MD School List/WAMC: Re-applicant, 5th gap year, 1 pub, 3 posters, 3.66 cGPA, 3.56 sGPA, 517 MCAT, ORM, IL resident

[yaboifoggy]

Hi everyone, I will be re-applying this year after unfortunately not getting any II during the 2020-2021 cycle and wanted to get some feedback on my current school list in relation to my stats and experiences to see whether I should change/add some schools. Would greatly appreciate any advice.

My application is research heavy as I have worked at a cancer research institute for the past few years and speak about my desire to serve cancer patients and employ precision/personalized approaches in my future career as a physician in my personal statement. My other significant experiences include dedication to education/teaching as well as being a life-long musician.

STATS:

• cGPA: 3.66 (3.39 > 3.56 > 3.64 > 3.97)
• sGPA: 3.56 (3.15 > 3.43 > 3.46 > 4.0)
• MCAT: 518 (130/125/132/131) taken in 2018, 517 (131/124/131/131) taken in 2021
• AMCAS submission date: 5/31/2023

BACKGROUND:

• State: Illinois, significant ties to CA
• Ethnicity/race and gender: Asian male
• Undergrad: T25 in California, graduated 2019 (5th gap year now)
• Major: Biology
• Minor: Music Production

CLINICAL EXPERIENCE:

• Volunteer: 137 hours as a hospice piano volunteer, 49 hours in the emergency department
• Paid: 267 hours as an ED scribe
• Total: 453 hours

RESEARCH EXPERIENCE:

• Full-time lab tech since 2019 (nearly 6000 hours)
• Co-author on publication in Nature
• 2 first-author posters presented at major national conferences, co-author on another poster presented at a major national conference
• This was one of my most meaningful experiences as it drove my curiosity in translational research and precision/personalized medicine, which I emphasize in my personal statement.
• Also did a 1 month problem-based research course in Guatemala in which I wrote about the factors that cause western medical resources to be underused in rural Guatemala (150 hours)

SHADOWING EXPERIENCE:

• 64 hours (orthopedic surgery)
• 80 projected hours as part of my full-time job (oncology)
• Was supposed to shadow a family medicine doctor in 2020 but COVID prevented that and haven’t been able to shadow since.

NON-CLINICAL VOLUNTEERING:

• 140 hours teaching conducting science experiments with 1st-3rd graders in low-income schools. Formal science education in these schools does not begin until the 4th grade.
• 48 hours distributing water, snacks, clothes, and other necessities to those experiencing homelessness
• Total: 188 hours

OTHER ACTIVITIES:

• 390 hours as an executive board member for my undergrad’s photography club
• 350 hours as an SI leader for physics
• 994 hours founding and leading a music-centered non-profit organization that raises money for health issues and creates online educational content
• Total: 1734 hours

HONORS/AWARDS:

• Eagle Scout
• Undergraduate Research Fellow in 2017 and 2018, received stipends to fund my research projects
• Recognized for academic excellence in my two widely varying fields of study (Biology and Music Production)

OTHER:

• Letters of rec: All strong and speak to different aspects of my interest in academic medicine and translational research. 1 from the Chief Translational Research Officer of the research institute where I work, 1 from my former SI director, and 1 from my hospice volunteer coordinator.
• Personal statement: Entirely re-written from my last application. Mentions how I’ve used music to benefit patients as a hospice volunteer. Also mentions my interest in serving cancer patients and how my research can benefit this population. Had it reviewed/edited by a former AdCom member at Stanford and was told it was strong.
• W&A essays: Entirely re-written from my last application. They were also reviewed by the former AdCom member at Stanford who told me they were strong and help build the narrative I establish in my personal statement.

I have listed 47 schools below, 35 of which are my tentative list and 12 of which are schools that I am considering in place of the schools I have already selected. I hope that my current list is a good balance so any insight regarding schools that are OOS-unfriendly, too far out of my reach, or not a good fit given my stats/experience would be very much appreciated. Additionally, please let me know if there are some other schools that I should consider adding, that would also be greatly appreciated.

For geographic preference, I would say that I prefer schools in more densely populated cities, but honestly open to living in most places. Just want to make sure I can get in somewhere this cycle. Please also let me know if I should consider applying to DO schools.

If you made it this far, thank you very much for taking the time to read my post and I greatly appreciate any feedback. Thank you!

Current List	Alternatives I'm Considering
Stanford	Arizona (Phoenix)
UCLA	Tufts
USC Keck	Tulane
UCSD	NYMC
UCSF	Pittsburgh
UIC	Hackensack
Rush	Emory
Loyola	Geisenger
Chicago Medical School at RFU	Temple
Northwestern	Sidney Kimmel
UChicago	NOVA Southeastern
Ohio State	UCF
Case Western
UMichigan
Albert Einstein
Indiana
MCW
UWisconsin
Colorado
Icahn
UCincinatti
UVA
Saint Louis
Hofstra
VCU
EVMS
Iowa
USF Morsani
Drexel
Miami
Rochester
UMass Chan
Western Michigan
Boston
Stony Brook

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[Mr.Smile12]

Off the bat, your community service work with homeless shelters needs to hit 150 hours. (Your tutoring elementary school children goes under the teaching/tutoring category and won't satisfy service orientation the way homeless shelter work you have done.) Applicants with fewer than 150 hours of service orientation activities are subject to being screened out at a lot of schools, so that's going to be an issue to pay attention to.

