amalgamgrillz

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Hi everyone,

I was wondering if anyone knows if NOT reporting your race is looked down upon? This recent article stirred up some thoughts I've always had about this issue. I don't want to be stereotyped as socially-inept or be expected to have a 4.0 GPA (if i'm competing for a spot within the Asian quota). If it works against me in ANY way, I will gladly just not report my race. I'm not ashamed of my ethnicity, I just want to play the game intelligently, by leveling the playing field any way I can. Thanks for your feedback.

http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/11/10/too-asian/
 
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peanutb123

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Hi everyone,

I was wondering if anyone knows if NOT reporting your race is looked down upon? This recent article stirred up some thoughts I've always had about this issue. I don't want to be stereotyped as socially-inept or be expected to have a 4.0 GPA (if i'm competing for a spot within the Asian quota). If it works against me in ANY way, I will gladly just not report my race. I'm not ashamed of my ethnicity, I just want to play the game intelligently, by leveling the playing field any way I can. Thanks for your feedback.

http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/11/10/too-asian/

whites have ~.50
Asians have ~.25
Minorities have ~.85 to .9

from the Adea book. for last 2 cycles.

Not sure about how quotas work or how they are calculated... Also i would assume only the people who have no advantage over reporting their ethnicity tend to leave out. b/c if something is going to help you in a + way, why wouldnt your list it...
 
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I may be wrong but I don't think it will hurt you if you don't report your race. But sometimes I wonder... does reporting race even matter if they can tell that you're Asian from your last name? Even if I didn't indicate race, anyone looking at my last name could figure out my race. But I can only guess if/how that is considered in admissions...

Racial quotas are stupid, as are all other quotas.
They may be stupid but that doesn't mean they aren't used. In case they are used, the OP just wants to make sure that it doesn't hurt his chances.
 

DividedByZero

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does reporting race even matter if they can tell that you're Asian from your last name? Even if I didn't indicate race, anyone looking at my last name could figure out my race.
Exactly, just report it. It really doesn't matter because if the school does have a racial quota they are going to fill it one way or another. Like it or not, you WILL be stereotyped - not reporting it won't help anything. C'mon OP, what are you gonna do if you get an interview? Wear a ski mask? Give me a break.
 
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amalgamgrillz

amalgamgrillz

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Exactly, just report it. It really doesn't matter because if the school does have a racial quota they are going to fill it one way or another. Like it or not, you WILL be stereotyped - not reporting it won't help anything. C'mon OP, what are you gonna do if you get an interview? Wear a ski mask? Give me a break.
I'm filipino, so my last name is actually extremely Spanish. If I do get the interview, I'm pretty confident I will no longer be stereotyped as the socially-inept, non-English speaking, anti-social Asian. But if you're implying that not reporting my race will help me avoid any stereotypes (PRE-INTERVIEW), then I'll definitely take my chances! Thanks
 
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eringer

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I don't know about you guys, but at the majority of my interviews, I was in a group with a majority of asians. Personally, I think that being of a minority race would help you in almost every situation. Looking at the class breakdown for most dental schools, it looks like asians make up a large portion of every class. To the OP...I would put it on my application.
 

namiie

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I'm filipino, so my last name is actually extremely Spanish. If I do get the interview, I'm pretty confident I will no longer be stereotyped as the socially-inept, non-English speaking, anti-social Asian. But if you're implying that not reporting my race will help me avoid any stereotypes (PRE-INTERVIEW), then I'll definitely take my chances! Thanks
Some schools actually delineate between Asian and Pacific Islander, and might consider Filipino to be Pacific Islander, not Asian.

But I agree with most of the responses so far: just put it on your application.

But re: "stereotyped as the socially-inept, non-English speaking, anti-social Asian." Is this even a true stereotype anymore? Maybe 10-15 years ago....especially the "non-English speaking" part.
 

qkchen

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i'm asian went to U of T and i think (hope) i turned out ok... right!?! :-S

hope i don't have to move back up north :p
 
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yappy

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I've often wondered about the Asian stereotype too... most of the time, in my classes, they're not the best students and they dont have the worst social skills (unless they struggle with english - in which case it's just a language barrier).
Most are at least second generation or greater and no longer resemble the stereotype of their culture- I think schools should not worry so much about race.
 

sfrice80

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Trust me, if you are Asian and you didn't get in, I can guarantee it was because of your GPA, DAT, EC's, etc. Not because you are Asian. Let's be honest, if your biggest concern is checking the Asian box on AADSAS, you shouldn't be worried!
 

grx20718

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I don't know about you guys, but at the majority of my interviews, I was in a group with a majority of asians. Personally, I think that being of a minority race would help you in almost every situation. Looking at the class breakdown for most dental schools, it looks like asians make up a large portion of every class. To the OP...I would put it on my application.
I kind of find that weird.
There are around 50% white applicants, 30% asians applicants. Every year 50% whites get accepted, 30% asians are accepted. So, it seems race or stereotype would not matter.
But, if the majority of interviewees are asian, there should be more acceptances for asian. However, they will not make more than 50% of the incoming classes of certain schools with the most asian acceptances. I wonder if they have statistics for acceptances per interviewes according to race and gender.

