SGU vs. Midwestern

[Be_Pawsitive]

So long story short, I accepted my seat to SGU in April and paid my deposit ($400) and my airfare (roundtrip $865). I've been all set to head to Grenada and I'm really looking forward to everything SGU has to offer, and then I got the call I was accepted to Midwestern.

I was actually able to tour Midwestern and loved Arizona, the facilities (especially the teaching hospital), and the faculty. I raved about it. However, there has always been that hesitation that they do not have full accreditation (although it doesn't seem to pose a real issue if what they said and what I see reported is true). I'm not sure how I feel going into a program that does not have a reputation for the vet med program and being kind of a guinea pig. The tuition is also a bit of a turn off as well. It's about the same distance from home as Grenada, but still in my home country, adding a comfort level, but not enough for me to instantly give up $1200 I spent and cannot get back only to shell out more to move to Arizona.

I've heard great things about SGU from professors, mentors, and friends. I haven't been able to tour the school for financial and work reasons (I know about the See SGU program, but again only beneficial if you matriculate). I have a friend at the med school for one more year to help adjust. Hearing that SGU has a great reputation, a lower price tag, and the chance to network for the clinical year at another school are pros for me. I'm a bit nervous to be out of the US, but that is the only reservation I feel I have about SGU.

If you made it to the end of that novel, congrats and thank you! I guess I'm hoping to get any type of advice/guidance from students of either school or anyone going through the same situation.

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[allygator13]

SGU is awesome! It is a huge change going away from home, but I'd say the majority of the vet students love living down here. It is an adjustment, but as long as you're open minded and can make the most of living the island life (which is a huge lifestyle change) then I'd definitely encourage you to make your way down here

 

[jmo1012]

When you say SGU is cheaper, are you accounting for a more expensive cost of living and travel? Just checking, because that will definitely get you if you haven't factored that in. Also, I'm sure some students will disagree, but I don't think it was better for networking. Most of the awesome and worth networking faculty at NCSU also teach preclinical classes, so students who attended NCSU knew them better (i.e. I met people for a couple of days up to w weeks, while some students knew these faculty members for years through classes, clubs, and advising)

I know nothing about Midwestern, except that one of our SGU professors left is to head admissions there. He hated that job and left after a year and is back at SGU now. I'm sure the program is great, I doubt accreditation is something to worry about, so I'd go where you want to. I'd have a tough time walking away from $1200 spent all things equal. I guess ultimately you have to decide if you might regret not staying in the US down the line. What will you do if you hate Grenada? How are you going to deal with that? There will be days you hate Grenada, hopefully not many but there are definitely people who hate every second they are one the island (it's sad).
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ETA:
WOAH is tuition at midwestern seriously $53k?? holy smokes. that makes me sick! wow. um yeah, so i'd go to the cheaper school...and for the doubters, yes you can definitely live more cheaply at SGU than what they predict you need. i did it, others have done it.

 

[Be_Pawsitive]

Travel and cost of living I'm fully aware is more expensive in Grenada than Arizona (I'm blown away by how low rent can be in Arizona vs. NY). I guess I'm saying like flat out tuition alone is more at Midwestern, a school with provisional accreditation, than at SGU, a school with full accreditation. I'm pretty low maintenance, I already only just spend money on necessities now while trying to save and get things I need for school. I'm not too worried; I'm a bargain hunter. SGU also has more alumni connections (especially where I'm from), considering SGU actually has alumni. SGU has a foundation in the veterinary field while Midwestern is just starting. I feel like I know my answer, but having a sounding board helps a lot. I was really impressed with how much Midwestern is putting into their program and I loved the campus, which makes this difficult, but the tuition alone is just steep.

I don't believe I will regret leaving the US. A bit nervous, sure, mainly because I've never been out of the country. Again, I'm pretty low maintenance and would love a bit simpler lifestyle. I do have this weird thing that even though SGU and MWU are basically the same distance from home that I'd feel closer to them by being in the states. Totally weird but hey, what am I gonna do.

