your interviews ASAP. As soon as I received an invite, whether on ERAS or by email (one program required applicants to call to schedule), I immediately scheduled my interview. Interview slots can be quickly taken up. A few applicants I know were offered interviews, but ended up on the waitlist because they didn't schedule in time.
• Don't forget to check the ERAS scheduler and your spam folder. I know a few applicants who missed interview invites this way.
• Stay organized. I used Google calendar to organize all my interviews. That way, I could easily pull it up on my phone or laptop and know which dates worked when scheduling interviews (for example, when I was on the phone with a PC I was able to quickly confirm the date). I also added the interview details (e.g. hotel arrangements, restaurant for the dinner) so I had all my information in one place. This helped me to follow up when necessary - on a couple of occasions, the PC forgot to provide some details.
• Front load interviews. I scheduled my first several interviews for the earliest dates possible (most in October), so I could leave dates in November-January open. This helped when I came off the waitlist at a few places because I still had availability during those months. I only had to reschedule one interview to accommodate another.

Interviewing

• Attend the resident dinner the evening before the interview. I was able to schedule my interviews so that I didn't miss any dinners. It's a great way to get to know programs in a more relaxed setting. It's also another way to make a good impression.
• Be prepared to explain any red flags during the interview.
• Always ask questions at the end of the interview. It's not hard to come up with a question and it shows interest in the program.
• Write thank you emails. I wrote a personalized thank you email to each interviewer, not just the PD. I sometimes sent a thank you email to the PC, too. While I can't quantify how much it helped, I know that it didn't hurt. Some PDs mentioned that they appreciate thank you emails. Of course, don't send any to programs that ask you not to.

FM specific advice

• Attend the AAFP national conference in July/August! Many residency programs attend. It's a great way to network and learn about other programs. I mentioned the connections I made during the conference in some of my emails. I got at least three interviews through my networking at conference.
• Go on second looks at your top choices. I went on a second look at my top three programs.

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[texturelikesun]

Thanks for the post!

(QOTSA = queens of the stone age?)

 

[QOTSA]

Thanks for the post!

(QOTSA = queens of the stone age?)

I posted this to help "suture up your future"

 

[mcl]

I posted this to help "suture up your future"

Thank you for sharing your experience--I think it will help a lot of people. One quibble, though--programs no longer download applications, they appear in real time. Programs get the vast majority on September 15th, but there is a window during which an application sent slightly later won't make much of a difference since I can't process hundreds of applications in a day even using strict filters. That said, it really is a good idea to have everything ready to go when ERAS opens.

 

[djeon1]

I am seeking for an advice for next match cycle.

With CK score pending, I applied for over 350+ programs last September (IM/FM combined), just find out I failed CK. I retook and passed in 01/2019. I received only one invitation, probably because my CK score wasn’t available throughout the interview season. Most programs probably have filtered out my applications. Didn’t match and is planning for next year. This is my credentials:

US-IMG, Caribbean Med school, 2 years USCE with 4LoRs
Step1: 225 (1st attempt)
Step 2 CK: 224 (2nd attempt)
Step 2 CS: Pass (1st attempt)
1 publication (based on stuff I did before medical school, published during MS1 though)

Options I am looking at:
· Option #1: Doing extended clinical rotations (6 months IM, starting in June)->school sponsors/covers tuition only upon postponing graduation until January 2019, which means I can’t take Step 3 before next cycle
Vs.

· Option #2: Graduate in May and take Step 3 + Observership/Externship
Vs.
· Option #3: Graduate in May and take Step 3 + Research

Having a red flag on my CK score (fail, mediocre score on 2nd attempt), how important is to take Step3? I thought the best way to improve my application is doing well on step 3 but at the same time, I have heard many residency programs don’t weigh much on Step 3 when sending out interview invitation. I was advised against it by school faculty who also said that Step3 isn't gonna do much since I'm US-IMG. He also said that having continuous clinical experience is a far more important factor in my situation.

Before I make my decision, I wanted to hear a second opinion from people who had the similar experience or from anyone who has any ideas/opinion.

 

[QOTSA]

I'm an AMG, but from what I've heard Step 3 really doesn't help at all. There are a lot more productive ways to improve your application / chances between now and September (e.g. research, going to AAFP national conference, making sure your personal statement is perfect). PDs do apply a "years since graduation" filter, so IMO delaying graduation (option #1) would be best.

