Sellouts: Once Its Greatest Foes, Doctors Are Embracing Single-Payer

[Ligament]

Once Its Greatest Foes, Doctors Are Embracing Single-Payer

Once Its Greatest Foes, Doctors Are Embracing Single-Payer

Article is about socialist, lemming young physicians.

1. Medical schools have for years now selected incoming medical students who are lemmings, and easily influenced to accept government control of their education and lives
2. Medical schools have for years now programmed medical students towards "social justice" and socialized medicine. You think you'd get into medical school if you state on your application statement that you'd like to go into private practice and own your business? No way.
3. Medical schools have for years now fully neglected to educate medical students on the business of medicine, running a private practice, and purposely portrayed the only employment opportunities as corporate or government. Private practice is shelved and ignored as an option.

This is the endgame; create a cadre of socialist, social justice physicians who are so very happy to let the government control their lives, and let the government enslave their services as "a human right," instead of a professional service.

Soon, the Canadians will have nowhere to go for healthcare, since they have to wait 6 months for an epidural injection or 1 year for a pain specialist consultation due to their wonderful socialized medical system, they can no longer come to the USA for care within the week.

Just amazing to me that young physicians can be so ignorant to believe that access to their labor is a human right.

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[NJPAIN]

Brainwashing really works. Especially now that health systems like Kaiser. Geisinger and Meridian Health have their own medical schools. The only thing that they will know about business upon graduating is what a wRVU is.

 

[Ligament]

Brainwashing really works. Especially now that health systems like Kaiser. Geisinger and Meridian Health have their own medical schools. The only thing that they will know about business upon graduating is what a wRVU is.

They may not even know what a wRVU is...after all, if healthcare is a right, what is the value in it, what use is an RVU?

 

[hyperalgesia]

“There’s tremendous potential … to be at the table if single-payer becomes a significant part of the political discourse, and create a system that is more equitable,” Pean said.

It's so incredible to me - there are Americans looking for "equity"??? What happened to dreaming big and shooting for the stars?

Saying they want equity is saying nothing of quality, affordability, access, etc - just that it's all the same - unAmerican.

 

[emergentmd]

Love how the new ones with the least amount of experience wants to live in a socialists society.

I am hopeful I will be out of medicine when they become the majority and not the minority.

 

[Aether2000]

Canadians will continue to have access in the US for more rapid healthcare, but the Canadian government will not pay for it. Given the high prices in the US for services, it is doubtful most Canadians would continue to avail themselves of that possibility. There are private pay systems even within the Canadian system, which is really several individual provincial systems. For instance, if you want to pay for a MRI ($500) in Quebec, you can have one the next day. However in Ontario, there are far more restrictions on private pay. However, most Canadians do not engage the private healthcare option and are actually reasonably satisfied with the fact they have healthcare without dealing with the maze of patchwork systems in the US that only partially cover illness and with very high deductibles.

Competition simply does not work in the US healthcare system for many reasons. Patients are at the mercy of whether their doctor and insurer can agree on contracting rates that decides whether their doctor is accepting their insurance that month or not. Healthcare is certainly not affordable to anyone in the US except the very rich (Who really don't need insurance anyway) and the very poor (Emergency medicine that is not paid by the patient and Medicaid). The cost of healthcare in the US is double to triple per capita of other Western nations that do have socialized medicine systems, and continues to accelerate at obscene rates without much significant improvement in the overall health of the nation. Drug costs are simply out of control and pharmaceutical manufacturers are so amazingly greedy that they compromise the safety of the nation by electing to manufacture high profit margin brand name drugs while eschewing any duty to manufacture critically short supply drugs necessary for anesthesia and the welfare of the nation. Hospitals are taking in so much money that the entire infrastructure has been rebuilt over the past 10 years and they are so awash with funding, they continue building more and more hospitals/ERs/clinics and continue purchasing doctors practices. Doctors engage in confiscatory schemes to do their surgeries in self-owned surgery centers intentionally not contracting with insurers so they can derive a much larger profit on surgeries- with the overall cost of the surgeries much higher than the already very high hospital cost for these same surgeries.

