Schools that offer clinical experience during MS1/2

[pageantry]

Hi all, I'm looking for help making a list of schools that have some sort of hands-on/clinical component throughout school. Does that exist in allopathic schools? Or is that like the kind of thing you'd only plan to do via a club or other organization?

I'm looking for schools that give you opportunities to remember why you're there beyond grades and fact-cramming, essentially. Any ideas?

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[maccu5000]

Most schools have some time in the hospital or clinic learning how to do stuff. Dartmouth does this well, for example, in their On Doctoring course. It's best to narrow down where you're interested and then ask specifically about those schools.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

Vanderbilt, Duke, and Harvard offer plenty of clinical experience during the 2nd year

 

[nm825]

USC

 

[pageantry]

Vanderbilt, Duke, and Harvard offer plenty of clinical experience during the 2nd year

Lol I'll sign right up then.

 

[redpanda]

Hi all, I'm looking for help making a list of schools that have some sort of hands-on/clinical component throughout school. Does that exist in allopathic schools? Or is that like the kind of thing you'd only plan to do via a club or other organization?

I'm looking for schools that give you opportunities to remember why you're there beyond grades and fact-cramming, essentially. Any ideas?

A lot of schools, including Pitt, where I am, have a learn the H&P course during MS1/MS2, which is usually 0.5 days/wk. This course is more about learning mechanics of the H&P than clinical reasoning. This is about the level of clinical experience that one can handle is MS1/MS2 without having finished all the preclinical coursework because you're pretty useless if you don't have knowledge about all the body systems and how they interact. It is really not terribly beneficial as an MS1 to be asked what the differential of X is when you've had zero organ system courses.

 

[Keladry]

Downstate does. Pretty sure a whole bunch of schools (most?) do some sort of clinical exposure (learning to take histories & do physicals) in the first two years, no?

 

[Tots]

Just about every school?

 

[SouthernSurgeon]

Quoting myself:

"Early clinical experiences" are awkwardly shoe-horned into the curriculum in such a way as to try and make them relevant, and in reality all they end up doing is being a time-sink for students who are stressed out studying for their next exam. So the human aspect of it which they should be appreciating ends up being an early introduction to the deprioritization/dehumanization of medicine.

Oh and it's also meaninglesss because every school has these opportunities, yet a select few brag about theirs as if it is a revolutionary concept that has totally changed their school for the better.

You'll spend your whole life working with patients. You'll get plenty of "real patient experience" in the clinical years, assuming they are done well.

...

In other words....a lot of pre-meds think something exactly along these lines:

"It might serve as a nice reminder about why I'm studying so hard, while helping to put what I'm learning in context."

Schools know this and prey on that line of thinking, even though anyone who has actually gone through the experience can tell you how trivial that ends up being.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/thr...what-do-you-value-most.1097324/#post-15666899

 

[Doug Underhill]

...and yet "early clinical experiences" are the most important thing for pre-meds to have, outside of GPA and MCAT.

 

[Goro]

Yup...we learned this the hard way ourselves.

Quoting myself:

"Early clinical experiences" are awkwardly shoe-horned into the curriculum in such a way as to try and make them relevant, and in reality all they end up doing is being a time-sink for students who are stressed out studying for their next exam. So the human aspect of it which they should be appreciating ends up being an early introduction to the deprioritization/dehumanization of medicine.

Oh and it's also meaninglesss because every school has these opportunities, yet a select few brag about theirs as if it is a revolutionary concept that has totally changed their school for the better.

You'll spend your whole life working with patients. You'll get plenty of "real patient experience" in the clinical years, assuming they are done well.

...

In other words....a lot of pre-meds think something exactly along these lines:

"It might serve as a nice reminder about why I'm studying so hard, while helping to put what I'm learning in context."

Schools know this and prey on that line of thinking, even though anyone who has actually gone through the experience can tell you how trivial that ends up being.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/thr...what-do-you-value-most.1097324/#post-15666899

 

[milk1993]

University of Iowa just revamped the curriculum to include some clinical experience throughout the first two years. Another part of the revamp was to shorten the length of the classroom period. Clinical rotations begin in January of MS2 with this new curriculum, and step 1 is taken around christmas during MS3 after a year of being in the hospital.

But like others have mentioned, I agree that the sprinkling of clinical experience while still studying for exams and such is probably not really all that beneficial especially without a solid base of medical knowledge. I am excited about starting clinical rotations a semester early, but I'd prefer to forgo the clinical experience until then so I can just focus on learning the material...

 

[pageantry]

Yup...we learned this the hard way ourselves.

Along those lines, then, and referencing my other post in the DO forum, what's your opinion about the OMM courses throughout MS1/2? It seems like there's plenty of resentment over there...

 

[Goro]

I think having only a single year of OMM is merely giving lip service to the profession.

 

[cbrons]

Just about every school?

But be careful about which school is advertising these "Early clinical experiences." There are some schools where these are simply pre-med style shadowing (but with a fancy white lab coat) which is a complete waste of time for medical students.

And I am pretty sure every LCME accredited school has to have clinical instruction on physical exam skills before 3rd year. Now the quality of this instruction will probably vary widely between institutions.