 

[the argus]

I am seeking for an advice for next match cycle.

With CK score pending, I applied for over 350+ programs last September (IM/FM combined), just find out I failed CK. I retook and passed in 01/2019. I received only one invitation, probably because my CK score wasn’t available throughout the interview season. Most programs probably have filtered out my applications. Didn’t match and is planning for next year. This is my credentials:

US-IMG, Caribbean Med school, 2 years USCE with 4LoRs
Step1: 225 (1st attempt)
Step 2 CK: 224 (2nd attempt)
Step 2 CS: Pass (1st attempt)
1 publication (based on stuff I did before medical school, published during MS1 though)

Options I am looking at:
· Option #1: Doing extended clinical rotations (6 months IM, starting in June)->school sponsors/covers tuition only upon postponing graduation until January 2019, which means I can’t take Step 3 before next cycle
Vs.

· Option #2: Graduate in May and take Step 3 + Observership/Externship
Vs.
· Option #3: Graduate in May and take Step 3 + Research

Having a red flag on my CK score (fail, mediocre score on 2nd attempt), how important is to take Step3? I thought the best way to improve my application is doing well on step 3 but at the same time, I have heard many residency programs don’t weigh much on Step 3 when sending out interview invitation. I was advised against it by school faculty who also said that Step3 isn't gonna do much since I'm US-IMG. He also said that having continuous clinical experience is a far more important factor in my situation.

Before I make my decision, I wanted to hear a second opinion from people who had the similar experience or from anyone who has any ideas/opinion.

I don't think you're going to like my advice, but here it is anyway...

Forgot about IM. You're not competitive with a below average step 1 and a CK failure then much below average passing score. Step 3 is not going to help this, and if you end up failing you've probably destroyed any chance of ever matching in any specialty.

Your stats are competitive for family medicine, and that's about it.

You should definitely do 6 months of extended rotations, but they should solely be FM-based rotations and not IM.

Sorry to be blunt, but you are the poster child for caribbean students who graduate but then don't ever match. Mediocre/poor performance in school, then unrealistic and ill-conceived application/match strategy. I would do FM-based rotations as above, and then apply to every FM program that has taken a Caribbean grad/IMG in the past 3 years and all previous DO FM programs that are now in the NRMP. Good luck!

 

[djeon1]

I don't think you're going to like my advice, but here it is anyway...

Forgot about IM. You're not competitive with a below average step 1 and a CK failure then much below average passing score. Step 3 is not going to help this, and if you end up failing you've probably destroyed any chance of ever matching in any specialty.

Your stats are competitive for family medicine, and that's about it.

You should definitely do 6 months of extended rotations, but they should solely be FM-based rotations and not IM.

Sorry to be blunt, but you are the poster child for caribbean students who graduate but then don't ever match. Mediocre/poor performance in school, then unrealistic and ill-conceived application/match strategy. I would do FM-based rotations as above, and then apply to every FM program that has taken a Caribbean grad/IMG in the past 3 years and all previous DO FM programs that are now in the NRMP. Good luck!

Thank you for your feedback.

 

[djeon1]

I'm an AMG, but from what I've heard Step 3 really doesn't help at all. There are a lot more productive ways to improve your application / chances between now and September (e.g. research, going to AAFP national conference, making sure your personal statement is perfect). PDs do apply a "years since graduation" filter, so IMO delaying graduation (option #1) would be best.

Thank you for your feedback

 

[ak_ps]

Reapplying this year.

Non-Carib IMG

233 1
246 CK
(Both first pass)
CS pass second attempt (failing before applying is what cost me the match)

4mo. USCE
3 US letters
Mid performance in med school


I will be applying -very- broadly for psych, fam med, neurology, and anesthesia


As for the gap year I will be doing anesthesia research and will take step 3.

What do you successful reapplicants think?

 

[the argus]

Reapplying this year.

Non-Carib IMG

233 1
246 CK
(Both first pass)
CS pass second attempt (failing before applying is what cost me the match)

4mo. USCE
3 US letters
Mid performance in med school


I will be applying -very- broadly for psych, fam med, neurology, and anesthesia


As for the gap year I will be doing anesthesia research and will take step 3.

What do you successful reapplicants think?