So forgive me, but I agree. Our system is broken, and we should indeed gradually transition to socialized medicine in some form. We have tried for decades to repair the current system but costs continue to spiral out of control to patients and the nation- this is the bottom line. Remember there are many types of socialized medicine systems, and not all are draconian.

 

[Ducttape]

our system is broken.

in addition, the vast majority of new grad doctors are not seeing the financial benefits of going into private practice. it is almost impossible to make a living being a general practitioner. how many of you can make a living and afford a staff on just E&M codes? and ones that will most likely be cut soon?

out of my internal medicine residency class, the only ones still practicing medicine are the ones that specialized or retrained, are hospital employed or are running multiple provider clinics heavy on midlevel providers. and the burnout of these remaining fellow grads is high. i have more colleagues who work for insurance companies doing peer review than run a solo private practice office.

this is the reality that most medical students see, not the gold palace lifestyle of a pain doc or an orthopedist. they are forced to find quality of life and appreciation of their career in ways other than big boats or motorcycles. in addition, they see huge bills in front of them.


how many pain docs here have a big toy - a boat, a motorcycle, a sports car? how many have more than 1? these are all out of reach for the general internist.

 

[SSdoc33]

crappy, cheap single payor for everyone. if you want the cadillac plan, you pay for it. a two tier-ed system will work for both sides. thats not REALLY what we have now.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

crappy, cheap single payor for everyone. if you want the cadillac plan, you pay for it. a two tier-ed system will work for both sides. thats not REALLY what we have now.

The big problem with this is that what that cheap plan covers will expand over time (because it always does).

I could actually get behind it if that weren't the case, but we both know it won't stay bare bones.

 

[SSdoc33]

The big problem with this is that what that cheap plan covers will expand over time (because it always does).

I could actually get behind it if that weren't the case, but we both know it won't stay bare bones.

so you put a spending cap on it. either via dollar values or % GDP or something. if a drug costs too much, "medicare-for-all" wont buy it. that will drive the cost down pretty quick if they lose that huge market share.

i see your point, but our system is working only for heavy-procedure specialties, and failing in primary care. as a PCP, which do you see as being more important?

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

so you put a spending cap on it. either via dollar values or % GDP or something. if a drug costs too much, "medicare-for-all" wont buy it. that will drive the cost down pretty quick if they lose that huge market share.

i see your point, but our system is working only for heavy-procedure specialties, and failing in primary care. as a PCP, which do you see as being more important?

It doesn't have to be either/or. Hell, cut the number of spinal fusions in half (which is probably still being too generous), and you can give us PCPs about a 10k/year raise. We'd see the same if not more if the cardiologists didn't stent every artery they can get a catheter into.

Honestly, being a PCP isn't so bad. I mean sure, I'd love to make more money - who doesn't? But for my 8-5 job, no call, no holidays, no weekends, patients don't die under my care, I'm pretty unlikely to ever be sued, the money we make isn't actually all that bad. I think the only reason these days that PCP pay gets much attention is the ever increasing student loan problem. Much easier to fix that than pay doctors more. When I first opened my practice, I didn't get paid for about a year. So we lived on my internist wife's salary exclusively. She had about 150k in loans at that point. So we paid for those, a nanny for the kids, a pretty nice house, and still were able to go out of town for a long weekend 2-3X/year.

And with the rise of DPC, there is a solo PP option again for primary care.