 

[allygator13]

I don't find cost of living here to be more expensive than back home at all... My rent in my apartments back home was always at least $700 a month even with roommates, whereas my rent here last semester was $400 a month and this semester in a very nice house is $550 a month. If you live in the dorms, it is more expensive for sure, and if you live in a really fancy place, but it is possible to not spend a lot of money on living down here. Buy the IGA brand of food at the grocery store rather than the US brand, don't run your AC constantly. It's doable.

 

[Fly Racing]

I'm a midwestern student and I'd say the accreditation concern is a non-issue since you are guaranteed to graduate with equal status as those from currently fully accredited schools, even if they later decide to remove accreditation.

There are lots of benefits to staying in the US. Do students in Grenada have higher phone bills calling and texting friends and family? What's your plan for a family emergency? Honestly, I don't know what the additional challenges are to living on the island, but I know AZ has been a very easy place to live.

I'm not sure I'd choose SGU for a more established reputation. It is still an island school, so you'll never get away from that (and I'm sorry if that offends someone from SGU, but it is in fact an island school even if the education is the same or better than a US school). Midwestern is going to be building, in my opinion, a pretty good reputation as time goes on. I haven't had it affect my externships or discussions with future employers at all and that is what is important right now.

The financial side is something no one online can decide for you, but you'll obviously be taking that into account. I have no idea about SGU and the associated costs, so I can't comment.

I think the biggest benefit to Midwestern is going to be the amount of hands on training you'll get before clinicals. We start surgery in the fall of 2nd year and each student will get to do 3-4 spay/neuter/simple abdominal surgeries. Our clinical anatomy class is great. We basically did all of the common procedures and basic surgeries on cadavers. As an equine person, getting do joint injections for hours (if I wanted) and passing a scope, putting in arterial lines, nerve blocks and joint injections using dye, and trying annular ligament and check ligament desmotomies, suspensory fasciotomy and neurectomy, and sinus flap surgeries on our cadavers were great experiences for me. The rectal exam simulator is pretty amazing too (SGU probably has one too). If you are interested on large animal, the experience we get in 2 and 3rd year with community owned and school owned horses and cattle might not be as available at SGU (I don't know this). The midwestern curriculum is also unique in that we take a communication focused course every quarter that integrates all our classes into a hands on skills class, case rounds, and our simulated appointments with actor clients and patients. It's the class that wants to make us great, well rounded vets, not just book smart vets.

And it doesn't hurt that a bunch of first years from midwestern won the student competition at a recent convention against other schools 1st-4th years

At the end of the day, go where you think you will be the most successful student. What environment will you learn in best? What program fits your leaning style better? Which will have less distractions and stress for you? Where will you be most comfortable living? Things like that. Good luck in your choice! I'm sure you will do great where ever you choose!

 

[deleted498041]

Pick whatever is cheaper and always pick the fully accredited school. You can't change tuition prices, but you can change how much you spend from day-to-day. Pick a cheap, crappy apartment. Eat beans and rice. Cook recipes exclusively from BudgetBytes. I don't go to either of those schools, so I can't speak for either of their programs but I'm a strong believer that everything should come down to money, at least at this moment in all of our careers.

 

[Be_Pawsitive]

However, this article was posted just today. Anyone know how this will impact SGU? https://www.avma.org/news/javmanews...=javma-news&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=gen

 

[jmo1012]

However, this article was posted just today. Anyone know how this will impact SGU? https://www.avma.org/news/javmanews...=javma-news&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=gen

I tentatively say I wouldn't worry too much about that. I can't speak for Ross, but I bet sgu will do what they have to to keep in good standing with loans. Accreditation and federal loans significantly increased the number of people interested in their program. Losing any of that would be a huge financial and public hit for them. They won't want the bad publicity. They are now able to fill classes of 100 both terms per year (not necessarily a good thing), when traditionally they, were probably enrolling roughly 70 students less simply because the interest in SGU wasn't there. Uts all speculation of course, but I bet whatever they are told to do will be done.

