So what does everyone consider "solid stats"?

[Psycho Doctor]

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I've seen people say "I have solid stats" so I'm curious what everyone thinks constitutes solid stats? And are you just referring to gpa and MCAT or other criteria? Also what does it mean anyway...that you'll get in somewhere? that you'll get in several places? 😕 😕 😕

 

[ElKapitan]

I've seen people say "I have solid stats" so I'm curious what everyone thinks constitutes solid stats? And are you just referring to gpa and MCAT or other criteria? Also what does it mean anyway...that you'll get in somewhere? that you'll get in several places? 😕 😕 😕

My opinion is >=30 MCAT, with a >=3.5 GPA, good EC's with leadership positions, Good LOR from people that will write something that isn't bad. If that isn't clear enough I can eloborate.

 

[Mistress S]

Well, it means different things to different people, but generally when people say this I think they mean they have at least a 30/3.5, and probably higher. Since these are about the averages for accepted applicants, if you have these stats then you should have a good shot at getting in assuming everything else in your app is solid, or at least it won't be your numbers keeping you out at most schools.

 

[45408]

My opinion is >=30 MCAT, with a >=3.5 GPA, good EC's with leadership positions, Good LOR from people that will write something that isn't bad. If that isn't clear enough I can eloborate.

I agree. Possible research/clinical experience, and some volunteering probably. Very good stats would start with ~3.75/35, and excellent would be 3.9/39.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

What if one had very good to excellent stats and lots of ECs /volunteer work (including a lot of clinical)/shadowing but NO research?

 

[DrYo12]

What if one had very good to excellent stats and lots of ECs /volunteer work (including a lot of clinical)/shadowing but NO research?

hmmmm...

 

[abcxyz0123]

what if you were a humanities major with a 3.5/30 but like a 3.0 science gpa?

 

[CarleneM]

What if one had very good to excellent stats and lots of ECs /volunteer work (including a lot of clinical)/shadowing but NO research?

i thinks that for the majority of schools, that will be fine. a school with a heavy research emphasis (ie u of chicago) may be upset but it definitely isn't expected that every student admitted to, say, the top 10 is a gungho researcher and wants to go into academic medicine. i would say having an open attitude towards doing research during med school would get you far in interviews, saying you don't see yourself making a career of it necessarily but feel its important to gain exposure. learning how to do research teaches you a great deal about evaluating others research, which is something every doc should know how to do. play up your strengths (EC's/volunteer) while at the same time acknoweldging it is an area you'd like to grow in (if it comes up).

 

[willthatsall]

what if you were a humanities major with a 3.5/30 but like a 3.0 science gpa?

that 3.0 science gpa is kinda shaky

 

[SanDiegoSOD]

that 3.0 science gpa is kinda shaky

I'd say that it's very shaky. Science GPA is much more important than total GPA, so I'd say that one would have to worry with anything less than a 3.4. A high MCAT can help compensate for a low GPA.

 

[opinionkitten]

what if you were like james watson but only had like a 2.0 science gpa and 21 MCAT. would that nobel in physiology put you into the "very good stats" range?

 

[TripleDegree]

I agree. Possible research/clinical experience, and some volunteering probably. Very good stats would start with ~3.75/35, and excellent would be 3.9/39.

I disagree - a 3.75/35 are excellent stats by any yardstick, and 3.9/39 would be extremely rare/outstanding.

Once you get past a certain threshold of GPA/MCAT, the amount of impact it makes on the Adcom greatly diminishes (law of diminishing returns). Then they tend to look more about other factors - personality, ECs, LORs, essays etc.

 

[53948]

I disagree - a 3.75/35 are excellent stats by any yardstick, and 3.9/39 would be extremely rare/outstanding.

Once you get past a certain threshold of GPA/MCAT, the amount of impact it makes on the Adcom greatly diminishes (law of diminishing returns). Then they tend to look more about other factors - personality, ECs, LORs, essays etc.

i agree

 

[53948]

What if one had very good to excellent stats and lots of ECs /volunteer work (including a lot of clinical)/shadowing but NO research?

depends on the school... california schools weigh research VERY heavily... and i know this because my roommate's sister went to UCSD med and thus did interviews on potential med students...

 

[Fermata]

3.5/30

 

[45408]

What if one had very good to excellent stats and lots of ECs /volunteer work (including a lot of clinical)/shadowing but NO research?

I just went for a pre-med event at MCW (Wisconsin) and they told us that in the 2004 M1 class, EVERY SINGLE ONE had research experience. Take it with a grain of salt, but I'd get some research.

 

[AsianDoc816]

I disagree - a 3.75/35 are excellent stats by any yardstick, and 3.9/39 would be extremely rare/outstanding.