 

[drusso]

Only Free Markets Will Save--And Strengthen--Healthcare

Site-neutral payment proposal sets the stage for battle royale between CMS, hospitals

Libertarian think tank: Providers would pay for Medicare for All

Healthcare Reform Creates Provider Monopolies | The Lund Report

Insurers are setting patients up for failure (Guest opinion)

Hospitals condemn CMS site neutral rule that would cut payments to off-campus clinics


There is a simple path moving forward:

• Get hospitals out of the business of practicing medicine and employing doctors. Prostrating to your employer while they rip off the health care system with inflated chargemaster prices, monopolistic business practices, usurious SOS d(f) is not an honest living. Every employed MD can be the tip of the spear of true, free market reform.
• Support independent practices and direct care/retainer/concierge PCP's. Stop referring to large hospital MD groups.
• Insist on site neutral payment.
• Insist on getting rid of pharmacy benefit managers and government-hospital pharmacy drug discount schemes.
• Tort reform
• Reduce regulatory burden
• Expand HSA's; require catastrophic insurance

 

[244913]

Some of these points are well taken, but implying that hospital employed MD's are not making an honest living is insulting. It's also rich, coming from you...

Do you still have your midlevel (s) churning out opioid rx's in between your cash only regenexx treatments?

 

[Aether2000]

I wish free markets would work in healthcare, but they seem to simply feed the inflation beast due to perverse systemic problems that appear to be insolvable. Take pricing for elective care: patients cannot compare prices between hospitals, clinics, surgeons, or even procedures since there is a maze of contracted arrangements, pre-set fees, co-insurances, ICD-10 codes, and variations in charges/treatments/diagnoses for exactly the same medical condition. Try to take insurers out of the equation, and the patient will assume the entire risk of financial devastation for even minor illnesses. Unfortunately such comparisons of pricing cannot exist in our current system. It is not so simple at all.

 

[drusso]

Some of these points are well taken, but implying that hospital employed MD's are not making an honest living is insulting. It's also rich, coming from you...

Do you still have your midlevel (s) churning out opioid rx's in between your cash only regenexx treatments?

I couldn't let myself do anything that would compromise my values, faith, ethics, or debase what I believe honors the highest principles of our profession.

 

[lobelsteve]

I couldn't let myself do anything that would compromise my values, faith, ethics, or debase what I believe honors the highest principles of our profession.

When did you quit stem cell?

 

[Gauss]

When did you quit stem cell?

after he read the chronicle this AM
Merchants of hope: Inside the flourishing consumer stem cell market

 

[drusso]

after he read the chronicle this AM
Merchants of hope: Inside the flourishing consumer stem cell market

That's interesting...85% of the article is about Berman, fat-derived cells, treating neurodegenerative conditions and blindness and you have to read 3/4 down to get to this part:

Arguably, the cells that Regenexx gives patients make sense for treating orthopedic conditions. They use mesenchymal stem cells, a type of stem cell meant to become the body’s structural tissue. Mesenchymal stem cells from bone marrow may turn into cartilage, for example, though many experts say there is little evidence that the cells work that way after being removed and re-injected.

Certainly, though, mesenchymal stem cells, which are also found in fat tissue, do not become brain or heart cells. They cannot replace cells in the eye that sense light.

“There are a few people who are doing things that are pushing the envelope with very little information, and they’re getting bad outcomes,” says Stephen Derrington, a Health Link doctor. “What ends up happening is we all get lumped into one big category of ‘stem cells,’ no matter what they’re being used for.”

The FDA would seem to agree. Its stem cell guidelines allow for “homologous” use, which means the cells are used in a way similar to their natural role in the body. So providers like Regenexx that primarily do orthopedic procedures do not need FDA oversight, said Norman Deitch, chief executive of Health Link, which has three other California locations besides San Rafael.

The FDA hasn’t quite given places like Regenexx the all-clear. But at least for now, the agency is much more focused on clinics, especially those using fat stem cells, that claim to treat conditions like multiple sclerosis, Parkinson’s disease or blindness.

And, I've already gone on the record taking a strong patient and consumer protection stance against stem cell fraud...

https://www.bizjournals.com/portlan...egon-patients-should-beware-of-stem-cell.html

 

[Gauss]

Once Its Greatest Foes, Doctors Are Embracing Single-Payer

Once Its Greatest Foes, Doctors Are Embracing Single-Payer

Article is about socialist, lemming young physicians.

