Should URM classification be continued?

[LaughingMan]

That and the oft-repeated idea that people tend to return to their communities to practice and work. For many minorities, those communities are highly underserved. URM, in a way, attempts to kill two birds with one stone.

Hmm, I know you specified idea---but by any chance do you have any studies trying to correlate this?

---

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[TheGloaming]

YES!!!! 100th voter to put the total at 50 to 50

 

[Neurosis]

And OP never posted again. Either we just got trolled or we scared him away...

 

[flaahless]

Wow. I am pretty surprised so many (supposedly) intelligent people said no.

awesome.

 

[Ron G]

troll harder

hopefully u cruise to 4.0 and a 39S and end up in grenada

 

[SunsFun]

Yes this is true--blacks also pay more in general for various products. The reasons you listed still do not justify AA. Each person has an individual struggle. No single group should receive a benefit

Out of curiosity, how do you think AA works exactly? The minorities don't just get pooled separately. They are evaluated as individuals with URM status being a factor in the process. Don't you think it is part of their identity and the level of hardship they had to endure to get there? Not taking this into account is pretty ridiculous.

 

[TriagePreMed]

The disadvantaged status should be put awhole lot higher than URM status if your reasoning is based on socioeconomics. But the only place disadvantaged status rly matters is for financial aid.

I really think there should be more "affirmative action" for poor people than there is now.

The problem is both socioeconomics AND race, as I stated previously. Reality says that many people prefer to be treated by people of their own race. Maybe if we hadn't had oppression in this country or in the future when things get better (I hope), we can scrap the whole URM thing.

But remember, people from disadvantaged status also are more likely to have lower grades. Why aren't people complaining when it's the poor white guy that got in with lower scores than the 3.8/40 Asian/white? Why don't we complain when it's the Asian guy with a 3.5 vs the white guy with a 3.8? After all, isn't higher grades all that matters?

It's easy to point the finger and say it's the minority's fault. Guess what? It's not, and when you complain and throw out the example of black billionaires, you piss off the majority of an entirely new generation of minorities that know you're full of it and know they've had to struggle with much more than they are given credit for.

In the end, the bulk of minorities go to HBCs and the grand majority of URM are not billionaires, so it's time to put the absurd argument of the black billionaire that gets in easy because that's nearly always not the case.

Out of curiosity, how do you think AA works exactly? The minorities don't just get pooled separately. They are evaluated as individuals with URM status being a factor in the process. Don't you think it is part of their identity and the level of hardship they had to endure to get there? Not taking this into account is pretty ridiculous.

Precisely. People here act like ADCOMS say "hmmm... asian, asian, white, white, white, black!!! Aha! Admit him immediately!!" "aren't we going to read the file and see his accomplishments and struggles, sir?" "Absolutely no need. Blacks and Latinos have a fast-track to med school where we don't need to look into that!"

 

[weezynation]

College and med school admissions are the two times in a future URM physician's life when he/she will get the opportunity to experience a privilege over ORMs. A URM physician will have to work twice as hard to get the same respect in the medical field as a ORM and that would be the case if URM preference in admissions did not occur. So just suck it up, improve your app, and get accepted. I wonder what would happen if you got exactly what you want and med schools based everything on gpa and mcat...I'm pretty sure white people would then be starting threads on SDN about how unfair it is that Asians and Indians are getting all the med school spots and how med schools should consider more than grades and mcat scores.

 

[sliceofbread136]

The problem is both socioeconomics AND race, as I stated previously. Reality says that many people prefer to be treated by people of their own race. Maybe if we hadn't had oppression in this country or in the future when things get better (I hope), we can scrap the whole URM thing.

But remember, people from disadvantaged status also are more likely to have lower grades. Why aren't people complaining when it's the poor white guy that got in with lower scores than the 3.8/40 Asian/white? Why don't we complain when it's the Asian guy with a 3.5 vs the white guy with a 3.8? After all, isn't higher grades all that matters?

It's easy to point the finger and say it's the minority's fault. Guess what? It's not, and when you complain and throw out the example of black billionaires, you piss off the majority of an entirely new generation of minorities that know you're full of it and know they've had to struggle with much more than they are given credit for.

In the end, the bulk of minorities go to HBCs and the grand majority of URM are not billionaires, so it's time to put the absurd argument of the black billionaire that gets in easy because that's nearly always not the case.


