Religious Conflict With Vet

Started by bee83
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bee83

bee83

Pre-Veterinary
10+ Year Member
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This is part rant and part request for advice, so bear with me here...

Unlike many of you, I have not been able to get a paying job at a vet clinic, and thus my "traditional" vet experience is quite minimal. I've worked with vets, just not in your typical large or small animal clinical setting. So, being a bit desperate for some experience, I decided last summer to call up an old friend of the family who attends the (extremely strict traditional Catholic) church that my family used to attend when I was younger.
He offered to let me come shadow/volunteer at his clinic. He doesn't practice much anymore, so even though I've seen him a few times, I've been working with the other three vets at this clinic but not him. Until today, because he is filling in for one of the vets who just had a baby.

I walked in this morning and immediately got pulled into the action, helping out with surgery. This is the first time we've worked together, and he immediately started asking questions about me, about school, etc. No problem. Then he asks, "Where are you going to church now?" I said I hadn't been to church in a while. He says "What??!? And why is that?"

Thinking that I'm being clever and avoiding the fact that I've been an atheist for well on eight years now, I tell him that I've been volunteering for a shelter on Sundays. Well, I guess you have to know how hardcore, fundamentally religious of a community I was raised in to know why this did not fly with him, at all. He said, "So what you're telling me is that you are putting this shelter, these CATS, before GOD? WHat is wrong with that picture?"
Meanwhile, he's flinging testicles all around the surgery room.

He goes on to ask me why, WHY is it, that when people lose their faith, they always lose it 110%??? (Mind you, I never said a single word about my religious beliefs, only that I had been too busy HELPING ANIMALS to go to church lately.) He also goes on to tell me that he doesn't want people who have lost their faith to enter the veterinary practice, because too many people who enter the practice anymore are homosexuals, or are the "new agey" type. And that there's no point to it, that nothing makes sense, if you don't have "The Faith."

I'm just standing there, completely flabbergasted, wondering how someone could possibly, actually, really and truly THINK this way. And yet, I grew up with this mentality, so in a way I completely understand it. And I think that's why I didn't get angry, I just kind of shrugged it off. He wasn't mean about it, he was just very matter of fact. Very direct. He wanted to put me on the spot, and hey, it worked.

But now I'm wondering, do I want to continue on with this? I was hoping that this very veterinarian might be able to write a recommendation for me, since he is very experienced and has known me since I was born, basically. He was very pleasant toward me for the rest of the day, but, quite honestly, I don't want to go back there next week. Is he going to grill me about my religious practices again, and judge my religious belief or lack thereof on the simple fact that I haven't been to church recently? He even grilled me on why my DAD hasn't been to church recently, and lectured me on why my dad should be going to church, and so on. Moreover, is this veterinarian going to refuse to write me a letter of recommendation simply because of this? Do I even want him to anymore???

I guess I'm just wondering how any of you would handle this. My instinct is to say it's not worth the trouble and the insult and to find a different vet to shadow. Then again, I have almost 70 hours at this vet clinic already, I was hoping to get to 100 hours before I start my next internship. I don't know if it would look bad on my application to be hopping around among vet clinics to shadow, and not to have spent a large amount of time at one place.

Sorry this is so long. I'm just so flustered and wondering if I should suck up my personal pride and dignity and just keep on at this clinic with this vet who so clearly thinks I'm not worth any thing as a future vet unless I "call that shelter and tell them I can't volunteer any more because I have to go to church!" End of story.
🙁
 
Absolutely, positively NOT.

It could just be because I'm gay and wouldn't want anything to do with a vet who not only thought my "lifestyle" was wrong but also brought it INTO THE WORKPLACE, but I'd be walking out that door so fast his head would spin.

I understand he's a friend of the family and he knows you very well, but to bring that up in the workplace is not very professional, and it's even more unprofessional to grill you about it in the workplace. It's one thing if he wants to have this discussion with you off the clock, but such things have no place on the job.

Being gay I've run into a lot of this very thing, and it's helped me learn to keep an open mind and to work with all kinds of people, even those who don't agree with me on things. However, being able to work with people who think and believe differently than you means that you push those things aside in order to get the job done. I certainly wouldn't mind working with this man had he just casually asked you about church and then said "Oh, okay" when you said you didn't go anymore. But to openly judge you and chastise you for it? No way. There's a huge difference between making friendly conversation and putting you on the spot inappropriately.