Once you get past a certain threshold of GPA/MCAT, the amount of impact it makes on the Adcom greatly diminishes (law of diminishing returns). Then they tend to look more about other factors - personality, ECs, LORs, essays etc.

I totally agree with this post as well. I mean, is there REALLY that much academic difference between a 3.75/35 student and a 3.9/39 student? Wouldn't you say that they are both incredibly intelligent?

 

[sidewalkman]

I just went for a pre-med event at MCW (Wisconsin) and they told us that in the 2004 M1 class, EVERY SINGLE ONE had research experience. Take it with a grain of salt, but I'd get some research.

I've heard this about other schools, and not just the typical powerhouse research places.

And another vote for 3.5/30

 

[Psycho Doctor]

i thinks that for the majority of schools, that will be fine. a school with a heavy research emphasis (ie u of chicago) may be upset but it definitely isn't expected that every student admitted to, say, the top 10 is a gungho researcher and wants to go into academic medicine. i would say having an open attitude towards doing research during med school would get you far in interviews, saying you don't see yourself making a career of it necessarily but feel its important to gain exposure. learning how to do research teaches you a great deal about evaluating others research, which is something every doc should know how to do. play up your strengths (EC's/volunteer) while at the same time acknoweldging it is an area you'd like to grow in (if it comes up).

yikes!! there goes U of Chicago 🙁
but thanks for the good advice

 

[Psycho Doctor]

I just went for a pre-med event at MCW (Wisconsin) and they told us that in the 2004 M1 class, EVERY SINGLE ONE had research experience. Take it with a grain of salt, but I'd get some research.

how can i do research now at this late date? how involved would I have to be? does it have to get published?

 

[gobblety_gook]

I think one way to define "solid stats" can be the following way...

if your GPA is above 3.3 AND your MCAT is above 27 (with at least an 8 in each section) then:

- if GPAX10 + MCAT between 60-65, ok
- if GPAX10 + MCAT between 65-70, solid
- if GPAX10 + MCAT 70-75, great stats
- if GPAX10 + MCAT 75-80, phenemenol

Again...just a rule of thumb...this breaks down if you push your luck at the boundaries though (i.e. low gpa with high mcat or vice versa).

Also, some might consider using your science gpa instead of your real gpa. Its all fickle. Someone made a great point that after a certain barrier you get to diminishing returns...and I think this is definately true...there is some cutoff where your ECs, recs, LORs, and interview start to matter more than your #'s and this cutoff is different for different schools.

 

[45408]

how can i do research now at this late date? how involved would I have to be? does it have to get published?

not that involved, and no, it doesn't have to be published - just do it

 

[fever5]

although having ones name attached to a few papers doesn't hurt, especially on pubmed.com 🙂

 

[Biscuit799]

What if one had very good to excellent stats and lots of ECs /volunteer work (including a lot of clinical)/shadowing but NO research?

Not having research is no big deal at all. I have lots of volunteer and shadowing (clinical) experiences but very little research experience (none of it is significant, it only helped me realize I don't want to do research). However I got into a state school. Basically it moves you from the "Top 50 Reseach Schools" to the "Top 50 Primary Care Schools." So don't expect to get into Harvard or Duke without any research, but schools like UCSD, Mich St, WF, or DO schools will still take you very seriously as long as you're strong.

 

[Biscuit799]

what if you were a humanities major with a 3.5/30 but like a 3.0 science gpa?

Well in that case you would be me (actually I'm an econ major with a 3.3 sci gpa). Regardless, I'll be attending an allopathic med school next year, so don't let a low sci gpa and not being a sci major get you down. With hard work, careful planning, and a sincere passion for medicine, you'll accomplish your goals. You won't get into Stanford, but hey, you'll be a doctor.

http://mdapplicants.com/viewprofile.php?id=2632

 

[mshheaddoc]

I do not have solid stats. I am a failure 🙁

If you are non-trad, they say don't worry too much about the research 👍 There are other things. I wouldn't worry about it too much this late in the game, but think about it in the future.

 

[opinionkitten]

i think the presence of research experience is good but the absence of it isnt necessarily bad. if youve got other junk it doesnt matter.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

not that involved, and no, it doesn't have to be published - just do it

Can it be any type of research project or do they want to see lab research? I work closely with a psychiatrist and volunteer in a crisis center. CanI somehow formulate a research project through him? I've done independent study before which involved a research study but I somehow didn't think that would count. Can I get involved in clinical trials? Can I conduct my own study on calls I get at the crisis center? At this late date I need to do something I am familiar with rather than starting from notyhing. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

 

[engg06]

hey,
I am a electrical electrical engineering major, what kind of research are we talking about?( im new here )
I still have 2 years left in my degree, do you guys have any advice for what I can do for research. Can it be in any field or medicine related?
As you guys said its not THAT important, but because of my low GPA i wanna get the other corners covered.
Thanks.