Precisely. People here act like ADCOMS say "hmmm... asian, asian, white, white, white, black!!! Aha! Admit him immediately!!" "aren't we going to read the file and see his accomplishments and struggles, sir?" "Absolutely no need. Blacks and Latinos have a fast-track to med school where we don't need to look into that!"

You just can't use socioeconomic burdens as an excuse for AA. There is a section where you list your families actual income, and it is not given much weight at all. Why use a generality that URMs are poorer when you have an actual individual scale of how poor or not poor they are.

URM discrimination is still a valid reason for AA, but I think as time goes on we're getting alot better about it as a society and it's becoming less and less needed (I know we're not fully rid of discrimination yet, I'm just saying it's getting better). I stand by my opinion that the main reason for AA is that society wants racially diverse physicians.

 

[sliceofbread136]

College and med school admissions are the two times in a future URM physician's life when he/she will get the opportunity to experience a privilege over ORMs. A URM physician will have to work twice as hard to get the same respect in the medical field as a ORM and that would be the case if URM preference in admissions did not occur. So just suck it up, improve your app, and get accepted. I wonder what would happen if you got exactly what you want and med schools based everything on gpa and mcat...I'm pretty sure white people would then be starting threads on SDN about how unfair it is that Asians and Indians are getting all the med school spots and how med schools should consider more than grades and mcat scores.

That scenario sounds rather horrifying and is why I support AA.

 

[jessiemsy]

damn. I wish I had known it was so easy for me to get into med school. Why, as a black woman, did I even bother working to get that 4.0 and 33 MCAT, all while working a fullt-ime job at a company that I owned? That must explain why there are only 2 black students so far (me and another guy) in my incoming class! In a city that is 80% black! The past few years of my life have been a waste. I could have been straight chillin! I mean, apparently I could have gotten in with so much less.....

I am a failure and have clearly taken the place of a more deserving hypothetical white and/or Asian applicant. After all, aren't all hypothetical white and/or Asian applicants more deserving?

 

[jessiemsy]

and I got in... and how many others did? 1 other guy so.... apparently the bar for us HAS been set high or else there would be more of us. URM advantage... giant myth. Tell it to the one black guy at your school.

 

[SunsFun]

No, I think the collective thought is that you (jessiemsy) have done great things [respectable GPA, good mcat score, hardworking, leadership, etc]... You are also, to quote you, "a black woman".

You serve as a case-in-point that individuals that match your demographic (read: black women) can accomplish just as much as whites/asian males/females.

Did you have someone providing you with handouts along the way? ...I doubt it, right? You spent the hours studying and working your business. As you said, you weren't "straight chillin".

It follows that perhaps the bar should not be set AUTOMATICALLY lower for you for checking a box (collective you -- black females) in admissions, and same with other URMs. If you work hard you can accomplish the same inside the classroom and out: equality.

Why not look at admissions through the same lens?

Yeah but you're missing the point. The fact is that if you're born URM versus someone in nearly identical position who is not, getting those stats is much more difficult because if systematic injustices faced by those people due to their race. In this context, having same or slightly below stats than non-URM applicant could be seen as a much greater achievement.

 

[flodhi1]

wow people complaining about URM when they occupy 10 % if even that of most medical school matriculants.

 

[sliceofbread136]

You do not know enough URMs to sample in order to determine if there is in reality a "URM advantage".

I do not know enough URMs to sample in order to determine if there is in reality a "URM advantage".

However, AAMC, does in fact know enough URMs to publish some interesting statistics on matriculants in regards to comparing academic credentials...

https://www.aamc.org/download/161696/data/table19.pdf

The statistics state that some URMs have historically lower scores. The reason for this is highly debatable, and we will get nowhere discussing it. The fact of the matter is that if URMs didn't get some help and every doctor was indian or asian the consequences would be pretty severe. AA is necessary.

 

[SunsFun]

I am not a black woman. However, I went to high school with a black woman. She studied like everyone else and went to my state U.

In college, she studied like everyone else and went on to grad school.

If we are talking about overcoming being "disadvantaged" (educationally/economically deprived, etc) it is a different discussion altogether...

Individual anecdotes do not tell the whole stories. If you read my comments on previous page you will see that I gave a small example of how just being a URM can make your life more difficult than someone who is not. There are numerous studies on the subject that show this with variables like education and socioeconomic status being controlled for. I don't understand why it is so difficult to see how accomplishing something as a URM can be more difficult even if it appears as if two people are on the exact same footings.

