Second Looks/Re-visits

[Saluki]

I know January is here, because I've started getting revisit invitations. I'm broke; I still need to cram for step 2; and I have to finish two last rotations between now and the match. Additionally, I don't really see the revisits affecting my decision making.

I'm a bit worried, though, about appearing uninterested. One of the programs said that if you were short on money or time, you could do a Skype or phone interview. So it seems even worse to say no to both, but I really have no questions. I'm sure there are things I don't know about the program, but there aren't any specific questions I didn't get answered on the interview day. And I can't think of anything someone could tell me on the phone that would affect my rank list.

How are other people handling this?

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[notdeadyet]

Don't bother with any second look unless you think there's something you'd get out of it.

If you have no questions, don't attend. If you have a couple specific questions (e.g.: amount of call in 3rd year, opportunities for international 4th year electives, etc.), email one of the many people who gave you their address. If you didn't get a feel for the place and want to look it over again, consider going.

Programs won't think you're uninterested just because they did their job well the first time and you left with a good understanding of what you are looking at.

 

[spinnerette]

I'm not planning to go on to any second look visits because of time and financial constraints. However, I am going to schedule a couple phone meetings with a couple attendings and PDs from the several programs I really love.

I didn't ask a couple questions during my interviews because I never thought about some of the opportunities prior to those interviews... so I do intend to call them and get a sense of what opportunities I would get at those programs (maybe the answers they give might change my rank list =P)

 

[psychphan]

I got that same (presumably) email about the Skype meeting. It's kind of an awkward situation in that I don't really have any other questions about the program but not taking the Skype interview seems like a rejection of the program. It is easy to say no to a live second visit, phone/Skype meetings are harder to come up with a good excuse to pass up on. That being said, I probably will not do it.


As far as other second visits I am going to one, because it's high on my list and I will be in the general area during their "Second Visit Weekend", and I may do one other second visit at one of my top choices. I don't particularly want to, but again I will be in the area and if I decide it will help my application I'll probably do it.

 

[Sneezing]

I just don't get the concept of second looks. Applicants have the night before for dinner, often times, and the whole next day for the interview. If you can't get all the info you will need personally to rank a program I can't help but wonder what the person was doing the whole time. Conversely, I don't understand why programs offer them in the first place. I just don't get it.

 

[peppy]

I just don't get the concept of second looks. Applicants have the night before for dinner, often times, and the whole next day for the interview. If you can't get all the info you will need personally to rank a program I can't help but wonder what the person was doing the whole time. Conversely, I don't understand why programs offer them in the first place. I just don't get it.

Yeah, I agree that the interview day should be structured in a way that both the applicant and the interviewers have a good feel for what the other one is like without having to do all this extra nonsense. We're all busy people and have other things to do than try to play some kind of arms race between "Showing Interest" vs. "Transparency / Candidate Vetting".

Honestly, I think talking about the program with your mentors at med school and talking to people here on SDN is a better way to learn about programs than just seeing what they want you to see by visiting the program. I've had visiting applicants stop by and talk to me at my program. When visiting applicants talk to us residents, believe me, we put on a happy face and focus on how much we love it here regardless of how we really feel. Nobody wants to get in trouble for complaining to applicants.

I went to one program where they had turned the interview into basically a three day event: a pre-interview dinner (that faculty attended, and it was implied it was NOT optional to attend), the full interview day , and then on interview day there was talk of a post-interview breakfast the morning after with residents. I think they did say that they would let us come back for second looks too.
I was annoyed by that. The majority of applicants are on tight schedules during interview season and I don't think it's very nice to make people feel like if they don't spend all this time hanging out at the program that it will look bad. It's not like most of us go on interviews on a whim. It's a lot of money and effort to attend an interview in most cases, and it is really annoying when there is pressure to go to even further lengths to prove you're really, REALLY serious.

 

[digitlnoize]

I'm going back to one place for a second look, mostly because it's very, very high on our list, and so my wife and daughter can check out the area, since none of us had ever been there until I went for my interview.

Really, I'm not going for the program so much, although I'm looking forward to checking out a facility we didn't get to see on the tour the first time around. I'm also going to shadow on the unit for half a day or so, so I can see what the workflow is like.

We're really just going to sightsee and get a feel for what it might be like to live there, check out neighborhoods, etc.

Probably wouldn't have bothered if I didn't have enough frequent flyer miles to cover the trip. I just booked 2 tickets (I'll be driving due to other interviews out that way) for points + $10.

