Arch Guillotti
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Spring 2010 Oral Boards thread
Started by Arch Guillotti
Congrats to all who passed. I hope to have that behind me next year.
Anyone who didn't pass feel like posting? I'd like to hear their thoughts on what went wrong, or curveballs they got thrown.
Anyone who didn't pass feel like posting? I'd like to hear their thoughts on what went wrong, or curveballs they got thrown.
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That's right Arch, you're a straight shooter with upper management written all over you. 😀
Congrats to everyone. It's been about 8 or 9 yrs since my oral and I still remember my 2 cases. Probably will remember them forever or at least until I'm senile.
Thanks for the shout out DreamMachine but I feel like most everyone here is passing material. Just looking for an anesthesia site to converse about your profession with others that you don't even know takes some passion. If you have the passion then you have the gift and with that comes board certification or better yet " A Diplomat of the American Board Of Anesthesiology".
Enjoy
Thanks for the shout out DreamMachine but I feel like most everyone here is passing material. Just looking for an anesthesia site to converse about your profession with others that you don't even know takes some passion. If you have the passion then you have the gift and with that comes board certification or better yet " A Diplomat of the American Board Of Anesthesiology".
Enjoy
Congrats!
1st round is on me.
👍
1st round is on me.
👍
I failed. No curveballs. It was a tough but fair exam just as i expected. It wasn't as though i was unprepared either - studied for several months and did practice sessions with buddies. I simply couldn't answer what i should have been able to answer on the first stem; the second stem went fine (i think).
My own assessment in retrospect is that i failed because i panicked in that environment or i didn't practice enough or both. It's cool though - i walked out of the first room KNOWING i failed so i'm not surprised about the result; heck, if i were the examiner in that first room i would have failed me too! I mean it still sucks and i feel like crap but i'm not wallowing in self-pity. I'm just gonna enjoy my time for now and when next April rolls around I won't fail again.
Sorry to hear that. Try to think about the things that you think that you did "wrong" and I'm not just referring to your answers to the questions. (how you answered, how you reacted to changes in the case and the examiners, clarity of thought WRT your diff diagnosis, urgent treatments, etc) If you felt unprepared because you didn't practice enough, or would benefit from test taking tips strongly consider a course. I didn't take one, so I can't give you any recs. I read good things about Ho though. We did many practice exams in residency and watched 2 for every one that we did. The people that continued to examine poorly were encouraged to go to a board review course, most did, all passed. You've got the right attitude.👍
P.S. You can have 2 drinks!
Don't beat yourself up too badly. I was in your position last year. I felt terrible. I also knew that I did not pass when I left the hotel. I did very well on the written exam and felt overly confident. I was like a deer in the headlights on exam day. One of my examiners actually laughed @ me. I worked hard over the next year and cleared the exam on my second attempt this spring. You sound like you just need to practice more with greater intensity. Your buddies will test you easier than the actual examiners will.
I would suggest that you take a couple of months off then get back on the horse. You do not want the knowledge that you have to decay. Maintain your knowledge level and practice.
A year from now your victory will be sweet.
You can send me a pm.
Cambie
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Arch Guillotti
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I am sure this is a difficult time but I agree with trying your hardest not to pity yourself. It takes a big nut sack to come out on this board and write what you did. Every one of us on this board who has been through the oral exam can understand where you are coming from (to some degree). The exam is a beast - not only do you have to know your stuff but you also have to get through the psychology of the whole process.
I know someone who previously failed orals because he admittedly got stagefright. Next time he came back and crushed it. I am sure you will do the same. Sounds like you have identified your possible weaknesses, moved on and started to develop a game plan for slaying the beast. Good luck, I have no doubt you will crush it the next time through.
I know someone who previously failed orals because he admittedly got stagefright. Next time he came back and crushed it. I am sure you will do the same. Sounds like you have identified your possible weaknesses, moved on and started to develop a game plan for slaying the beast. Good luck, I have no doubt you will crush it the next time through.
As Arch said: Big ballsack. Says a lot about who you are dude. 👍
I would like to humbly say that it is only a test and that your true abilities as a consultant anesthesiologist is not determined by your performance: written or orals.
