Specialties to recommend with good prospects?

[planisphere]

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I am a now a rising D3. My current rank is within 15% (hopefully it stays that way). I am hearing slightly different things about the future of some specialties, so I hope to get some more opinions from fellow dentists here. I'd appreciate some of your insights based on your real world experience out there...thank you.

What I read/heard so far, simply put:
Ortho is dying (GPs being able to take more and more cases with advancing technology)
Pros is dying
Endo is dying (patients just preferring to get implants)
Peds is always in need
Perio is a descent option
Dental anesthesiology is a descent option

I've been interested in Ortho or Endo, but I've been hearing mixed opinions. I'd appreciate any input for the lost D2 and motivation!...

 

[Pleurodynia]

You forgot the best one. Choose whichever you like the best, all of the specialties have good futures as long as your debt is not too crazy

 

[JacquesVallee]

Endo is dying (patients just preferring to get implants)

Endo isn't dying. It's still preferable to save a natural tooth with endo over an implant. The endo I refer to is very very busy.

I've been interested in Ortho or Endo, but I've been hearing mixed opinions. I'd appreciate any input for the lost D2 and motivation!...

Both have good prospects. Ortho isn't the golden goose it once was but they still do well. I'd imagine the endo job market is better than ortho but you should ultimately go into the field you see yourself doing for the next 20+ years.

 

[planisphere]

Endo isn't dying. It's still preferable to save a natural tooth with endo over an implant. The endo I refer to is very very busy.

Both have good prospects. Ortho isn't the golden goose it once was but they still do well. I'd imagine the endo job market is better than ortho but you should ultimately go into the field you see yourself doing for the next 20+ years.

Yes, my mentors at school told me regardless I have to experience and find the one that I enjoy doing + be good/fast at. I hope to find that 'one' in clinic years.

 

[JacquesVallee]

Yes, my mentors at school told me regardless I have to experience and find the one that I enjoy doing + be good/fast at. I hope to find that 'one' in clinic years.

Also, don't rule out general dentistry. Just because you have a good class rank doesn't mean you have to specialize. A GP owner can make just as much as a specialist. Moreover, you can always go back to specialize. In fact, endo really values general dentistry experience.

 

[DustFreeEraser]

Don't count on pedo.

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[planisphere]

Don't count on pedo.

Dentaltown - Where The Dental Community Lives®

Dentaltown is an interactive healthcare community working to connect dentists to their peers, dental service providers and manufacturers. Dentaltown has the most comprehensive online dental collection of dental forums, clinical cases, continuing education (CE) courses, magazine articles...

www.dentaltown.com

Why not?

 

[702]

Oral and Maxillofacial Surgery.

 

[JustWisdom]

Hi OP

I’m a 2023 Grad and I have some insight to share as a GP. I had the same thoughts as you while in dental school and even before I started back in 2017-2019. Here were my thoughts back then:
Ortho - was dying clear aligners are dominating
Prosth - is just advanced general dentistry
Endo - an implant is way better isn’t it?
Peds - cash money
Perio - where the implants were at
OS - no words needed — always needed
DA - was still new and I didn’t know much of it back then

