Shadow one or multiple docs?

[FutureMD129]

So far, I have shadowed two docs in two different ER's for a total of 6.5 hours. I shadowed one doc for 4 hours and another for 2.5 hours, as the latter was on New Year's Day at the VA hospital where there was little going on. I am wondering if it's better to shadow one doc consistently versus multiple docs. Any thoughts?

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[Lysinee]

Shadow one doc consistently so you can get a good LOR. After that, you can start shadowing docs in other fields.

 

[FutureMD129]

Thank you, Lysinne. I would like to find a doc to shadow consistently so I can get a good LOR. The two docs I shadowed didn't say anything about my shadowing consistently, so maybe the ER isn't the best place to shadow on a regular basis? I want to go into pediatrics so ideally, I'd like to find a pediatrician I can shadow regularly.

 

[The Buff OP]

I would also shadow at least one primary care doc and other specialties, so you can get a feel of different specialties and talk about it on your interviews (if it comes up).

 

[Lysinee]

Thank you, Lysinne. I would like to find a doc to shadow consistently so I can get a good LOR. The two docs I shadowed didn't say anything about my shadowing consistently, so maybe the ER isn't the best place to shadow on a regular basis? I want to go into pediatrics so ideally, I'd like to find a pediatrician I can shadow regularly.

It depends on the Dr. The ER is fast paced and sometimes it's hard to keep interacting with the Dr. Maybe you can ask around and see if there are any Drs that are good people to shadow.

 

[FutureMD129]

The Buff OP, I just looked on the American College of Family Physicians and DO directories and have a list of family docs I plan to contact. Besides ER (which I've already done) and primary care, is there another specialty you've shadowed that you would recommend to others?

I actually have an interview with a pediatrics office so that might be a good opportunity to shadow.

Lysinee, I think you're right that regular interaction with the doc can be hard to get in the ER. The doc I recently shadowed spent a lot of time talking with me as the VA hospital is one of the less chaotic ones in DC. She told me I can contact her anytime so maybe I will ask if I can come back another day to see if anything different happens (as I was there on NYD).

 

[mehc012]

Thank you, Lysinne. I would like to find a doc to shadow consistently so I can get a good LOR. The two docs I shadowed didn't say anything about my shadowing consistently, so maybe the ER isn't the best place to shadow on a regular basis? I want to go into pediatrics so ideally, I'd like to find a pediatrician I can shadow regularly.

Some schools may require a doctor's letter (mostly DO schools), but aside from any such strict requirements, a shadowing letter is pretty much useless - at most it will say that you show up on time, keep your mouth shut, and occasionally ask decent questions. Shadow enough docs in enough specialties that you get a good idea of what you're going into and what options are available. Shadowing is for your benefit, so it's in your best interest to do what works for you. As long as you can point to some things that you learned in the process, you'll probably be fine as far as admissions goes.

 

[The Buff OP]

The Buff OP, I just looked on the American College of Family Physicians and DO directories and have a list of family docs I plan to contact. Besides ER (which I've already done) and primary care, is there another specialty you've shadowed that you would recommend to others?

Good deal. If you can, try to shadow a surgeon and a subspecialty of medicine. I have met up with FM, Rads, Peds Cards, Peds, Gastro, Peds Onc, A&I, EM, and Rheumatology. It's funny, I'm all about wanting to end up doing surgery, but I have never shadow a surgeon.

 

[FutureMD129]

The Buff OP, funny you've never shadowed a surgeon if that's what you want to do. I don't want to do surgery, so I'm not convinced shadowing a surgeon would be a useful experience. Some of the docs I found are peds, but most are FM.

Mech012, what specialties have you shadowed?

I'm currently drafting a letter to prospective docs. Is it okay to mention an interest in shadowing consistently?

 

[Osteoth]

Thank you, Lysinne. I would like to find a doc to shadow consistently so I can get a good LOR. The two docs I shadowed didn't say anything about my shadowing consistently, so maybe the ER isn't the best place to shadow on a regular basis? I want to go into pediatrics so ideally, I'd like to find a pediatrician I can shadow regularly.

The ER can be a mixed bag. I shadowed fairly consistently (~1/month) there for a couple of years in college, and some shifts my doc would be HUSTLING around, and others he would have only a few patients and would be able to talk to me more. Also depends on what type of clinic you're at, as Trauma centers will be much busier/higher acuity than community based hospitals, but you will also get to see much more interesting cases.

And the whole point of shadowing is to give you an idea of what an actual doctor does during their day, so that when(!) you get to medical school you won't join the pediatric society, do research in peds, commit your life to peds only to realize when you get on the wards in 3rd year that peds sucks and your whole life is now ruined.

Shadow as many specialties as you can until you feel as though you've gotten all you can out of them. I shadowed EM (>100 hours), IM (~10 hours), Rads (4 hours, fell asleep), Path (see Rads), Anesthesiology (10 hours, meh), Surgery (too early, too much standing, pretty cool procedures), Neuro (~15 hours, depressing w/chronic headaches, etc), and I think that's it. Every time I shadowed I felt as though I learned a little bit more about the specialty, which will/has helped me make decisions regarding my future in medicine.

 

[FalconSlice]

Shadow one doc consistently so you can get a good LOR. After that, you can start shadowing docs in other fields.

If OP is not a DO applicant (which I assume he/she is not because of his/her username), why would you want a LOR from your shadowing physician? There are much better candidates that can write vastly better LORs based on you as a person than a doctor you stared at from the corner mostly.

Btw, shadow multiple doctors if you want. Perhaps to compare and contrast specialties, mainly.