We've toyed with the idea of doing a weekend away to check out the more regional cities closer to us (not to do actual second looks), just to check out the cities again, but we may not do this...we'll see.

 

[psychphan]

I just don't get the concept of second looks. Applicants have the night before for dinner, often times, and the whole next day for the interview. If you can't get all the info you will need personally to rank a program I can't help but wonder what the person was doing the whole time. Conversely, I don't understand why programs offer them in the first place. I just don't get it.

I think the latter is the more important question. Programs offer second looks, and I'd assume most ppl who take them do so because they believe it will help their application status (which it quite possibly does, even if it's only subconsciously).

 

[notdeadyet]

I just don't get the concept of second looks. Applicants have the night before for dinner, often times, and the whole next day for the interview. If you can't get all the info you will need personally to rank a program I can't help but wonder what the person was doing the whole time. Conversely, I don't understand why programs offer them in the first place. I just don't get it.

Programs offer second looks as a chance for anyone who couldn't get it together during the interview to come back for more to ask everything they need to. It's a last chance for programs to sell themselves to you. It's not so much a last chance for you to sell yourself to them, because you're not being interviewed and I don't know of any programs that have feedback mechanisms to affect your ranking.

I think the latter is the more important question. Programs offer second looks, and I'd assume most ppl who take them do so because they believe it will help their application status (which it quite possibly does, even if it's only subconsciously).

I wouldn't get my hopes up. I doubt it would affect your ranking in the slightest. Go if you need to go, but I definitely wouldn't make a special trip if you don't need to.

 

[billypilgrim37]

I'm going back to one place for a second look, mostly because it's very, very high on our list, and so my wife and daughter can check out the area, since none of us had ever been there until I went for my interview.

This is by far the best (maybe only good?) reason to do a second look. I took a second look at the program I ranked #1, but didn't really do it on purpose (as in, I didn't really think of it as a second look). I just wanted my wife to see the city, so I remember flying from Boston to the city where I'm at now and having my wife meet me there before we drove back down to the Confederate States for Christmas. I met with the PD for about 15 minutes, but mostly just to find out a few suggestions for things to do and just so my wife could see the building and stuff.

Whatever your reason for doing it, make sure it's YOUR reason and it's to help YOU make your decision.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

This is by far the best (maybe only good?) reason to do a second look. I took a second look at the program I ranked #1, but didn't really do it on purpose (as in, I didn't really think of it as a second look). I just wanted my wife to see the city, so I remember flying from Boston to the city where I'm at now and having my wife meet me there before we drove back down to the Confederate States for Christmas. I met with the PD for about 15 minutes, but mostly just to find out a few suggestions for things to do and just so my wife could see the building and stuff.

Whatever your reason for doing it, make sure it's YOUR reason and it's to help YOU make your decision.

Exactly. I don't think they really help at all, and the process is already so expensive that I wouldn't advocate spending extra money on it. But if you've got some lingering questions about a program or about a city (and having family check out the city definitely can fit in that picture) then they might make sense.

My one program perspective -- I saw a few people pop by for second looks last year. They all said they were ranking us #1, and none of them are here. And I think last year was maybe an average year in terms of recruiting here, so we didn't randomly place higher on our list than usual.

 

[Bartelby]

My one program perspective -- I saw a few people pop by for second looks last year. They all said they were ranking us #1, and none of them are here. And I think last year was maybe an average year in terms of recruiting here, so we didn't randomly place higher on our list than usual.

Just out of curiosity do you think that means your program did not rank them to match anyway or do you think the applicants lied and ranked another program higher?

I don't plan to do second looks. I have been on the road and spent enough money this year, and I tried my best to get a feel for programs as I went. I think letting family see the place or addressing some major nagging doubts about a potential top choice would be the only thing that could convince me to make the trip out.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

Just out of curiosity do you think that means your program did not rank them to match anyway or do you think the applicants lied and ranked another program higher?

I don't plan to do second looks. I have been on the road and spent enough money this year, and I tried my best to get a feel for programs as I went. I think letting family see the place or addressing some major nagging doubts about a potential top choice would be the only thing that could convince me to make the trip out.

The fact that they were doing a second look suggests to me we probably were their top pick. Doing multiple 2nd looks seems pretty extreme to me. I could be wrong, though. It's happened before.

There's a much cheaper way to let a program know they're your #1, though -- you can just send 'em a letter and save all that airfare and time.