Fast forward to 2025 and here is my perspective after working in Private Practice. Again I don’t speak on behalf of anyone, only my own.
Ortho - Still strong but diluted. I do my own clear aligners and keep myself pretty busy with it. Though, there are cases where I wouldn’t touch. I have ortho come into my office once a week to do every case I don’t touch.
Prosth - In my opinion Proths is strong in the hospital or academic setting. Fabricating a prosthesis for a SCC or malignant path survivor should not be made by just any dentist. Proths takes the throne here.
Endo - Definitely not dead and nowhere near dying. I do all my endo except for re-treats. Majority of patients elect to RCT + Crown on a saveable tooth over EXT + implant. I always tell my patients - implants are the best option for the replacement of NO Teeth not the replacement FOR teeth. My example when explaining the difference between an implant and endo is - a well placed implant is like a sports car - It’s nice, it’s new. However if it breaks down it’s expensive to repair. (Failing implant = explant + bone graft + another implant). A well done Endo is like a Camry. Reliable, predictable, tried and true (one of the oldest type of restorative techniques), cheaper to repair (re-tx, some cases - apico surgery)
Peds - Still doing great, however, you do not need to specialize to do Pedo. There is a massive DSO specially for the pediatric population that hire majority GPs if you were interested. I refer all peds patients Perio - In my opinion Perio is still strong in certain areas/ populations where patients are conscious and concerned about their health. I send SOO many Perio referrals of patients who have had unsuccessful SRPs / arrestin but they return in the exact same condition saying that after the Perio consult… “4 quads of osseous surgery, CTG, FTG, bone graft, open flap debridement is too much money and insurance doesn’t cover it, so I’ll just deal with this recession. It doesn’t hurt me anyways”. And with so many GPs and OS placing implants (myself included), patients choose the cheaper option anyways. Don’t get me wrong, if I had to get an implant on myself in an esthetic area or had to refer friends or family, I’d send them to a periodontist but there are so many patients out there who just want the cheapest screw.
OS - still the same - no words needed, always needed

And as stated above, you don’t HAVE to specialize if you are top of your class, good Super GPs are hard to come by and they have it tough, it’s very demanding but also extremely rewarding.

In any case, this is my last year as a GP. Going into Endo! Good luck in school.

 

[Big Time Hoosier]

Seems like you want to specialize for the sake of specializing. That’s the wrong way to go about it.

Big Hoss

 

[unsatisfiedomfs]

Hoss updated the PFP

 

[charlestweed]

To get paid as a specialist, you have to sit down and perform the procedures. So the busier you are and the more patients you treat, the more money you will make. In order to get patients to walk into your office, you need to have good communication with your referring GPs. If you are willing to go door to door to meet the GPs and show them that you can do good work for their patients, then you will have a lot of patients and you will love your job more. If you are a shy person and hate going door to door (I hate doing this too), then the only option you have is to travel to work at multiple GP and DSO offices in order to keep yourself busy. It depends on how hard you are willing to work. It depends on your clinical skills. The more complex procedures you can successfully treat, the more trust you will earn from your referring GPs and the more cases they will refer to your office.

I didn’t know dental anesthesiology is a good specialty until my wife, who’s a perio, started working at my friend’s pedo/ortho office, where she does mostly 3rd molar extractions and canine exposures under IV sedation, 2 years ago. My cousin, who’s a MD anesthesiologist, recently joined this practice as well. I recently joined this practice as well. I am semi-retire so I have free time to drive my wife to work at this office because it’s an 1.5 hour drive each way (I don’t care because the Tesla’s autopilot makes driving around the city so easy). The ortho owner of this pedo/ortho office saw this and I asked if I could help cover for him whenever I am with my wife.

It’s not hard to find jobs. You just have to be willing to travel multiple offices because each office can only save a few cases for you.

 

[D1Bound]

To get paid as a specialist, you have to sit down and perform the procedures. So the busier you are and the more patients you treat, the more money you will make. In order to get patients to walk into your office, you need to have good communication with your referring GPs. If you are willing to go door to door to meet the GPs and show them that you can do good work for their patients, then you will have a lot of patients and you will love your job more. If you are a shy person and hate going door to door (I hate doing this too), then the only option you have is to travel to work at multiple GP and DSO offices in order to keep yourself busy. It depends on how hard you are willing to work. It depends on your clinical skills. The more complex procedures you can successfully treat, the more trust you will earn from your referring GPs and the more cases they will refer to your office.