1. Medical schools have for years now selected incoming medical students who are lemmings, and easily influenced to accept government control of their education and lives
2. Medical schools have for years now programmed medical students towards "social justice" and socialized medicine. You think you'd get into medical school if you state on your application statement that you'd like to go into private practice and own your business? No way.
3. Medical schools have for years now fully neglected to educate medical students on the business of medicine, running a private practice, and purposely portrayed the only employment opportunities as corporate or government. Private practice is shelved and ignored as an option.

This is the endgame; create a cadre of socialist, social justice physicians who are so very happy to let the government control their lives, and let the government enslave their services as "a human right," instead of a professional service.

Soon, the Canadians will have nowhere to go for healthcare, since they have to wait 6 months for an epidural injection or 1 year for a pain specialist consultation due to their wonderful socialized medical system, they can no longer come to the USA for care within the week.

Just amazing to me that young physicians can be so ignorant to believe that access to their labor is a human right.

Get off my lawn!
The majority of the population now can't afford healthcare so PP is dead, and we're all just standing around waiting for the funeral

 

[drusso]

Get off my lawn!
The majority of the population now can't afford healthcare so PP is dead, and we're all just standing around waiting for the funeral

Personalized practice: Direct primary care grows locally, nationally

https://www.dpcare.org/

Bull$hit. Direct primary care, retainer medicine, and concierge practices are growing like weeds all over the country as MD/DO's give the middle finger to their hospital overlords. And, these models are demonstrating improved outcomes and lower costs to the health care system. No more 60 min $2,000 CESI's done in the hospital OR/HOPD.

 

[hyperalgesia]

Get off my lawn!
The majority of the population now can't afford healthcare so PP is dead, and we're all just standing around waiting for the funeral

Is healthcare the same thing as healthcare insurance? This is really incredible marketing.

 

[Gauss]

Personalized practice: Direct primary care grows locally, nationally

https://www.dpcare.org/

Bull$hit. Direct primary care, retainer medicine, and concierge practices are growing like weeds all over the country as MD/DO's give the middle finger to their hospital overlords. And, these models are demonstrating improved outcomes and lower costs to the health care system. No more 60 min $2,000 CESI's done in the hospital OR/HOPD.

None of that covers the less healthy or the more complex which are the growing majority - immunotherapeutics, cancer care, neurodegenerative disorders, renal failure, etc.

 

[Gauss]

And we all know this was coming
Amazon has plans to open its own health clinics for Seattle employees

 

[drusso]

And we all know this was coming
Amazon has plans to open its own health clinics for Seattle employees

...and this:

https://regenexxcorporate.com/regenexx-corporate-program/

Access HealthNet Partners with Regenexx to Increase Employer Access of Leading Edge Medical Innovation | Markets Insider

SpineMark Announces a Strategic Partnership With Regenexx |

The private sector will ultimately create the right incentives to drive down prices in a manner that subsidized HOPD Health System doctors could never imagine...

 

[SSdoc33]

...and this:

https://regenexxcorporate.com/regenexx-corporate-program/

Access HealthNet Partners with Regenexx to Increase Employer Access of Leading Edge Medical Innovation | Markets Insider

SpineMark Announces a Strategic Partnership With Regenexx |

The private sector will ultimately create the right incentives to drive down prices in a manner that subsidized HOPD Health System doctors could never imagine...

a 100 dollar POS is still a POS.

private sector sells snake oil to fools and laughs all the way to the bank. private sector is martin skreli.


jump ship on regennexx while you still have some semblance of dignity

 

[Biohazard685]

All this crackdown and vitriol on IPM, will spine surgery ever get scrutinized in the MSM?

The laser spine institute promotes itself as God's gift to back pain and remains a media darling.

 

[drusso]

a 100 dollar POS is still a POS.

private sector sells snake oil to fools and laughs all the way to the bank. private sector is martin skreli.


jump ship on regennexx while you still have some semblance of dignity

Meanwhile in the "public health system..."