To OP, if you have great stats, you should not worry at all. But in some cases, one of my friend has very asian name with 3.2 GPA and 21 DAT. He got no interviews with applying to over 20 schools. Maybe they do have certain quotas?
I dare believe white males will compete against white males. White females will compete against white females. Asian males compete against asian males and such.

Am I in trouble? :eek:
 
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But re: "stereotyped as the socially-inept, non-English speaking, anti-social Asian." Is this even a true stereotype anymore? Maybe 10-15 years ago....especially the "non-English speaking" part.
I definitely agree with this. This stereotype is SO old and no one really thinks this anymore. Most schools have some/a lot of asians in their current classes and they should see that they aren't anti-social/socially-inept. I don't think schools will be that stupid and ignorant to see an asian name and assume that person can't talk.

Also, dentistry is a field where you have to be a people person and a good communicator. Admissions people know that probably most of the applicants (asian or not asian) like to talk to people, otherwise why would they want to be a dentist?
 
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amalgamgrillz

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hahahaha

...and I agree, what a pointless thread
Well, with your average stats and multiple application cycles, I'm surprised you haven't been wondering the same thing. I personally think this is a pertinent issue regarding increasing chances of at least getting an interview. If you were black and had those stats/extra-curriculars, you'd get in no problem. Many white people have similar stats and they're getting In (or at least interviews). I have NEVER seen an Asian with a 3.2 get in. I don't think you can call that coincidence. Perhaps because you're "Asian" with those stats, maybe that's why you haven't been getting in.

Deny it all you want - this is still a numbers game in terms of GPA, DAT, and quotas (sex, degree disciplines, ethnicities). I just want to help my chances any way I can.
 
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Well, with your average stats and multiple application cycles, I'm surprised you haven't been wondering the same thing. I personally think this is a pertinent issue regarding increasing chances of at least getting an interview. If you were black and had those stats/extra-curriculars, you'd get in no problem. Many white people have similar stats and they're getting In (or at least interviews). I have NEVER seen an Asian with a 3.2 get in. I don't think you can call that coincidence. Perhaps because you're "Asian" with those stats, maybe that's why you haven't been getting in.

Deny it all you want - this is still a numbers game in terms of GPA, DAT, and quotas (sex, degree disciplines, ethnicities). I just want to help my chances any way I can.
You are missing the most important rule to life: LIFE IS UNFAIR!
And Rubber Dam Man is mature enough to accept LIFE. And stop blabbing, you are Phillipino, you don't got it the worst when it comes to admission process FYI! Please do more research in to WHY there is Affirmative Action and also understand the dynamic of dentistry before you start something like this.

You can try and do whatever you want, admissions is a game, but play it smart, not listing your ethnicity is a stupid move because you MUST have an interview (except for Creighton). What are you going to do for interview? paint your face? wear a mask? GOOD LUCK
 

Rubber Dam Man

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Well, with your average stats and multiple application cycles, I'm surprised you haven't been wondering the same thing. I personally think this is a pertinent issue regarding increasing chances of at least getting an interview. If you were black and had those stats/extra-curriculars, you'd get in no problem. Many white people have similar stats and they're getting In (or at least interviews). I have NEVER seen an Asian with a 3.2 get in. I don't think you can call that coincidence. Perhaps because you're "Asian" with those stats, maybe that's why you haven't been getting in.