IN2B8TR can back me up on this: One of our CT fellows from residency did not pass his boards last year. He is an excellent anesthesiologist. Keep that in mind Home-E.
You'll hit it outta the ball park next time. 😎
Thanks for posting. It sounds like you have a good perspective
Did you do mock orals? Take a course?
I just found out a friend of mine failed also. He's pretty stellar and taught me a lot so I was surprised. It could happen to the best of us.
And I would be remiss if I didn't mention that you clearly have sack, otherwise you wouldn't have posted this.
leaverus said:
sevoflurane said:
Agree, we all know great anesthesiologists who have been tripped up by this thing.
It's why I feel far more exhausted relief than happy accomplishment having passed it. My family was, and remains, totally perplexed why I was so stressed about the oral after 3 years of absolutely smoking the ITEs and the written exam. They don't "get it" but I was grateful for their support and encouragement.
And though I surely can't "get" what you're feeling now I hope the forum's support and encouragement helps. We know you'll beat it in the end.
I spent a lot of time over the last few weeks wondering if I would have the balls to come on here and admit if I failed the boards. I am still not certain that I would have had the cojones to do it.
So beers and broads to you and your big ballsack and better luck next year. I bet you will smoke it.
- pod
So beers and broads to you and your big ballsack and better luck next year. I bet you will smoke it.
- pod
Thanks, everyone, for the words of support and encouragement although i don't know how much "balls" it really takes to come out on an anonymous forum and admit failure. Truth is, i'm rather ashamed to admit to my family, friends and colleagues who believed i could pass that i didn't. I'm not really a "regular" around here and don't know any of you personally (i assume) - but it still does mean a lot because i know you guys can imagine what it feels like.
Bigeyedfish: i did not take a course and i did not do "mock orals." Perhaps it was my ego, but i've never really been a course-taker and thought i would not need one this time either; obviously i don't plan to leave anything to chance the 2nd time around. Anyway, i read a lot and did many one-on-one sessions in person and online with classmates using stems from Board Stiff and Ho material. I will say that i came from a residency program (i'd rather not say which one so please don't ask) that was VERY weak on preparation for orals - the focus is more on passing writtens and after that you're on your own.
BTW, congratulations to everyone who did pass.
Cambie, i sent you a PM.
Bigeyedfish: i did not take a course and i did not do "mock orals." Perhaps it was my ego, but i've never really been a course-taker and thought i would not need one this time either; obviously i don't plan to leave anything to chance the 2nd time around. Anyway, i read a lot and did many one-on-one sessions in person and online with classmates using stems from Board Stiff and Ho material. I will say that i came from a residency program (i'd rather not say which one so please don't ask) that was VERY weak on preparation for orals - the focus is more on passing writtens and after that you're on your own.
BTW, congratulations to everyone who did pass.
Cambie, i sent you a PM.
Leaverus, you're not alone man...
Not to ride on your coattails or looking for sympathy, but I too failed the test. Like you, i thought the exam was fair and tough. BUT, i thought I would squeak by and pass this damn thing. The first day i was in a daze and the next day it really hit me. I am devastated and feeling quite down. I HATE the ABA. Not because i don't believe in these exams and all, but I really don't want to wait a year to take this test again. They really need to change that rule. But that is another debate.
I took the Ho course, and tried to do a case almost every night. The course was ok, it was more of a reality check and what to expect. In the end, it's all about practice. For now, i'm just reliving that day in atlanta on what went wrong. It wasn't perfect, but i felt i had a chance.
Oh well, what is done is done, and i can't change the outcome of that day. Another year of putting your life goals on hold...
Cambie and Leaverus, I will be PM'ing you soon. Would def like to get your perspectives. congrats all, pour some liquor out for the fallen.
dogz
Not to ride on your coattails or looking for sympathy, but I too failed the test. Like you, i thought the exam was fair and tough. BUT, i thought I would squeak by and pass this damn thing. The first day i was in a daze and the next day it really hit me. I am devastated and feeling quite down. I HATE the ABA. Not because i don't believe in these exams and all, but I really don't want to wait a year to take this test again. They really need to change that rule. But that is another debate.