 

[Ducttape]

...and this:

https://regenexxcorporate.com/regenexx-corporate-program/

Access HealthNet Partners with Regenexx to Increase Employer Access of Leading Edge Medical Innovation | Markets Insider

SpineMark Announces a Strategic Partnership With Regenexx |

The private sector will ultimately create the right incentives to drive down prices in a manner that subsidized HOPD Health System doctors could never imagine...

even if you are so naively optimistic to think this, how long do you think the private sector and independent practice pattern as the norm will last?

in other words, name me one market in which small independent practices are the majority.


maybe law. but who wants to be a scum sucking slimeball lawyer? and the vast majority of lawyers aren't private practice - they are corporate or business or govt employees.....



one final point, drusso. an estimated 73 million Americans are on Medicaid. 17% (or 50 million?) of the US population are on Medicare.

unless your version of care comes at under $40/month, you have effectively eliminated 49% of the US population from healthcare, because they will not be able to afford it.

 

[Dr. Ice]

a 100 dollar POS is still a POS.

private sector sells snake oil to fools and laughs all the way to the bank. private sector is martin skreli.


jump ship on regennexx while you still have some semblance of dignity

I’m pretty sure the $80 cervical esi is a POS but people gladly do that all day long

 

[Orin]

As the original article notes, smart young people are realizing that the system is broken and they have a willingness to try something new/different. They may not be educated about the business of medicine, but everyone that has been doing this a long time seems to have mucked it up as it is, so I'm not sure if knowing more about the money side makes it any better.

With all the stuff about Canadian healthcare, I remember this recent article:
Survival in Cystic Fibrosis Between Canada and the United States | Annals of Internal Medicine | American College of Physicians
Why Cystic Fibrosis Patients in Canada Outlive Those in the U.S.

"""When U.S. patients were categorized according to their insurance status, Canadians had a 44% lower risk for death than U.S. patients receiving continuous Medicaid or Medicare (n = 6230; 24.3%) (HR, 0.56 [CI, 0.45 to 0.71]; P < 0.001), a 36% lower risk than those receiving intermittent Medicaid or Medicare (n = 8429; 32.9%) (HR, 0.64 [CI, 0.51 to 0.80]; P = 0.002), and a 77% lower risk than those with unknown or no health insurance (n = 205; 0.8%) (HR, 0.23 [CI, 0.14 to 0.37]; P < 0.001). No difference in risk for death was observed between Canadians and U.S. patients with “other” insurance (n = 10 754; 42.0%), including private coverage (HR, 0.85 [CI, 0.67 to 1.07]; P = 0.15) (Supplement Table 3)."""

At least for CF, the Canadian healthcare system seems as good as the US commercial insurance and way better than the US Medicare/Medicaid system.

 

[drusso]

even if you are so naively optimistic to think this, how long do you think the private sector and independent practice pattern as the norm will last?

in other words, name me one market in which small independent practices are the majority.


maybe law. but who wants to be a scum sucking slimeball lawyer? and the vast majority of lawyers aren't private practice - they are corporate or business or govt employees.....



one final point, drusso. an estimated 73 million Americans are on Medicaid. 17% (or 50 million?) of the US population are on Medicare.

unless your version of care comes at under $40/month, you have effectively eliminated 49% of the US population from healthcare, because they will not be able to afford it.

No one wants to shop for health care at the Post Office. And, if MD/DO's continue to promote professional autonomy and support strong specialty groups and PAC's (I recommend ASIPP's PAC) to look after our interests, then the future can be anything we want it to be...start contributing today!

Mission possible: Saving freedom in medical care

Asipp-Pac – Asipp-Pac

Home | Association of Independent Doctors

 

[SSdoc33]

Meanwhile in the "public health system..."

the private sector MIGHT drive down prices on regenerative medicine d/t competition. but driving down the price ona bucket of crap doesnt really help our healthcare system, now does it?

look, i have little faith in the gvt to get this right, either. one thing i do know is that anybody who wants to inject some organic-based, cell-containing goop into their arthirtic knee should pay for it themselves

 

[hyperalgesia]

We should completely eliminate Medicare because it has failed (unsustainable)

This would free states like California to make health care systems just like Canada or Europe. In the meantime, we could go back to having the best health care in the world before Medicare came along to save it...