And I realize that he probably made you feel very small and intimidated, but remember that you too are an adult and you CAN stand up for yourself in these situations. If you choose to continue to work with him, you're going to have to put your foot down. You are going to have to tell him that while you realize he doesn't approve of your lack of church-going, it's a decision that you've made and you're going to have to agree to disagree, and you'd appreciate it if he'd stop talking about it. If that doesn't work, I'd get out of there.

I personally wouldn't want a vet who had something like this against me write a LOR. I am like you, never had a paying job at a vet clinic, and I still managed to get hundreds of hours of vet experience as well as glowing recommendations from two vets who, while they only knew me for about a year, were very attuned to my goals and my value as a prospective vet student.

Good luck and I hope you can figure this all out!
 
Run. Fast.

OK, but seriously by the way this guy sounds I wouldn't want him writing a recommendation letter anyways. Sounds like he already has a negative view of you because you don't go to church. You're probably a great person and would make an amazing vet and this guy might not be able to get past the fact that you don't go to church to write an honest recommendation of your fitness to be a vet.

My opinion of the catholic church and all organized religion in general is already so low that this opinion in itself is in all likelihood biased. Plus you sound way more tolerant than me, so maybe you can put up with him long enough and bs your way around the whole going-to-church thing to get a nice letter.
 
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bee--

First of all, not to be creepy-stalkery-weirdish, but I'm 95% sure I know who you are. 😉 And if you are who I think you are, I KNOW that you are a good person and will make an amazing vet. (do you know who I am from my avatar? 🙄)

Run away. There are a ton of other opportunities for you. I seriously did cold calls when I first moved back to Indy. And I have since worked with some vets who said they would write a letter for me after a few months of me working with them. I don't think it's worth it to you to sacrifice many of the good things you have and risk that this vet write you a LOR.

If it helps, I had a lot of random places on my application, some of them only a few hours. But I still put it because it was quality experience.
 
To be perfectly honest, if this vet knows you/ your family from church, it is not fair to hold it against him for asking about church. Do I think that he should have exploded at you? No. It is HARD for religious people to understand why people turn away from faith, because we all struggle to live up to our faith. I don't want to condone this vet's behavior AT ALL, but I must admit that I empathize. (Does this make me a bad person? I hope not.)
But if you're wondering why he assumed you have fallen from the faith, you should remember that a vigil mass on Saturday evenings is a staple of Catholic churches (at least it's what got me through volunteering at a vet ER on Sunday mornings).
Finally, having worked for a conservative Catholic vet before, I know that it IS possible for them to hold their feelings in, but also feel free to discuss their opinions with their staff as they feel comfortable, (and NOT in a way that alienates any staff member).
 
Completely unacceptable in oh so many ways and for oh so many reasons.

Do not go back there. Do not subject yourself to how many untold hours of feeling uncomfortable, full of angst, stressed out etc all in the name of what some anonymous admissions committee might think when they see "only" 70 hours at a particular place. (Here's a hint: there's really no difference at all between 70 and 100.) NOBODY should have to put up with this.

Find a place where you feel comfortable with the person and the medicine. You will feel more free to ask questions and to learn, and it will be a healthier work environment for you. Plus, THAT is a letter you can count on and trust. This guy seems way unpredictable.
 
I haven't posted much on this forum so sorry if I'm being presumptuous by throwing in my $0.02. I'm not religious at all but I kind of agree with Niri here. If it really makes you uncomfortable then by all means go someplace else, but you're going to have to deal with all types as a vet anyways. You might as well start now. You said you're hard up for experience and he's offering you a great one. From the way you said it, it doesn't sound like he's berating you. He just sounds like he's opinionated and has some stupid ideas and doesn't really know when to shut up. Maybe I'm less sensitive about it, but personally I'd put in the hours and use this as a chance to practice my diplomacy skills. You said you spend most of your time with the three other vets anyways.

But I do agree that those conversations are embarrassing and he should've minded his own business.
 