Deny it all you want - this is still a numbers game in terms of GPA, DAT, and quotas (sex, degree disciplines, ethnicities). I just want to help my chances any way I can.
are you serious? I not once in 5 years thought about my race as being the reason I have not been accepted. Obviously, a 3.0 science GPA out of undergrad will never make the cut into dental school especially with just average DAT scores. Yes, someone who is considered a "minority" (ie. african-americans, hispanics, etc.) might have been be able to gain acceptance with my stats on their first application attempt (back in Fall 06), however I'm not going to sit and complain about it. There are reasons for why many schools have quotas for minority individuals... many of these students are exceptional students, show great leadership ability, have the most wonderful personalities, but faced serious setbacks (ie. life experiences) which hampered and impeded on their ability to prove their academic prowess. Minorities face an uphill battle and that's a fact. Yes, I'm a minority... but not when it comes to professional school and therefore, I will never be upset or question why I did not get in with my stats in prior cycles solely on the basis of my race. I have struggled and paid the price for certain things in my life that did not allow me to focus on my undergraduate education... I consider myself to be an intelligent individual, but I was not able to translate that into "stats" due to my extraordinary life experiences. However, I still take full responsibility for not being able to do exactly that. Having said that, I am not going to sit and make excuses and hope to be let in with BELOW-AVG stats based on my minority status in the real-world. I want to be accepted based on my accomplishments and how I have picked myself back up when my life turned upside down. I have completed a Master's Degree and worked my butt off for everything I have earned and honestly... I'm glad I had to go this route because I will appreciate and be proud of what I, MYSELF, have accomplished without any "connections" or simply based on factors outside of my GPA, DAT, dental-related work experience, etc.

Life is NOT fair... the sooner people begin to accept that and take responsibility for their own actions, the better off these people will be. I recommend not worrying about others as everyone has their own life experiences. You want to apply to professional school - accept the circumstances surrounding the admissions process... understand your own weak areas and sorry, your race doesn't count.
 
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amalgamgrillz

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You are missing the most important rule to life: LIFE IS UNFAIR!
And Rubber Dam Man is mature enough to accept LIFE. And stop blabbing, you are Phillipino, you don't got it the worst when it comes to admission process FYI! Please do more research in to WHY there is Affirmative Action and also understand the dynamic of dentistry before you start something like this.
I'm not sure what you're implying, but if you're suggesting that Filipinos haven't had to escape war-torn areas (not just pretty turf wars between Bloods and Crips - I mean REAL war), face extreme poverty (not just foods stamps in the ghetto), endure slavery, be subjected to racism, then you're sadly mistaken and need to brush up on which cultures also deserve Affirmative Action (if you even agree that this ideology should even exist in the first place). Again, about the mask in the interview comment - I'm not hiding my race, I just don't want to get weeded out if I don't make the intial cutoff for Asians (if that exists).

Rubber Dam Man said:
I want to be accepted based on my accomplishments and how I have picked myself back up when my life turned upside down.
Exactly. I'd like to be accepted based on my accomplishments, too. Which is why I'm wondering if not reporting my race will affect my application. I don't think anyone should be admitted or rejected based on race. I agree that race has nothing to do with your accomplishments or failures. I don't care what socioeconomic class you grew up in or what part of the ghetto you grew up in - I started off at the bottom, and I'd say I've done very well for myself. I'm not using my race as an excuse at all..I'm just trying to avoid any unfair prejudices that might exist pre-application. I'm almost sure we're agreeing on the same thing, so, I don't know why you're getting bent out of shape about my thread.

Rubber Dam Man said:
understand your own weak areas and sorry, your race doesn't count.
I do understand my weakness: my GPA. I am working hard to improve that, but I'd just like to know if it would be more advantageous to not report my race, because according to the statistics and other feedback, race does play a role. I'd like to be judged on my character/application, but apparently race does count. Thanks for your advice, anyway.
 
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Maygyver

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Just curious, what are your stats? Maybe we can help you find a way to improve other than spending all of your time hating on other people.
 
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amalgamgrillz

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Just curious, what are your stats? Maybe we can help you find a way to improve other than spending all of your time hating on other people.
If I came off as hateful, then I need to do some editing, because the only hatred I have is to any school that accepts/rejects applicants based on anything besides merit. Lol, despite the passive-aggressive undertone, I actually appreciate your help. But, I have a feeling I know what you're going to advise: go back, take more science classes, and pull up your GPA and DAT to a 20+, because your scores are keeping you out, NOT your race. As big of an a**hole as I might come off on SDN, I'm humble and less obnoxious in my personal statement.