You thus have way too few hours for service-focused schools like Rush, Loyola.

Is your Eagle Scout project related to any activities you listed?

Shadowing: get that fam med shadowing in. No more COVID emergency means no more excuses.

Other than the adcom from Stanford, who else has given you feedback about your essays and W/A?

Geographically, I need to know why you are sending apps to: EVMS, WMU, UIC, Colorado, Roch, Iowa, Stony, Chan, Indiana. I don't see these schools as being located in "densely populated areas". (Correct me if I'm wrong.)

I’ve used music to benefit patients as a hospice volunteer. Also mentions my interest in serving cancer patients and how my research can benefit this population.

How did you tie these two concepts together in your PS? Cancer/oncology is also a really big disease that every medical school will likely address somehow, so what specifically about cancer do you want? NCI-funded investigators? Access to clinical trials? Networking with pharma and medical affairs companies? What exactly is your purpose as a future physician in 10 years?

 

[yaboifoggy]

Hello Mr.Smile12, thanks so much for the quick feedback, really appreciate it.

Off the bat, your community service work with homeless shelters needs to hit 150 hours. (Your tutoring elementary school children goes under the teaching/tutoring category and won't satisfy service orientation the way homeless shelter work you have done.) Applicants with fewer than 150 hours of service orientation activities are subject to being screened out at a lot of schools, so that's going to be an issue to pay attention to.

You thus have way too few hours for service-focused schools like Rush, Loyola.

Got it. I will work on building my community service work with those experiencing homelessness. I also should have clarified this in my original post, which I have now edited, but I categorized the experience with “teaching science lessons” as community-service because the activity involved conducting fun experiments with elementary school kids in low-income schools to foster an early curiosity in science. This was important because the science curriculum in these schools does not begin until the 4th grade, and since formal lessons weren’t really given to them I saw it as less of a teaching/tutoring activity.

If you were to count the hours from this activity into my total of non-clinical volunteering, would 188 hours still be too low for Rush or Loyola even though I am an Illinois resident? This was something that I feared as well, so thank you for bringing it to attention and I will probably not apply to these schools if so.

Is your Eagle Scout project related to any activities you listed?

Unfortunately my Eagle Scout project was not related to any of my current activities in my AMCAS as I completed it back in high school. I included my Eagle Scout rank in a combined “Awards/Recognitions” entry in AMCAS as I did not want to create an entire entry for it alone. I also included it to show a history of service.

Shadowing: get that fam med shadowing in. No more COVID emergency means no more excuses.

Understood. Since I already submitted, would I mention any additional family medicine shadowing I complete in an update letter should I receive IIs later this cycle?

Other than the adcom from Stanford, who else has given you feedback about your essays and W/A?

I have received feedback from my translational research PI, my clinical research PI who used to be involved with MD admissions at Baylor, several MDs that I have worked with in the past, current medical students at top schools (Stanford, Columbia, JHU), anonymous readers online who have also gotten strong results this past cycle, and many friends both in and out of the medical field. The consensus is that my personal statement is strong and gets the 5 “yes’s” that Moko mentions in the Personal Statement Reader List thread.

Geographically, I need to know why you are sending apps to: EVMS, WMU, UIC, Colorado, Roch, Iowa, Stony, Chan, Indiana. I don't see these schools as being located in "densely populated areas". (Correct me if I'm wrong.)

For the schools you listed, I largely selected them based on stat considerations as well as their "friendliness" to OOS students (%OOS interviews offered as well as %OOS matriculants). EVMS, Roch, Stony, Colorado, and Chan, as you have pointed out, are not located in as densely populated cities and would thus not be my preferred school environment. But I would still be happy to attend those schools despite their locations. I am applying to WMU, UIC, Iowa, and Indiana since I am originally from IL and these schools are close in proximity to my family.

How did you tie these two concepts together in your PS? Cancer/oncology is also a really big disease that every medical school will likely address somehow, so what specifically about cancer do you want? NCI-funded investigators? Access to clinical trials? Networking with pharma and medical affairs companies? What exactly is your purpose as a future physician in 10 years?

I talked about two patient encounters: one in which I was able to use music to make a positive impact on my patient, and another in which I was unable to use music to help the situation. The latter scenario involved a patient with cancer and her family and it emphasized to me the dire need to improve how cancer is treated and managed as well as why I want to become a physician. Other interactions with patients facing cancer have further solidified my desire to serve this population. I would say that I am looking for schools that are big on precision health/translational research as well as clinical trials, since I have experience in both of these types of research. My work mainly involves new research models for cancer that enable personalized care approaches. In 10 years, I see myself becoming an academic oncologist so that I can continue to improve cancer treatment/management through research, teach and train students, and provide direct care to patients.

I hope that provides additional context. Besides removing Rush and Loyola, do you have other suggestions? Thanks so much again.