Just dittoing the 'run, fast' sentiment. I would NOT waste your time there if possible. If you need the experience to get another shadowing gig/job/what have you then maybe stick it out but do NOT ask him for a LOR. Dude sounds BSC. He may be a good veterinarian but he sounds like a bad person (or at least a judgmental one - yes I see the hypocrisy).
 
alliecat44 said:
Find a place where you feel comfortable with the person and the medicine. You will feel more free to ask questions and to learn, and it will be a healthier work environment for you. Plus, THAT is a letter you can count on and trust. This guy seems way unpredictable.
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I can't back this up enough. I've worked in unfortunate situations, and they made me doubt if I wanted to continue with vet med. What I didn't realize was that not all of vet med was like that, and I didn't have to SUFFER and be MISERABLE to achieve my dreams.

More doors will open for you. Don't just jump through the first one that opens. You'll find a better situation-- I promise.
 
I have to slightly agree with Niri. Since you are just shadowing you are there because he is allowing you to be there, due to your prior relationship. It is only natural for him to ask questions, and if he is really religious feel that he needs to "save" you. If it was me I would not put up with it, you could possibly just try to tell him how you feel, but you never know when you may need a letter so it may be best to just leave the situation.

I once was in a situation kinda similar. I was applying for a job at this one clinic and the vet/owner was interviewing me and asking me all those inappropriate questions such as age, religion, etc. He made it clear that everyone in the clinic was Christan and that everyone was expected to go to church on sunday. Even though at the time I was a Christian the situation made me so uncomfortable when I got offered the job I turned it down.

Weigh the benefits and the cost of walking away from this vet, can you shadow somewhere else?
 
He's a bigot. Don't support him with your labor.

Life is too short for idiots like him and there are plenty of other opportunities out there.
 
EnvyPointers, I do believe we know each other 😉 lol.

Thank you all for your support and understanding. It makes me feel better about being put in that situation. I don't feel any ill will toward him, and I am VERY grateful for the opportunity that he gave me. However, I choose to see this as a big red sign that says "THIS IS NOT RIGHT FOR YOU." Even though I've learned a lot, I've never really liked the way the practice is run, and I've caught myself saying more than once that I would never bring my pets there!

The thing is, if I don't shadow for him on Tuesdays anymore, than I can volunteer at the medical days for the same shelter that he accused me of putting before God 😛
 
His behavior was inappropriate, disrespectful, and if you were an employee or applying for a job, probably illegal. When people act like this it's rarely an isolated incident. I suspect if you stay there you will find all sorts of unprofessional behavior from this guy.
 
Can you figure out when he's going to be there and schedule yourself on other days? Do you HAVE to get a recommendation from him, as opposed to one of the other vets there?

If you have other opportunities to get clinical experience, then it might be better for you to take them and get the heck out of there. But if you really need the hours, maybe you can avoid more inquisition, either by shadowing when he's not there, or by working with him on days when he sees appointments and so will have less opportunity to harangue you.
 
It sounds like you've made up your mind, but I'll throw my two cents in just for funsies.

While I think it's pretty obvious that this was not appropriate for a work environment/boss-employee conversation, I don't think you should necessarily run away. If your instinct is that you really desperately do not want to go back, then obviously you shouldn't. But it is experience, and as you said, he doesn't actually work often. If you do go back, I would have a conversation with him first. Just politely explain that while you respect his opinion and his beliefs, you don't think it's an appropriate line of conversation for an employer and employee to have, and that you would appreciate that the topic of your religious beliefs and practices (and those of your family/friends/complete strangers) remain off-limits.

That being said, if you have other options, I'd go with those. I've had a boss who made very nasty comments (without any nasty intentions) to me, and even though I went back, I was never comfortable when he was around.
 
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BeagleOne, the one vet I have worked with most from this clinic has just left on maternity leave, and he is filling in for her for the next two months. If I were to ask for a recommendation from anyone else it would be her, but I have only worked with her once a week for five weeks..
 
His behavior was unbelievably unprofessional, and you have every right to leave your position there. I personally would not want a LOR from someone that seemed to judge me so much, and on a personal matter. And I do not think it would look bad for you to leave after working there for 70 hours.
On the other hand, if he doesn't work often and you are getting good experience with the other doctors, it might be worth continuing working there. Would one of those doctors write you a letter, since you seem to be spending more time with them anyway?
This could end up being an experience you can use in future applications or interviews, about facing this obstacle and how you handled it. Whether you stay or leave, it can reflect your ability to stand up for your principles.
The bottom line is that if you feel uncomfortable about the possibility of having a repeat encounter with him, you should leave, but if you think you can get him to agree to disagree or possibly avoid him in the future, it might not have to be the end of your experience with the other vets in the office.
 