I'm an Asian male. Honors biology degree from Tier 1 University.
GPA:
undergrad cGPA: 3.19
undergrad sGPA: 2.91
undergraduate non-science GPA: 3.8
last two years of undergrad GPA: 3.82
graduate GPA (MSc. biological sciences): 4.0
overall cGPA: 3.32
overall sGPA: 3.20

DAT:
bio: 19
chem: 20
reading: 19
PAT: 21
carving: 29
TS: 19
AA: 19

Extra Curriculars:
~2000 hours general dentistry (100 volunteer, 1900 paid)
~3000 hours orthodontics (paid)
~100 hours research experience (no publication)
2 week dental mission trip (volunteer)
Pre-dental society president (+other executive positions)
Alpha Epsilon Delta Honors society
English Assistance mentor
Several leadership awards
Varsity Athlete
Graduate Teaching Assistant
Resident Advisor (+ other campus leadership positions)

2009-2010 Cycle:
14 applications, 14 rejections, 0 interviews
 

qkchen

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man, this thread is getting a little bit tense for such a trivial topic. if it helps comfort anybody, i think this article was written for undergrad admissions and does not pertain so much or directly to professional schools, i think :oops:

but reading that article totally reminded me of a time back in the days when i was on the U of T cheerleading team. man, i remember our first game against those Western Mustang (party) kids. not only did they massacre our Varsity Blues football team 89 to 8, but their cheerleading team also creamed us made a total mockery of us. this guy one did a roundoff back handspring followed by 3 consecutive backflips and finished up with a tumbling maneuver right in our faces. while using this cell phone. yup, gotta love that cockiness :D

anyways, i should have known something was up when we were being taught about 5 defensive cheers for every 1 offensive cheer. on top of that, this is also what happens when you gotta maintain a 3.5 GPA to play on any sports teams at U of T :thumbdown:

lesson to be learned for all you young folks out there: eat, sleep, study and party - live a balanced life :thumbup:
 

AmpedUp

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Why would you not accept your ethnicity in a silly application checkbox? Just check "Asian" and call it a day. What happened to pride? Don't be too naive and think schools choose someone based on their ethnicity. THIS, I can assure you, is not the truth. Excuse my harsh nature of this comment, but people should really have common sense when it comes to issues such as this. Fact is, you're Asian and cannot change ANYTHING about who you are. Love dentistry with all your heart and nothing can go wrong, right? Mark it, close your eyes, and see where life takes you - I'm sure it'll be a pleasant ride. Good day!
 

Maygyver

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One thing I notice is that you took the Canadian DAT. I would retake (I know you probably don't want to) the American version of the DAT. I'm not sure how much taking more science classes would help, although it wouldn't hurt if you did well, but your master's GPA should suffice for that category.

Also, are you an international student? That is another possibility for why you are getting rejected.

Honestly, I think the first thing you should do is take the American DAT and shoot for a 21+. Just having an American DAT score might get you interviews. Hopefully this is somewhat helpful.
 
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man, this thread is getting a little bit tense for such a trivial topic. if it helps comfort anybody, i think this article was written for undergrad admissions and does not pertain so much or directly to professional schools, i think :oops:

but reading that article totally reminded me of a time back in the days when i was on the U of T cheerleading team. man, i remember our first game against those Western Mustang (party) kids. not only did they massacre our Varsity Blues football team 89 to 8, but their cheerleading team also creamed us made a total mockery of us. this guy one did a roundoff back handspring followed by 3 consecutive backflips and finished up with a tumbling maneuver right in our faces. while using this cell phone. yup, gotta love that cockiness :D

anyways, i should have known something was up when we were being taught about 5 defensive cheers for every 1 offensive cheer. on top of that, this is also what happens when you gotta maintain a 3.5 GPA to play on any sports teams at U of T :thumbdown:

lesson to be learned for all you young folks out there: eat, sleep, study and party - live a balanced life :thumbup:
I don't know when or which U of T you went to... But you said Varsity blues... that's University of Toronto... I can tell you there's no 3.5rule... a 3.5 at UofT is no joke bro... most nerds don't even get higher than 3.5... I don't know a single Varsity athelete who has a 3.5, my buddy was praised for his 3.2 (which is graduation with distinction)
 

aelian

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I know I'm a few hours late but Asians duking it out. :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:
Everyone was Kung Fu fighting
those cats were fast as lightening
I know, I'm contributing absolutely nothing to this conversation, except maybe a little racism, but OP, your dental experience is gorgeous and congrats on your grad success. The biggest thing holding you back is definitely your DAT. Your grad grades are good but I think knocking your DAT out of the park would have a bigger impact. Just put a little time in. I'm pretty sure you have improved your science knowledge drastically by now. And, heck, I'm pretty sure you can get a 30 on your quantitative section, easy, because, you know, I hear you people are pretty good at math. /starts running for his life/
Keep your head up partner. I've gotten a couple of interviews in the last couple of weeks and my stats suck...and I'm kinda Asian, sort of.
 