This successful IMG applicant thinks that is a bad plan. Unless you have specific LORs and personal statements for each of those 4 specialties you listed, I think you are unlikely get many interviews.

Those are 4 specialties that are nothing alike. Programs expect letters from docs in the respective specialty. More than 1 letter from someone not in the same specialty as you are applying is a red flag. This is especially true to psych. Psych programs are going to expect LORs from psychiatrists. And sending a psych letter to basically any other specialty is bad.

Your scores are good. Programs are either going to forgive your CS failure and not care one bit about it now that you've passed, or they will filter you out and never even look at your application.

You would be better served deciding which specialty you actually want to spend the next 30+ years practicing, and tailoring your application to that specialty and applying to basically every program in the country.

That would have been my strategy in your shoes...

 

[ak_ps]

This successful IMG applicant thinks that is a bad plan. Unless you have specific LORs and personal statements for each of those 4 specialties you listed, I think you are unlikely get many interviews.

Those are 4 specialties that are nothing alike. Programs expect letters from docs in the respective specialty. More than 1 letter from someone not in the same specialty as you are applying is a red flag. This is especially true to psych. Psych programs are going to expect LORs from psychiatrists. And sending a psych letter to basically any other specialty is bad.

Your scores are good. Programs are either going to forgive your CS failure and not care one bit about it now that you've passed, or they will filter you out and never even look at your application.

You would be better served deciding which specialty you actually want to spend the next 30+ years practicing, and tailoring your application to that specialty and applying to basically every program in the country.

That would have been my strategy in your shoes...

Right. So let me clear out the whole letter situation.

-I have two letters for psych and reached out for a third yesterday. All US docs.

-I already have a confirmed letter from my school's fam med doc, and have another one I requested.

-Also from my school I have two anesthesia letters and will work my ass off during summer research for a US doc anesthesia letter.

I've got two 'broad' specialty letters I have also requested this week. Just aiming out early so I can get letters and responses on time and early.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

This is tough. If you applied to my IM program, I'd see that year of anesthesia research and decide instantly that you're not really interested in IM, and into the reject pile you would go. Many psych programs are going to do the same thing -- why would someone interested in psych do anesthesia research? regarding letters from "your school", if that's not in the US the letters will be much less helpful.

Neurology and ANesthesia may require prelim years, which you then have to apply for separately. Some of them have created categorical programs (most of the Anesthesia programs are Cat now, so that may not be an issue), but that's yet another problem.

I get the sense that you really want anesthesia. That's where your application is headed. I don't know how much the CS fail will hurt you, and that question was not asked on the 2016 NRMP PD Survey.

 

[Zealnit]

Hi, Thanks for sharing. Quick question. The program you matched into was what number on your rank list? Thanks in advance.

Hi everyone - I'm posting my experience of re-applying to help others. I found it helpful to read re-applicants' experiences on SDN, so hopefully others will find this post useful and encouraging. I'm happy to answer any questions!

Stats

• AMG from a top 30 med school
  
• Grades: bottom quartile
  
• Step 1: 200<X<210, first attempt
  
• Step 2 CK: 215<X<225, first attempt
  
• Step 2 CS: passed on second attempt. I didn't prepare at all before taking CS, and I barely failed. I prepared before retaking and easily passed. I definitely recommend preparing for CS and scheduling it earlier, so you have time to retake if necessary.
  
• Other red flags: repeated MS1

What happened the first time

My school didn't give me the best advice, so I didn't apply to enough psych programs (29) and didn't get enough interviews (nine). I also didn't rank two programs. I thought I would rather not match than end up at those two programs.

I tried to SOAP, but accidentally failed to assign my documents to programs. (Right after submitting, I double checked one program, and I had assigned documents to it. It just so happened that I had only assigned documents to that one program and no others.) By the time I discovered my error, it was too late. It was a brutal week to say the least, and I didn't get any offers through SOAP.

Not matching and not SOAPing felt very, very ****ty. My first piece of advice is to keep your chin up and stay positive. Make a plan. Don't give up!

What I did the second time

After graduating, I began a full-time, paid research position at my home institution. I also volunteered / shadowed in clinic twice a week. I was fortunate to have a job during my year off, and they accommodated all of my subsequent interviews.

My school recommended re-applying to 30-40 FM programs. This time, I didn't follow their advice. Because I didn't want to risk not having enough interviews, I re-applied to 112 FM programs (a good mix of competitiveness and based on my geographical preferences).