 

[Fermata]

Listen, if you don't like research then don't do it.

However, if it's something that sounds remotely cool then give it a shot.

You may just end up liking it and want to pursue it in the future.

Simply doing research to pad your resume is really stupid.

 

[velo]

What if one had very good to excellent stats and lots of ECs /volunteer work (including a lot of clinical)/shadowing but NO research?

oh then they're doomed...DOOOMED!!!

 

[JDAD]

If you wait until the right now to start anything, don't expect to get much credit for it from the adcoms. They will see right through any last ditch efforts to pad your application.


Also, doing anything just to make yourself look good to the adcoms is pretty weak. Do what you like, don't do anything just to impress the masses.

 

[JDAD]

how can i do research now at this late date? how involved would I have to be? does it have to get published?

You can't, it's too late. Stop being a whiner, you know and I know you will have you choice of med schools. (as long as you interview well) Don't worry about anything right now, you are sitting pretty.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

If you wait until the right now to start anything, don't expect to get much credit for it from the adcoms. They will see right through any last ditch efforts to pad your application.


Also, doing anything just to make yourself look good to the adcoms is pretty weak. Do what you like, don't do anything just to impress the masses.

well people started telling me i better have some research. i was only going to do a research study on work i had already done. I'm not sure it's worth it. I suppose research in an independent study counts for much, does it? Of cours ei realize it's sort of weak and my true passion is in clinical medicine, not research and i have plenty of experience with that.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

You can't, it's too late. Stop being a whiner, you know and I know you will have you choice of med schools. (as long as you interview well) Don't worry about anything right now, you are sitting pretty.

ok fine, it's easier on me. and i'm not whining, just trying to do whatever is feasibly possible since all my apps are done and i need to keep doing stuff. it makes me feel better. 😎

 

[DrYo12]

You can't, it's too late. Stop being a whiner, you know and I know you will have you choice of med schools. (as long as you interview well) Don't worry about anything right now, you are sitting pretty.

Good luck!

 

[JDAD]

ok fine, it's easier on me. and i'm not whining, just trying to do whatever is feasibly possible since all my apps are done and i need to keep doing stuff. it makes me feel better. 😎

Don't fret it phych, i have faith in you. You must have worked hard to get where you are, right? So take the well deserved break. Stop stressin and start relaxing. All you can do now is just wait for all your acceptances to roll in. Enjoy the time off and the traveling you get to do for your interviews.

Stressing out won't make the mail man move any faster.

 

[kingcer0x]

I think one way to define "solid stats" can be the following way...

if your GPA is above 3.3 AND your MCAT is above 27 (with at least an 8 in each section) then:

- if GPAX10 + MCAT between 60-65, ok
- if GPAX10 + MCAT between 65-70, solid
- if GPAX10 + MCAT 70-75, great stats
- if GPAX10 + MCAT 75-80, phenemenol

Again...just a rule of thumb...this breaks down if you push your luck at the boundaries though (i.e. low gpa with high mcat or vice versa).

Also, some might consider using your science gpa instead of your real gpa. Its all fickle. Someone made a great point that after a certain barrier you get to diminishing returns...and I think this is definately true...there is some cutoff where your ECs, recs, LORs, and interview start to matter more than your #'s and this cutoff is different for different schools.

'phenomenol' can you drink that? I think some phenomenol is all we need to get into med school, at very least, a hospital connected to a med school.

lets see, the solid stat(e) is defined as:

lim(x-> infinity) GPA(x) + d(MCAT👍)/dy - Grad(z) = acceptances where z: {R| number of times you cried during an interview, number of family members on the admissions committee; how little your mcat score matters when you;'re chillin in the offshore medical school wonderland of your choice; time wasted reading a bored med student dribble about how little scores matter when he in fact got a 46 on the MCAT)

 

[RustNeverSleeps]

Can it be any type of research project or do they want to see lab research? I work closely with a psychiatrist and volunteer in a crisis center. CanI somehow formulate a research project through him? I've done independent study before which involved a research study but I somehow didn't think that would count. Can I get involved in clinical trials? Can I conduct my own study on calls I get at the crisis center? At this late date I need to do something I am familiar with rather than starting from notyhing. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

I definitely would not do that. At any university (I don't know if your crisis center is affiliated with a university or not), any research using human participants requires IRB approval. You can't just decide to suddenly do a study on calls you get a crisis center because you want to be a more competitive med school applicant. In addition, you need to get someone's consent before s/he participates in research. Would you want to take the time and risk losing the trust of people who are calling into a crisis center, especially since this project would mostly be to benefit you? I think it is at best ethically questionable and at worst could cause serious trouble.