aelian

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How are you kinda Asian? Are you good at math? Lol
Well, see, that is tricky. My parents are Palestinian but there is no such thing as Palestine which is beside the point. So, I descend from people who descend from the country of Israel and Egypt, which are in Asia and Africa, respectively, but we're not really considered Asian nor African but caucasian which includes Middle Easterners and North Africans. I look kinda Mexican and Black which increases my success with Mexican/Black chicks by .43 percent but not really Arab chicks because they're prudes...or because my chick-getting skills suck. So yeah, circling the Caucasian box on my application feels wrong because I want to go down the list and check them all. And I watched Pocahontas enough times to qualify as Native American. So, yeah, excuse my super long explanation as to why I'm kinda Asian...and no, I'm terrible at math. I am however good with chopsticks. [sees a 3 year old Chinese baby eating with chopsticks on tv...no longer feels special]
 
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aelian

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Hahaha. This makes me incredibly happy. It's like my mom coming home with some Pilsbury Toaster Strudels instead of those stale store brand pop tarts. Don't get me wrong, I'll eat them up, but I can't write my name with frosting on those suckers or draw Spider-Man on them. Spreadable F'ing Frosting, man.
 

txlonghorn

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You being African + Asian = 0, as the added benefits of being African on your application cancel out with you also being Asian. I guess that makes you white then, as they are not given preference nor is it held against them. Man, we are so tip toeing on a fine line here.lol
 

aelian

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You being African + Asian = 0, as the added benefits of being African on your application cancel out with you also being Asian. I guess that makes you white then, as they are not given preference nor is it held against them. Man, we are so tip toeing on a fine line here.lol
Hahaha. :laugh: Your math is rather irrefutable. You wouldn't happen to be Asian now, would you? :D My friend, I think we crossed the line a while back.
 

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To OP, if you have great stats, you should not worry at all. But in some cases, one of my friend has very asian name with 3.2 GPA and 21 DAT. He got no interviews with applying to over 20 schools. Maybe they do have certain quotas?
I think your buddy with a 21 on his DAT had some huge flaw on his application. Maybe he got a D in a Pre-Req class judging by his low GPA. 21 is very competitive and if your applying to over 20 schools your definitely getting AT LEAST a couple interviews, I don't think his race or name had anything to do with him not getting any interviews.
 

jj007

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That is why dental schools have interviews. They want people who can communicate or relate to other people regardless of their race.

To the person who made the statement that asian people are anti-social, that is quite an ignorant statement to make. It's even more surprising that it is coming from someone of Asian ethnicity.

I would worry less about being Asian and more about having a 2.9 sGPA and a 19AA/TS. With those stats and being an international student (Canada), your chance of getting into a US institution is low, but it seems that you already knew that.


I definitely agree with this. This stereotype is SO old and no one really thinks this anymore. Most schools have some/a lot of asians in their current classes and they should see that they aren't anti-social/socially-inept. I don't think schools will be that stupid and ignorant to see an asian name and assume that person can't talk.

Also, dentistry is a field where you have to be a people person and a good communicator. Admissions people know that probably most of the applicants (asian or not asian) like to talk to people, otherwise why would they want to be a dentist?
 
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grx20718

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I think your buddy with a 21 on his DAT had some huge flaw on his application. Maybe he got a D in a Pre-Req class judging by his low GPA. 21 is very competitive and if your applying to over 20 schools your definitely getting AT LEAST a couple interviews, I don't think his race or name had anything to do with him not getting any interviews.

I know I find it very wierd. You made me research a bit. I have too much free time till December 1st.

From what I know, he started out as 2.9 GPA out of undergrads. Through 2 years of postbac programs, he got it up to 3.2 which means he has been getting close to 3.8. So, even if he got a D in pre-req, that happened 4 to 5 years ago and he probably retook them during his postbacs. ADCOM will be able to know he is academically qualified.

Predents.com is only a small reflection of the whole applicants. According to predents.com, no asian male under 3.2 GPA and 21 DAT got accepted last cycle. Honestly, no one even received an interview. Meanwhile, whites with similar stats were able to gain acceptances and multiple interviews. Just looking at predents.com which may not be reliable but the only source that can differentiate students under different categories such as DAT, GPA, ethnicity and gender, I can only believe there is a certain quota for gender and ethinicity. And I dare say it is more competitive for asian males.
But again, predents.com reflects only a small portion of the applicant and there is no way of knowing.