If I were you, I would try to keep it up with the vet as long as you can until you have another place to go. If you find another vet that'll take you, leave and say that you've got a lot on your plate and thank him nicely- try not to burn the bridges. The reason I say stay is because it's sometimes easier to find other places to go when you already have a place you've been at, and if you've already had tough luck, a miserable vet experience is better than no vet experience, in terms of the hours on the paper.

In the meantime, try to side step the questions and just say you don't feel comfortable discussing it. If he gets mad, then really you don't want his name associated with you. I'm sure you're not the first one that's been there and vet schools may already have experienced his opinions. Religion has no place in the work place.

Also, if you have a large hospital near you it may be easier to get in and observe there.

Anyway, Good luck! I know it's crap, but don't let it get to you!
 
nitheninny said:
It sounds like you've made up your mind, but I'll throw my two cents in just for funsies.

While I think it's pretty obvious that this was not appropriate for a work environment/boss-employee conversation, I don't think you should necessarily run away. If your instinct is that you really desperately do not want to go back, then obviously you shouldn't. But it is experience, and as you said, he doesn't actually work often. If you do go back, I would have a conversation with him first. Just politely explain that while you respect his opinion and his beliefs, you don't think it's an appropriate line of conversation for an employer and employee to have, and that you would appreciate that the topic of your religious beliefs and practices (and those of your family/friends/complete strangers) remain off-limits.

That being said, if you have other options, I'd go with those. I've had a boss who made very nasty comments (without any nasty intentions) to me, and even though I went back, I was never comfortable when he was around.
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I'm kind of in Nitheninny's camp. No question his behavior is indefensible. That is not the question here.

1) Most importantly is what kind of recommendation can he write for you? If he can't recommend you because you have abandoned your faith (in his mind) then end of game. Get out. You will have to discuss this with him or try to feel him out.

2) Can you tolerate being with him? I know many people recommend running away, but that is not always the best option in life. If you are in a religious community this may be something that you might be able to put up with IF it is worth it for an AMAZING recommendation. Otherwise why bother. Anyway it depends on your personality.

Some things are not worth it in life, but that is for you to weigh. There are few absolutes.
 
As an aside, why is it that most of us in the veterinary profession have so much tolerance for horrendous work environments? Whether for application experience or as graduates who hate to leave because "if I do, what will happen to the patients?" we seem to have a tremendous capacity to put up with semi-abusive working relationships. Ugh.

This kind of thing would not be acceptable ANYWHERE and is borderline illegal (and only borderline because our lovely SDNer isn't a paid employee). Pathetic (in my opinion) that it should even be seem as something reasonable to put up with for the sake of an adcom!

Run before it ruins your opinion of veterinary medicine.

And it sounds like his medical practices are just as questionable as his ability to relate to people. Run, run, run...

Tangent--off! 🙂
 
I'm gonna have to also second NitheNinny's opinion, and Ehkehfemal's.

Is there any way to get a recommendation from a vet that works at the shelter you volunteer at? It seems like that place is a much better avenue for a LOR than this other vet your working with.
 
I think I may take the contrary viewpoint on this. So the guy rubbed you the wrong way and made what would be considered by many 'inappropriate work conversation' -- you've known this person for ages and on more than a working relationship.

You have a different viewpoint and you may not agree with him. Does that mean you can't get along with him? Is he a bad person (despite his staunch conservatism)? Is he a bad vet?

Instead of just lying about the issues step up a bit and be honest, especially if you want to continue to work there. Let him know that you are not comfortable discussing certain topics and move on from there. Unless you let a person know something bothers you, don't expect them to read your mind. Especially if they've known you for years and think/thought you were on the same page as them.

Furthermore it might make for some interesting talk during surgery -- granted I don't know just how closed-minded this person is and if they are up for rational discussion (or if you are for that matter).

Good luck in whatever choice you make, just make sure to give the guy a fair chance.
 
Getting into vet school is hard, if it helps just humor the old geezer. Say something he wants to hear like "Oh I'm so inspired by your ultra religious bs and I am so going to church this Sunday"

If its me I'd just do whatever it takes to get the LOR

These ultra religious types are all the same; judgmental, holier than thou etc. They all came off the same assembly line but they are not necessarily bad people. See it from his perspective, he probably means well (for your soul).