 

[Levrone]

Is a physician LOR still useless if you were a patient of his for a while and got to know each other better? My parents are both patients of his as well (PM&R) and talk about me a lot to him lol, so he knows about my work ethic kinda

 

[Lysinee]

If OP is not a DO applicant (which I assume he/she is not because of his/her username), why would you want a LOR from your shadowing physician? There are much better candidates that can write vastly better LORs based on you as a person than a doctor you stared at from the corner mostly.

Btw, shadow multiple doctors if you want. Perhaps to compare and contrast specialties, mainly.

If you shadow a Dr at an academic institution it's possible to get involved in research, fundraising events, etc. So that LOR will be stronger. It's a plus if the Dr is a good LOR writer and can really vouch for you.

It depends more on the LOR writer. You can say the same thing about a professor who lectured you from a distance and had a few office meetings. If that professor if a good LOR writer, I will ask that professor.

Is a physician LOR still useless if you were a patient of his for a while and got to know each other better? My parents are both patients of his as well (PM&R) and talk about me a lot to him lol, so he knows about my work ethic kinda

The LOR carries less weight if the LOR writer is a good friend of yours. Also, being a patient doesn't mean much to an adcom.

 

[mimelim]

Shadow one doc consistently so you can get a good LOR. After that, you can start shadowing docs in other fields.

Just no. You can not get a good LOR out of shadowing.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/letters-of-recommendation.985472/

Regarding shadowing. The purpose of shadowing is to be able to say, "I know what doctors do every day and I can see myself doing that for my career." Spending less than ~20 hours with a given provider borders on useless. You should spend time with several specialties if possible, and with someone in primary care if feasible.

 

[The Buff OP]

The Buff OP, funny you've never shadowed a surgeon if that's what you want to do. I don't want to do surgery, so I'm not convinced shadowing a surgeon would be a useful experience. Some of the docs I found are peds, but most are FM.

Hahaha, maybe I'm just crossing specialties off the list.

The first time I saw a surgeon at a hospital in my mind he looked like a boss (scrubs, surgeon's cap, swag) after that I started researching about it and watching a whole bunch of surgery videos. I want to help people with my hands (procedures), so even if I end up on the medicine side, most likely I will be doing a fellowship that will have me doing procedures.

 

[The Buff OP]

Is a physician LOR still useless if you were a patient of his for a while and got to know each other better? My parents are both patients of his as well (PM&R) and talk about me a lot to him lol, so he knows about my work ethic kinda

Hi, "Kevin."

 

[Levrone]

The LOR carries less weight if the LOR writer is a good friend of yours. Also, being a patient doesn't mean much to an adcom.

Well he's not a good friend. I was hoping it would; he works at the hosptial of the med school I really wanna get into, plus the reason i'm a patient was i got a serious injury which kinda led to me wanting to be a doctor/fascinated with sports medicinem and he knows this...

i mean I'll ask him for the letter.. even if it raises by chances by 1% im happy

Hi, "Kevin."

Hello, Phillip.

 

[FutureOncologist]

Shadow your PCP or a Family Medicine physician working in a clinic or a smaller hospital. More personal and you get to see a lot of different patients (children and adults.) From there, if you build a good rapport, you can have the FM find other colleagues that are willing to let you shadow.

 

[FutureMD129]

FutureOncologist, I emailed my PCP in December and asked if I could shadow her or a colleague. She said she'd think about people she knew and get back to me...but hasn't.

Since I was in a medical building for an interview, I decided to drop by doctor's offices and see if I could shadow. I first went to an internist's office where the receptionist said the docs don't let students shadow them. The next was a travel clinic which I found out is staffed by NP's, so no luck there. Then, I went to an ophthalmologist who said that ophthalmology isn't the best specialty for shadowing but that he'd let me shadow him if I couldn't shadow a doc in a more interesting specialty. By "interesting," he meant one of the primary care specialties, cardiology, or pulmonology. He also said ER is interesting, when I mentioned I shadowed 2 ER docs. Finally, I went to an internist's office where the receptionist didn't really understand what I meant by shadowing. I just explained it to her and left her my contact info asking the doc to contact me.

 

[FalconSlice]

What is the best that they can say? "Yes, he/she showed up on time and didn't interrupt when I was with patients"

Bottom line ask professors that you have a good relationship with that know you as an academic and a person. Their LORs will weigh significantly more. The chances that a LOR from a shadowing physician is strong is slim (unless you also worked with him/her in a lab or other setting and they know more about you). There are countless threads about why an LOR from a shadowing physician is not ideal.

 

[mehc012]

The Buff OP, funny you've never shadowed a surgeon if that's what you want to do. I don't want to do surgery, so I'm not convinced shadowing a surgeon would be a useful experience. Some of the docs I found are peds, but most are FM.

Mech012, what specialties have you shadowed?

I'm currently drafting a letter to prospective docs. Is it okay to mention an interest in shadowing consistently?

Well, I was an ED scribe. I also scribed in an outpatient Orthopedic clinic for a while.
I've shadowed most surgical specialties (all in an academic center) - neuro, CT, vascular, ENT, GI, Transplant, Trauma, SurgICU, Surgical oncology, Plastics, etc. This included residents AND attendings, on rounds, the OR, and clinic.
I've been through the Cath lab with the cardiologist, and our ER PA was also a cardiology PA, so we talked about that a lot.
I've shadowed two small private practice general surgeons - totally different from the academic center.

No primary care shadowing, unless you count the ED...everyone treats it like the clinic/urgent care center anyway
But then, I've never had a primary care physician and I really can't see myself being one, so hopefully it won't matter.
I should probably find some IM or IM subspecialty...I only tagged along with the hospitalists a few times while scribing.