To OP, with my hypothesis and your stats, you may get more interviews by leaving the ethnicity blank. But, when you interview, they will know you are an asian anyways. Also, ADCOM from each dental school knows asians are not anti-social. They have seen outstanding applicants through out their interview processes. I understand that you are worried. But honestly, there is nothing you can really do. Just get more EC's and keep earning your A's before you apply. Also, ace American DAT. Be an applicant that ADCOM will really want simply by looking at your stats. Obviously, they want someone who stand out. I have 23 AA, 24 TS and 24 PAT. I only got 3 interviews out of 8 schools I applied. With only 3 interviews, I feel insecure that I will be the only one with 99 percentile DAT with no acceptance. This is really getting competitive. Quota will play only a small factor. Maybe it can help for the last few spots. But, would you not be much happier if you get right in on December 1st. Keep getting your stats up before worrying about checking ethnicity box! (I know you did not want to hear that. But before complaining about ethnicity, you will need 3.5+ GPA, 22+ DAT and rejections to complain about the racism.Then, I will support you to max!)
I hope this helps to clear up your mind.
 
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amalgamgrillz

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To OP, with my hypothesis and your stats, you may get more interviews by leaving the ethnicity blank. But, when you interview, they will know you are an asian anyways. Also, ADCOM from each dental school knows asians are not anti-social. They have seen outstanding applicants through out their interview processes. I understand that you are worried. But honestly, there is nothing you can really do. Just get more EC's and keep earning your A's before you apply. Also, ace American DAT. Be an applicant that ADCOM will really want simply by looking at your stats. Obviously, they want someone who stand out. I have 23 AA, 24 TS and 24 PAT. I only got 3 interviews out of 8 schools I applied. With only 3 interviews, I feel insecure that I will be the only one with 99 percentile DAT with no acceptance. This is really getting competitive. Quota will play only a small factor. Maybe it can help for the last few spots. But, would you not be much happier if you get right in on December 1st. Keep getting your stats up before worrying about checking ethnicity box! (I know you did not want to hear that. But before complaining about ethnicity, you will need 3.5+ GPA, 22+ DAT and rejections to complain about the racism.Then, I will support you to max!)
I hope this helps to clear up your mind.
Thanks for your advice/help, I really appreciate it. I don't know what I said to make people think I'm feeling as if I'm getting rejected based on my race solely. That's not the case at all. I'm absolutely sure my rejections are because of my low stats - I don't know why people think I believe otherwise.....? lol

I've gotten my scores up (and will try to increase my DAT scores), so that's why I wondered: for this upcoming cycle, will it lessen my chances of getting an interview by not reporting my race. It's obviously going to be ANOTHER strike against me (in addition to my low GPA) if there is a quota/ if I'm going to be competing against other Asians. That's all I wanted to know. I'm not trying to hide my race - I know they can tell when/if I get an interview -- that is not my intention. It would be great if I could be judged solely on merit, and if it's not (if race does play any factor whatsoever), then I'm going to play this game intelligently. I just want to maximize my chances of GETTING an interview; so, if that means no reporting my race, then I definitely won't do it.
 
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grx20718

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Feb 21, 2009
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Thanks for your advice/help, I really appreciate it. I don't know what I said to make people think I'm feeling as if I'm getting rejected based on my race solely. That's not the case at all. I'm absolutely sure my rejections are because of my low stats - I don't know why people think I believe otherwise.....? lol

I've gotten my scores up (and will try to increase my DAT scores), so that's why I wondered: for this upcoming cycle, will it lessen my chances of getting an interview by not reporting my race. It's obviously going to be ANOTHER strike against me (in addition to my low GPA) if there is a quota/ if I'm going to be competing against other Asians. That's all I wanted to know. I'm not trying to hide my race - I know they can tell when/if I get an interview -- that is not my intention. It would be great if I could be judged solely on merit, and if it's not (if race does play any factor whatsoever), then I'm going to play this game intelligently. I just want to maximize my chances of GETTING an interview; so, if that means no reporting my race, then I definitely won't do it.
I honestly do not know for sure whether quota really exists or not. I tend to side that race does play a role in dental admission though with the small portion of the data i could get. There is no reliable data I can find. I really wish to see average applicant GPA and DAT for all different ethnicities and two genders. Also, average GPA and DAT of enrollees, according to their ethnicities and genders. This can really shut down the debate. But, it has never been released. Makes me more curious! lol. I guess it is up to you. If you feel suspicious about quota, just do not check the box. I think that is a reason why they give you an option whether to check it or not.

BTW, aren't you kind of late in applying right now?
 
OP
amalgamgrillz

amalgamgrillz

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I honestly do not know for sure whether quota really exists or not. I tend to side that race does play a role in dental admission though with the small portion of the data i could get. There is no reliable data I can find. I really wish to see average applicant GPA and DAT for all different ethnicities and two genders. Also, average GPA and DAT of enrollees, according to their ethnicities and genders. This can really shut down the debate. But, it has never been released. Makes me more curious! lol. I guess it is up to you. If you feel suspicious about quota, just do not check the box. I think that is a reason why they give you an option whether to check it or not.