 

[mipp0]

im latino, i have a 30 on my MCAT 13 B 10 P and 7 in V, with a 3.85 gpa and i got interview at 5 schools and i only got accepted to 1 of my instate schools(got waitlisted to 2). I think i could have done a lot better on my MCAT if it wasnt because i have only been here in US for 6 years. I dont think its 100 percent fair that urm get an advantage, but u also have to consider that we have to go through different things in our life. i have worked since the moment i got to this country, i have had to mantain a job while going to school, i had to learn a new language which i still have a lot of difficulties with. For example, one of my interviews was at drexel (which i got rejected from), the school has an mcat average of 30 and a gpa average of 3.6. i am above the average for the school and i couldnt write the stupid essay that they give us at the begining of the interview cause i usually need a computer to correct all the mistakes that i make when i write. Still i am sure that i was better at science that half of the people at my interview day. In conclusion, it might not be fair to you, but it helps people that will make excellent doctor to at least have a chance to prove that they are just as good as any asian or white person.

To be fair, a lot of this isn't unique to URM. Sounds a lot like many of my ORM friends...

 

[mipp0]

The statistics state that some URMs have historically lower scores. The reason for this is highly debatable, and we will get nowhere discussing it. The fact of the matter is that if URMs didn't get some help and every doctor was indian or asian the consequences would be pretty severe. AA is necessary.

Lol. Yes, the healthcare system would explode!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My goodness, not ever doctor would be Asian (Indian = South Asian), talk about hyperbole...

 

[Joe the Plumber]

The statistics state that some URMs have historically lower scores. The reason for this is highly debatable, and we will get nowhere discussing it. The fact of the matter is that if URMs didn't get some help and every doctor was indian or asian the consequences would be pretty severe. AA is necessary.

Well, it's not inconceivable that there were evolutionary selective forces that varied by location. It's possible intelligence was favored in Asia and Europe, whereas something else conferred a reproductive advantage to humans living in Africa.

Anyway I think we overlook that blacks apply with, on the whole, worse stats. It this because of modern racism and all that jazz? Or is it because the URM advantage is overhyped, thus inferior students aren't discouraged from applying. I'm sitting at a 3.8 and people have told me to not bother applying. I'm guessing there's sort of a vicious cycle where the URM advantage is exaggerated, thus crappy black students apply thinking they have a chance, and when they don't get accepted it looks like blacks get screwed, thus people say we need URM...and the beat goes on.

 

[sliceofbread136]

Certainly diversity is valuable when it comes to serving different patient populations... but in what sense are we speaking of diversity?

My physician shares the same culture as me?
My physician shares the same skin color as me?
My physician shared the same hardships as me?

It seems that sometimes schools are simply trying to satisfy a quota instead of answering these questions.

Think about the outrage from the black community if they were significantly less black doctors than there already are now. There would be so many lawsuits. I think this by itself is a good enough reason for med schools to continue AA....

Also, having cultural diversity in medicine is important. It may seem silly, but some patients are more comfortable if their doctor is the same skin color, let alone the same culture. Also, someone else mentioned that URMs are more likely to help underserved communities.

 

[sliceofbread136]

Well, it's not inconceivable that there were evolutionary selective forces that varied by location. It's possible intelligence was favored in Asia and Europe, whereas something else conferred a reproductive advantage to humans living in Africa.

Anyway I think we overlook that blacks apply with, on the whole, worse stats. It this because of modern racism and all that jazz? Or is it because the URM advantage is overhyped, thus inferior students aren't discourage from applying. I'm sitting at a 3.8 and people have told me to not bother applying. I'm guessing there's sort of a vicious cycle where the URM advantage is exaggerated, thus crappy black students apply, thus it looks like blacks still get screwed, thus people say we need URM...and the beat goes on.

Like I said, the reasons are highly debatable and we won't get an answer by bickering in this thread, so why try? That being said, I think your cycle theory is highly unlikely.

 

[sliceofbread136]

Lol. Yes, the healthcare system would explode!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My goodness, not ever doctor would be Asian (Indian = South Asian), talk about hyperbole...

You need to think more. If you think there wouldnt be minority uproar creating a hugely publicized issue you are just ignorant.

 

[SunsFun]

1: certainly. that is why I posted aggregated data prior.