It didn’t know dental anesthesiology is a good specialty until my wife, who’s a perio, started working at my friend’s pedo/ortho office, where she does mostly 3rd molar extractions and canine exposures under IV sedation, 2 years ago. My cousin, who’s a MD anesthesiologist, recently joined this practice as well. I recently joined this practice as well. I am semi-retire so I have free time to drive my wife to work at this office because it’s an 1.5 hour drive each way (I don’t care because the Tesla’s autopilot makes driving around the city so easy). The ortho owner of this pedo/ortho office saw this and I asked if I could help cover for him whenever I am with my wife.

It’s not hard to find jobs. You just have to be willing to travel multiple offices because each office can only save a few cases for you.

Why is your wife a periodontist not doing perio?

 

[charlestweed]

Why is your wife a periodontist not doing perio?

Not at this office because all the patients there are under 18 yo and don't have perio disease. Even the orthodontist owner there doesn't treat adult patients. My wife does perio at other offices and her own office.

 

[acciDentally]

Why is your wife a periodontist not doing perio?

General dentists are doing 3rds and sedations by the way not just periodontists! I only refer the worst 3rds to oral surgeons (unhealthy patients that are severely obese, multiple blood thinners), the rest I do myself. I send implants to perio unless they are extremely unhealthy and can't be treated safely in most offices. Usually those oral surgeons end up referring them to academic centers too since they don't want to deal with difficult things in their office either.

Just letting you know there isn't any gate keeping between specialties and other providers and it's on you to earn referrals, being an OMFS isn't the end all be all outside of dental school.

Seems like you want to specialize for the sake of specializing. That’s the wrong way to go about it.

Big Hoss

Agreed. I had the grades but wasn't interested in pigeonholing into one area alone. I have benefitted financially by doing so, and I didn't have to waste 4-6 more years living like a student or worse. Specialize only if you are truly interested in the work OR you can't hack it like I can with CE courses and good business sense.

 

[0bliqueridge]

Agreed. I had the grades but wasn't interested in pigeonholing into one area alone. I have benefitted financially by doing so, and I didn't have to waste 4-6 more years living like a student or worse. Specialize only if you are truly interested in the work OR you can't hack it like I can with CE courses and good business sense.

cope

 

[D1Bound]

cope

1000%.

 

[SuxDrugs&Rocuronium]

General dentists are doing 3rds and sedations by the way not just periodontists!

Just don’t kill your patients!

Following deaths, North Carolina families demand stricter dental anesthesia laws

An uptick in deaths in the dental chair lead to calls for more rules and oversight over how dentists administer anesthesia.

www.wral.com

.


Agreed. I had the grades but wasn't interested in pigeonholing into one area alone. I have benefitted financially by doing so, and I didn't have to waste 4-6 more years living like a student or worse. Specialize only if you are truly interested in the work OR you can't hack it like I can with CE courses and good business sense.

Sound logic. If you can’t hack it in general dentistry, you’ll definitely be able to prepare and match into the very competitive specialities and then endure a rigorous 2-6 years to then have to still go into private practice.



That was sarcasm in case anyone missed it.

I also find it humorous when people think some weekend CE courses are equivalent training to specialty residencies.

To the OP, dental anesthesiology is a great field to go into with a huge demand. But you have to truly be interested in it because it’s not easy

 

[702]

Why is your wife a periodontist not doing perio?

It sounds like because she’s doing very well doing omfs procedures at that pedo/ortho office.

 

[dentalinthemental]

Just don’t kill your patients!

Following deaths, North Carolina families demand stricter dental anesthesia laws

An uptick in deaths in the dental chair lead to calls for more rules and oversight over how dentists administer anesthesia.

www.wral.com

oral surgeons have great anesthesia training, but don’t forget death is a possible risk of sedation for all providers, regardless of training.

https://amp.tri-cityherald.com/news/state/washington/article296953784.html

 

[SuxDrugs&Rocuronium]

oral surgeons have great anesthesia training, but don’t forget death is a possible risk of sedation for all providers, regardless of training.

https://amp.tri-cityherald.com/news/state/washington/article296953784.html

Yeah i understand that. I’m not an oral surgeon. I also don’t support the operator/anesthetist model.