BTW, aren't you kind of late in applying right now?
Haha yeah, if they published this information, people might start asking unwanted questions. Thanks again for your advice.

I'm not applying until the next cycle.
 

grx20718

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Feb 21, 2009
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Haha yeah, if they published this information, people might start asking unwanted questions. Thanks again for your advice.

I'm not applying until the next cycle.

O ok. You still have 6 more month to boost your stats up!! Even 0.1 GPA can be huge! Good Luck!
 

txlonghorn

5+ Year Member
Jun 29, 2009
688
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Reppin Asia! What up! lol

Same - 99.7 percentile AA and 99.9% TS with a 3.8 GPA with only 2 interviews out of 7 places I applied to. I know my personal statements was good, LORs, and I have like 1600+ hours of community service in a leadership position. However, I doubt that my race is affecting me getting interviews. I took my DAT late and I am worried one of my profs might have made a dumb mistake of writing medical school or something. lol. I don't think that happened, but that is what I keep telling myself for not getting interviews.lol
 

herkulease

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Jan 23, 2009
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the ADEA guide has some data that interesting. the DAT manual has interesting stats too.

you can read it here
http://www.ada.org/sections/educationAndCareers/pdfs/dat_users_manual.pdf

Breaks down have gender and race for all test takes. Asians on average have a higher score in all categories but reading comp.

other data that is interesting but has nothing to do with race.

By 2004, the number test takers nearly double that of 1999.

from the ADEA guide. DAT range for enrolled students(I presume for 2009)

AA range was 13-27 (mean of 19),
PAT 12-30(mean of 19,
TS 13-28(mean of 19.19)

Science GPA
range of 2.2-4.25(mean of 3.46)

total GPA
2.2-4.25(mean of 3.54)

I seriously wonder if the 12 and 13s are a joke some school is playing.
 

grx20718

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Feb 21, 2009
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Reppin Asia! What up! lol

Same - 99.7 percentile AA and 99.9% TS with a 3.8 GPA with only 2 interviews out of 7 places I applied to. I know my personal statements was good, LORs, and I have like 1600+ hours of community service in a leadership position. However, I doubt that my race is affecting me getting interviews. I took my DAT late and I am worried one of my profs might have made a dumb mistake of writing medical school or something. lol. I don't think that happened, but that is what I keep telling myself for not getting interviews.lol
When did you take DAT?
There is no way only 2 schools decided to interview you. Probably your dat was in really late or you only applied to such schools like Harvard, UPenn, and other super competitive state schools. I only applied to private schools. =)

Well, this leads to another debate. Overly qualified applicants with no interviews because dental schools think they will not attend. Your stats are amazing and I agree with you that your race has nothing to do with it.
Pretty sure you will hear more for interviews. But, after getting into your top choice in two weeks, you will withdraw anyways!
 

grx20718

10+ Year Member
Feb 21, 2009
125
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Pre-Dental
the ADEA guide has some data that interesting. the DAT manual has interesting stats too.

you can read it here
http://www.ada.org/sections/educationAndCareers/pdfs/dat_users_manual.pdf

Breaks down have gender and race for all test takes. Asians on average have a higher score in all categories but reading comp.

other data that is interesting but has nothing to do with race.

By 2004, the number test takers nearly double that of 1999.

from the ADEA guide. DAT range for enrolled students(I presume for 2009)

AA range was 13-27 (mean of 19),
PAT 12-30(mean of 19,
TS 13-28(mean of 19.19)

Science GPA
range of 2.2-4.25(mean of 3.46)

total GPA
2.2-4.25(mean of 3.54)

I seriously wonder if the 12 and 13s are a joke some school is playing.