I took the Ho course, and tried to do a case almost every night. The course was ok, it was more of a reality check and what to expect. In the end, it's all about practice. For now, i'm just reliving that day in atlanta on what went wrong. It wasn't perfect, but i felt i had a chance.
Oh well, what is done is done, and i can't change the outcome of that day. Another year of putting your life goals on hold...
Cambie and Leaverus, I will be PM'ing you soon. Would def like to get your perspectives. congrats all, pour some liquor out for the fallen.
dogz
Sorry to hear about hotdogz and leaverus. I have two acquaintances that also failed. I do not think they are on this forum.
Congrats to those that passed.
IlDestriero: that looks like my whiskey cabinet (except for the Glenlivet). You have good taste!
Congrats to those that passed.
IlDestriero: that looks like my whiskey cabinet (except for the Glenlivet). You have good taste!
So I will take the suspicion of the "first time poster" but give my 2 cents. I was a top resident, did well on ITE and failed written by 1 point. It sucked. I was not happy to go back to work and tell all I failed. You never really get over it, but learn to conquer. I studied like no body's business and passed the written board by 100 points the second time. Took 2 Jensen courses. He seemed to have the best working knowledge of the written.
I felt I could not make the same mistake twice with orals, so I 100% focused. No vacations, no ball games, no hanging out with friends. I trained like an olympic athlete. Took 2 practice exams every weekend with my wife, she is not an anesthesiologist, but it gets you prepped for how to answer a question you don't know the answer to without BSing and without sounding like an idiot.
I took Michael Ho's course the weekend, the week-long, and the crash before boards. All good courses. Good mock exams and good chance to hear how others mess-up. Also good chance to get in the hot seat in front of the audience which has nearly the same tension as the orals. Read Yao and Artursio's and Board Stiff 2--(did not like board stiff 3). Choose Ho because he seems to have the inside scoop and the passion for the oral exam. A good reason to take a course is for time out of the OR and to put your "game face" on.
Week of boards I took the Ho course until Sunday and then studied in the room until Wed evening. Took the board on Thursday. Did not feel confident I passed but walked out knowing I did everything I possibly could have.
I will be honest here and mainly for those who have not taken the exam yet (written or oral) Prepare yourself to the point that when you walk out, you can look in the mirror and say "I could not have prepared myself any more for this exam" For those who state review courses cost too much money, I lost a year's increase in salary for not being boarded. I have to board in 5 years or lose the job. Was cheaper to take the review course than to fail again.
To those who did not pass. Pick it up and do what you have to do to pass.
I felt I could not make the same mistake twice with orals, so I 100% focused. No vacations, no ball games, no hanging out with friends. I trained like an olympic athlete. Took 2 practice exams every weekend with my wife, she is not an anesthesiologist, but it gets you prepped for how to answer a question you don't know the answer to without BSing and without sounding like an idiot.
I took Michael Ho's course the weekend, the week-long, and the crash before boards. All good courses. Good mock exams and good chance to hear how others mess-up. Also good chance to get in the hot seat in front of the audience which has nearly the same tension as the orals. Read Yao and Artursio's and Board Stiff 2--(did not like board stiff 3). Choose Ho because he seems to have the inside scoop and the passion for the oral exam. A good reason to take a course is for time out of the OR and to put your "game face" on.
Week of boards I took the Ho course until Sunday and then studied in the room until Wed evening. Took the board on Thursday. Did not feel confident I passed but walked out knowing I did everything I possibly could have.
I will be honest here and mainly for those who have not taken the exam yet (written or oral) Prepare yourself to the point that when you walk out, you can look in the mirror and say "I could not have prepared myself any more for this exam" For those who state review courses cost too much money, I lost a year's increase in salary for not being boarded. I have to board in 5 years or lose the job. Was cheaper to take the review course than to fail again.
To those who did not pass. Pick it up and do what you have to do to pass.
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I mentioned earlier that I failed the orals last year and passed this year.