I ended up getting 18 interviews and went on all except one. I found out on Monday that I matched!

Ultimately, I am glad that I didn't rank those two psych programs or SOAP successfully the first time around. By reapplying, I had more control over my future and more programs to choose from. I was very happy with all the programs on my rank list this time around, and I can't wait to find out where I'm going on Friday!

Below are some of my tips / learnings.

Application

• Over-apply to programs. I thought I had drastically over-applied with 112 FM programs, but I only received 18 interviews. (The matching stats for AMG re-applicants aren't great.) You're better off over-applying than under-applying. If you have to turn down some invites, so be it. Better than wishing you had more!
• Get your ERAS app in right BEFORE programs can begin viewing them. I spoke to many PDs who said they downloaded all their applications on September 15. Because programs receive hundreds if not thousands of applications, they don't need to go back into ERAS to download more. So they would only go through the initial stack of applications (which was more than enough) and send interview invites from there. I received most of my invites in October.
• Make sure your ERAS app is 100% complete when you submit (except for CS). I also heard from several PDs that they only granted interviews to applicants with complete applications - meaning all LORs uploaded and Step 2 CK available. Request your LORs early so your letter writers have plenty of time (follow up with them if necessary!). Step 2 CS just needs to be available before the rank list opens.
• Don't diminish your chances because of monetary reasons. I was fortunate enough to have the financial resources for my ERAS application fees and travel costs. But even if you don't, you should do whatever you can to over-apply and go on all the interviews you can. Go into credit card debt if you must. Your chances drastically diminish the further out you are from graduation. Your best shot at re-applying is the first time, so maximize it. Otherwise, you risk not ever becoming a physician.
• Email PDs and PCs / call PCs early on to get more interviews! I secured eight interviews alone by emailing the PD and copying the PC. I mentioned any personal connections I had (e.g. family in the area) and where my interests aligned with the program's mission statement. Timing-wise, I sent my emails the earlier of: after I saw that the program had already sent interview invites on SDN (so some as early as September 24) or after MSPE was released / mid-October. I also landed one interview by calling the program coordinator (to follow up on my email). It seemed like she had a waitlist (she looked up my name) and gave me an interview slot on the spot (likely a cancellation). If you're polite and sincere, it can't hurt to reach out!

Interview scheduling

• Schedule your interviews ASAP. As soon as I received an invite, whether on ERAS or by email (one program required applicants to call to schedule), I immediately scheduled my interview. Interview slots can be quickly taken up. A few applicants I know were offered interviews, but ended up on the waitlist because they didn't schedule in time.
• Don't forget to check the ERAS scheduler and your spam folder. I know a few applicants who missed interview invites this way.
• Stay organized. I used Google calendar to organize all my interviews. That way, I could easily pull it up on my phone or laptop and know which dates worked when scheduling interviews (for example, when I was on the phone with a PC I was able to quickly confirm the date). I also added the interview details (e.g. hotel arrangements, restaurant for the dinner) so I had all my information in one place. This helped me to follow up when necessary - on a couple of occasions, the PC forgot to provide some details.
• Front load interviews. I scheduled my first several interviews for the earliest dates possible (most in October), so I could leave dates in November-January open. This helped when I came off the waitlist at a few places because I still had availability during those months. I only had to reschedule one interview to accommodate another.

Interviewing

• Attend the resident dinner the evening before the interview. I was able to schedule my interviews so that I didn't miss any dinners. It's a great way to get to know programs in a more relaxed setting. It's also another way to make a good impression.
• Be prepared to explain any red flags during the interview.
• Always ask questions at the end of the interview. It's not hard to come up with a question and it shows interest in the program.
• Write thank you emails. I wrote a personalized thank you email to each interviewer, not just the PD. I sometimes sent a thank you email to the PC, too. While I can't quantify how much it helped, I know that it didn't hurt. Some PDs mentioned that they appreciate thank you emails. Of course, don't send any to programs that ask you not to.

FM specific advice

• Attend the AAFP national conference in July/August! Many residency programs attend. It's a great way to network and learn about other programs. I mentioned the connections I made during the conference in some of my emails. I got at least three interviews through my networking at conference.
• Go on second looks at your top choices. I went on a second look at my top three programs.