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

even if you are so naively optimistic to think this, how long do you think the private sector and independent practice pattern as the norm will last?

in other words, name me one market in which small independent practices are the majority.


maybe law. but who wants to be a scum sucking slimeball lawyer? and the vast majority of lawyers aren't private practice - they are corporate or business or govt employees.....



one final point, drusso. an estimated 73 million Americans are on Medicaid. 17% (or 50 million?) of the US population are on Medicare.

unless your version of care comes at under $40/month, you have effectively eliminated 49% of the US population from healthcare, because they will not be able to afford it.

As mentioned previously, DPC is growing quite rapidly. In my state when I started mine, there was 1 other guy doing it. When I sold my practice 2 years later, there were 12 doctors doing it.

Still very small numbers true, but growing.

 

[Dr. Ice]

the private sector MIGHT drive down prices on regenerative medicine d/t competition. but driving down the price ona bucket of crap doesnt really help our healthcare system, now does it?

look, i have little faith in the gvt to get this right, either. one thing i do know is that anybody who wants to inject some organic-based, cell-containing goop into their arthirtic knee should pay for it themselves

You seem to have a lot of antagonism towards regen. Do you have any personal experience with it? Have you attended any scientific courses on it and drawn your obvious bias against based on what you’ve heard, seen, read? I’m just curious. I offer prp..not to every Tom dick and harry. My prices are not exorbitant by any means. People probaly make more than what I charge (if they have good insurance contracts) for a lumbar tfesi. I have seen very positive results for peritendonus prp, and even sij prp. I don’t believe the placebo effect is sooo overwhelming great that these patients have “mind over mattered” their way out of pain..particularly not at their price point for the treatment offered by me. My partner has had great results with bmac as well. Just curious why you believe so wholeheartedly that it’s “snake oil”

 

[willabeast]

The younger docs embracing single payer fits their psychological profile and education. They want a life outside of medicine, and think single payer will give it to them. Very sad that the only thing that will change under single payer is less money, the vast majority of docs will still have very little free time outside of medicine, and they will be just as unhappy but with less money under single payer. MD's making more money on average than similarly educated Americans has only been during our lifetimes. Single payer is not inevitable unless the Democrats win big. The Republicans want your money to prevent that from happening. My two cents. This is a link to average American incomes during the 1960's.
Occupations of federal white-collar workers. v.1-5(1957-61).

 

[CheGuevaraMD]

The younger docs embracing single payer fits their psychological profile and education. They want a life outside of medicine, and think single payer will give it to them. Very sad that the only thing that will change under single payer is less money, the vast majority of docs will still have very little free time outside of medicine, and they will be just as unhappy but with less money under single payer. MD's making more money on average than similarly educated Americans has only been during our lifetimes. Single payer is not inevitable unless the Democrats win big. The Republicans want your money to prevent that from happening. My two cents. This is a link to average American incomes during the 1960's.
Occupations of federal white-collar workers. v.1-5(1957-61).

Honestly, single payer is inevitable. People increasingly cannot afford healthcare, but they want coverage. So, they will support reform. Physicians are free to quit or leave the country, but stopping the tide is impossible at this point. It's over!

 

[drusso]

Honestly, single payer is inevitable. People increasingly cannot afford healthcare, but they want coverage. So, they will support reform. Physicians are free to quit or leave the country, but stopping the tide is impossible at this point. It's over!