Practice makes all the difference. Don't get me wrong. Practice cannot make up for a poor fund of knowledge.
I spent about two months trying to figure out what happened and speaking to my colleagues to determine my next move.
I wasted my money taking the Ho course, twice as a matter of fact. My presentation was so poor that I needed intense coaching. People @ the Ho course kept telling me that they could sense that I knew more than what I was saying but no one could help me to get ,"more," out.
I was a poor partner for the people that I got paired up with. The orals is a thinking test. You have to understand the purpose of the test and how it is set up. If you understand that you are half way there.
The must know cases are a waste of your time if you have a strong fund of knowledge and can apply the information appropriately.
The exam test judgement and basic anesthesiology. Good judgement and a strong fund of knowledge can be applied to any case.
My plan for next year would have involved more intense practice.
Tape yourself answering questions and review the tape with your SO. You will be surprised by the strange gestures that you make when you are speaking or under stress.
Speak aloud
Explain aloud how the pulse ox works. You will realize that your answer contains certain key words. Light source through a pulsatile vascular bed. Difference in absortion @ two wave length....
That applies to just about everything. A patient who becomes aggitated during a MAC case may be in pain however he/she may be hypoxic,hypercapnic or hypotensive with decreased cerebral profusion.
My problem was I could not develop a good working differential. I was the guy who said give him more versed.
I am not anti-HO. His course helps most people. There is a minority of people like me who need a more intense program to get through the exam. i set my own program up. thank God it worked for me.
One last thing. If you failed the orals do not keep it a secret it takes too much NRG to keep secrets. Tell your family and friends. You will need the moral support. You can study more effectively if everything is out in the open.
Cambie
Practice makes all the difference. Don't get me wrong. Practice cannot make up for a poor fund of knowledge.
I spent about two months trying to figure out what happened and speaking to my colleagues to determine my next move.
I wasted my money taking the Ho course, twice as a matter of fact. My presentation was so poor that I needed intense coaching. People @ the Ho course kept telling me that they could sense that I knew more than what I was saying but no one could help me to get ,"more," out.
I was a poor partner for the people that I got paired up with. The orals is a thinking test. You have to understand the purpose of the test and how it is set up. If you understand that you are half way there.
The must know cases are a waste of your time if you have a strong fund of knowledge and can apply the information appropriately.
The exam test judgement and basic anesthesiology. Good judgement and a strong fund of knowledge can be applied to any case.
My plan for next year would have involved more intense practice.
Tape yourself answering questions and review the tape with your SO. You will be surprised by the strange gestures that you make when you are speaking or under stress.
Speak aloud
Explain aloud how the pulse ox works. You will realize that your answer contains certain key words. Light source through a pulsatile vascular bed. Difference in absortion @ two wave length....
That applies to just about everything. A patient who becomes aggitated during a MAC case may be in pain however he/she may be hypoxic,hypercapnic or hypotensive with decreased cerebral profusion.
My problem was I could not develop a good working differential. I was the guy who said give him more versed.
I am not anti-HO. His course helps most people. There is a minority of people like me who need a more intense program to get through the exam. i set my own program up. thank God it worked for me.
One last thing. If you failed the orals do not keep it a secret it takes too much NRG to keep secrets. Tell your family and friends. You will need the moral support. You can study more effectively if everything is out in the open.
Cambie
Your attitude alone will get you through on your next try.
Gotta agree. The test can be tough--all depends on the luck of the draw, to some extent. Bottom line: know your stuff cold. Present it in the appropriate way. Hope for the best. "Smart" people fail this test too. There ain't no one that knows everything--such a person never existed and will never exist. Board examiners know that, they just want to skirt the limits of your knowledge.... It is a right of passage, nothing more, nothing less....
Arch Guillotti
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This can be a tough crowd here and I think that it takes balls of steel to come on here and talk about things the way you did.
It will be all the more sweeter when you crush it next time around.
In light of the Office Space reference in the other thread:
Congratulations to everyone.
Now go and have some beers and enjoy yourself!