 

[deleted1056062]

Your tutoring elementary school children goes under the teaching/tutoring category and won't satisfy service orientation the way homeless shelter work you have done

I am confused by this. Wouldn't tutoring low-income children (and not receiving any compensation for it) count as volunteering? I think there's a big difference between tutoring low-income elementary children at an impoverished school and tutoring your peers at your university.

 

[Faha]

Remove Rush and Loyola since they expect far more non clinical and clinical exposure hours than you have. Also remove Stony Brook and UCSD since they admit few non residents. That would still leave you with far too many schools. I suggest these schools with your stats:
Illinois
Rosalind Franklin
Northwestern
U Chicago
Medical College Wisconsin
U Wisconsin
Western Michigan
U Michigan
St. Louis
Tulane
USF Morsani
Miami
Emory
Duke
Wake Forest
U Virginia
Eastern Virginia
Virginia Commonwealth
George Washington
Georgetown
Drexel
Temple
Jefferson
Pittsburgh
Hackensack
Rochester
Hofstra
Einstein
Mount Sinai
New York Medical College
Vermont
Tufts
Boston University
Dartmouth
Cincinnati
Case Western
Kaiser

 

[Mr.Smile12]

I am confused by this. Wouldn't tutoring low-income children (and not receiving any compensation for it) count as volunteering? I think there's a big difference between tutoring low-income elementary children at an impoverished school and tutoring your peers at your university.

The OP provided details to clarify. There are differences, but a lot of premeds tutor at impoverished schools as set up by their science programs (I did this and have had many advisees do "magic shows" or "health exercises"/"brush and floss" at such schools).

 

[Mr.Smile12]

I would say that I am looking for schools that are big on precision health/translational research as well as clinical trials, since I have experience in both of these types of research. My work mainly involves new research models for cancer that enable personalized care approaches.

If you are in the field, you know already which schools are players and the startups or companies that work with the investigators. Cross reference against your list. See if any medical students are involved.

On the music side, check for lifestyle medicine and wellness programs. What you are thinking about likely works better in the music therapy camp, and I'm not sure you will have that role as a physician. Hopefully you can find a program that proves me wrong.

Find schools that have genetics counseling programs where the masters students work closely with medical students (if such exists).

 

[yaboifoggy]

Remove Rush and Loyola since they expect far more non clinical and clinical exposure hours than you have. Also remove Stony Brook and UCSD since they admit few non residents. That would still leave you with far too many schools. I suggest these schools with your stats:

Hi Faha, thank you very much for providing your feedback, much appreciated. Yes it seems like I will be removing Rush and Loyola as my service hours are not in the ballpark they are looking for. I will also remove Stony Brook and UCSD based off of the information you mentioned.

The school list you recommend looks well balanced to me so I will definitely be using it is a guide to finalize the list. For example, I did not consider GWU, Georgetown, or Kaiser previously but they look like good matches for me so I will be adding them. Thanks again!

 

[KaiBuzz]

Maybe I missed it but have you been promoted in the 4 years you’ve served as a lab tech? Leadership experience is highly valued. Your clinical and non clinical hours seems light considering the number of gap years you’ve taken.

 

[yaboifoggy]

If you are in the field, you know already which schools are players and the startups or companies that work with the investigators. Cross reference against your list. See if any medical students are involved.

On the music side, check for lifestyle medicine and wellness programs. What you are thinking about likely works better in the music therapy camp, and I'm not sure you will have that role as a physician. Hopefully you can find a program that proves me wrong.

Find schools that have genetics counseling programs where the masters students work closely with medical students (if such exists).

Yes, I have been looking for schools that have comprehensive cancer centers as well as the research opportunities I am interested in. I'll be sure to cross reference and double check.

I agree, I'm not sure if music therapy will be a big part of my role as a physician but I have been taking note of schools that have music-related opportunities. So I will mention those opportunities in their secondaries.

@Mr.Smile12 @Faha I'm reading that Georgetown is also a service oriented school. Is this a school I should consider applying to given my hours?

 

[yaboifoggy]

Maybe I missed it but have you been promoted in the 4 years you’ve served as a lab tech? Leadership experience is highly valued. Your clinical and non clinical hours seems light considering the number of gap years you’ve taken.

Hi KaiBuzz, yes I've been promoted at my lab and coordinate several student interns and other lab techs on projects now. I am also project lead for several collaborations our lab has with other institutions.

And yes I also agree. I was able to split my time between my lab tech and ED scribe positions before COVID, but after the hospital I scribed at shut down during the pandemic, it was not feasible for me to transfer to a new hospital nearly an hour away to continue scribing. Volunteering as pianist for hospice patients has been the compromise I found for not being able to work full-time as a lab-tech and part-time as a scribe.

Do you have any suggestions or feedback on the schools that I have listed? Would greatly appreciate your thoughts.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

I'm reading that Georgetown is also a service oriented school. Is this a school I should consider applying to given my hours?

Understand what "cura personalis" means and how it is manifested in the curriculum. I don't know if you have enough hours though you might have some insight with the exposure you have had. Georgetown has a huge applicant pool given it is in DC, and its Jesuit culture cannot be easily ignored.