That said, it makes me so mad that they target only the island schools in the article. There are multiple us schools that are just as guilty. Look at Midwestern - there is no way a student gets out of there without at least $250k spent, and that's assuming 4th year is the same cost (it's usually more), no inflation, and living expenses of 10k a year max. Please explain to me how that isn't just as bad or worse? They opened that school in the middle of a crisis and are absolutely robbing people. Same for lmu! Go ahead and state my school is expense, it is, but stop ignoring the astronomical prices of us schools. They are just as bad or worse!

 

[deleted498041]

That said, it makes me so mad that they target only the island schools in the article. There are multiple us schools that are just as guilty. Look at Midwestern - there is no way a student gets out of there without at least $250k spent, and that's assuming 4th year is the same cost (it's usually more), no inflation, and living expenses of 10k a year max. Please explain to me how that isn't just as bad or worse? They opened that school in the middle of a crisis and are absolutely robbing people. Same for lmu! Go ahead and state my school is expense, it is, but stop ignoring the astronomical prices of us schools. They are just as bad or worse!

Just prefacing this with the statement that I really don't know the financial status of most of the vet schools in the US or outside of it... Ross and SGU are considered "for-profit" right? I know WesternU is private but we're a non-profit. What about MWU and LM? I'm assuming that's why the article is "targeting" the island schools -- the new legislature would only affect private for-profit schools.

 

[jmo1012]

Just prefacing this with the statement that I really don't know the financial status of most of the vet schools in the US or outside of it... Ross and SGU are considered "for-profit" right? I know WesternU is private but we're a non-profit. What about MWU and LM? I'm assuming that's why the article is "targeting" the island schools -- the new legislature would only affect private for-profit schools.

Regardless of profit status, there are schools that are charging the same amount or more and adding to an already saturated market. Some of these schools are substantially newer even. If they are trying to help the students, they need to address the whole problem

 

[BirdsinMyHouse]

I know a lot of Rossies past and present, and I'm sure the school is also going to do what they have to. I don't think they'd have ANY students attending--maybe a few exceptionally wealthy folks--without federal loans. I don't know a single person who wasn't relying on loans of some sort to go, and most were federal loans. They'd lose a lot of their profit if they weren't able to offer their students loans.

This is not to say it isn't a good school, far from it. However, it's a program that could not exist as it does currently without federal loans, as no one would be able to attend.

 

[deleted498041]

Regardless of profit status, there are schools that are charging the same amount or more and adding to an already saturated market. Some of these schools are substantially newer even. If they are trying to help the students, they need to address the whole problem

I 100% agree with you. However, I think the island schools were the only ones explicitly mentioned in the article because other similarly priced schools are not affected by this change in loan regulations.

 

[deleted498041]

This is not to say it isn't a good school, far from it. However, it's a program that could not exist as it does currently without federal loans, as no one would be able to attend.

I've only ever met one person who never had to take out loans for vet school, regardless of where they went.

 

[jmo1012]

I know a lot of Rossies past and present, and I'm sure the school is also going to do what they have to. I don't think they'd have ANY students attending--maybe a few exceptionally wealthy folks--without federal loans. I don't know a single person who wasn't relying on loans of some sort to go, and most were federal loans. They'd lose a lot of their profit if they weren't able to offer their students loans.

This is not to say it isn't a good school, far from it. However, it's a program that could not exist as it does currently without federal loans, as no one would be able to attend.

That might be true currently, but access to federally funded loans is relatively recent for both schools. Ross has been around graduating vet students for many, many more years. Yes it would deter some, but there are plenty of people out there willing to do private loans, trust me.

 

[BirdsinMyHouse]

That might be true currently, but access to federally funded loans is relatively recent for both schools. Ross has been around graduating vet students for many, many more years. Yes it would deter some, but there are plenty of people out there willing to do private loans, trust me.

Right. Good points.

 

[rushy]

Just prefacing this with the statement that I really don't know the financial status of most of the vet schools in the US or outside of it... Ross and SGU are considered "for-profit" right? I know WesternU is private but we're a non-profit. What about MWU and LM? I'm assuming that's why the article is "targeting" the island schools -- the new legislature would only affect private for-profit schools.

Midwestern is non-profit as well! Additionally they have existed for over 100 years in Illinois.
https://www.midwestern.edu/about/mwu-at-a-glance.html