2: keyword is "can". is it actually the case when it comes to med school admissions?

Absolutely.

 

[Koosalagoosagoo]

This URM thing is such a big argument on this forum its ridiculous, a new thread pops up every week...

 

[Joe the Plumber]

Like I said, the reasons are highly debatable and we won't get an answer by bickering in this thread, so why try? That being said, I think your cycle theory is highly unlikely.

As do I. But often people post a graph here on SDN showing the lower stats of black applicants and act as if that is proof of modern racism, institutional discrimination, whatever. My point is you probably have inferior black students who aren't discouraged from applying, whereas Asians and whites probably are given more of a reality check. Would you agree?

 

[sliceofbread136]

As do I. But often people post a graph here on SDN showing the lower stats of black applicants and act as if that is proof of modern racism, institutional discrimination, whatever. My point is you probably have inferior black students who aren't discouraged from applying, whereas Asians and whites probably are given more of a reality check. Would you agree?

I'm sure it happens in some cases. But the extent of it? I can't think of a way to actually figure this out. Too many confounding variables.

 

[SunsFun]

Well, it's not inconceivable that there were evolutionary selective forces that varied by location. It's possible intelligence was favored in Asia and Europe, whereas something else conferred a reproductive advantage to humans living in Africa.

Wow. Aside from Mein Kampf are there any other source you can cite?

Anyway I think we overlook that blacks apply with, on the whole, worse stats. It this because of modern racism and all that jazz? Or is it because the URM advantage is overhyped, thus inferior students aren't discouraged from applying. I'm sitting at a 3.8 and people have told me to not bother applying. I'm guessing there's sort of a vicious cycle where the URM advantage is exaggerated, thus crappy black students apply thinking they have a chance, and when they don't get accepted it looks like blacks get screwed, thus people say we need URM...and the beat goes on.

How about a simpler explanation? It is harder to get into a medical school when you are a URM.

 

[SunsFun]

As do I. But often people post a graph here on SDN showing the lower stats of black applicants and act as if that is proof of modern racism, institutional discrimination, whatever. My point is you probably have inferior black students who aren't discouraged from applying, whereas Asians and whites probably are given more of a reality check. Would you agree?

 

[Joe the Plumber]

I'm sure it happens in some cases. But the extent of it? I can't think of a way to actually figure this out. Too many confounding variables.

To be honest, I just liking arguing both sides of any issue. It's depressing to think of a society in which poor black kids grow up with bad parents, in an inner city, go to a bad school, have a low-ish gpa and mcat and then don't have a chance compared to the rich white and Asian applicants. But this moreso supports something based on SES rather than AA, since poor people of every race get f-ed over.

 

[crmellon]

I'm not speaking out against URM classification, but I think it's ridiculous when people just assume that because someone is caucasian they were silver-spoon fed. There are economic, familial, and education disparities amongst all ethic groups. Assuming that simply because someone isn't URM, they would have a massive advantage, is as racist as saying that URM's are not disadvantaged.

 

[Joe the Plumber]

Wow. Aside from Mein Kampf are there any other source you can cite?


How about a simpler explanation? It is harder to get into a medical school when you are a URM.

Why do Norwegians have light skin? It's called evolution. Certain factors bring about conditions that favor certain traits. Maybe moving to colder climates required increased intelligence to build insulated shelters, plan ahead for food and firewood supplies, etc. I don't know, but it's very flippant to totally disregard the possibility of an evolutionary explanation to the black-everyone else performance gap. After all, evolution explains everything aboout biology, thus everything about biology can be explained by evolution. There are obviously social factors that play a role, too - I'm not denying that. But maybe there's a reason when Africans were fine-tuning the mud hut and spear, up north the Romans had invented double-barrel arches and concrete that sets up underwater. Not to mention the Etruscans and Greeks before them.

 

[crmellon]

Why do Norwegians have light skin? It's called evolution. Certain factors bring about conditions that favor certain traits. Maybe moving to colder climates required increased intelligence to build insulated shelters, plan ahead for food and firewood supplies, etc. I don't know, but it's very flippant to totally disregard the possibility of an evolutionary explanation to the black-everyone else performance gap. After all, evolution explains everything aboout biology, thus everything about biology can be explained by evolution. There are obviously social factors that play a role, too - I'm not denying that. But maybe there's a reason when Africans were fine-tuning the mud hut and spear, up north the Romans had invented double-barrel arches and concrete that sets up underwater. Not to mention the Etruscans and Greeks before them.