 

[charlestweed]

I know a few OS's who stopped doing IV sedation in their offices. My cousin, who is a MD anesthesiologist, currently works part time at an OS office. I thought it's because this OS is doing plastic surgeries. But my cousin told me that he also helps the OS sedate the patients for 3rd molar extractions.

My dental school classmate, who is an OS, also stopped doing IV sedation in his office. His OS partner gave up the partnership to work full time for Kaiser hospital, where he does mostly orthognathic surgeries.

 

[LFA20]

OS

 

[acciDentally]

Just don’t kill your patients!

None so far!

 

[D1Bound]

Yeah i understand that. I’m not an oral surgeon. I also don’t support the operator/anesthetist model.

Why don’t you support that model of anesthesia?

 

[Big Time Hoosier]

Yeah i understand that. I’m not an oral surgeon. I also don’t support the operator/anesthetist model.

As a pediatric dentist, I hate being the operator/anesthetist even with just moderate sedation. So, I stopped offering it. If your kid can’t handle treatment with N2O, my nurse anesthetist friend is gonna drug them up. Heck, research suggests that with kids the failure rate of a moderate sedation is around 25%. If you have less than that, you’re over sedating the kids and you’re eventually gonna hurt someone. If I’ve got a 1/4 chance that I’m not going to get any treatment done with a moderate sedation, then it’s not worth my time and it’s too disruptive to my schedule.

Big Hoss

 

[SuxDrugs&Rocuronium]

Why don’t you support that model of anesthesia?

It’s difficult to focus on both. Anesthesia alone requires a great deal of attention, providers should be monitoring at minimum 4-5 monitors, and it can be easy to miss small changes. And those small changes can turn into big changes very quickly. It’s be one thing if the patients were intubated but most of them are doing deep sedation with and open airway, which increases the risk of airway issues, and if they do happen, it can be easy to miss initially if you’re focused on drilling bone and controlling bleeding in the posterior pharynx. I’m sure I’ll get multiple rebuttals about this.

 

[0bliqueridge]

It’s difficult to focus on both. Anesthesia alone requires a great deal of attention, providers should be monitoring at minimum 4-5 monitors, and it can be easy to miss small changes. And those small changes can turn into big changes very quickly. It’s be one thing if the patients were intubated but most of them are doing deep sedation with and open airway, which increases the risk of airway issues, and if they do happen, it can be easy to miss initially if you’re focused on drilling bone and controlling bleeding in the posterior pharynx. I’m sure I’ll get multiple rebuttals about this.

regardless of your opinion, the safety rate of sedation provided by oral surgeons speaks for itself

 

[Allsmiles!]

regardless of your opinion, the safety rate of sedation provided by oral surgeons speaks for itself

@SuxDrugs&Rocuronium is this not true 👆🏻

 

[yappy]

It’s difficult to focus on both. Anesthesia alone requires a great deal of attention, providers should be monitoring at minimum 4-5 monitors, and it can be easy to miss small changes. And those small changes can turn into big changes very quickly. It’s be one thing if the patients were intubated but most of them are doing deep sedation with and open airway, which increases the risk of airway issues, and if they do happen, it can be easy to miss initially if you’re focused on drilling bone and controlling bleeding in the posterior pharynx. I’m sure I’ll get multiple rebuttals about this.

This makes sense to me. It’s why I work with a traveling anesthesiologist. No one can do both 100%. Also, I don’t think you should discount the training you do in residency that is exclusively focused on anesthesia.

 

[SuxDrugs&Rocuronium]

@SuxDrugs&Rocuronium is this not true 👆🏻

You tell me.