Just roll with it, put up a smile and pretend his religious mumbo jumbo is mad dog's bark and you'd be alright. Best not to aggravate him since he knows you so well and very likely you will be seeing him again. Its quite unavoidable if you are gonna work in this profession
 
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^I disagree. As a vet you are going to have to stand up against people and make your own ethical choices. May as well start now. Why be dishonest about yourself and complacent about bigotry and then ask for a letter about your personal character? I think it would say a lot more about your character to stand up to him and then find a better place to work.

And I think what crosses the line for me is not the religion (though I'm an atheist) but the bigotry. If it were me and he brought up his homophobia again (which he will) I would have no choice but to set him straight that it's 2010 and that **** is not ok. Which probably wouldn't help you out on the LOR front 😀
 
bunnity said:
I think it would say a lot more about your character to stand up to him and then find a better place to work.
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If there is one lesson I have learned in my professional career thus far, it is never burn a bridge because you will never know when you will need it.

Yes as a professional it is great to be able to take a stand on an issue and defend it, but like raveler said it is a small world.
 
bbeventer said:
If there is one lesson I have learned in my professional career thus far, it is never burn a bridge because you will never know when you will need it.

Yes as a professional it is great to be able to take a stand on an issue and defend it, but like raveler said it is a small world.
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You can stand up to someone without burning a bridge in most cases. And to me it is more important to have a reputation for not tolerating bigotry - even if it causes that person to not like me - than to have a reputation for getting along with everyone. YMMV
 
Additionally if he's that closed-minded there's no way he's going to write a good LOR for you if you don't conform to his beliefs of what people should be like. And you can't really lie about going to church because I think the OP said they go to the same church. It's lose-lose IMO and the amount of bull**** you'd have to put up with is not worth it if there's other options.
 
theunraveler said:
If its me I'd just do whatever it takes to get the LOR
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Been there. It's not worth it. They try not to accept miserable, bitter, crazy people into vet school, which is what a situation like this will turn you into. They prefer happy, well-balanced folks, I hear.
 
breenie said:
Been there. It's not worth it. They try not to accept miserable, bitter, crazy people into vet school, which is what a situation like this will turn you into. They prefer happy, well-balanced folks, I hear.
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I would disagree but then I have lots of 'training' in this area. I have suffered under people with very bad views about gay, race, morality and religion. Generally the best approach is to be fluid about it, or as Bruce Lee said "be like water"😀. Just be nice, pretend whatever they say is a mad dog's bark and be like "ya whatever..."

Might also be useful when he starts his religious rant to slowly change the subject to something else, try to find out from the vet nurses or those who work there for a long time what he likes and then change the subject to something less offensive.

A trend I notice is that people with the most repugnant views on gay marriage, race etc tend to be higher up in the hierarchy of things. They also tend to be older and more established in society. Chances are you gonna need their help sometime in the future, best is not to burn bridges with them.

In my time working for those bastards, I never once felt miserable or bitter. Its surprisingly easy for me to switch off while in their presence. I also think its an important skill for people to learn, as jerks are born every second and chances are you might have to work for one in the future.
 
I worked for a veterinarian that is bipolar for about 3 years on and off (during high school and college breaks). I accumulated 1500 hours with him. The majority of the time it wasn't so bad but sometimes he would totally flip. He threw something at me one time, I think it was a chart or a pen...nothing too terrifying. (He had thrown one of those small animal scales at another tech before). And screamed at me to go home because I had asked him a question concerning a client that he didn't feel like dealing with. Maybe it was because of all of the advice that everyone else that worked there had given me, but I knew to lay low for about 30 minutes and then get back to work because he would be angrier if we were short staffed.

He wrote me a LOR and I still have a very good relationship with him. Granted, it is different because my vet's issues are that he's bipolar and won't take medication. But I have been in the position that I stuck it out because I knew that it would get better. There are also 3 other doctors at the practice, so I didn't always have to work with him.

In your situation though this man sounds like he's always like this so I don't know if it would be worth it to stay there. If you were getting tech experience or had invested more time there I might say that it's worth it to stay. (My vet didn't throw things at me until I'd worked there well over a year). But in this case it might be easier to just thank him for the experience and leave. I would agree with the "don't burn your bridges" remark that many people have been expressing. The vet community is small so it may be good to have him on your side one day.
 
