Something Unethical?

Discussion in 'Pre-Medical - MD' started by DrRayRay, May 8, 2008.

  1. DrRayRay

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    Hello Everyone,

    I have to write a paper for my bioethics class on a controversial issue involving and ethical dilema. Can anybody share some real life stories theyve heard about, seen themselves, or even read about? I've searched all the forums and can't find anything other than hypothetical situations. I'm looking for a real deal story of something that's actually happened.

    Thanks for your help!
     
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  3. nonesuchgirl

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  4. flip26

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    What about the mother who got pregnant with a second child so that the sick first child would get some benefit (umbilical cord goop, maybe?)...

    Or the hospital where body parts were harvested and sold without permission...

    You know, you are the one who has taken a class in this stuff - no ideas from it?
     
  5. Kaustikos

    Kaustikos Archerize It

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    Seriously.
    I can't emphasize that enough.
     
  6. HumidBeing

    HumidBeing In Memory of Riley Jane
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    This forum is filled with examples. Just use SEARCH and try "cheating" or "ethical". I immediately came up with piles of them.
     
  7. Kaustikos

    Kaustikos Archerize It

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    Or wait until this summer's continuing session of naive premeds giving this information out for secondary apps. :smuggrin:
     
  8. nonesuchgirl

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    idk... i think if i have to write about ethical dilemmas i'm going to write about people who ask other people to do their assignments about ethical dilemmas for them...
     
  9. DrRayRay

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    why is it so funny that i am trying to find something thats been in the current news about someone acting unethical?
     
  10. DrRayRay

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    im not asking anyone to write my paper, im asking about a specific case i can write my paper on
     
  11. nonesuchgirl

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    because it's unethical to get other people to do your work.

    google.
     
  12. DrRayRay

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    maybe you should read my question a little closer..i didnt ask for someone to write a paper.. you dont even have a clue about what my paper has to be on..i just asked for help find a specific case to write on
     
  13. LizzyM

    LizzyM the evil queen of numbers
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    Look at the titles of articles that appeared in back issues of the American Journal of Bioethics

    http://www.bioethics.net/journal/issues.php

    Something should catch your eye and you'll have a bunch of articles to jumpstart your research (the journal usually publishes a main piece and several short reaction papers in response in each issue).
     
  14. HumidBeing

    HumidBeing In Memory of Riley Jane
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    There is a question on some secondaries which asks students to describe a situation where they had to make a decision involving ethics. Every summer people come on here trying to be sneaky & get others to do the work for them.

    You just haven't seen it happen, yet.
     
  15. Kaustikos

    Kaustikos Archerize It

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    Okay, here's what I did.

    I took your class

    BIOETHICS

    copied it
    pasted it in GOOGLE

    and got this:
    http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=bioethics&btnG=Search

    Coincidentally, the same as LizzyM.
     
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  17. DrRayRay

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    well that explains why some people are such a$$es on here..like i said before..i'm just looking for a current event that has created controversy in the media so i can write my paper on
     
  18. LizzyM

    LizzyM the evil queen of numbers
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    Yeah, but I have a subscription so I bypassed Google and went straight to the journal.
     
  19. teachmed27

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    Chill man, you're just asking for it when you start a thread like this. 95% of the responses you will get is "Go do your own research!" Just take the info you were fortunate to get from here and run with it.
     
  20. EpiPEN

    EpiPEN Aegis of Immortality

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    show-off ;)
     
  21. Kaustikos

    Kaustikos Archerize It

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    My point was; he obviously didn't do his homework. Putting your name was just for reference, I suppose. Anyways.

    Is it really that difficult to use google for searching?
     
  22. Myuu

    Myuu 例えば、貴方の名前を忘れてしまうとか。 。。
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    Autonomy and terminal minors is always an interesting read.
     
  23. Martin Prince

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    http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2003699286_childrens09m.html

    This was a pretty hot case up in Seattle last year. Basically, a physically and mentally disabled 6 year old girl was given a hysterectomy which would limit her growth so her family could care for her as she ages. It could make an interesting paper.

    Ignore the rest of these posts on here. God help you if you go on an internet forum and ask a question.
     
  24. DrRayRay

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    i did do my homework and did try to come across a story that was recently in the news, but wasn't able to find anything. again, im not asking anyone to do my assignment..just looking for a good story to base my paper on.
     
  25. DrRayRay

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    i read about this myself and found it very interesting, the only problem is that the teacher used it in class for one of our discussions so its hands off :(
     
  26. devilpup

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    to the OP,

    In my Bio-Medical ethics course we spent two weeks analyzing issues about advance directives. Philosophers like Dworkin, Thomson, and McMahan have published great papers (you can find them in pubmed) and provide analysis on cases like the following which was taken from the Journal of Law, Healthcare and Ethics:

    Daniel is a 90-year-old man who has recently been admitted to a short-term, in-hospital nursing facility for the elderly because he has been exhibiting signs of dementia along with behavior problems. Daniel's dementia has been leading to difficulties with eating and drinking. He is unable to swallow food or drink without getting them into his lungs. Daniel is in good health otherwise and has no terminal diseases and seems relatively happy. His behavior problems have been easily controlled with medication and he enjoys watching TV, reading (more or less) the newspaper, and talking to people. By all accounts he is relatively happy and content with his surroundings, except for his eating problems. The doctors have decided that the only way to feed Daniel effectively is to insert a feeding tube into his stomach.