Patient death leads oral surgeon to surrender license

An oral surgeon has voluntarily surrendered his license for allegedly practicing below the standard of care.

www.drbicuspid.com

17-year-old’s death during wisdom teeth removal surgery was ‘completely preventable,’ lawsuit says

A 17-year-old died during a routine wisdom tooth removal in Washington state back in June, and his parents filed a lawsuit this week against the surgeon.

www.wsaz.com

Man Dies After Being Given Too Much Anesthesia During Dental Surgery: Coroner

A Lake County dentist is the subject of an investigation by the state’s attorney’s office after a patient died following a dental procedure in early June.

www.nbcchicago.com

https://jada.ada.org/action/showPdf?pii=S0002-8177%2815%2900459-6

“Using the available data and informational
reports, the authors estimate that the incidence of death and
brain injury associated with deep sedation or general anesthesia administered by all dentists most likely exceeds 1 per
month………..Airway compromise is a significant contributing factor to anesthetic complications. The American Society of Anesthesiology closed claim analysis also concluded that human error contributed highly to anesthetic mishaps.”

So we’re okay with a once per month death/hypoxic brain injury? I also never said anything about oral surgeons specifically, I’m talking about anyone who does operator/anesthetist, but I find it interesting that omfs immediately jumps into defense mode.

 

[acciDentally]

You tell me.

Patient death leads oral surgeon to surrender license

An oral surgeon has voluntarily surrendered his license for allegedly practicing below the standard of care.

www.drbicuspid.com

17-year-old’s death during wisdom teeth removal surgery was ‘completely preventable,’ lawsuit says

A 17-year-old died during a routine wisdom tooth removal in Washington state back in June, and his parents filed a lawsuit this week against the surgeon.

www.wsaz.com

Man Dies After Being Given Too Much Anesthesia During Dental Surgery: Coroner

A Lake County dentist is the subject of an investigation by the state’s attorney’s office after a patient died following a dental procedure in early June.

www.nbcchicago.com

https://jada.ada.org/action/showPdf?pii=S0002-8177%2815%2900459-6

“Using the available data and informational
reports, the authors estimate that the incidence of death and
brain injury associated with deep sedation or general anesthesia administered by all dentists most likely exceeds 1 per
month………..Airway compromise is a significant contributing factor to anesthetic complications. The American Society of Anesthesiology closed claim analysis also concluded that human error contributed highly to anesthetic mishaps.”

So we’re okay with a once per month death/hypoxic brain injury? I also never said anything about oral surgeons specifically, I’m talking about anyone who does operator/anesthetist, but I find it interesting that omfs immediately jumps into defense mode.

OMFS want to keep making that cash so they push for it. You want to dive into their market if it's taken from them so you push against it. Meanwhile me the general dentist giving sedation for as long as the policy allows me to as well! Although it begs the question, why not be a real anesthesiologist instead of a dental anesthesiologist? Or a CRNA? They seem to be practicing in dental offices too!

 

[0bliqueridge]

So we’re okay with a once per month death/hypoxic brain injury? I also never said anything about oral surgeons specifically, I’m talking about anyone who does operator/anesthetist, but I find it interesting that omfs immediately jumps into defense mode.

ok but Im talking about oral surgeons.

0.1% AEs and 0% mortality rate in this study of almost 18,000 sedations. This is just one paper, you'll find these same results reproduced in many others. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0278239120314257

whats the point of posting isolated events that made the news?
check this out: Florida surgeon mistakenly removes patient's liver instead of spleen, causing him to die, widow says
general surgeons should probably stop doing splenectomys right? I mean look what happened...

 

[Big Time Hoosier]

I’m talking about anyone who does operator/anesthetist, but I find it interesting that omfs immediately jumps into defense mode.

Big Hoss

 

[acciDentally]

ok but Im talking about oral surgeons.

0.1% AEs and 0% mortality rate in this study of almost 18,000 sedations. This is just one paper, you'll find these same results reproduced in many others. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0278239120314257

whats the point of posting isolated events that made the news?
check this out: Florida surgeon mistakenly removes patient's liver instead of spleen, causing him to die, widow says
general surgeons should probably stop doing splenectomys right? I mean look what happened...