The oldest civilizations are in Sumeria, Egypt, etc. I wouldn't touch that thought with an 8-foot pole. There are literally thousands of reasons why there are tribal cultures in Africa as opposed to why Western Civilization modernized, and they all have almost nothing to do with evolution.

Romans also didn't have to deal with Lions, Mambas, and Crocodiles. Just saying, in a humorous point.

 

[SunsFun]

Why do Norwegians have light skin? It's called evolution. Certain factors bring about conditions that favor certain traits. Maybe moving to colder climates required increased intelligence to build insulated shelters, plan ahead for food and firewood supplies, etc. I don't know, but it's very flippant to totally disregard the possibility of an evolutionary explanation to the black-everyone else performance gap. After all, evolution explains everything aboout biology, thus everything about biology can be explained by evolution. There are obviously social factors that play a role, too - I'm not denying that. But maybe there's a reason when Africans were fine-tuning the mud hut and spear, up north the Romans had invented double-barrel arches and concrete that sets up underwater. Not to mention the Etruscans and Greeks before them.

There are people far more experienced and knowledgeable in the field of genetics and evolutionary biology on SDN who can easily dismiss your "theory" based on almost every piece of modern research.

 

[Joe the Plumber]

The oldest civilizations are in Sumeria, Egypt, etc. I wouldn't touch that thought with an 8-foot pole. There are literally thousands of reasons why there are tribal cultures in Africa as opposed to why Western Civilization modernized, and they all have almost nothing to do with evolution.

Romans also didn't have to deal with Lions, Mambas, and Crocodiles. Just saying, in a humorous point.

That's true, there are climatic considerations. But it gets cold as heck in Europe, just saying.

 

[SunsFun]

Am I being trolled here? Joe, you're not being serious, right?

 

[Joe the Plumber]

Am I being trolled here? Joe, you're not being serious, right?

I fully support affirmative action that helps out people from modest economic background. But it's not inconceivable intelligence varies (slightly) by race, and that's worth investigating.

 

[crmellon]

I fully support affirmative action that helps out people from modest economic background. But it's not inconceivable intelligence varies (slightly) by race, and that's worth investigating.

It's not, actually. Because that is literally the past 2,000 years of racism in a nutshell. That some races by virtue of being born are superior to other races. I'd be incredibly careful of posting opinions like that, if only that it could damage your professional career.

 

[Joe the Plumber]

It's not, actually. Because that is literally the past 2,000 years of racism in a nutshell. That some races by virtue of being born are superior to other races. I'd be incredibly careful of posting opinions like that, if only that it could damage your professional career.

Let me guess, you opposed the sequencing of the human genome because it was racist? We must relentlessly pursue Truth. Let the chips fall where they may.

 

[crmellon]

Let me guess, you opposed the sequencing of the human genome because it was racist? We must relentlessly pursue Truth. Let the chips fall where they may.

What? How does that in anyway apply to what you're saying. You can't biologically measure intelligence to begin with.

 

[Joe the Plumber]

What? How does that in anyway apply to what you're saying. You can't biologically measure intelligence to begin with.

"How many bubbles in a bar of soap?" comes to mind. Jk. I guess you're right though. Dang, we'll probably never cure cancer, I guess we should stop trying, right?

 

[Shmemifly]

I wish we would stop debating this issue in terms of compensating for the disadvantages of life as an URMs. As others have pointed out, AMCAS disadvantaged status does (some) of that -- but more importantly, there is an edge of condescension in that approach. I think adcoms view URMs favorably not because of their past, but because of the very unique potential they hold for both the class and for the future of their URM communiites.

We all know that medical school is not prohibitively difficult -- it is about hard work. Which means that anyone above some general intellectual/academic cutoff is usually capable of learning the material, and successfully becoming a competent practicing physician. Given that, there really is zero added value to the school in continuing to select for higher and higher MCAT/GPA ranges. Thankfully, most schools realize that, and do NOT select the top 300 LizzyM scores in their pool. So, they consider other things, including a person's potential likelihood of serving a pool of patients that need to have representation in medicine.