    Several years ago, Daniel signed a living will indicating that nothing extraordinary should be done to keep him alive if he were ever in such a state that he could not competently consent to treatment. This living will apparently precludes the insertion of a feeding tube. The doctors, in consultation with Daniel's family, have decided that he will not be given nutrition and hydration since they feel this would violate the intent of his living will. Daniel has not been given food and water for several days, although he has constantly complained of being hungry and has asked why he hasn't been given any food. He cannot currently remember having signed a living will and legally lacks the competence to change such a document. He does not, however, currently wish to starve to death and has repeatedly expressed the desire to stay alive, even if it means being intubated, although it is certainly unclear whether he can understand what being intubated would entail.

    Daniel's family and HCPs are thus faced with the decision of whether to intubate him or allow him to die. At t1, a presumably competent person signed a living will generally forbidding such a procedure. At t2, a seemingly incompetent patient appears to want the procedure, although it does not appear that he fully understands what it entails, nor does he presumably understand why it will help him not feel hungry any more. The patient at t2 does seem to be enjoying his life because by all accounts he is relatively happy most of the time, even though his cognitive capacities are severely limited. His family, who are typically called upon to make his healthcare decisions for him, wish to refuse the procedure.


    Should Daniel be intubated?

    BTW, take the mean comments with a grain of salt :smuggrin:. Pre-allo forum can be like that.
     
  27. Martin Prince

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    Hmmm, so the Seattle case is out. I believe there's a lawsuit brewing somewhere about a transplant surgeon being present at the time of death of a donor. I read about it somewhere on SDN a few weeks ago. The alleged misconduct and the ethical issues surrounding the appropriate roles and actions of organ donation professionals could be interesting as well.
     
  28. seansss

    seansss ATX

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    I just finished a report on the exact same thing. I two books, one was Bioethics and the other was Medical Ethics. Both books had compiled various articles on topics like assisted suicide, organ transplants, and reproductive medicine. http://www.bioethics.net/ is also a good site, and it have many of the articles in the books I mentioned.
     
  29. HIVdoc2b

    HIVdoc2b Bored.

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    In Seattle, a Hep C pt just died, unable to be listed for a liver transplant due to medical marijuana use.
     
  30. bigDee

    bigDee Junior Member

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    The old man shouldn't get the procedure. When he signed the will, he already took into consideration that he may at one point want to live by means of doing such a procedure. So if he says he doesn't ever want such a procedure done, then it shouldn't be done. He knew he would eventually be begging for it and still didn't want a procedure done in the future if he got in that situation.
     
  31. Bacchus

    Administrator Moderator Physician

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    Go read My Sister's Keeper. You'll finish it in two days and have tons to write about.
     
  32. LifetimeDoc

    LifetimeDoc EM Attending
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    YES; a living will cannot tie the hands of a patient or sentence them to death if they are able to articulate that they wish to live. It's unethical to have a person begging to live, but you just stand idly by (or actively) and let/cause the person to die. Living wills are for those who cannot be understood, and are to direct those who are empowered to make decisions for the person to follow to the letter. Since the patient can articulate and make himself understood, even if minimally, you can't sentence him to die because of a piece of paper.
     
  33. nonesuchgirl

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    qft
     
  34. Wylde

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    On a similar note: The mother who has a sick kid (cancer of some kind) and then has a second child so they can be used for transplants (kidney, bone marrow, blood, etc.).

    I saw it on a tv show haha (I think it was "without a trace").
     
  35. LifetimeDoc

    LifetimeDoc EM Attending
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    what does "qft" mean?
     
  36. nonesuchgirl

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    quoted for truth
     
  37. nonesuchgirl

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    CSI
     
  38. Farmer Jane

    Farmer Jane Anti-ANA RN

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  39. devilpup

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    In actuality, the demented patient was starved/dehydrated to death.

    The reasoning is based on the concept of "precedent autonomy." The advance directive is supposed to represent his critical interest back when he had full autonomy. Since he suffers from dementia, his current autonomy was questioned, and caretakers looked for the best evidence of what his autonomous state would desire. In this case, the best evidence of his precedent autonomy was represented in his advance directive.

    I think the true debate is whether his precedent autonomy trumps his current best interest (e.g. 'experiental interests' which include being fed, watching TV, reading the newspaper, enjoying himself regardless of his demented state).

    I agree with you, he should've be fed. But in the eyes of many (including providers and family members), honoring the advance directive is the way to go...so sad...
     
  40. paranoid_eyes

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    it's funny because your topic is too broad.

    anyways, if you want an example of anything, search Dr. Prem Reddy on google. there was a LA times piece done on his questionable medical/business practices.
     
  41. LifetimeDoc

    LifetimeDoc EM Attending
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    In my real life medical school ethics class we came to the conclusion that I outlined. If what you say is true, then God help us all. I'd be afraid to be a patient in such a system where people take it upon themselves to play God.
     
  42. Steeler7588

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    Is it really such an outrageous decision? Just reading over the situation briefly, surely it's got to be taken into account how competent the patient is when he's making these new demands. Think about it. A patient, fully competent and under no immediate duress to his health, makes a decision to forego certain procedures/treatments. He wants to reverse this decision (unknowingly, he has no memory of making such a decision previously right?) when he is now incompetent. Is weighting the decision of a competent person over their decision while incompetent really "playing God"? It's unfortunate that he ended up starving to death. At the same time, it's also respecting the wishes of a man, of sound mind, who presumably had thought it over and had good reasons for making such a decision in the first place.
     

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