You will find that the oral surgeon's voice is smaller than all of the ASA and a few dental anesthesiologists. Even if your logic is debatably sound, a majority defeats a minority! I wonder how many years a small subspecialty like OMFS can continue fighting this fight. Anesthesiologists couldn't do anything about CRNAs, but they sure will win against oral surgeons eventually.

 

[nots0dumb]

You tell me.

Patient death leads oral surgeon to surrender license

An oral surgeon has voluntarily surrendered his license for allegedly practicing below the standard of care.

www.drbicuspid.com

17-year-old’s death during wisdom teeth removal surgery was ‘completely preventable,’ lawsuit says

A 17-year-old died during a routine wisdom tooth removal in Washington state back in June, and his parents filed a lawsuit this week against the surgeon.

www.wsaz.com

Man Dies After Being Given Too Much Anesthesia During Dental Surgery: Coroner

A Lake County dentist is the subject of an investigation by the state’s attorney’s office after a patient died following a dental procedure in early June.

www.nbcchicago.com

https://jada.ada.org/action/showPdf?pii=S0002-8177%2815%2900459-6

“Using the available data and informational
reports, the authors estimate that the incidence of death and
brain injury associated with deep sedation or general anesthesia administered by all dentists most likely exceeds 1 per
month………..Airway compromise is a significant contributing factor to anesthetic complications. The American Society of Anesthesiology closed claim analysis also concluded that human error contributed highly to anesthetic mishaps.”

So we’re okay with a once per month death/hypoxic brain injury? I also never said anything about oral surgeons specifically, I’m talking about anyone who does operator/anesthetist, but I find it interesting that omfs immediately jumps into defense mode.

why don't you post some actual studies instead of random articles?

Ontario- The estimated prevalence of mortality in the 20-year period from 1996 to 2015 was 3 deaths in 3,742,068 cases, with an adjusted mortality rate of 0.8 deaths per 1 million cases. The estimated prevalence of serious morbidity was 1 injury in 3,742,068 cases, which adjusts to a serious morbidity rate of 0.25 per 1 million cases.

Mortality and Morbidity in Office-Based General Anesthesia for Dentistry in Ontario - PMC

Our objective was to estimate the prevalence of mortality and serious morbidity for office-based deep sedation and general anesthesia (DS/GA) for dentistry in Ontario from 1996 to 2015. Data were collected retrospectively in 2 phases. Phase I ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

go back to /r/anesthesiology

 

[Allsmiles!]

why don't you post some actual studies instead of random articles?

Ontario- The estimated prevalence of mortality in the 20-year period from 1996 to 2015 was 3 deaths in 3,742,068 cases, with an adjusted mortality rate of 0.8 deaths per 1 million cases. The estimated prevalence of serious morbidity was 1 injury in 3,742,068 cases, which adjusts to a serious morbidity rate of 0.25 per 1 million cases.

Mortality and Morbidity in Office-Based General Anesthesia for Dentistry in Ontario - PMC

Our objective was to estimate the prevalence of mortality and serious morbidity for office-based deep sedation and general anesthesia (DS/GA) for dentistry in Ontario from 1996 to 2015. Data were collected retrospectively in 2 phases. Phase I ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

go back to /r/anesthesiology

why don't you post some actual studies instead of random articles?

Ontario- The estimated prevalence of mortality in the 20-year period from 1996 to 2015 was 3 deaths in 3,742,068 cases, with an adjusted mortality rate of 0.8 deaths per 1 million cases. The estimated prevalence of serious morbidity was 1 injury in 3,742,068 cases, which adjusts to a serious morbidity rate of 0.25 per 1 million cases.