The Fiscal Implausibility of Medicare for All

"An analogy might help frame the choice. Suppose, for example, that a government representative came to your door and said, “We’ve totaled up all the money you spend each year on food. We think you’re wasting money paying for restaurants’, groceries’, and farms’ costs of doing business, as well as others in the food industry. We think we can do this more efficiently. So we’re going to raise your taxes by that amount of money, and we’ll provide all your food to you for free. And we’ll also be able to take care of those Americans who don’t have enough access to food. We’re planning to cut all payments to restaurants, groceries, farms and other food providers by about 40%, and if we do that we might be able to cut 3-4% off of your total food bill.” Would Americans take this deal?"

 

[SSdoc33]

You seem to have a lot of antagonism towards regen. Do you have any personal experience with it? Have you attended any scientific courses on it and drawn your obvious bias against based on what you’ve heard, seen, read? I’m just curious. I offer prp..not to every Tom dick and harry. My prices are not exorbitant by any means. People probaly make more than what I charge (if they have good insurance contracts) for a lumbar tfesi. I have seen very positive results for peritendonus prp, and even sij prp. I don’t believe the placebo effect is sooo overwhelming great that these patients have “mind over mattered” their way out of pain..particularly not at their price point for the treatment offered by me. My partner has had great results with bmac as well. Just curious why you believe so wholeheartedly that it’s “snake oil”

Don't do it, doctor ice. Don't go down that road. Regenerative medicine is typically offered by those who have neither the will nor the skills to compete with traditional allopathic medicine tools. just because you may be getting elbowed out of what you want to be doing, or aren't getting paid what you feel you deserve, that doesn't make regenerative medicine a legitimate medical option

For a very narrow set of patients, like PRP for tendinopathy, it's fine. Sure. Go ahead. But to expand that into the variety of the pain conditions that we treat is pretty ridiculous right now. I have read the literature, and it's really crappy. I'm have gone to courses, and I've not been impressed

don't do it man, don't do it

 

[Gauss]

The Fiscal Implausibility of Medicare for All

implausibility vs the coming reality - what will we do when the population on medicare and medicaid outnumbers those with private healthcare? CA is already at 30% of its population on just medicaid FACT CHECK: Does Medicaid Cover A Third Of All Californians?
I bet when you factor in the medicare numbers the total approaches 50%
those numbers will not reverse

 

[Dr. Ice]

Don't do it, doctor ice. Don't go down that road. Regenerative medicine is typically offered by those who have neither the will nor the skills to compete with traditional allopathic medicine tools. just because you may be getting elbowed out of what you want to be doing, or aren't getting paid what you feel you deserve, that doesn't make regenerative medicine a legitimate medical option

For a very narrow set of patients, like PRP for tendinopathy, it's fine. Sure. Go ahead. But to expand that into the variety of the pain conditions that we treat is pretty ridiculous right now. I have read the literature, and it's really crappy. I'm have gone to courses, and I've not been impressed

don't do it man, don't do it

Lol..thanks for the advice as if I’m a fellow or 1-2 year out attending. Except...I’m not. I’ve been in practice for 10 years and can assure you I have the skill set to practice “traditional allopathic medicine tools.” I have several publications, in a past life have taught residents, etc. But I digress. I AM doing it and IT IS working whether you espouse to it or not. We all create our own reality don’t we? You have chosen yours..and I’ve chosen mine.

 

[nvrsumr]

Dr Ice. Do you have an inexpensive way to prepare ur prp that u would share? The kits cost me $200 plus and that limits me offering to most of my patients

 

[Dr. Ice]

Dr Ice. Do you have an inexpensive way to prepare ur prp that u would share? The kits cost me $200 plus and that limits me offering to most of my patients

I’ll PM you

 

[willabeast]

Honestly, single payer is inevitable. People increasingly cannot afford healthcare, but they want coverage. So, they will support reform. Physicians are free to quit or leave the country, but stopping the tide is impossible at this point. It's over!

Like Hillary was inevitable? The only thing inevitable about politics is how each side claims to be sure they will win. Never understood that as a strategy, I would think it would reduce voter turnout by one's favorite side.