Yea, I have seen that. Do you happen to know how the percentages work out? For instance, on TS section, it is 12.3% for asian with 20 TS . I understand total %. 9.2% of total means 9.2% from the whole 13000 takers which equals 1200. So, i though i would get 12.3% of 1200 to see how many asians got 20 AA. But, that is totally wrong because when I add all the percentages for 20 AA it does not add up to 100%. Does anyone know how to read the chart?
 

rickblas

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Sep 29, 2008
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Hi everyone,

I was wondering if anyone knows if NOT reporting your race is looked down upon? This recent article stirred up some thoughts I've always had about this issue. I don't want to be stereotyped as socially-inept or be expected to have a 4.0 GPA (if i'm competing for a spot within the Asian quota). If it works against me in ANY way, I will gladly just not report my race. I'm not ashamed of my ethnicity, I just want to play the game intelligently, by leveling the playing field any way I can. Thanks for your feedback.

http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/11/10/too-asian/
I'm filipino too (half) but my father is italian/portugease/mix w/ some brazilian relatives....and I myself usually pass as latino by looks at least although I always considered myself half white/asian and not half latino/asian. Pssssssh i should have circled latino on my application though, I swear I would've got more interviews :rolleyes:, but I'm not complaining. However, I think it would be foolish to not fill in your race at all.
 

txlonghorn

5+ Year Member
Jun 29, 2009
688
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When did you take DAT?
There is no way only 2 schools decided to interview you. Probably your dat was in really late or you only applied to such schools like Harvard, UPenn, and other super competitive state schools. I only applied to private schools. =)

Well, this leads to another debate. Overly qualified applicants with no interviews because dental schools think they will not attend. Your stats are amazing and I agree with you that your race has nothing to do with it.
Pretty sure you will hear more for interviews. But, after getting into your top choice in two weeks, you will withdraw anyways!
I applied to Harvard, Columbia, UConn, USC, and UoP, other than my state schools (one of my state schools didn't interview me). Still, I think I should have heard from the other schools though. My DAT was done in late Aug, however, my app was in around July.
 

grx20718

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Feb 21, 2009
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I applied to Harvard, Columbia, UConn, USC, and UoP, other than my state schools (one of my state schools didn't interview me). Still, I think I should have heard from the other schools though. My DAT was done in late Aug, however, my app was in around July.
So, you are from Texas. Two interviews out of 3 state schools are really good. About other schools you applied to, I am not sure why you would not get an interview from Columbia and USC yet. I think it is because your DAT was a little late. Your DAT was done in late Aug, so it takes at least 3 weeks for AADSAS to receive it and another two weeks that AADSAS sends your DAT score to the schools. Basically your application was complete in mid-October. I don't really know how TMDSAS works though. IMO, Harvard, and UConn are super competitive schools as well as Columbia. Columbia seems to pick their interviewees according to DAT so you will get one. I believe they only had two or three rounds of interview invites. So, you will get your chances. USC receives a LOT of apps and they might not have gotten to yours yet. They only pick 1/3 of their classes Dec 1st anyways. Don't I make you feel way better? :D But, again, I am pretty sure you will withdraw once you get into your state school on Dec 1st. I believe you have 99% chances of getting in unless you really really bombed your interviews.
 
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I'm filipino too (half) but my father is italian/portugease/mix w/ some brazilian relatives....and I myself usually pass as latino by looks at least although I always considered myself half white/asian and not half latino/asian. Pssssssh i should have circled latino on my application though, I swear I would've got more interviews :rolleyes:, but I'm not complaining. However, I think it would be foolish to not fill in your race at all.

I'm of Spanish and Portuguese descent, and we're not latino, so you'd be wrong. Spaniards and Portuguese = white people; therefore, you are right. :thumbup:
 

Maygyver

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I know I find it very wierd. You made me research a bit. I have too much free time till December 1st.

From what I know, he started out as 2.9 GPA out of undergrads. Through 2 years of postbac programs, he got it up to 3.2 which means he has been getting close to 3.8. So, even if he got a D in pre-req, that happened 4 to 5 years ago and he probably retook them during his postbacs. ADCOM will be able to know he is academically qualified.
Honestly, a 2.9 is low. I'm sure adcoms are hesitant about picking an applicant who slacked off his/her undergraduate career over students who have shown dedication to their work.
 

herkulease

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Jan 23, 2009
898
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Yea, I have seen that. Do you happen to know how the percentages work out? For instance, on TS section, it is 12.3% for asian with 20 TS . I understand total %. 9.2% of total means 9.2% from the whole 13000 takers which equals 1200. So, i though i would get 12.3% of 1200 to see how many asians got 20 AA. But, that is totally wrong because when I add all the percentages for 20 AA it does not add up to 100%. Does anyone know how to read the chart?
I see your problem. You're apply the percentage for asians towards the overall.

they only tell you that 13.1% of all asian test takers had 20 TS. Same goes for all other ethnicity. At the very bottom it tells you how many test takers are white/asians/black etc and you can figure out from there the exact number of whites/asians/black etc for each.

So 13.1% of all asians test takes got 20TS, so only about 473 or so asians (depending on how they round numbers) scored had 20TS.

If you do the same for all ethnicity you'll come close to their total count of those with a 20.