Mortality and Morbidity in Office-Based General Anesthesia for Dentistry in Ontario - PMC

Our objective was to estimate the prevalence of mortality and serious morbidity for office-based deep sedation and general anesthesia (DS/GA) for dentistry in Ontario from 1996 to 2015. Data were collected retrospectively in 2 phases. Phase I ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

go back to /r/anesthesiology

@SuxDrugs&Rocuronium is this true? 👆🏻

 

[SuxDrugs&Rocuronium]

OMFS want to keep making that cash so they push for it. You want to dive into their market if it's taken from them so you push against it. Meanwhile me the general dentist giving sedation for as long as the policy allows me to as well! Although it begs the question, why not be a real anesthesiologist instead of a dental anesthesiologist? Or a CRNA? They seem to be practicing in dental offices too!

Dive into their market? I hate to break it to you but DAs are already in the market, and business is booming.

I assume you mean MD anesthesiologists. I’d hate to work in a hospital for the rest of my career, and it’s not super common for them to work in dental offices. We train specifically for the dental setting, so we do many more nasal intubations and are very familiar with non hospital anesthesia.

And CRNAs training is a joke.

 

[SuxDrugs&Rocuronium]

why don't you post some actual studies instead of random articles?

Ontario- The estimated prevalence of mortality in the 20-year period from 1996 to 2015 was 3 deaths in 3,742,068 cases, with an adjusted mortality rate of 0.8 deaths per 1 million cases. The estimated prevalence of serious morbidity was 1 injury in 3,742,068 cases, which adjusts to a serious morbidity rate of 0.25 per 1 million cases.

Mortality and Morbidity in Office-Based General Anesthesia for Dentistry in Ontario - PMC

Our objective was to estimate the prevalence of mortality and serious morbidity for office-based deep sedation and general anesthesia (DS/GA) for dentistry in Ontario from 1996 to 2015. Data were collected retrospectively in 2 phases. Phase I ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

go back to /r/anesthesiology

I did post a study. Read it. Estimated once per month death or hypoxic brain injury.

 

[Allsmiles!]

Dive into their market? I hate to break it to you but DAs are already in the market, and business is booming.

I assume you mean MD anesthesiologists. I’d hate to work in a hospital for the rest of my career, and it’s not super common for them to work in dental offices. We train specifically for the dental setting, so we do many more nasal intubations and are very familiar with non hospital anesthesia.

And CRNAs training is a joke.

Oh. Now it all makes sense. C’mon man! 🤪

 

[D1Bound]

You will find that the oral surgeon's voice is smaller than all of the ASA and a few dental anesthesiologists. Even if your logic is debatably sound, a majority defeats a minority! I wonder how many years a small subspecialty like OMFS can continue fighting this fight. Anesthesiologists couldn't do anything about CRNAs, but they sure will win against oral surgeons eventually.

What about access to care? OMS claim a very strong track record of safety. If you remove their anesthesia/operator privileges, less patients will receive care. Not every office can get a CRNA

 

[SuxDrugs&Rocuronium]

Oh. Now it all makes sense. C’mon man! 🤪

Trust me, I hate going to omfs offices. They always have the sickest patients, or are bringing us because the patient has failed their sedation (but they’re the experts in anesthesia?). I’d much rather just do healthy peds cases all day every day.

 

[SuxDrugs&Rocuronium]

What about access to care? OMS claim a very strong track record of safety. If you remove their anesthesia/operator privileges, less patients will receive care. Not every office can get a CRNA

Train more anesthesia providers. If OMFS would routinely intubate I’d be more for it. Almost all of their complications are airway related.

But let me ask how many preventable deaths/brain injuries is acceptable?

CRNAs vary greatly, some are good and some are terrible. They do something like 600 cases during their training, we do 2500+

 

[Big Time Hoosier]

Perio reading this thread:

Big Hoss

 

[Allsmiles!]

Trust me, I hate going to omfs offices. They always have the sickest patients, or are bringing us because the patient has failed their sedation (but they’re the experts in anesthesia?). I’d much rather just do healthy peds cases all day every day.