Can you honestly say that you would be equally comfortable if your pcp were a hispanic female who spoke broken medical english and had trouble understanding your family's approach to life? What about your oncologist or neurologist? Most of us would switch to a physician who spoke our language natively and understood our culture: OB/Gyn patient preferences for female gyns reflect that. Most of us have that luxury, the patients in URM communities do not. That should be changed, even at the cost of selecting A FEW of students who score 'better' in our arbitrary numerical system of LizzyM scores.

 

[TriagePreMed]

You just can't use socioeconomic burdens as an excuse for AA. There is a section where you list your families actual income, and it is not given much weight at all. Why use a generality that URMs are poorer when you have an actual individual scale of how poor or not poor they are.

URM discrimination is still a valid reason for AA, but I think as time goes on we're getting alot better about it as a society and it's becoming less and less needed (I know we're not fully rid of discrimination yet, I'm just saying it's getting better). I stand by my opinion that the main reason for AA is that society wants racially diverse physicians.

We are getting better? Stop listening to the media. Things are horrendous still in America. Have you heard of the kid Treyvon Martin that got murdered? And that's just one in many cases.

I use the generality because the reality says it is. Look at URM in this country and their net income in comparison to white and Asian families. There are significantly many more poor people. And I don't know why people keep pushing in this thread that the disadvantaged box is nearly meaningless and overlooked. Based on what evidence? And based on what evidence are URM taking so many spots? The massive bulk of URM go to HBCs. Until I see evidence that URM outside of HBC are given massive breaks for race alone, I'm going to call it bull. Schools don't keep averages of 3.7 by overloading they classrooms with URM with a 2.0 to 3.4 GPA.

 

[ACE Rx]

Should definitely be discontinued. Only the most qualified applicants (GPA, MCAT, personal statement, extracurricular) should be accepted without regards to race. Penalizing one race, normalizing another, and giving extra credit to other races, I believe, is unethical and degrading at best.

 

[Narmerguy]

There are people far more experienced and knowledgeable in the field of genetics and evolutionary biology on SDN who can easily dismiss your "theory" based on almost every piece of modern research.

Rest assured that anyone who has studied intelligence (that is versed in genetics, psychology, and sociology) knows that Joe has missed the mark as many armchair scientists did before him. Just as a sampler, when studying people of mixed races, those that self identify as "white" have scored higher on IQ tests than those that consider themselves "black" despite being of similar racial backgrounds. The same effect has been shown in twin studies, though this is more difficult to do. Here it's easy to show that people of the same "racial genetic pool" can vary their supposed intelligence (let's ignore the legitimacy of these IQ tests as a measure of intelligence) just by how they view themselves--though obviously their genetics don't change.

Intelligence is complicated. I can say that until I am blue in the face but some people refuse to let go of this idea that all the disparities we see in this country, or even just a portion of it, are the result of genetic inferiority. I've decided, particularly on SDN, that it is not worth my time to argue, nor is this an appropriate place to do so.

 

[Barcu]

You guys are missing the point.

It's not about intelligence or test scores (the URMs accepted do well, so the selection process is not an issue). It's about providing care to a diverse patient population. Shared experiences matter when building relationships with patients, and race is about the biggest one out there.

 

[NickNaylor]

Rest assured that anyone who has studied intelligence (that is versed in genetics, psychology, and sociology) knows that Joe has missed the mark as many armchair scientists did before him. Just as a sampler, when studying people of mixed races, those that self identify as "white" have scored higher on IQ tests than those that consider themselves "black" despite being of similar racial backgrounds. The same effect has been shown in twin studies, though this is more difficult to do. Here it's easy to show that people of the same "racial genetic pool" can vary their supposed intelligence (let's ignore the legitimacy of these IQ tests as a measure of intelligence) just by how they view themselves--though obviously their genetics don't change.

Intelligence is complicated. I can say that until I am blue in the face but some people refuse to let go of this idea that all the disparities we see in this country, or even just a portion of it, are the result of genetic inferiority. I've decided, particularly on SDN, that it is not worth my time to argue, nor is this an appropriate place to do so.

I'm pretty sure Joe came up with an assay that measures the amount of "intelligentsase," a protein he discovered whose concentration is directly correlated to intelligence. Foolproof.

 

[natorx]

I'm taking my URM status to the bank if I can - through undergrad my URm status landed me grant funded research positions?

U mad?

 

[natorx]

All honestly most of you don't plan on practicing in the barrio, hood like I want to... Most URM want to go back to there community.

 

[natorx]

Joe the plumber cited his evidence from the kkk scientific journal

 

[gatorade848]