Real chances for a future IMG, need your help

[drjekyllhyde]

Hello everyone,

I've been reading a lot about all the process and matching as an non-us IMG, but I need your help to analyze my situation and discuss with you if it's worth it or not. I already know what I have to do in order to apply (usmle, steps etc.).
Maybe it could be a long post, but I'll write some cliff notes at the end for the ones who don't want to read it all

So, I'm in the first year of Medical school in Europe and one of my dreams would be to apply for a surgical residency in the US and then live and work there. I know, it's early but if I have to do this, I want to commit myself 100% in this thing, from the very first days.
The fact is that when I'll be finishing my MS I'll be 31. So that's my first doubt, it's 31 too late to apply and get matched? Especially in a surgical residency?

I would love try to get a residency as neurosurgeon or some other surgical program. I don't have any medicine contact or recommendation in the US or in my country.

Let's suppose I do all my best, scoring very good at each point, step1, 2cs/ck, step 3. Start doing some research and publication during my academic path, observership in the US, maybe everything else I can, if it wouldn't cost me a lot of years (I always think that as 31 I can't lose any time, I feel kinda late/old). What my real chances to match would be? In NC? If not, any advise in which other IMG friendly residency (alway surgical I prefer) I would get better chances?

Also assume that I'll get a match, do my 7 year of residency, how does it works after that in the US? I'll be send back to my country or I have good chance/certainly chance to remain in the US, working and living there (off course I don't have a green card atm)?

CLIFF NOTES
-European, visa needed;
-31 years old when I'll graduate;
-Would like to apply, with real chances, to neurosurgery or other surgical programs;
-No med contact or recommendation atm;
-Willing to do anything an human be can do to succeed, starting as soon as I can (but not wasting too much years because I would love to have also a career if possible)


Please be honest and direct to me, If you think that I don't really have a chance, just say it. I don't want any false hope, I need your help to understand if I will be wasting my times or it will be worth the commitment

So guys, what do you think?
Thanks in advance for reading this and I hope you'll clear all my doubts I'll take any advices you are willing to give!

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[Winged Scapula]

Cliff Notes answer:

1) 31 is not too old to start
2) Neurosurgery is very unlikely; most IMGs who match into surgical specialties have done their "dues" in the respective research lab at the NSGY program for several years. You are not likely to be "that guy". Your best chance is probably with general surgery (assuming only surgical options).
3) You must do elective rotations in the US and obtain US letters of recommendation while you are still a student; discuss with your program how to arrange this now for your final year
4) The ability to stay in the US after your training will depend on what sort of visa you can obtain.

 

[drjekyllhyde]

Cliff Notes answer:

1) 31 is not too old to start
2) Neurosurgery is very unlikely; most IMGs who match into surgical specialties have done their "dues" in the respective research lab at the NSGY program for several years. You are not likely to be "that guy". Your best chance is probably with general surgery (assuming only surgical options).
3) You must do elective rotations in the US and obtain US letters of recommendation while you are still a student; discuss with your program how to arrange this now for your final year
4) The ability to stay in the US after your training will depend on what sort of visa you can obtain.

Thanks Winged Scapula.

So, I guess it would be "mandatory" for me to do all the steps, including step 3 (so that I can hope to get a H1b visa from the program) and come in the US doing elective clinical rotations, maybe during the summer when I have 1,5 month free.

Also general surgery is a choice, but how does it works in the US after the residency?
Assuming that I have an H1b visa, and not the J1 that makes me go back to my country with no choice, it's difficult to find someone who hire you, after the residency?
I just want to understand if there could be a future as a non-us physician who did residency in the US, working and living in the US. Been forced to come back to my country would be pretty bad for me, as I don't think that the specialization done in the US, would be recognized. I don't wanna think about having to start all over again

Also, if someone knows if there is website/data sheets somewhere out there, to see how the non-us IMGs who get matched have done by speciality, would be great

Thank you again.

 

[ThoracicGuy]

Thanks Winged Scapula.

So, I guess it would be "mandatory" for me to do all the steps, including step 3 (so that I can hope to get a H1b visa from the program) and come in the US doing elective clinical rotations, maybe during the summer when I have 1,5 month free.

Also general surgery is a choice, but how does it works in the US after the residency?
Assuming that I have an H1b visa, and not the J1 that makes me go back to my country with no choice, it's difficult to find someone who hire you, after the residency?
I just want to understand if there could be a future as a non-us physician who did residency in the US, working and living in the US. Been forced to come back to my country would be pretty bad for me, as I don't think that the specialization done in the US, would be recognized. I don't wanna think about having to start all over again

Also, if someone knows if there is website/data sheets somewhere out there, to see how the non-us IMGs who get matched have done by speciality, would be great

Thank you again.

You need to do these electives while in medical school. You will not be able to do clinical electives after you have graduated.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Also the electives must almost always be during your final year (they cannot be done between MS1 and 2, for example).

 

[Winged Scapula]

Thanks Winged Scapula.

So, I guess it would be "mandatory" for me to do all the steps, including step 3 (so that I can hope to get a H1b visa from the program) and come in the US doing elective clinical rotations, maybe during the summer when I have 1,5 month free.

As noted above, most US programs will only allow electives from foreign students during their final year. This can take some time to set-up, requires malpractice insurance good in the US, health insurance, a place to stay, etc. so best to start thinking about it NOW.

Yes, if Step 3 is required to obtain the H1b then you need to do them (which is the easy part).

Also general surgery is a choice, but how does it works in the US after the residency?
Assuming that I have an H1b visa, and not the J1 that makes me go back to my country with no choice, it's difficult to find someone who hire you, after the residency?

I would have no idea if its easy to find a job as a non-citizen in the US. Best to check with the state department and others that have done it before.

I just want to understand if there could be a future as a non-us physician who did residency in the US, working and living in the US. Been forced to come back to my country would be pretty bad for me, as I don't think that the specialization done in the US, would be recognized. I don't wanna think about having to start all over again

Then you shouldn't come here. You should only come to the US for training if you are able to stay permanently or the training will be accepted in your country. There are no guarantees.

Also, if someone knows if there is website/data sheets somewhere out there, to see how the non-us IMGs who get matched have done by speciality, would be great

Google NRMP Charting Outcomes for the Match

 

[mikeGR]

Btw in terms of visa, my anecdotal experience is that >90% of matching applicants have to take a J1 (most programs don't offer h1b). There are ways to get around the 2 yr rule but it will be tough, and there are no guarantees.

 

[doc05]

Your chances are very poor. Unfortunately, it will be an uphill battle through every step.

I feel that 31 is too old to start surgical training, and that's based on the assumption that you will match the first time around.

add 5-8 years for residency+/- fellowship ... then you may not be able to stay in U.S. to practice, depending on your Visa situation. (to be hired as an attending, most employers will want a green card rather than an H1b)

If it turns out you can stay, you cannot possibly predict what the job market will be at that point.

 

[becomingdoctor]

try to get pre residency fellowship if you are serious about ns.