So, only the easy cases…forget the sick…nice. 😏 it’s good that you advocate what you think is right but...data matters…and you ignore that to help your self serving argument. Why not be secure in your chosen profession, as you said, DAs are taking over the world…look out REAL anesthesiologist out there, and not belittle CRNAs contributions or use anecdotal examples to make a point. Expert, I guess you consider yourself an expert…Imagine what a REAL anesthesiologist would say to you? We all play a role to help patients…yup, even the real sick ones. I’ve spoken to a few REAL anesthesiologist…they are moving a bit more into the dental business…I guess like you, they don’t want to be stuck in a hospital all day…I can see this happening more into the future.

 

[SuxDrugs&Rocuronium]

So, only the easy cases…forget the sick…nice. 😏 it’s good that you advocate what you think is right but...data matters…and you ignore that to help your self serving argument. Why not be secure in your chosen profession, as you said, DAs are taking over the world…look out REAL anesthesiologist out there, and not belittle CRNAs contributions or use anecdotal examples to make a point. Expert, I guess you consider yourself an expert…Imagine what a REAL anesthesiologist would say to you? We all play a role to help patients…yup, even the real sick ones. I’ve spoken to a few REAL anesthesiologist…they are moving a bit more into the dental business…I guess like you, they don’t want to be stuck in a hospital all day…I can see this happening more into the future.

I never said forget the sick? I just said I don’t like doing those cases, and I can guarantee any anesthesiologist you ask doesn’t like doing sick cases. How am I ignoring data? You’ve yet to respond to the study I posted showing an estimated 1 death/injury per month. Not sure what you keep going on about “real” anesthesiologists? Please enlighten me how my 3 year residency doing the same cases the MD residents do makes me a fake anesthesiologist? Because I don’t have the letters “MD” in my credentials?

 

[Hockeytalk]

Dive into their market? I hate to break it to you but DAs are already in the market, and business is booming.

I assume you mean MD anesthesiologists. I’d hate to work in a hospital for the rest of my career, and it’s not super common for them to work in dental offices. We train specifically for the dental setting, so we do many more nasal intubations and are very familiar with non hospital anesthesia.

And CRNAs training is a joke.

Honest question. How is crna training different from DA training in terms of time, supervision etc?

And btw I am willing to bet MDAs consider you less than a crna, just another dentist meddling in their world.

 

[Big Time Hoosier]

and I can guarantee any anesthesiologist you ask doesn’t like doing sick cases.

Especially outside of a hospital setting.

Big Hoss

 

[Big Time Hoosier]

Especially outside of a hospital setting.

Big Hoss

I was doing in office IV sedation one day and a construction crew across the street knocked out power to my clinic. The nurse anesthetist and I about crapped our pants. I was so lucky that I was just about to cement the last SSC of the case. Do you think my clinic has a backup generator? Nope.

There is much to be said for having the support and help, when needed, that is found in a hospital/surgery center.

Big Hoss

 

[Allsmiles!]

I never said forget the sick? I just said I don’t like doing those cases, and I can guarantee any anesthesiologist you ask doesn’t like doing sick cases. How am I ignoring data? You’ve yet to respond to the study I posted showing an estimated 1 death/injury per month. Not sure what you keep going on about “real” anesthesiologists? Please enlighten me how my 3 year residency doing the same cases the MD residents do makes me a fake anesthesiologist? Because I don’t have the letters “MD” in my credentials?

I was waiting for that answer…so, you get the exact same training as the MDAs…oh, ok. That’s not what MDAs tell me…they sort of chuckle at you guys. Egos all over the place! You’re a dentist just like me…well, I’m a dentist/MD so obviously I’m better than you. When I’m in the OR, I only see real anesthesiologist. By the way, where is all the research you are talking about as it relates to OMFS? And, I like to see the research on CRNAs too since their training is inferior to yours.