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At first I was thinking the same as most of the commenters above: RUN and FAST!! But, if this is the first time you have worked with him or the first problem you have had and you otherwise are enjoying your experience with the other three vets, why waste the opportunity? I would NOT get a LOR from him, but if you get to know the other 3 vets well enough you could get LOR's from them. I did see your post saying that you have thought to yourself that you would not bring your pets to this clinic and this makes me say: RUN!! You don't want this experience to be a negative cloud on your impression of vet med....if you stick with a clinic you don't like long enough you can quickly burn out and get to the point where you no longer even want to go to vet school...because the bad clinic is all you know (I have had serious doubts about if I still want to be a vet after working in a couple of bad clinics...but I have had the experience of good clinics to remind myself of what vet med should be like to keep my head in the game). So, if you are enjoying your time with the other vets, you think you can get LOR's from them and it will not be a negative experience to cloud your judgement of vet med than stick with it, but if for any reason you are not enjoying it or can do something else that will be better...than RUN and FAST!! Good Luck!!! :luck:
 
This strikes me as very odd behavior from a Catholic, unless he was of an evangelical faith before. In my (almost) 36 years of experience as a Catholic, I haven't met anyone that acts like that. Even my grandmother isn't the interrogating type - it helps that she saw me on CNN attending church before the 2003 invasion. My experience has been limited to the midwest, where we have a culture of keeping to ourselves. I completely disagree with you lying. It calls into question your ability to choose the hard right over the easy wrong. If you truly hold your beliefs dear, then stand up for them. If you're going to compromise your integrity so quickly over such a trivial matter, then do everyone a favor and find a new field.
 
i'm very proud to see the answers to this thread. I'm starting Ostopathic Medical school and I hope the views of my fellow classmates will be like the majority on this thread.

OP: go find a place where helping animals on a sunday instead of trying to earn brownie points with a mythical magical creature is viewed as a good thing.
 
theunraveler said:
In my time working for those bastards, I never once felt miserable or bitter. Its surprisingly easy for me to switch off while in their presence. I also think its an important skill for people to learn, as jerks are born every second and chances are you might have to work for one in the future.
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Then you're a lucky and talented person. I don't see the need to sit around and endure it when there are likely better options. Necessary skills, yes, but I meet enough intolerant, unprofessional people in my day-to-day life that I feel I can be choosy in the type of people I want to work for. 🙂
 
bunnity said:
And I think what crosses the line for me is not the religion (though I'm an atheist) but the bigotry. If it were me and he brought up his homophobia again (which he will) I would have no choice but to set him straight that it's 2010 and that **** is not ok. Which probably wouldn't help you out on the LOR front 😀
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100% this.

While the religion discussion is inappropriate on a professional level, I know sometimes stuff like that just comes up in conversation between people who know each other well enough. It's an important distinction to make though, that this guy really seems to have crossed a line by throwing in the talk about gays in the profession. That's ridiculous and honestly makes me a little bit sick, and I'm not sure that I would have been able to hold my tongue there personally, even though I know intellectually that it would pretty much put me on the same level of unprofessionalism to say what I'd probably say. I mean it's no different from a vet ranting about women in the profession or all the minorities or whatever - it's disgusting and deplorable, and I personally can't respect a person with those sorts of viewpoints in this day and age.
 
bee83 said:
I just kind of shrugged it off. He wasn't mean about it, he was just very matter of fact.

He was very pleasant toward me for the rest of the day, but, quite honestly, I don't want to go back there next week. Is he going to grill me about my religious practices again, and judge my religious belief or lack thereof on the simple fact that I haven't been to church recently?
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I'm going to give a different perspective.

I think these are the important components of the OP. He wasn't mean, he was pleasant the rest of the day.

Did you ever bother to say "I'm not comfortable discussing this in a professional environment. I'd enjoy hearing about what other issues you feel are impacting veterinary medicine, since I don't get to work with you very often." He's told you he feels lack of faith is an issue. It's his opinion, he is entitled to it. Mine him for other information. Set a firm boundary. Some folks (likey Nyanko, like myself) tend toward lively debate and can be ok with not ever agreeing, while other folks prefer to keep it calm, which sounds like what you were hoping for. This could just be a simple personality/opinion conflict.