LOL, Arch: I must admit, I kinda acted like the guy in the movie when I knew that I was leaving my last gig--sort of liked saying "naahhh, I jus don't feel like doin' thaaat. Why don't you go ahead and do the next call, Dr. Lumberg!"
Guys/gals it's not the end of the world.
One of my older sisters (very smart woman, graduated near the top of class in college/med school). Passed writtens easily.
Than she failed the oral boards 3 (three) times. Yes, you heard that right. She failed it 3 time.....you know what happens after 3 attempts. She lost her board eligibility.
She's a fighter. She had to take the in training exam just to become board eligible. Than pass the real written exams. AND than she finally passed the orals on her fourth try.
We found the reason why an ordinarily smart person would fail the orals that many times....Beta Blockers. She just got so nervous doing the orals. Either she panicked or talked way too fast. She never lost her job, she never complained. She kept on chucking along.
For those of you who failed it once, find out why you failed it. 98% of the time, it isn't about lack of knowledge. You wouldn't have passed the writtens without fundamental knowledge of anesthesia.
One of my older sisters (very smart woman, graduated near the top of class in college/med school). Passed writtens easily.
Than she failed the oral boards 3 (three) times. Yes, you heard that right. She failed it 3 time.....you know what happens after 3 attempts. She lost her board eligibility.
She's a fighter. She had to take the in training exam just to become board eligible. Than pass the real written exams. AND than she finally passed the orals on her fourth try.
We found the reason why an ordinarily smart person would fail the orals that many times....Beta Blockers. She just got so nervous doing the orals. Either she panicked or talked way too fast. She never lost her job, she never complained. She kept on chucking along.
For those of you who failed it once, find out why you failed it. 98% of the time, it isn't about lack of knowledge. You wouldn't have passed the writtens without fundamental knowledge of anesthesia.
Thanks again, everyone, for the support and advice - any and all that you guys want to offer, i'm all ears; whatever it takes to pass this thing, i'll do. aneftp, that's a very inspirational story about your sister and thanks for sharing it - sad to say, in my case, it wasn't mere jitters. i strongly believe i was lacking in fundamental knowledge (or the inability to express/manifest it) that i must acquire before next April. Sandman & Cambie, i especially value your input 'cause you've tread this path before. i like the idea of recording myself talking and will do that for sure.
After walking out of my boards I felt worked over. I really thought I had just wasted a lot of money. It wasn't the knowledge part that bothered me so much, not to say I didn't run into areas where I wished I would have know more. It was awkwardness of the whole process. I thought I "ummed", and "I don't knowed" way too much. I thought I probably babbled myself into tough questions that I could have avoided.
"Well, it could be A, B, or Zebra" Crap, I can't remember anything about zebra
"Tell me about Zebra"
I did mock orals every year in residency, but I hadn't done any since. I really wished I would have taken some time and practiced with someone. Just being used to answering questions in the format they want is such a huge part. Barring big knowledge gaps most of it seems to be more about style and judgment. As far as style, it takes practice. At the least answering practice questions to yourself out loud. At best find a faculty from you neighborhood anesthesiology program and sit down a couple times for mock orals. As far as judgment, give reasonable conservative plans that you can defend, but don't marry yourself to them. Be able to change.
My rambling $0.02
"Well, it could be A, B, or Zebra" Crap, I can't remember anything about zebra
"Tell me about Zebra"
I did mock orals every year in residency, but I hadn't done any since. I really wished I would have taken some time and practiced with someone. Just being used to answering questions in the format they want is such a huge part. Barring big knowledge gaps most of it seems to be more about style and judgment. As far as style, it takes practice. At the least answering practice questions to yourself out loud. At best find a faculty from you neighborhood anesthesiology program and sit down a couple times for mock orals. As far as judgment, give reasonable conservative plans that you can defend, but don't marry yourself to them. Be able to change.
My rambling $0.02
Yes, MT passed
- pod
- pod
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Yes, I did. Like a lot of us (I assume) I had four weeks to keep thinking about all the additional preparation I wish I would have done.
I think I was sleep deprived rambling typing mode when I wrote that post.
I think I was sleep deprived rambling typing mode when I wrote that post.