However, volunteering at a crisis center is very impressive. I'm sure you have some interesting things to tell interviewers about that -- so appreciate the unique aspects of your own application instead of worrying so much about research and other things you might not have done. If you are applying to medical school now (which from all your questions, I hope you are -- otherwise you really need to relax 🙂 ), it's probably too late to start any meaningful research, and it might look to Adcoms like some kind of ploy. I'm sure you will be fine with what you have done already!

 

[abraxas20]

that 3.0 science gpa is kinda shaky

Grrr...this always drives me nuts....there is a difference if you are gunning for top ten or trying to go to your state school too.

The 3.5/30 stats may actually be high for your instate choice, but crappy for Big Name U.

By the way my science gpa is WAY lower than my cumulative...and both were a lot lower than you have all recommended, and I got in just fine. First choice school, ED.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

congrats!!!

 

[gobblety_gook]

I definitely would not do that. At any university (I don't know if your crisis center is affiliated with a university or not), any research using human participants requires IRB approval. You can't just decide to suddenly do a study on calls you get a crisis center because you want to be a more competitive med school applicant. In addition, you need to get someone's consent before s/he participates in research. Would you want to take the time and risk losing the trust of people who are calling into a crisis center, especially since this project would mostly be to benefit you? I think it is at best ethically questionable and at worst could cause serious trouble.

However, volunteering at a crisis center is very impressive. I'm sure you have some interesting things to tell interviewers about that -- so appreciate the unique aspects of your own application instead of worrying so much about research and other things you might not have done. If you are applying to medical school now (which from all your questions, I hope you are -- otherwise you really need to relax 🙂 ), it's probably too late to start any meaningful research, and it might look to Adcoms like some kind of ploy. I'm sure you will be fine with what you have done already!

 

[45408]

Listen, if you don't like research then don't do it.

However, if it's something that sounds remotely cool then give it a shot.

You may just end up liking it and want to pursue it in the future.

Simply doing research to pad your resume is really stupid.

Like I said though, at my particular in-state school, which is in the middle of the pack (something like ~45 on US News in research), every single person in this year's class of over 200 had research experience. Take that as you may, but it sure sounds like schools like to see that.

 

[Cerberus]

What if a circle was a square and your mother was your father?

 

[Ross434]

"What if the devil had sex with a dog, and your mother, was that very dog." (Master shake)

 

[fullefect1]

I think one way to define "solid stats" can be the following way...

if your GPA is above 3.3 AND your MCAT is above 27 (with at least an 8 in each section) then:

- if GPAX10 + MCAT between 60-65, ok
- if GPAX10 + MCAT between 65-70, solid
- if GPAX10 + MCAT 70-75, great stats
- if GPAX10 + MCAT 75-80, phenemenol

Again...just a rule of thumb...this breaks down if you push your luck at the boundaries though (i.e. low gpa with high mcat or vice versa).

Also, some might consider using your science gpa instead of your real gpa. Its all fickle. Someone made a great point that after a certain barrier you get to diminishing returns...and I think this is definately true...there is some cutoff where your ECs, recs, LORs, and interview start to matter more than your #'s and this cutoff is different for different schools.

Rule of thumb? I have heard 3.5/30 about 10,000 times, but this is a first for your post. Where did you come up with this equation type of a thing?

 

[Ypo.]

Rule of thumb? I have heard 3.5/30 about 10,000 times, but this is a first for your post. Where did you come up with this equation type of a thing?

I've seen it in some medical school preparation books.

 

[zpdoc]

I think the best thing you can do is write in your personal statement about how you have logically deduced that evolution is crap and that all schools should teach creationism instead.

Trust me, they'll be impressed with your strong convictions.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

I think the best thing you can do is write in your personal statement about how you have logically deduced that evolution is crap and that all schools should teach creationism instead.

Trust me, they'll be impressed with your strong convictions.

too late..my PS has long ago been submitted and i never mentioned it; perhaps i could bring it up at the interview...??!! 😎

 

[Surg Path]

I totally agree with this post as well. I mean, is there REALLY that much academic difference between a 3.75/35 student and a 3.9/39 student? Wouldn't you say that they are both incredibly intelligent?

Further, the difference between a 32 and 39 is dependent on more variables. Have you published any research as first author? Are your articles in well respected peer reviewed journals? Have you received any grants for your research projects?

Recent stats of med school aplicants at the best schools indicate that this type of accomplishment may weigh heavier than 2 or 6 points higher on your MCATS. Also, LOR from research 'big wigs' can add a little weight.

That said, if you don't hit a 31+ and 3.6 gpa you might look for schools that emphasize publications in research (NOT JUST WORKING IN A LAB- all this means is that you knwo how to pipette a microtiter plate).