Now, if you draw a boundary, and he doesn't respect that, then leave. Otherwise, to leave without ever drawing the boundary is, in my opinion, passive-aggressive. And the issue of appropriatness depends on a lot of things, including region, relationship, etc. ( It isn't appropriate to be sexually involved with a co-worker most of the time, but how many husband-wife vet clinics exist? He may have approached this from the family-friend side of the relationship rather than the professional side, especially if you used the family-friend side to get the oppurtunity to be there.) He probably was in the wrong, but I believe if you didn't draw the line, you were also wrong. I also wouldn't assume you can't get a good recommendation out of this (from him or another vet) because, at this moment, you don't know. If you leave now, though, you certainly won't.

YMMV.
 
breenie said:
They try not to accept miserable, bitter, crazy people into vet school, which is what a situation like this will turn you into. They prefer happy, well-balanced folks, I hear.
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----------------MEMO --------------------------------------------------

TO: The miserable, bitter, crazy people out there.
From: A miserable, bitter, crazy person.

Do NOT let breenie discourage you. There IS a place for miserable, bitter, and crazy people in vet school. I am your poster child!

All the worst,
SOV
 
sumstorm said:
I'm going to give a different perspective.

I think these are the important components of the OP. He wasn't mean, he was pleasant the rest of the day.

Did you ever bother to say "I'm not comfortable discussing this in a professional environment. I'd enjoy hearing about what other issues you feel are impacting veterinary medicine, since I don't get to work with you very often." He's told you he feels lack of faith is an issue. It's his opinion, he is entitled to it. Mine him for other information. Set a firm boundary. Some folks (likey Nyanko, like myself) tend toward lively debate and can be ok with not ever agreeing, while other folks prefer to keep it calm, which sounds like what you were hoping for. This could just be a simple personality/opinion conflict.

Now, if you draw a boundary, and he doesn't respect that, then leave. Otherwise, to leave without ever drawing the boundary is, in my opinion, passive-aggressive. And the issue of appropriatness depends on a lot of things, including region, relationship, etc. ( It isn't appropriate to be sexually involved with a co-worker most of the time, but how many husband-wife vet clinics exist? He may have approached this from the family-friend side of the relationship rather than the professional side, especially if you used the family-friend side to get the oppurtunity to be there.) He probably was in the wrong, but I believe if you didn't draw the line, you were also wrong. I also wouldn't assume you can't get a good recommendation out of this (from him or another vet) because, at this moment, you don't know. If you leave now, though, you certainly won't.

YMMV.
Click to expand...

Agreed, 100%. Very well-put.
 
StartingoverVet said:
----------------MEMO --------------------------------------------------

TO: The miserable, bitter, crazy people out there.
From: A miserable, bitter, crazy person.

Do NOT let breenie discourage you. There IS a place for miserable, bitter, and crazy people in vet school. I am your poster child!

All the worst,
SOV
Click to expand...

I literally just snorted/choked/giggled outloud in the library when I read that.

Fine, fine, you're right. But you put on a smiling, sunny face in your interview, right? 😉
 
I'm pretty good at being passive-aggressive, so I think I'll go with the route I've chosen. Thanks for the input all! And good luck with finals for those of you to whom it applies! :luck:
 
I think this guy's response was totally out of line and any response that involves flinging testicles is by its very nature irrational and inappropriate.

That being said - I wonder if you might have had better luck if you'd told the truth. You don't go to church because you're an atheist. It has nothing to do with your volunteering at the shelter on Sundays. Just like I don't go to Mass very often because I am a lazy butt. Yes, I work on Sundays, but that's not why I don't go. And it's not that I'm an atheist either. I'm just lazy. Honestly, I respect you more for being an atheist.

So yeah - I don't know if it would have been possible to get a rational response out of that guy. But do yourself a favor and tell the truth about these things. You can still do it gently.
 
StartingoverVet said:
----------------MEMO --------------------------------------------------

TO: The miserable, bitter, crazy people out there.
From: A miserable, bitter, crazy person.

Do NOT let breenie discourage you. There IS a place for miserable, bitter, and crazy people in vet school. I am your poster child!

All the worst,
SOV
Click to expand...

Whew! I'm ok then. Don't need the deck stacked against me more than it already is.
 
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