 

[hyperalgesia]

I wish free markets would work in healthcare, but they seem to simply feed the inflation beast due to perverse systemic problems that appear to be insolvable. Take pricing for elective care: patients cannot compare prices between hospitals, clinics, surgeons, or even procedures since there is a maze of contracted arrangements, pre-set fees, co-insurances, ICD-10 codes, and variations in charges/treatments/diagnoses for exactly the same medical condition. Try to take insurers out of the equation, and the patient will assume the entire risk of financial devastation for even minor illnesses. Unfortunately such comparisons of pricing cannot exist in our current system. It is not so simple at all.

I feel like this is the pernicious and inevitable creep of socialism. First it promises. Then it disrupts. Then it instills dependency. Now people are afraid the evil free market will bankrupt them, when that was never an issue before Medicare and "health insurance" made it one.

Health insurance companies brainwashed half of the US population into thinking that their product is, in fact, your actual HEALTH and making it ILLEGAL not to buy it. You are buying your own health, after all...

I wonder if the fed could allow states to opt out of Medicare and instead use those dollars for their own plans. I would have no issue with states trying MediCal for all with Medicare dollars etc. My main priority at this point would be to protect the ability for a free market to emerge from this circus.

 

[lobelsteve]

Lol..thanks for the advice as if I’m a fellow or 1-2 year out attending. Except...I’m not. I’ve been in practice for 10 years and can assure you I have the skill set to practice “traditional allopathic medicine tools.” I have several publications, in a past life have taught residents, etc. But I digress. I AM doing it and IT IS working whether you espouse to it or not. We all create our own reality don’t we? You have chosen yours..and I’ve chosen mine.

10 yrs out and still can't recognize your own financial bias and experience blinding you from the lack of science. Modern Alchemy.

 

[Dr. Ice]

10 yrs out and still can't recognize your own financial bias and experience blinding you from the lack of science. Modern Alchemy.

It’s not a huge part of my practice and I’m not fleecing anyone. The science is nascent but it’s there.

 

[lobelsteve]

It’s not a huge part of my practice and I’m not fleecing anyone. The science is nascent but it’s there.

Charging for human experimentation is fleecing.

 

[Ducttape]

I feel like this is the pernicious and inevitable creep of socialism. First it promises. Then it disrupts. Then it instills dependency. Now people are afraid the evil free market will bankrupt them, when that was never an issue before Medicare and "health insurance" made it one.

Health insurance companies brainwashed half of the US population into thinking that their product is, in fact, your actual HEALTH and making it ILLEGAL not to buy it. You are buying your own health, after all...

I wonder if the fed could allow states to opt out of Medicare and instead use those dollars for their own plans. I would have no issue with states trying MediCal for all with Medicare dollars etc. My main priority at this point would be to protect the ability for a free market to emerge from this circus.

to go back in a time there was a free market for medicare, one has to go to the 1965. at that time, 40% of the elderly did not have any health insurance and possible care. they didn't worry about evil free market. they just went without - completely.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

demographics have completely changed this country. People in 1965 didn't live as long, viewed pain and medical problems as an inevitable consequence of aging and had much more resiliency and coping skills. You had a heart attack at home, maybe you survived, got your affairs in order, spent time with your grand kids and then waited patiently for "the big one."

New solutions are needed- and no, Ben Shapiro (have you signed up yet to paratroop into Tehran you little ****) it's not the glorious free market.

Pop quiz: what has happened to real wages for the middle class in the last 30 years?

Free market can't fix everything, but it can make a big difference in terms of cost savings: Direct Primary Care Contributes to Union County's Cost Savings

Using the math from that one, free market medicine decreased total health costs by $1300 per person. Obviously we can't generalize that across the entire country, but that's still a huge savings. $1 million saved by switching just 730 employees to free market medicine.

Or this one: Health Care Switch Saving Oklahoma County Thousands

570k in 5 months saved. So also on track to save 1 million. I couldn't find how many covered lives it took to get there, but its not going to be a huge amount more than the previous link.